Unca Harlan's Art Deco Dining Pavilion

Archive - 09/27/2005 to 11/20/2005

Unca Harlan's Art Deco Dining Pavilion

>it seems ridiculous to me that a civil trial can even take place (constitution or not) if someone has been acquitted in a criminal trial - one would think that an acquital would be the perfect defense.<

In many cases I'm sure it is. But in cases like Blake and Simpson, where the reasonable doubt was just barely so (and not at all, for some people), it doesn't help.

The advantage to a civil case is that it's over money, not your life, and you can lock things up in appeals and not be sitting in the slam throughout the whole process.

Civil vs. Criminal
Charlie and Duane,

Thank you for your replies to my question. I understand the difference in venues and evidence. Maybe I'm being idealistic or completely irrational, (both of which I can most certainly lay claim to on occasion) but it seems ridiculous to me that a civil trial can even take place (constitution or not) if someone has been acquitted in a criminal trial - one would think that an acquital would be the perfect defense.

*shrug*

This is probably why I'd suck at being a lawyer.

Thanks, again!

K

Cookies
Unca Harlan:

I'm sorry that I don't have any chicken croquette recipes to pass on; however, I remember that your favorite cookie was the lost and lamented Hydrox. I don't know if you eat many cookies these days, but I think that I've finally found a reasonable replacement of creme-filled, chocolate joy. Newman's Own Organics produces Newman-O's creme filled chocolate cookies. We have only tried the Hint 'O Mint variety, so far, but it is most encouraging. The creme is soft, creamy and quite tasty, and the cookies themselves are firm and crunchy with a strong chocolate flavor. They definitely put Oreos to shame.

The bad news is that they are fairly pricey: Around $3.50 US for a 16 oz. package of 33 cookies. You'll probably also have to visit a large grocery chain that has an organic foods section in order to find them. Nonetheless, I urge you to check them out!

All hail Paul Newman!

DISREGARD URL TO O'BANNON INTERVIEW -- INCORRECT!
I apologize, folks for providing the wrong URL and for double-posting. I'll repost when I figure out how to provide you wtih the correct URL.

Kevin the Cyber Idiot

ROCKNE S. O'BANNON INTERVIEW
Harlan, you are kindly mentioned in this profile of Rockne S. O'Bannon, which focuses on (but isn't limited to) his terrific TWILIGHT ZONE episode "Wordplay":

http://mailcenter.comcast.net/wmc/v/wm/4380C28D000073530000289E2206424413979D0A900E0207900A05?cmd=Show&no=3&uid=178594&sid=c0#article2

First SF readings
I am almost certain that the first SF I read was a Ballantine collection of Henry Kuttner stories that came out in the mid-1970's. I was 12 years old, and I vividly remember the inventor who could only invent when he was drunk and considered himself a purist because he only drank beer out of cans, not plastic bulbs. (Even though I was a teetotaler at the time, I mourned with him when the last brewer to put its suds in cans went out of business.)
I also read A WRINKLE IN TIME around that time--it would have been shortly before or after the Kuttner collection. And I vaguely remember reading the NARNIA series in elementary school. But the Kuttner stories made a real impression on me. After that came Bradbury, Clarke, the Heinlein juveniles, Simak's "City" story cycle and yes, at the tender age of 14, Harlan Ellison's "Deathbird Stories." And I took his warning to read only one story at a time sincerely, and not as hyperbole.

BTW, anent my previous post, Jennifyr recommends Roscoe's House of Chicken is another possibility. (I bow to her superior knowledge of Southern cuisine and restaurants in California.)

Chicken croquettes
My friend Jennifyr says that her mother used to do salmon croquettes, which are similar:

The simplest is to use primarily dark meat because it's more juicy. Chop up 2 cups of chicken, then take saltine crackers (1/4 box; in other words, 1 wax paper sleeve's worth--about 30 saltines). Leaving the salt in, crumble the crackers and mix them in with the chicken in a large bowl. (You can also use bread crumbs). Add 3 L or XL eggs--best to whisk them up before adding to mixture. If you like onion, you can add dehydrated onion flakes (easiest), or chop up or cut with scissors a green onion. Once all this is together, check the consistency. If the mixture won't hold together, then it's time to start adding extra moisture. You can add chicken broth, an egg or a splash of milk.
Taste the mixture--add salt and pepper to taste. (If you're a spicy guy, this would be the time to add 'em if you wish.)
Smoosh mixture into balls, then drop into cooking oil and flatten somewhat with spatula. (This is so they will cook evenly.)
Form patties into whatever size you want--I would suggest 3 inches in diameter. Fry patties in frying pan--use any kind of oil you want--olive, peanut,etc. (I would suggest not using an oil that would add extra flavor.) Patties do not have to be deep-fried. Watch them very closely--estimated cooking time is about 4 minutes on each side. When done, drain on plenty of paper towels. If you want to be thorough on draining oil from the patties, change the towels. After changing the initial paper towels, replace them and this time use other paper towels to press down lightly from the top (like a sandwich). DO NOT leave upper paper towels on top after pressing, as this will remove the crunch. (Remember, steam is the enemy to crunch here.)
Serve and enjoy!

Jennifyr also recommends Johnny Rebs for their authentic Southern cuisine. They have restaurants in Victorville, Long Beach, Bellflower and Orange.

Reading List
The earliest SF-ish books I remember reading were Heinlein's Starship Troopers (odd, but true), and two Mark Twain stories (Tom Sawyer Abroad, Connecticut Yankee) with what must have been -- at the time -- SF-ish elements.

Also, a very vivid image comes to mind of a novel for which I cannot remember the title, but I clearly recollect that it involved multi-organism aliens with detachable tentacles, a disaster in space, and a very solid description of a collapsing gantry on the moon. The cover featured a spacesuited human hiding behind a metallic disc with four tentacles reaching around the disc. (If this sparks recognition in anyone, please let me know the name of the thing.) Again, think children's book.

And, yes I'll admit it, "Star Trek: Mission to Horatius". There are some things best left alone...

ME

Correction:

The del Rey title I had in mind was, "Marooned on Mars".

"Moon of Mutiny" is another Heinlein title.

Childhood Reads
One influential book was PAGOO, by Holling C. Holling. It was the life story of a hermit crab, and about life in the sea. It was technically accurate and at the same time made feisty little Pagoo an appealing character. It helped encourage my interest in science and storytelling, and showed the two could go together.

The opening of the book went something like this:

LITTLE Pagurus-"Pagoo" for short-floated at the surface of the sea...Instinct said, "You're hungry!" And sure enough, he was.

Chuck

Oops...
Charlie in St. Pete nailed it more accurately and succinctly than I did.

Hey Keiti,

If I get this wrong, someone will point out my folly, but my thinking goes like this:

Criminal trials and civil trials have different "burdens of proof." With criminal trials, the prosecution must prove their case beyond a reasonable doubt. Volumes have been written on what is meant by "reasonable doubt," but we'll just leave the term defined as it is.

With a civil trial, the burden of proof is "Preponderance of the evidence," which is less rigorous than "reasonable doubt." This basically means if the prosecution can convince a jury that there is more evidence supporting their side, then the jury can convict. Since a criminal court can have someone's freedom taken away (or killed), the Constitution requires a much higher standard of proof than "we are at least 51% sure so-and-so committed this crime."

In both cases, a criminal jury didn't believe that the prosecution proved its case beyond a "reasonable doubt" (for whatever hair-ripping reason, at least in the case of OJ). But a CIVIL jury, which can't send a man to prison but can take large sums of his money, was convinced that there was at least a 51% chance that the defendant was indeed guilty.

Now, I'm no big city lawyer (he said, tugging at his suspenders), but it's the best I could come up with. Anyone more knowledgable than I have any thoughts?

ME: Started with speculative fiction in middle school, with this stuff.

Lloyd Alexander's Prydain series
C.S. Lewis' Chronicles of Narnia
Asimov, Bradbury, and Clarke short stories
Stephen King's Nigh Shift

Good stuff.

PAB

Early Reading

I started reading Harlan in 6th grade after i discovered he was the creator of THE CITY ON THE EDGE OF FOREVER. Found a couple-three stories in the old Orbit anthologies ed. by Damon Knight. Blew me the eff away.

I read WILLARD by Stephen Gilbert
The Science Fiction Hall of Fame
The Martian novels of Edgar Rice Burroughs
Elric novels of Michael Moorcock
The Andromeda Strain and The Terminal Man by Crichton
Joseph Wambaugh and Ed McBain novels

On second thought, better not have the kid start with the stuff that I did.

Regards,
Neal

Harlan,

If you want a basket full of hot Southern biscuits to sop up the gravy with, I've got a Savannah recipe passed down from my maternal grandmother that my mom taught me to make. They are the real deal.

ME

This stuff is great for early teens:

del Rey (Moon of Mutiny, etc.)
Heinlein (Have Spacesuit Will Travel, etc. anything from '40s & 50's)
Doc Smith (Lensman, Skylark, etc.)
Le Guin (Earthsea)

Regarding children's books
ME: Ever read THE FORGOTTEN DOOR by Alexander Key? I'd still prefer to live in Jon's world. People haven't changed much in forty years.

Eleanor Cameron's MUSHROOM PLANET books made me want to build a rocket in my backyard, and I often scoured old newspapers looking for classified ads printed in green ink. [Midnight confession... I still do, and long for a planet just big enough for me.]

Evelyn Sibley Lampman's THE CITY UNDER THE BACK STEPS may seem more fantasy than science fiction this days, but I was fascinated by the concept of going to live among ants.

I'm sure that there are dozens more I can think of; going to the library with my dad remains the best memory of my childhood in the Sixties.

---------Patty

Keiti...Two different venues (civil and criminal) and two different legal standards (preponderance of the evidence vs. beyond all reasonable doubt). There is no constitutional prohibition to be found not guilty in a criminal trial and to be sued thereafter in a civil court. The state is the party in interest in criminal proceedings whereas a civil suit (such as in OJ & Blake) is brought by the estate of the deceased person (plaintiff) against a defendant.

Completely Random Question
Greetings to All.

I have a question that I thought perhaps some of you could shed some light on...

As I'm sure most of you have heard (whether you care or not) Robert Blake was found liable for his wife's death in a civil suit after he was acquitted in criminal court.

So, my question is essentially this: How does it make any sense for him to even have had a civil trial and subsequently found liable when he was acquitted of any criminal wrong doing?

Same thing with O.J.

For the record, I don't want this turned into a frackus (sp) concerning actual guilt or innocence. I simply don't understand why or how it makes any sense to hold a civil trial after a person (any person) has been acquitted in criminal court.

Could someone please explain this to me?

I'm gagging...
Stop stop stop stop stop
Stop stop stop stop stop stop stop
Stop stop stop stop now!


Got that from my boyfriend. =)

But seriously.

takin' care of bidniz

HARLAN:

Got your message. I'm copacetic.

Should note my change of address, for purposes of future "Rabbit Hole" mailings (recent issue was forwarded just fine) as well as the upcoming task:

1030 SW Jefferson, #637
Portland, OR 97201

Large packages are probably best sent to my workplace:

Old Federal Courthouse
620 SW Main, Suite 702
Portland, OR 97205

CROQUETTE RECIPES

Thank you, one and all.

he

Barney, here in Elanoy, "manual" is two syllables. Man-yull.

Drinking melk, Eric

Poppy
HARLAN

POPPY Z may have an answer to your query, hubby is a chef. She digs the cuisine.

Neal

Pacific Rimshot
A Note Composed Long After The Rising Of The Sun On Eastern Shores But Possibly Encountered By West Coast Dwellers As They Sip Thir First Cup Of Java.

(In which our hero, and by "our" I mean me, but what the heck, attempts yet another haiku in a fruitless attempt to avoid the actual chores waiting for him as daylight ceaselessly burns.)

Harlan Ellison
Net surfing is not his way
Must pound manual

- b

Chicken Croquettes
Harlan, Susan:

Judi is an accomplished cook. She can do chicken croquettes Cuban, Jewish, or Italian style. (Not Southern, she says.) We will be gone all day today, but if you'd like a quick lesson she'll be delighted to provide one.

A-TC

Croquette, anyone?
http://www.foodnetwork.com/food/recipes/recipe/0,,FOOD_9936_20485,00.html

http://www.foodnetwork.com/food/recipes/recipe/0,,FOOD_9936_15881,00.html

Children's books; what a great topic.

Maybe in forth grade or fifth grade I picked up William F Wu's "The Robin Hood Ambush" (part of the Robert Silverberg
"Time Tours" series). And Arthur Roth's "The Iceberg Hermit". I recall reading a lot of stories about guys in very cold places; some with dogs, some without.

Some really great books I read in 6th grade are the Susan Cooper "The Dark Is Rising" series.

And of course, you gotta stock up on "Calvin and Hobbes" for your kid. I loved that strip. Being an extremely daydreamy creative kid (seen as an odd duck by everyone), I could really relate to Calvin. I felt atleast Bill Waterson understood what it was like to be like me...a real spirit lifter.

I really wish I had kept more of the books I had when I was younger. Or atleast a list. That might be something you want to do for your kid. Jot down every title s/he has until s/he can write, then encourage your child to keep up the list.

I read all the time when I was growing up (starting at an earlier age than most) but for the life of me, I can't remember 97% of what I had read during those years. I recall a lot of stuff based on cartoons and movies...Transformers, GI Joe, and Indiana Jones chapter books. And I know I read every single Encyclopedia Brown my school library had. Comic books...loads of comic books. I started collecting as soon as I could read; I have thousands and thousands now. Y'know in Boy's Life, there was a comic strip based on Isaac Asimov's "Norby"; not sure who wrote and drew it though.

The recipes from the 1918 version of the Fannie Farmer Boston Cooking School cookbook may be the sort of thing you're looking for:

http://www.bartleby.com/87/r1062.html
http://www.bartleby.com/87/r1061.html

In terms of interesting cooking, you might also want to dig up copies of Food That Really Schmecks and More Food That Really Schmecks, both by Edna Staebler and both perenially in print -- basically, German-Canadian-Mennonite Country recipes that are delightful and simple.

Cheers, Jon

Todd Cassel, Harlan -
imagine the limericks
eschewed for haiku.

* * *
As for chicken croquettes, perhaps either of these will do:
http://southernfood.about.com/od/deepfryerrecipes/r/bl01006c.htm
http://www.freerecipe.org/Appetizers/Croquettes/chicken-croquettes-1-recipe-bscr.htm

ME:

I think "Tripods" has been released in the UK. You'd probably find it on e-bay or some other website.

Begining books? I think I was born in the wrong decade. I started with Wells and Burroughs. Then it was Doctor Who novelizations, then back to Burroughs. What's the cut off age for childhood? I think still in it actually. . .

Vincenzo Kagetaka:

Finally, another naysayer. But what's wrong with Celtic Heritage?

Finally,

I Cannot Impress
Harlan Ellison
So I Will Not Even Try.


Love,

Steve

HARLAN - Paste this into your browser
http://chicken.allrecipes.com/az/lftvrchckncrqtts.asp

if you can't get it to work, I'll send you a printout! This version is almost trivially simple though. Google generates *multiple* hits.

Kristin

HARLAN SEEKS A RECIPE

One of my favorite foods from when I was a kid...

"What is patriotism but the food we ate as a child." LIN YUTANG

...was something every restaurant in America made from the weekend's leftovers. It was a purely American dish, with a swell yellow-white country gravy to drizzle over it.

And it was...

CHICKEN CROQUETTES!!!!!!!!!

The restaurants would take all the leftover chicken meat, dark, but mostly white, mince the hell out of it, mix it with spices and other stuff, and deep-fry it into those nifty rhomboid shapes (like rounded cones, blunt at the top), crispy golden outside, crunchy and crackly...and delicious inside, about the consistency of, say, the best tuna casserole you ever et.

Well, as they've nearly ceased making nationalistic foods everywhere in the world (I asked at ten different restaurants in Australia before an old fry-cook knew what a jaffle was), so has it befallen the fate of the humble, magnificent chicken croquette.

Nibbler's in LA was the last place I could get what was on every menu in every lunch counter and Woolworth's and reliable neighborhood beanery in this nation--before the fucking razr-fone & iPod turned dining in public into a nightmare imposition of being forced to eavesdrop on everyone's else's boring as shit private conversations--all through the '30s, '40s, '50s and into the '60s, '70s, early '80s: but Nibbler's closed down their last restaurant three months ago.

And now Susan and I cannot enjoy chicken croquettes, a modest wonder of American cuisine. We've tried making them ourselves, but the recipes have been lacking. They are ersatz, written by people who've never actually EATEN a chicken croquette.

So...

We need some GOOD SOLID unfancy non-cuisine-minceur American down-home, diner and one-arm joint recipes for CHICKEN CROQUETTES. Would some of you out there, maybe Amy, maybe Cindy, maybe ANYdamnbody who has an old gramma who cooked tasty, not fancy-schmancy croquettes, please see if you can send us the Real Goods so we can enjoy a meal of croquettes and that lovely glutinous yellow-gold country gravy?

Huh, wouldja please?!!!!????

Droolingly, Yr. pal, Harlan

sci-fi books that got you started...
With a new child on the way and the wife piling up cool books to tease the mind (The Rainbow Goblins, anyone?)... I began thinking ahead to the books that inspired me to investigate speculative fiction.

Of note, I remember reading around age 11 or 12 The White Mountains (Tripods trilogy) by Samuel Youd (aka John Christopher). I now think these books set me forth on my love of science/speculative fiction and adventure stories.

Anyone else want to share their early, early reading? Anyone want to critique Christopher's work? Anyone have a bootleg of the DVD "The Tripods" that I understand was never released?

Supes


Stacy Dooks,

Way waaaaaay cool.

Neal

Look what I started
I lower my head in shame
Please, no more haiku!!!!!

-TODD

"Haiku" chokes out like
Cats coughing slimy hairballs
Onto the carpet

Trees whisper softly
In the Garden of Envy
..."Harlan Ellison"

Stacy,

I saw the teaser on Smallville last night. (Yeah, it's a WB teeney bopper show, but it can be suprisingly good at times) It's been far too long since The Big Red S has been on the screen; the trailer definitly put a smile on this fans face.

Harlan Ellison
Spoke of Mickey Mouse porno
Disney wasn't pleased

To Adam-Troy Castro
In order to write
a creditable haiku
you must learn to count.

Oscar
(paraphrasing) "You don't WANT his undivided attention."



Harlan Ellison
Eat where he tells you to eat
And don't get him mad

Oft misspelled Mefisto
HE reaches for pistol
Boom

REPLY TO OSCAR LIM (whoever the hell HE is)

Oh, indeed, it DID happen.

Try the Office of Military Records, Fort Benning, Georgia, March--April 1957. Ranger Training Battalion.

O, Oscar, you ought to be ashamed of yourself. Never happened, my ass.

PFC Harlan Ellison US 51403352 Mustered out: 1 April 1957.

Harlan Ellison
a U.S. Army Ranger?
Never happened, man.

On Harlan's driveway
Shatner laid a skid. Model?
The one in his shorts

Still a seven-month wait, but worth it. . .
Yes, there are probably more esoteric and enlightening things I could be discussing right now to rub shoulders with the literati here but c'mon now. Tell me in your secret heart of hearts where the inner fanboy or girl dwells this teaser doesn't give you a little tingle: http://supermanreturns.warnerbros.com/

Chills man. Chills up and down the spine. I think Singer and company are on the right track with this one.

This has been Stacy's Geek Moment of the Week. We now return you to the higher-brow programming already in progress. ~.^

Stacy

Peter Jackson's filming of Tolkien accentuated the worst aspects of his books, the part based on ancient ethnic myths, and mitigated their strong imaginative originality. The end result for such a mass medium is that it encourages every burley, unshaven, poltroon to put on chain-mail and leather and be proud of his Celtic heritage.

Peter Jackson's filming of Tolkien accentuated the worst aspects of his books, the part based on ancient ethnic myths, and mitigated their strong imaginative originality. The end result for such a mass medium is that it encourages every burley, unshaven, poltroon to put on chain-mail and leather and be proud of his Celtic heritage.

Joining in your Reindeer Games

In Onyx HE wrote
A favourite tale of mine
Read first in Slippage

Of all the stories I enjoyed in Slipppage the story and the title of 'Mephisto in Onyx' sticks in my mind. It's not the best story in Slippage (IMHO) but for some reason it's the most memorable.

Harlan Ellison
And Japanese Poetry?
No apparent link...

Various
Returned to NYC, staying in a hotel other than the one that trapped Harlan, the Castros, and divers others in an elevator last spring. THAT one is undergoing major renovation, but we gave it a shuddery wide berth.

Saw the glorious AVENUE Q again. THE PILLOWMAN, which I consider must-see theatre, is alas no longer playing on Broadway.

Ariana Huffington is offering a great service, over on her blog: for the price of an e-mail to her, she will hand-deliver your name to Bill O'Reilly, so you can be placed on his touted Enemy's List.

Harlan Ellison
Stuck in the lift with you
The Shaft Rings With Rage

Harlan Ellison
reading haiku massacre
bleeding from his eyes

The ED SF Project
Most of you in the SF genre know that SCI FI has axed the online zine SCIFICTION, of which Ellen Datlow was the editor. To pay tribute to her and the ezine, David Schwartz has put together the ED (For Ellen Datlow) SF Project: http://edsfproject.blogspot.com. Go now and choose your favorite story, before it gets taken, and write a loving tribute to it. Still up for grabs are a couple of classic Ellison pieces, so hurry now before they're snatched up.

James

Harlan Ellison
eats Hydrox cookies atop
Kilimanjaro.

Harlan Ellison
is a registered trademark,
so tread carefully.

Harlan Ellison
the crimson leaves fall, collect
beneath your lone oak

Echoes...
Did anyone else catch Criminal Minds on CBS Wednesday night? I couldn't help but flash back to Harlan's 'Rat Hater' when the serial killer tortured the man by cutting him and leaving him for the rats to eat...who knows? I imagine the writers all grew up reading Manhunt and its like. 'Rat Hater' certainly conjures images that are hard to exorcise.

By the way, those who aren't watching CM are missing one of the best hours on television.

Harlan Haiku
Harlan Ellison
Makes other scribes jealous, son.
HE, is Nobel One.

Harlan Ellison
Harlequin beneath the skin
Horror's favored son

Haiku:

Harlan Ellis-ain't
Mister Cordwainer Bird 'less
The man fuck him up


(I think I've had one too many beers.)

Harlku
Harlan Ellison
The devil can't write like he
His books: razor sharp

Haiku
Pheromones, pishaw
Ellison is a horndog
Now you are smiling

Haiku


Holy Fucking Shit!
Someone in Webderland Pukes
It's Alan Coil's fault

Ellison haiku.
65 degrees on Tuesday, cold and blustery on Wednesday, 27 degrees right now with snow flurries. (4:30pm EST)

Just in case there is someone who doesn't know, a haiku is
5 beats
7 beats
5 beats
Each beat may be a word or syllable (or sound effect, I'd guess)

Hows about we all write a haiku with the first line: Harlan Ellison. Here's mine.

Harlan Ellison
Listening to what he says
Won't drive you bugfuck

Harlan,

Thank you so very much for your reply and I shall send a note off to Susan at HERC to get the necessary information on joining. I have looked around the net, picking up editions that fit in gaps in my collection, but will be very pleased to get notice ahead of time for any new releases.

Thank you again for your reply.

Marlow

Bobby Hutcherson's Oblique, re-released remastered RVG edition. With Herbie Hancock on piano, Albert Stinson on bass, Joe Chambers on drums. They do a version of Hancock's Blow-Up theme. Tres cool.

rambling, ending with a question for Harlan
cool... I like this.

The Six String Samurai is cool; Buddy Holly inspired sword-slinger riposting to "If I were you, I'd run" with the line "If you were me, you'd be good lookin'." Cool.

Also cool:

Watching the first snowfall of the season (flurries here in Michigan) and realizing that, good things willing, I'll have a child before the last snowfall of the season.

Morphine (the band; baritone sax, drums, bass)

The opening line to Neuromancer.

Starting a car ride with five hours of an un-listened to Ellison audio.

That was me two weeks ago and I've been meaning to write a thank-you note to you, Harlan, ever since I got back. The cd set in question was 'Midnight in the Sunken Cathedral' and all I can say is: good god, sir. I was well aware of your chops as a writer, and had already read most of what was on the cd when I rented it. Likewise, I've heard you speak, in the lecture/question-and-answer sense of the word, and so I knew you had a certain stage presence. At least, I thought I'd known... hell, I had no idea. On that cd you brought a different voice to Every. Frickin'. Story.

How, how, HOW did you do that? Does it come with effort? Practice? Years of influence from radio and vaudville? Or is this talent just one of those things; some people can curl their tongues, wiggle their ears, etc - you just happen to have the moderately more startling ability to conjure a wide array of voices.

This generated some unexpected reactions to the readings, too. Your voice and the mental voice that accompanies what I read are more than a little different; I came out from Jeffty is Five with an angry ennervation I'd never picked up before. "Prince Myshkin, and Hold the Relish" had me just a shade too fascinated to actually slip into hysterics. And "Pennies off a Dead Man’s Eyes," well...

This is probably one of my favorite stories of yours, ever. Unlike, say, Jeffty, this voice I'd picked up on pretty accurately just from reading it, and hearing you act it out started me wondering all over again. Have you ever been concerned about being accused of using someone else's voice? This isn't a criticism of what you've written, but is something I've been wondering about.

I'm white. As a writer I'd rather not be restricted to just writing white voices for white characters, but... Maybe I'm overly sensitive, maybe college brainwashed me, but whatever the reason I'm left feeling like I don't have any right to write from a perspective with which I am not personally familiar. That I could be called out and pilloried for stealing, for co-opting a voice/heritage/issue that I have no right to use because I am not [insert ethnic background here].

You write so well that I can't really picture much in the way of criticism being leveled at what you've done, but I'm curious to hear anything you have to say on the matter. And has there ever been a time you've backed away from a writing in one voice or another?

COOL THINGS:
Recently got a chance to see my favorite Antonioni film, THE PASSENGER (starring Jack Nicholson), in a theater again for the first time in, oh, 30 years. It's coming out on dvd soon. (HARRY POTTER & THE GOBLET OF FIRE is swell, too.)

Listening to: Kate Bush's AERIAL, The Cardigan's SWEET EXTRA GRAVITY, Stevie Wonder's A TIME TO LOVE, Fiona Apple's EXTRAORDINARY MACHINE (the album of the year), The New Pornographers' TWIN CINEMA, Regina Spektor's SOVIET KITSCH, and Aram Khachaturian's GAYANE suites. (Note to DWIGHT: Please post your home address so I can play these for you from the sidewalk outside youe bedroom window some night. Asshole.)

Austria...land of free speech - not.

Hitler's home country will toss you in the slam for 20 years for saying the wrong thing:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051117/ap_on_re_eu/austria_irving_arrested

Irony. It's a bitter pill, Mr. Irving.

Cool stuff ahoy!
The Harold Lloyd Comedy Collection Vols. 1-3 just released on DVD.

The Burial at Thebes : A Version of Sophocles' Antigone (Paperback)
by Seamus Heaney (Translator)

Love Cannot Bear
by Robert Fripp (Audio CD, you know, music)

I am looking forward to seeing the Egon Schiele retrospective at the Neue Galerie this Sunday, although I suppose his work is fairly confrontational. I will be meeting an old classmate for coffee at the museum's cafe. Now that I think about it, that may be fairly confrontational too.

I did see Andrew Lloyd Webber's "Woman in White" at the Mariott Marquis last night. It wasn't confrontational, but it was awful in every other regard, and the theater smells like a cistern.

Webber is the most amazing talent-void. He's so talentless, it's almost as if other people's talent cannot escape the gravitational pull of his mediocrity. I sat through the entire shower of shrieking dreck with my eyes open, stone cold sober to boot, and am unable to tell you if any of the cast could so much as carry a tune in a sponge.

By the way, the Mariott Marquis, in addition to possessing all the architectonic grace of a men's room in the Death Star, has the most uncomfortable seats of any theater in the entire city. If I sit somewhere for six hours and wind up with a sore rear like that, I expect at least to be landing very shortly in France. Or saying good morning to Colin Farrell.

Or something.

I don't think I'm very good at this "not, um, mean" thing.

I blame my parents.

Things that are cool? Yes, LOST is very cool. LOST is one of the best shows ever produced for television. It hasn’t hit a sophomore slump in the least, in fact, it’s better than ever.

Old Kubert stuff is cool (did I ever tell you that he was a member of my father’s congregation back when we lived in Dover, NJ….Kubert still does…..and I would play basketball with Andy in our junior jew group. Andy used to be one of those kids who, regardless how young, you needed to flinch back when he was around because he would always be hitting you….y’know, those punchy kids who even hit adults). Anyway, old Kubert stuff is cool, but what is cooler is that he is still producing great stuff today and has a new Sgt Rock mini-series about to come out.

Portable DVD players are cool. Mine allows me to get through many of my backlog of discs while taking the dogs for their excretory visit around the backyard each night. I sit in my lawn chair, watch some old Sergio Leone pastawesterns at 10-15 minute intervals, while the dogs do their things. When Nova begins to eat leaves, then it’s time to go in.

Fall and Winter in Phoenix is cool. Never cold, just cool. It’s time for everyone to come out of their A/C hibernation and visit some of the weekly outdoor festivals that have now begun. Last week was the Fountain Hills Arts Festival which surrounds a beautiful park and pond with the country’s highest spouting (world’s highest spouting?) fountain that spurts impressively each hour at 15 minute intervals. 500 artists sell their wares, pack up, and prepare for the Tempe Arts Street Festival in two weeks. And then my favorite, the Indian artists festival at Indian School Park in central Phoenix, where I can barter for freshly made, beautiful and expensive Kachinas.

The original King Kong coming out on DVD for the first time, along with a 2 hour documentary and Son of Kong, Mighty Joe Young and something else that slips my mind: that’s cool. Whether you loathe remakes, or whether you give them a chance, Peter Jackson’s King Kong looks very very cool. Keeping it a period piece (wait, you can’t KEEP something a period piece when the original was from that period) was a smart move, and could probably have only been done by Peter Jackson and his newfound Hollywood power. Yes, we all love the original Kong with his constantly flowing hair, and we all want to look down on remakes…..but I expect cool from this one, and if not, at least it’s the reason why the original Kong is appearing in DVD. Finally.

Oh, and let's not forget. Harlan is cool. Just that name is cool....it rolls off the tongue: HARLANELLISON. Perfect for Haiku:

Harlan Ellison
He isn't a sci-fi guy
Say so and you die


-TODD

Maybe we should have a Pavillion day or two in which we describe cool stuff that isn't irritating, confrontational or, um, mean.

Lost was cool last night, with its humanization of Ana Lucia. And the Joe Kubert Tarzan archives volume 1. comes out today from Dark Horse. 200 pages of Kuberty goodness originally published at DC in the 1970's and featuring everyone's favourite jungle hero!

Cheers, Jon

LORD HALIFAX:
Uh... thanks for sharing... uh, I guess...

I would like to have an orgy with Cate Blanchett, Tilda Swinton, Gwyneth Paltrow, Naomi Watts and Uma Thurman in an extra large heart shaped bed with mirrors over the top and a soap bubble machine going. After that I could die in peace.

I lived for two years on 181st and Riverside in the 1980's.

There was a lot of ethnic music being played at excessive volumes then, too.

I guess ethinic music is not linked to global warming after all.

It's the middle of November temperatures are in the 70's in New York, there are lot's of Puerto Rican's listening to their ethnic music at excessive volumes on their Sony portable stereo systems. Thing's just aren't like they used to be....

What?
Harlan bought you a round of drinks and you....

1> Threw a tumbler of single malt in his face?

2> Poured it on the carpet and loudly demanded any writer present in the restaurant to lick it up?

3> Hid a really obvious joke in plain sight?

Flummoxed, I remain... flummoxed.

oral delights

Yesterday, I went to the central library to see LA attorney Lesley Klinger speak about the third and final volume of his brand-new annotated Sherlock Holmes. Normally, I assiduously avoid pinioning authors with an obvious question, but this one was unavoidable: Having lugged around -- with great affection -- my boxed set of W.S. Baring-Gould's annotated Holmes for about 28 years now, I had to ask Klinger how his version differs. How well did he answer? Well, suffice it to say that with great anguish I added $150 to one of my credit cards at the end of the talk.

Fortunately, in the course of answering other people's questions, Klinger said that, apart from the Hound, his favorite Holmes short story might be "The Adventure of the Blue Carbuncle," which enabled me to announce to the room that I am scheduled to read that particular story aloud for my "Story Time for Grownups" in December, so I got to pass out or collect email addresses and phone numbers from interested parties afterward.


On Monday, November 21, the Readers Theatre of Mt. Hood Repertory Company will present a dramatic reading of George Bernard Shaw's "The Devil's Disciple," a tale of the American Revolution set in 1777 shortly before the Battle of Saratoga.

Richard Dudgeon is shunned by all as the freethinker whom everyone knows as "the Devil's Disciple," but the Redcoats mistake him for the Reverend Anthony Anderson, a Presbyterian minister they intend to hang as an example to the rebels, and Richard has to decide what he's going to do -- especially under the gaze of the Reverend's pretty, youthful wife Judith.

Readers Theatre is a relaxed, casual evening of play reading by professional actors from the Portland area. (Then there's me; director Keith Scales unaccountably cast me as General Burgoyne, the urbane and literary soldier known -- mostly behind his back -- as "Gentlemanly Johnny.")

The show is next Monday, Nov. 21, at 7:00 p.m. The performance will occur in the 80-seat theater of Reynolds Middle School on the corner of East 201st and Halsey in Fairview. Tickets are $7.

For more information and a map, go to www.mthoodrep.org

BARBERism
STEVE:

Wheeew.

Well, your little jape succeeded. You had me troubled, upset, concerned, bothered, beetle-browed, querulous, rattled, canted, worried and unmanned. After reading your first post, I had to wait two and a half days to get in touch with Lakesha, because she's closed on Mondays, and doesn't come in for dinner on Tueday till 5:00. And so, I was distended for two worrisome days till I could reach her last night BEFORE I posted to you. You'll be pleased to know she would not "speak of it" to me, and said I was to have a tete-a-tete with her when I arrive for dinner with out of town guests tomorrow evening.

Would not "speak of it."

"How well do you know these people?" she asked.

"Not at all," I replied, already upset. "The man appears on my website, I'm not sure I've even met the women. Why??? What the hell happened??? Why this talk of credit cards and cleaning charges and such...???"

She would not go into detail, would not "speak of it."

So. Much troubled, for obvious reasons, I entered my post to you.

Now I have an answer.

I will "play along" with this gag, and commend you on the effectation of a "joke on the jokester," and will allow Lakesha to bring it to fruition tomorrow night.

No need to do anything. I will not surprise her with advance knowledge of my having been let into the loop.

And I cannot thank you enough for having added to my daily burden of tsuriss and emotional drain. Perhaps you'll be able to explain to Susan and Sharon why I spent the last two days in a funk, snapping at them for no apparent reason.

Apparent.

I will no further "speak of it."

Harlan

Good Wishes for Stan and More on White Phosphorus
Stan, allow me to also wish a very speedy and complete recovery to your wife

As for Elijah's posting on the use of white phosphorus, I have some additional details and links to articles to share, as I was the individual who originally posted the article on its use in Fallujah.

According to the data I have been able to gather, Elijah is correct, white phosphorus is not a banned weapon under the Chemical Weapons Convention. However, that is more a technicality than anything else, as it is a very dangerous chemical agent whose properties are very similar to many other weapons that are banned.

Here is a quote from a BBC article:

Professor Paul Rodgers, of the University of Bradford's department of peace studies, said white phosphorus could be considered a chemical weapon if deliberately aimed at civilians.

He told PM: "It is not counted under the chemical weapons convention in its normal use but, although it is a matter of legal niceties, it probably does fall into the category of chemical weapons if it is used for this kind of purpose directly against people."


The sad fact that is emerging is that we fired a chemical agent that could actually melt skin into an area that had both civilians and insurgents. More than that, they lied about its use. At first, the military denied the use of white phosphorus completely, then amended that to state that it was only used for illumination purposes, then admitted that it was used within Fallujah itself. If there was really nothing wrong with their actions, why lie in the first place?

Here are a couple of links to some addition articles on the use of the Weapon of Mass Destruction within Iraq:

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/article327094.ece

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4440664.stm

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2005/11/9/164137/436

Well, sometimes you get the gag, and sometimes the gag gets you.

Does anyone know how Tom Snyder is, btw? When he stopped blogging, he seemed to have dealt with some health stuff and been faced with some other health stuff. A good interviewer and, so far as i could tell from out here in TV Land, a nice fellow. Now sit back, relax, and watch the colored pictures fly through the air, thanks to our good friends at Bacardi.

My other observation for the day is that a lot of people are model train aficiandos -- one Snyder interview revealed Meat Loaf's love of Lionel (?) trains, and apparently Neil Young loves 'em too, to the tune of co-owning the company.

Cheers, Jon

Sucking Out
Okay, agreed. I sucked out.

It was my first time staring down the twin-barrelled eyebeams of Mr. E. Suddenly, visions of time-honored retributions; week-old packages of gopher carcasses sent book rate; the very palpable moment in time when seated, dining, in my favorite restaurant when -- behind me and very close -- I would hear "so YOU'RE that suck-a** weasel who tried to put one over on ME???"

And so on.

In my own little world I'm probably up to it. Here on the main stage, however...

A friend of mine once wrote (probably stealing)
"So, it seems, it's not the twisted mind that's the problem, but the supply of alcohol.
Funny how it can all be reduced to economics like that."


Sorry Dima, sorry Lakesha.

Harlan: If you need me, my true name is George W and I live in Washington.



(I know. I suck.)

***Jeff*** "which looks to BE A nice compilation..." Hey, if you're going to cut and paste me, please proof me and clean up my typos, would'ja? ;-)

Yeah, after a quarter of a century plus of dumbass celebrity interviews, that one still lives on in memory as "must be seen to be believed" television. After that, the Dan Akroyd SNL sketch was more like cinema verite than parody.

My other favorite from around the same time was David Bowie on Merv Griffen singing FAME. Since the song is almost a round like "row row row your boat", once you decide which track/chorus you're going to sing you spend half the song waiting for your part to come around again. Then he sits down for the interview and CANNOT stop sniffling. I was in high school and even I knew he was coked to the gills. Griffen asks him if he has a cold. Bowie does a double-take, checks out the audience of blue haired ladies and says, "yeah, right, that's it, a cold, guvner", and they moved on. Funny stuff.

- Barney

Things must be a little slow in L.A. this week.

Steve!!!! Nooooooooo.
Man, you gotta call me before something like this happens! You caved! I'm bored in Boston and I coulda come up with at LEAST 10 ways for you to turn this! Arrrgh. I mean ARRRGH.


Joke Setup = 7.5 (it was very good, but the inspecifics sounded fishy to me)

Joke Execution = 1 (dismal, I tell you, to see you cave like that. Be bold. BOLD!)

-Keith

Sir Arthur C received the Lankabhimanya award, the highest civilian award in Sri Lanka.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20051114/sc_nm/srilanka_clarke_dc

Cheerios boxes have childrens books in them for their current promotional/free item. And that's all nice and dandy for kids. But it's a darn shame General Mills (or any other cereal company) never thinks about the adults who eat their breakfast foods. How cool would it be to open a box of Cheerios and find a short story by HE, Sir Clarke, Bloch, Silverberg, Chabon, or anyone. "Little Quack" and "No Dogs Allowed!" (the 2 kiddie books that have come in my cereal thus far) just don't do it for me.

Cripes
(I should wait until morning, but hope this merits a second post.)

Harlan - Okay, plans went awry. Lakesha felt she would speak to you today, and hence a badly planned leg-pulling (unless, of course, you're pulling mine and actually HAVE talked to her). Just a chance to play with the master of practical pranks.

Nothing happened. Nada. No spillage, no damage, no hits, runs or errors. No massive credit-card bills. Nothing but a purely fun evening, with perhaps just a bit too much mischief afoot.

From even further beneath the rock,

Steve B

(And yes, on certain things I fold like an origami swan)

If a goat is a kind-of-a-ram; and a mule is an ass, why is a ram in the ass a goose?

BARBER: Before I speak to Lakesha later this week, just simply tell me what happened.

I am not smiling as I write this.

Harlan

Hey Barney,

Which looks to ba nice compilation of all those interviews Tom Snyder did with Punks and proto-Punks over the years. I distinctly remember the trainwreck interviews with Wendy O' Williams and John Lydon.

a big "hell yeah" to that remembrance. I saw the interview with the Pistols and to this day remember Johnny Rotten being completely rude then having Snyder say, "Pardon me while you're interupting". I still use that one today and find more and more opportunities for its usage as more and more people take their breaks from talking to grab a breath and talk some more while ignoring what i say. Sheeeeeeesh!

First Amendment Minute
Hey everyone,

I found an interesting website: firstamendmentminute.com.

From the homepage:

"The First Amendment Minute is a topical, fast paced, entertaining, and informative 60 second look at freedom of speech, religion and other liberties protected by the First Amendment. Every week join Derek Newman for his solidly legal, sometimes laughable, seldom lame, up-to-the-minute take on these Constitutional freedoms we enjoy."

You can listen to mp3 archives of previous "minutes" (about a minute long -- hence the name) covering such topics as regulating radio, "adult entertainment," terrorist litmus tests, etc. You need Quicktime, but each download is small; less than, well, a minute or so on an average dialup connection (a few seconds on DSL).

Check it out and let me know what you think. -- duane

footnoting an earlier topic
The following is apropos of nothing, but as I stumbled onto the following today I thought I'd pass it along as a sort of follow up. Apologies for the non-sequitor, I assume it'll be no trouble for the disinterested to scroll past.

About a week ago, give or take, someone posted a story concerning the possible use of white phosphorous by U.S. troops in Iraq. The article (I've tried and failed to find the link in the archives here, sorry) was broken by the Italian media and seemed prominently based on evidence presented by Iraqi doctors and such. I can't speak for anyone else, but I was a bit skeptical.

Today, the following fell into my lap today (via boing-boing.net, if anyone's wondering):
Marines Quiet About Brutal New Weapon
http://www.defensetech.org/archives/001944.html
"a thermobaric mixture which ignites the air, producing a shockwave of unparalleled destructive power, especially against buildings"

While apparently this new weapon was used in Fallujah (which left me wondering if it could be tied to the Italian story) at the conclusion there is a link to a more in depth article regarding what does and does not constitute a chemical weapon, shifting the discussion specifically to white phosphorous:

http://armchairgeneralist.typepad.com/my_weblog/2005/11/its_not_chemica.html
It's NOT Chemical Warfare
We like WP because when you're under fire by snipers or groups of hostile people that you can't immediately reach out and touch, you can call for fire and get a nice, thick smoke screen between you and them very, very quickly. Yes, WP has some nasty qualities, and maybe particles of the WP fall off and hit people, but it's quick and it saves U.S. military lives. Because the fighting is in an urban area, some of those people hurt might be noncombatants. But we don't use "phosphorus munitions" to target and hurt civilians. Not only is it very inefficient (why not just drop HE?), it's not moral. And our soldiers (relatively speaking) are better than that.

...and a bit later...

The U.S. military has made a clear distinction between chemical-filled munitions and chemical warfare munitions since World War II, and the funny thing is, most of the world's nations agree with us (check out the Chemical Weapons Convention sometime). IT'S NOT CHEMICAL WARFARE. It's conventional warfare, period, when a military force uses an incendiary weapon to attack an adversary's position. There is nothing like flame to scare the crap out of the enemy, and it's very effective.

All that being said, the article concludes with the following update: "Well, evidently the Army IS using WP in a direct-fire mode against combatant targets." and links to a .pdf by way of explaination:
The Fight for Fallujah
http://sill-www.army.mil/FAMAG/Previous_Editions/05/mar-apr05/PAGE24-30.pdf
page 26
"WP proved to be an effective and versatile mutition. We used it for screening missions at two breeches and, later in the fight, as a potent psychological weapon against the insurgents in trench lines and spider holes when we could not get effects on them with HE. We fired 'shake and bake' missions at the insurgents, using WP to flush them out and HE to take them out."


I will resist editorializing; my only plan was to supplement information provided earlier.

Tom Snyder tidbits
***Stan*** Perservere and my very best wishes to your wife for a full and speedy recovery. If they can fix the throats of sinners like me and Charlie Watts, I have very high hopes for the innocent.

***Others*** A friend just sent me this;

http://www.tvshowsondvd.com/newsitem.cfm?NewsID=4489

Which looks to ba nice compilation of all those interviews Tom Snyder did with Punks and proto-Punks over the years. I distinctly remember the trainwreck interviews with Wendy O' Williams and John Lydon. Good times.

This leads me to believe there could be more in the offing. If not a DVD of just Harlan's appearances on The Tomorrow Show, then perhaps a "best of authors appearances", or, forgive me, SF related appearances.

Well, I can hope.

- Barney Dannelke

Harlan, you might like this. Matt Welch writing in Reason magazine:

"To this day, journalists discuss Talese’s 1966 Esquire piece 'Frank Sinatra Has a Cold' in the same reverent tones with which originalists describe the Constitution."

Jay--karma points are good at Starbucks? I am getting SO many chai lattes.

And a banana nut muffin.

Thanks for the heads-up!

Mrs. Ellison,

I just picked up a money order for the Limited Edition and should have it in the mail today or tomorrow, in which case, it should reach you post-haste. eeggouchh that pun hurt!
Thanks

> I just read your February 28, 2000 review of A.M Homes'
> book "The End of Alice"

You mean the one on Amazon? Holy cow, you must have dug deep to bring that one up! I trust you looked at some of the other, highly-offended reviews -- they're hilarious. As a writer, Homes can do anything, I am convinced. Check out _The Safety of Objects_, if you haven't already: It has some fairly hair-raising but admirable tales, including the title one about a young teen male who has an affair with his older sister's Barbie. Her latest book of stories includes on that imagines, fairly straight, what life was like for Ron and Nancy Reagan in their last days. And she's a babe, on top of it. (Not that that matters.)

I meant to include a note to Stan yesterday: Sending warm thoughts and lots of hope your way.

Owning Up - Harlan
Harlan,

Thank you for the recommendation of L'Kesh for Sunday night, and for the round of drinks you so generously bought for us. You're exactly right. The food is terrific and Lakesha herself is an utter delight -- as is her sister!

Now the hard part. You've likely, at this point, spoken to Lakesha and have some understanding of my little gymnastic gaffe. I have already let Lakesha know that you had no idea I'd do something quite so klutzy, and I sincerely hope she doesn't regard you with any less love and respect as a result. Dima and my wife were similarly horrified.

Lakesha has my credit card number for laundering and carpet cleaning, but she indicated she'd be speaking with you about this.

With sincerest of apologies, and from well beneath a rock somewhere in the Mohave Desert,

Steve B

Karmic Xfer Notice
Upon receipt of ten-thousand +karma points for whatever good I did this week, I hereby transfer the balance what I didn't already owe my own wife and kiddies to Charlotte for use as she pleases (+karma transferrable, net worth x2 in transfer = 5,000 +karma). Redeemable at any church, synagogue, mosque, participating starbucks, or the universal church of payitforward; Kirby Hensley Pope-rioter.

Seriously, our best hopes and thoughts for you both.

Stan:

I've been away from the Pavilion for a week or so, but please allow me to add my best wishes for Charlotte's health to the many other kind thoughts expressed here. May mercy find you both.

D.

Harlan,
Thank you for your reply to my question! I like asking the Big Questions. They're fun! Your reply was excellent, and has me squirming with urges to say a lot, ask, discuss, maybe argue. But mostly, I am just being quiet and reading thoughtfully. This paper will be a learning experience for me in a number of ways, not just for technical aspects, but because I'm asking a question that genuinely interests me. So, I am listening for now. =)

Having said all of that, I actually have one more question for you. This time, it is more specific. May I pose it to you?

Philip,

There's more than enough older material to fill the waiting period between new releases. As the Edgeworks were reprints of older works anyway, you can always just hunt down the books from previous printings. There's a catalogue here on the website, or any good internet used book store should have what you need to grow your Ellison library.

And if ya stick around here as a regular reader/poster, you're bound to get the scoop as new things come out.

REPLY TO PHILIP MARLOW

Sir:

Thank you for asking. Yes, there are about half a dozen new and semi-new things coming out. The newsletter of the Harlan Ellison Recording Collection (HERC), issued with sporadic regularity by Susan, enumerates same, with details. It saves me the time of repeating all that data infinitum.

I urge you to join up. Write to HERC, PO Box 55548, Sherman Oaks, CA 91413 for the subscription info ... or perhaps one of the good Webderlanders will reiterate it here in brief, for your convenience. It's a piddling amount for an au courant and snappy illustrated periodical that my good wife slaves over a hot stove to produce.

Again, thanks for asking. (Recent back issues will probably list an already-extant half-dozen items you might not know about.)

Respectfully, Harlan Ellison

Stan -- God bless you and your wife; I will say a prayer.

And may I say, you are a classy guy. So many on the net are argumentative and combative and a pain-in-the-butt. You, sir, are a gentleman.

Kate

STAN,

My thoughts are with you and your wife. Strength to you and yours from your southern neighbor.

DAVID LOFTUS,

I just read your February 28, 2000 review of A.M Homes' book "The End of Alice," and I must say that I agree with your assessment that it's an amazing book. I'm reading the book right now and find it disturbing yet compelling...and I don't mean warm and fuzzy compelling, but compelling from being well-written.

To Mr. Philip Marlow(e): Whereas you look forward to anything new by Harlan, I, on the otherhand, look forward to new adventures about you! It's been some time!

((Yeah, like you don't get that all the time))

-TODD

Harlan,

My pardon if this is a question that arises in the pavillion regularly, but I am new to the site--although not your work. Is there any new book coming out soon? Or resumption of the Edgework books? I look forward to seeing any new titles from you and pass on my bok money for new works of yours to enjoy.

Sincerely,

Philip Marlow

TO STAN:
Everyone else here said it much better than I could. The percentages are on your side. Please don't forget that.

maxim-al exposure

>Growing older is an honor none enjoy.
>And I liked it in a Deepak Chopra, pseudo-intellectual kind
> of way. I wonder if it is original?

Depends on the context. In the big picture, it's probably not original because almost nothing is.

But if nobody around you has heard of it, it's original enough. Use it often and claim it proudly until someone informs you otherwise.

A GREAT BIG THANIK YOU!
Yes...a great big thank you to all of you here on Pavilion and very special thank you to you Harlan.

So far....my wife has not heard from the second biopsy. Maybe sometime today...hope for the best. She is, going for a second opinion and our insurance provider and hospital cannot refuse her that.

To the few on here who profess being Christian...thank you for your prayers.

To the many on here who are agnostic or call themselves atheist...thank you for your thoughts.

and finally to those of you who are like me...more questioning of organized religion but still hold on to a basic belief whether it be God or E.T. A big thank you to you all.

TO UNCA HARLAN...We will probably never meet. But I want to make a special thanks to you (and to Susan), for being who you are...for making us all think with our brain...maybe in conjunction with our heart, for allowing a Conservative Republican like me, to love and cherish the words you have put down in the form of novels and short stories...and who still thinks Hollywood is shafting one of the greatest writers of television, movies, short stories and novels to come down the literary pike. Poltically and spiritually we probably do not agree...but in the long run...it does not matter, we are all human and I would like to count you and your lovely wife as friends of mine. Thanks again.

STAN

Stan: I'm keeping a good thought for you and your wife.

Hang Tough,
Mark W.

Stan
Just another voice in the crowd, shoulder to shoulder with everyone else: my thoughts are with you and your wife. You have my every sympathy just for being in such a situation, but please don't give up when the fight's not over. Persevere and good luck.

Random thought
I was just in a colleague's office and we were talking about "Oingo Boingo" and, "They Might be Giants," and we were both in the later years of high school when those groups were in their prime. She said something to the effect that we were getting old, and sighed. Then I said:

Growing older is an honor none enjoy.

And I liked it in a Deepak Chopra, pseudo-intellectual kind of way. I wonder if it is original?

-Keith

Stan,

Best wishes to you and your wife.

BOOK/RECORDING/HERC Order
Mrs. Susan "Glad to have you in my clutches" Ellison,

I'll send the order in as you specified.

Thanks for quick response,
Kelly.

Dear Stan -

There are periods in the life of each human being during which we look around and it seems like all we see is loss - and as often as not, it's more than merely "seems like". And it's never just one stretch: such periods often recur. And there are no words to describe the feelings of helplessness and rage and terror of such times.

I can only think of two things that can lend the least iota of comfort. First, as Unca Harlan often states so eloquently in his work, you are not alone. We all either have gone or will go through such horrific times ourselves; and I think I can say with some assurance that everyone of us here stand ready with all the comfort and encouragement we can offer.

Second, should worse come to worst, I've found some peace in remembering that life is a temporary proposition and at the base of it, we're all just on loan to each other - it's the time we have together that's the real treasure.

So: go cherish each other. The future and what it holds will arrive whatever else you do.

Cheers,
Doc

Stan, my regards and thoughts to your wife. Hope things get better for the both of you.

--Eric

Stan
.
My good thoughts are with you and your wife and family. It must be hard, with so much adversity striking in such a short time. Take care, but don't give up.

Remember that you'll always be able to get a leg up, a shoulder to lean on, a pat on the back, and even an occasional ass kicking, here. That's what friends and family do.

-Keith

Stan -

Hang in there. Yeah, I know from personal experience that life is often an exercise in futility and depression, but it almost always gets better, given time and the right people. (Hm. Reading that it becomes too obvious I'm also in a 'down' period right now).

Hang in there, friend - you're not alone.

cd

Words can only help so much. Stan, none of us can promise that things will get better. We hope your wife pulls through. And we know that you will _endure_. You may find yourself with the worst days of your life. Your wife will need help after the operation. But endure. We can't promise that any joys that come will be great, or that there's some kind of reward for it.

But every day that you _do_ continue, that you _do_ endure, is a victory against pain and emptiness.

Stan and Family


yes, what they all said

Respectfully,
Neal

Yeah, Stan...saw your post only now. These are the moments life presents its roughest challenges, the ones so blatantly unfair. I honestly hope your situation finds a ray of light.

Stan, please add us to the list of those who wish the best for you and your family. Going through bad times is never easy, so if it helps even a little, keep posting. There's a lot of good resources here, and a pretty deep well of compassion, too.

Alice and John

Likewise, Stan, our thoughts are with you and your wife.

Michael and Alia

Stan,
I can't even imagine what you're feeling. I will pray for you and Charlotte and for your family. Everything that Harlan conveyed to you, everything that Alex Krislov and Alex Jay wrote is right and correct. My heart goes out to yours along with my hopes for Charlotte's complete recovery. Please keep us posted here.

Cindy

Stan
Our thoughts and prayers are with you, Stan. If there is--indeed--a God, keep in mind that just because He sees every sparrow fall does not mean that He's shooting them down with a cosmic shotgun. Things do NOT always happen for a reason.

Amen.

STAN:

We are here if you need us. And we care. Beyond that, words are well-meant, but no more than words. Repeatedly, we all stand in front of that dark doorway, and when the tears run out there is only courage.

May your God, and all the others, go with you in the dark places. Courage, Stan.

With hope, from your friends here,

Harlan

Stan, hang in there
I've got Barrett's esophogus with dysplasia, myself, and repeated checks haven't shown cancer. Yes, be prepared for the worst--but don't assume it. Stay strong for your wife and for yourself.

STAN,

God's "punishing" you? For what? Despite what the more hardcore Christian sects might believe, God has no interest in the pursuit of punishment. If anything, God "punished" us by simply making us human, warts and all.

My sincerest prayers go out to you and your wife.

Stan
Allow me to join the chorus. You've got my thoughts, prayers and any other services can be provided. Listen to Alex J, he is right to point out the percentages work the other direction.

The pain is undoubtedly intensified in that all this is happening to your loved ones and you feel there is nothing you can do. Hold her hand, steady her shoulders, tend to her bruises, love her intensely -- that's what she needs right now and for the forseeable future, and that's what you've been doing right along. That will get the two of you through this.

Go fight the good fight and we'll "see" you when she's better. Even a Louzyrepublican suchiz y'self. Godspeed.

Stan:

What Alex said. If God listens to agnostics, I'll put in a good word for you. Don't try to second-guess The Big Deity by thinking he's punishing you. It may have nothing to do with that.

And remember to focus on the ninety to ninety five percent.

Chuck

STAN: Compassion knows no political affiliation. My thoughts are with you and your wife.

(And do me a few favors: Remember that five to ten percent chance of NO means a ninety to ninety-five percent chance of YES. I were you, I'd start thinking of what to get her for your thirty-eighth, and for the anniversary after that, and after THAT ...

Do keep us posted, please.

Harlan photography
Seeking professional-quality photo(s) of Harlan suitable for framing.

Our thoughts (And in the case of theists, prayers) are with you Stan.

Kristin

A SPECIAL NEED
Well people...just need your thoughts and prayers (for those of you who still believe in God). My wife has been diagnosed with Barrett's Esophagus with high end Dyspasia...the dyspasia is almost always cancerous. On November 29th, she will be going into a local hospital here in the Portland area. MY wife Charlotte and I have been married for over thirty seven years...looking at the possibility of losing her (there is a five or ten percent chance she might not survive the operation, which involves removal of the esophagus and stretching the upper portion of her stomach up to replace it. So....you can see that I will be putting things on hold...including expounding on here or even getting back to my story writing.
If God is out there....I think he is punishing me by having go through the hell of losing everyone around me....first it was the murder of my only brother...then my dad died in 2003...and now I just might have to go through hell again by the possible loss of my wife. All I know is ... the past five years have not gone well for me...am not looking forward to any good future. Harlan? Take care of yourself good buddy...Susan? Cherish the time you have with him, because you never know when the unthinkable can happen. Time with friends, and family are very precious...thanks again, to you Harlan and to your web server for letting me expound my thoughts...even though I am a die-hard Conservative and Republican ... Ha!

STAN BLUMENTHAL
Beaverton, Oregon USA

Generalissimo Francisco Franco and Lenny Bruce - still dead.

That header may or may not work, but it is presented in the spirit of "sick" humor and also to reference his contined influence, so sue me.

http://www.netflix.com/MovieDisplay?movieid=70041214&trkid=148483

The Lenny Bruce "Performance Film" comes out on DVD this week and includes the Lone Ranger animated short. It's not really rare and sadly it documents that period near the end of his career when he was reading his court transcripts with running commentary, BUT, it is one of those things you should see at least once. Now at last in a more durable format.

For anybody coming in late to this show, the Harlan/Lenny Bruce connection is that when Harlan was working at ROGUE magazine in the early 1960's Lenny Bruce had a monthly column called BRUCE HERE that Harlan, umm, ghost wrote. I only put the "umm" in there because I don't know that Harlan has ever tried to quantify the level of input on either end and I don't want to take anything away from either of them. The way Harlan has occasionally told it, he would take shtick [schtick?] scrawled on cocktail napkins and turn them into whole columns. I've seen and heard Harlan repeat long complicated remarks by other people verbatim. I've also seen Harlan make up outrageous material on the spot just to see the look on someones face. SO, this is where the "umm" and qualifications come in. But, nevertheless, that's the Lenny Bruce connection.

If this gets traction I can repost some of Harlan's remarks on Bruce - or, Doug Lane can - so that Harlan doesn't have to chew his cud twice.

question: How do kids these days keep those nightgown length white t-shirts so damned white?

answer: Blee-acchh!!

- Barney

Hellinabucket, PA.

Weekend Stuff
For anyone checking on over the weekend, plans are for Cafe L'Kesh at 7pm Sunday. Reservations recommended.

Brad--Many thanks.

--Susan

Susan - Both of Harlan's episodes are in the season 1 package.

THE HUNGER - UK EDITION

Brad--Thanks for the info. Question: Are Harlan's episodes in the series 1 or series 2 package?

Thanks--Susan

Harlan - Don't know if this of any interest to you, but the first series of THE HUNGER, containing the two 'Cordwainer Bird' episodes, has just been released on DVD in the UK.

Cindy, I'm fine and will drop you a line before going back out.

On minor Harlan spotting, I recieved the Columbia DVD of the extended version of Major Dundee yesterday. Exploring the special features, there is a short documentary concerning the film where L.Q Jones is interviewed whilst a poster of "A Boy & his Dog" is prominately displayed.

FAQ

Kelly:

I have no problem with sending the book order and HERC membership/order in the same envelope, but the book check is payable to THE KILIMANJARO CORPORATION while the HERC stuff is payable to THE HARLAN ELLISON RECORDING COLLECTION. Glad to have you in my clutches. [Did I say that out loud?]

With kind regards--Susan

Jason, I checked out the link. That has to be one of the funniest things I have ever read. "The COULTER Laws?" Hannity and Liddy in charge of some deep, dark underground? Ho!

It's satire, pure and simple.

If anyone is offended by this, it's probably a measure of personal provinciality, and proof that yet another brilliant satirist has hit his target.

Mrs. Ellison,

Yes Ma'am I definitely would like a copy. Just wanted to make sure I send you the correct amount. Thanks.

NEOCON COMIC BOOK

http://accstudios.com/f/accproduct.htm

Oh dear god.

I actually believe I remember seeing this pitched in, of all places, one of Peter David's message boards (either his old AOL board or the comments sections on www.peterdavid.net, can't recall which). One of the ultra conservative trolls he so often attracts was going on and on about how all comic books were liberally biased and that wouldn't it be great if someone published HIS idea for a conservative comic? And then he went on to describe this exact comic book. This must have been a couple years ago at least. He phrased the whole thing as a sort of "dare" to the comic book industry - would they have the GUTS to print something that didn't kowtow to their "liberal jewish new york elite etc." worldview?

I can't believe he actually made it into print. I'm somewhere between appalled and impressed.

Brent:

You might check the Powells Books web site for Edgeworks 3 and 4. I often see copies on the shelf when I drop by there.

Being Difficult

Mrs. Ellison,

I'd like to order a recording (AN HOUR WITH HARLAN ELLISON) as well as a book (THE HARLAN ELLISON HORNBOOK) from the store.

I'm not yet a HERC member. May I send the HERC membership form, the order forms for the recording (requires HERC membership ID number) and the book all in one evelope with a single money order to cover the lot?

Kelly.

Mike: THE ESSENTIAL ELLISON -- Limited/Boxed/Numbered is $150.00 plus $5.00 S/H (and, if appropriate, 8 and 1/4% CA tax). Do you still wish a copy?

Alex: I'll hold one for you.

Brent: We do not have copies of EDGEWORKS 3 or 4 for sale. Sorry.

Thanks--Susan

Restaurant Recommendations
Harlan - Thank you for the recommendation. L'Kesh it is if I can coordinate with Dima and anyone else who wants to join us. Sunday at 7pm is the most likely time. (Reservations are highly recommended.) Stay tuned!

If I may exchange the favor? Not sure if you and Susan like Italian food, but, bar none, nothing, no one and nowhere, the very best garlic bread in the known universe can be found at Prizzi's Piazza in Hollywood (http://www.prizzispiazza.com/).

The rest of the food is danged good as well, but the garlic bread requires mega-doses of Lipitor prior to consumption -- a necessary step prior to the first eyeballs-rolling-back-in-the-head, look-of-pure-childlike-bliss, tears-rolling-down-your-cheeks, manna-from-heaven bite. Tell the owner Catherine that Cris Barber referred you. (She may allow you to sit inside.)

I will post the final plans (if any) tomorrow morning. One way or t'other, Cris and I will prolly be at L'Kesh Sunday at 7.

Mrs. Ellison,

I forgot to ask the most obvious of questions yesterday about the Limited Edition.. uhmm how much does it cost? Thanks for the help.

Term paper
Hi Erika. Two aspects I can think of that no one else here will think of ;-) are:

1. Science fiction stories have increased people's interest in technological developments because they have shown us what end results technology might advance towards. This increased interest in technology has also encouraged more people to go into science and thus to accelerate scientific/technological progress.

2. Science fiction literature has a smaller audience than sf (or "sci-fi") television and movies (which tend to mix sf notions with Hollywood storytelling standards), but literature of every kind filters through to a mass audience by well-known processes. It may well be that everyone asks themselves the question "what if?" a lot more than they normally would without sf movies and tv.

For example, we have seen the results of global warming in a number of films. In my estimation that's very important. To some degree the needs and opinions of the people determine where the money is spent and what laws are passed.

By the way, if I remember correctly, Harlan prefers the term "speculative fiction" (someone correct me). As you may well know, it is not necessarily the "fiction of the future" nor of science and technology. Science and speculation help writers create unusual environments for the characters to reveal themselves in through their actions.

Jan

Harlan,

That was one really nice, affecting little piece o'prose there.

That was a good angle, Erika. Ingenious. I wish I'd thought of it before. From now on when I seek a reply from da man I'm gonna wave a term paper around.

REPLY TO ERIKA OF THE TERM PAPER ERIKA

Kiddo, that is one complex bloody query. Seemingly tidy and small, it is--of course--deep and wide and openly requiring substantial original conceptualizing. Not easy to answer; and I'd be writing your entire paper if I were to attempt even a shortie. You sneaky li'l dickens, you.

But--unless other Webderlanders take up your cause and help you summat--here is a starting place concept no one else in your class will be thinking of (I guarantee it):

History is the River of Time, and it endlessly flows away from us unchanneled and wild. It has a personality and a demeanor all its own. It can be turned in any direction or be dammed by the smallest, least obvious individual, cultural artifact, scientific device, or idle word spoken at the precise pressure-point.

The ancient invention in Mesopotamia of the stirrup, so that charging horsemen could grip a horse's flanks with the knees, thus freeing their hands to use the bow and arrow, altered the course of battles, gave victory to nations without precedent, and changed the flow of the river.

The simple EXISTENCE of the atomic bomb changed the thinking of the entire world. UNCLE TOM'S CABIN, THE SEA AROUND US, Upton Sinclair's THE JUNGLE, as just three examples of the written word, have had powerful freightings for society. The automobile altered moality as well as commerce in America.

Paradigm shifts occur daily. It takes a futurist much cannier than I to spot the ones that will matter. And similarly, a story can cause an epiphany in some fifteen-year-old today, and ten, twenty years from now...that kid will invent a surefire male contraceptive pill and bring forth the answer to Malthusian overpopulation, the abortion controversy, the sheer face of society.

Who is to know what song sung today, will be the battle anthem of tomorrow? Stories and writing are powerful. Why do you think everyone tries to censor it?

That's the best I can do for you, Erika.

Good luck.

Yr. pal, Harlan Ellison

DIMA ... STEVE BARBER ... ET AL:

Take Dima to Cafe L'Kesh on Burbank between Van Nuys Blvd and Kester.

Tell Lekesha Harlan sent you.

You will adore me for this suggestion.

Yr. pal, Harlan (& Susan)

REPLY TO JOHN SIUNTRES

Sir:

You think those perfectly cordial, mild and bland as Buddha's countenance, querulous and quavering, mewling and whimperish comments were any sort of manifestation of the so-called

"Wrath of Harlan"

?

Surely, you pull my gotkes, Slim. I was no more than civilly responsive. A touch, a tad, a soupcon of gentle pique, mayhap; but

W R A T H

?

Ho, m'lad; you obviously dunno from WRATH.

But, yes, your offer of largesse is heartily, even imperially, received here. Please do send me a CD of my dear pal and long time editrix, Ms. Schutz, speaking her piece. You can post it to me care of

The Harlan Ellison Recording Collection
Post Office Box 55548
Sherman Oaks, California 91413-0548

And if you include your own return address, as well as a working telephone number, I will attempt to get in touch with you to discuss this "interview" business. I make no promises.

Respectfully, but hardly wrathfully,

Yr. pal, Harlan

More from the "we decide, you listen" crowd. Actually some on target parody- http://mysite.verizon.net/vze1ldyn/id2.html

Heading to London this Christmahanakwanzaa season, any decent bookstores to search out? Any to avoid??

A note to Susan...
Susan, if you've another limited Essential Ellison available, could you hold it for me? I'd like to buy an inscribed copy for a friend who did me a solid. I'll be sending payment along with an envelope I'd like included with the book, and, of course, an address (one out in L.A., as it happens).

Harlan,
Hi. :) I'm seeking your opinion, and thoughts for a term paper of mine: How influential do you feel that a science fiction story can be on how a society and its technology develops? What types of observations have you had?

Anything that you can share would be mighty gracious and helpful. =)

Dima in Town, LA Weather
Keith, wish I could add to your fantasy-trip visualizations, but it's a dreary, drizzly northwest-like day in LA. But, looking ahead, the 10-day promises our cherished sun will return tomorrow.

LA-based folks: I have Dima's contact info and she has mine. She's staying in the Century City area for several days on a business trip.

Email me if you might be interested in a board group get-together-something maybe this weekend. I'm thinking uniquely old-time "LA" like Pink's, Farmer's Market or maybe Cantor's. Late night?

Something in Hollywood or Santa Monica?

Jazz club?



Anyone? Anyone? Beuhller?

The Diana Schutz Interview
HE,

My apologies for not providing more step by step info about how to hear my mp3 shows. You're right, I did assume that by now most folk have computers with mp3 players pre-installed, and that the dissatifaction with RADIO has sent many like us t the net for more diverse sounds.

However, I also feel a little warm and fuzzy that something I did, (or didn't do) incurred the "Wrath Of Harlan"!
I've loved your stories and rants for decades, and now I'm a target. Unlike Scooter Libby & Karl Rove, that's fine by me! ;)

If you still havaen't heard the interview, and want to, I'd be glad to send you a CD copy. Please e-mail me an address.

If you also don't think I'd request a future converstaion with you for my show, you're nuts! It'd be a real honor.

As a guy who grew up in Wilmette, I'd make you talk about what the hell you were doing in Evanston, Il back in the day?

I'll hang up now, and wait for my answer,

John Siuntres
wordballoon.com

Warfare, WMDs, and silly little word games.

Mark Goldberg,

Followed the link you provided. I have trouble with the Italian language, but I was able to find the video footage referenced by the link. If we are using WMDs, it wouldn’t be the first time. The problem with warfare has always been that innocent people die. I don’t think it matters if they are targeted for attack, or just get in the way of an attack. Warfare is not like a sport, played on a field, with only 2 teams. It’s messy. I’m not condoning or excusing the death of innocent people, but people always seem to suggest an outrage at chemical or biological weapon use, but no outrage for war itself. It’s sick that we’re over there. Totally sick. I mean if 8000 civilians die by mines, or by bullets, or by bombs, or by nuclear weapons or by chemical weapons, aren’t they still dead? And doesn’t it require some crazy kind of mental disconnect on our part to actually differentiate between the means of their death? A gut-shot 8 year old boy probably suffers more pain and agony, and for a longer period of time, than a phosphorous coated one.

Thanks for the link though. Shows me more than ever what a huge mistake this Iraq thing was and is, and why the Neo-Cons approach is way off base. And yes, the irony you mention is glaringly obvious.

Mike Lane,

I take fantastical and obviously false pride in the fact that as soon as I moved from Maryland to Virginia, we Virginians elected a Democrat Governor and the Marylanders elected themselves a Republican one. Thereby short-circuiting my sister and brother-in-law's argument that I was moving from civilization into a Red-Neck zone. As if I was moving to Kansas or something! Sheeeit.

Dima!

Hi yourself! I’m still feeling guilty about Cleveland. I hope you and your husband have forgiven me by now. And, I’m envious about your trip to the West coast. I would love to step into LA or San Diego right about now and enjoy the weather. Or drive up the coast from LA to San Francisco and enjoy the magnificent views. I'm sure you'll have fun.

FinderDoug!

Good to hear your keyboard-voice again. Shoot me an e-mail if you can go hiking this weekend. I’ve always wanted to hike the Manassas Battlefield Park (since I heard about it last week from another friend of mine), and this weekend could be good for getting out. Then you and I can go out whoring and drinking in Manassas. Or maybe get a game of Scrabble going. Best word I ever used in Scrabble? UVULA, against a pediatric dentist’s wife and daughter at the Danzante resort in Baja last year. That was way fun. They creamed me, though.

Be seeing you!

-Keith

"I cannot fathom as to how some people can be so numbskullish to see G. Gordon Liddy or Ollie North as some sort of hero."

"But surely this series is supposed to be a parody!"

Does it matter? If the person did this _seriously_, then obviously they're more than a little cracked. If the person did it as a _satire_, then it magically turns into _funny_.

But this bit of alchemy requires that we know, or be told, about the person's motives and values. So, either we're asking for a Nod and a Wink to make the joke more explicit... or we have to have the joke _explained_ to us.

I think it's pretty funny no matter _what_ the creators intended. The picture of _Sean Hannity_, of all dickless wonders, scowling like Judge Dredd was priceless.

Nate P wrote:

"I cannot fathom as to how some people can be so numbskullish to see G. Gordon Liddy or Ollie North as some sort of hero."

But surely this series is supposed to be a parody!

Fountain Pens
Harlan/Susan: Just wanted to verify with the source, do you have any copies of EDGEWORKS vol. 3 or 4 for sale? I didn't see them listed on the order sheet.

Mitch:
I use a fountain pen that is almost 100 years old. A Waterman 52. I love it. They just don't make nibs like it anymore, no idea why. It is the old fashioned kind that sucks up the ink and can be messy, but that is part of the charm, in my opinion.

The nib is the key when it comes to smooth writing. If your pen has a crappy nib, not much you can do. If money was no object I would buy a Pelikan 800, I tried one the other day and it was heaven. Big fat pen, with a smooth as butter nib that flowed greatly. However, I think they are around $200 or more, I think a lot more actually. Being financially embarrassed, I just can't swing that myself right now. Your bank account may vary.

The other key thing is ink. Make sure you use nice ink, I have some Schaffer, although again like the Pelikan I was recently turned on to Lamy. Wow. Smooth as buttered up baby born in butterscotch. Once you have the smoothness and scratchy part taken care of my help ends. My handwriting isn't something that I'm particularly proud of, perhaps books can improve that somehow.

I enjoy writing things by hand, as it makes you think about what you're doing and give it so much more meaning when held in hands rather than seen on screen. However, my biggest problem is you can't find fountain pens or ink, you get looked at like you stepped on a baby when you inquire at office stores. There is only one store in my state I'm aware that sells them, and its like walking into a jewelry store, I can't justify buying anything in there. So, I'll have to look to mail order over the Internet soon, as my supply of ink is nearly gone. Ironic that I'll use modern technology to buy antiquated.

Dear Mrs. Ellison,

Thanks for the reply. If you can hold one for me, (limited edition) I'd be greatful. I will notify you via the board here on the date I send the payment. Thanks again and best wishes to you.

Sincerely
Mike Lane

Fountain Pens
Friends,
I have a request. I know that Mr. Ellison has a plethora of fountain pens and probably alot of you people do as well, so you should be able to help me. I've been buying fountain pens since my high school days (and that's been awhile ago), and have tried all kinds from the inexpensive to the not-so-inexpensive ones. Thing is, I've never had much luck writing with them. I love them, love the way they look, the idea of writing in an old-fashioned manner, love owning them (like I love owning books), but my writing stinks. Not only does my writing stink, the pens always feel 'scratchy' and the ink never flows like the manuals tell me it should. 'The nib should lightly rest opon the vellum, and with expansive flourishes, using a minimal of pressure, the very ebon liquid should flow like darkest, perfect, night...' yada, yada, yada. But the ink doesn't flow for me. At least not the way I'd like.
Here's my question: could you people give me some practical advice on the care and feeding of fountain pens? Or point me in the direction of some really good books on the subject? I've searched the net and my local bookstores, but their is a dearth of reading material on such things. Right now I am using (or trying to use) a Namiki Vanishing Point pen. A beautiful retractable pen my wife bought me for Christmas a few years ago. It is a pleasure to hold. But I'd really rather find pleasure in the writing.
I would really, really appreciate any practical advice you would give me. Thank you fellows and felletes.

Mk

Look what bullshit is availible at a comic store near you.

http://accstudios.com/f/accproduct.htm

I cannot fathom as to how some people can be so numbskullish to see G. Gordon Liddy or Ollie North as some sort of hero. Its almost just as bad as the swarms of idiots that have a hard-on for McCarthy.

Mike:

Re: THE ESSENTIAL ELLISON.

We a few limited editions available. The trade is available through the stores (or discounted to HERC members directly from Morpheus). If you want the limited, I'll hold one for you. Please advise.

Thanks--Susan

Keith - Wasn't that sweet? I feel as if a great weight has been lifted from the Commonwealth's shoulders... of course, why you need to widen 66 INSIDE the Beltway is beyond me - it's a hideous bitch goddess from Centreville to Gainesville from 4 to 7:30 every night.

The Good, the Still Good, and then there's Harlan's Royalties
Ezra - For every Kansas, there's a Pennsylvania.

"DOVER, Pennsylvania (Reuters) - Voters on Tuesday ousted a Pennsylvania local school board that promoted an "intelligent-design" alternative to teaching evolution, and elected a new slate of candidates who promised to remove the concept from science classes. "

In the next graph it mentions that 8 of the 9 existing board members were edumacated out of office.
________________________________________________

Dima - You post your note after most Webderlanders have posted for the day and (legally) cannot reply until after you lose your access. Keep my email above and I'll let you know if anyone else can get together while you're in the area. Let me know possible times and where you might want to meet.

I suggest "Pinks" -- I hear there may be quite the discussion on Russian literature going on.
________________________________________________

Harlan?

I DO know a bit about the publishing industry (second-hand, but still quite reliable).

$100 a year?

(Dude. *I* make more than that, and I'm a useless nobody hack.)

Does this mean orders from HERC are not only highly recommended, but are now be tax-deductable as support of the arts? Hmmmmm...?

LA
Hi everyone,

I will be in Los Angeles from the 10th to the 15th for a conference, and I was wondering whether any of the local webderlanders would like to get together? I will probably be free most evenings. I may not have internet access after tonight, so I will check back this evening in case anyone's interested.

Regards,
Dima

P.S. Hi Keith!

Keith
I was agreeing about the election results, that is. sorry bout the double post.

Dear Mr. Ellison,

Thanks very much for your reply. I admit freely to being ignorant about the publishing industry (along with numerous other subjects, unfortunately). Although it disappoints me to find hear (or read actually) that authors don't receive much in the way of compensation for the actual sales of their books, it doesn't really surprise me. I would expect large publishing companies to take advantage of authors. Or at least that is what I would assume to be true. Not having experienced the process first hand, is this assumption correct? Or are there publishing companies that treat authors fairly while others don't? Has the relationship between the publishing industry and authors changed over time? Are things better or worse now than in the past for new authors or are they the same? Or again does it depend on the company?

Please don't take my inquiry is an attempt to "tease the cat". Since visiting this site I have a pretty good impression of how you feel about working with the film and TV industry but not the publishing industry. My question comes strictly from curiosity about something with which I have absolutely no direct experience. I'm not trying to draw you into a tirade against (or for, for that matter) the publishing industry. Nor would I expect you to provide a list of your favorite companies or "name names" or anything like that. You have better things to do, I’m sure.

It is just that my personality, upbringing, etc. are such that I tend to be suspicious of large corporate interests as they relate to the individual. This is a prejudice. I admit that as well. Someone like yourself who has started from the bottom and risen to the top in this field, knows many different authors, and doesn't pull punches would be a good source for an opinion about such an industry and might make me reconsider my assumptions about it.

And finally, since you mentioned it, do you happen to have a copy of the latest Essential Ellison a 50 Years Retrospective I can buy direct from the author? I didn’t see them on the HERC list so I figured I’d just ask. Thanks again for your response and especially for your work.

Respectfully,
Mike Lane

For Keith Kramer

I agree wholeheartedly while wiping the sweat off my brow with absolutely profoundly perplexed yet astounded relief.

Belated Thanks to Rick & Interesting Article
Rick,

You do a great job here managing the board, thank you for all of your hard work and diligence in keeping all of us in line. Have a great time with the Ellisons, and I hope you will have some fun pictures to share with us after the visit.

I came across this article and cannot believe that it has not generated more public outcry:

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/middle_east/article325560.ece

I have no idea if the allegations within the article are true, but there needs to be a serious investigation on these charges. The use of white phosphorus in warfare is prohibited as it is a Weapon of Mass Destruction, and to use it within an urban warfare area to help secure a city (Fallujah), is nothing short of War Crimes.

I find it darkly ironic that the US was unable to find any WMDs within Iraq, yet we are accused of using them against the Iraqi population ourselves.

Kansas, Future Manufacturing Hub of the USA
-
Current State Motto: To the stars through difficulties

Suggested Motto 1: To hell with the stars.
Suggested Motto 2: We used to be progressive.
Suggested Motto 3: Seeing stars and difficulties.
and my number 4...

In the beginning there was Kansas, and it was good.

Peace Out. At least we hired ourselves another Democrat Governor in VA. If Kilgore hadn't been palling around with Bushy on the last day, it might have turned out a bit different. Thanks Prez!

-Keith

Let us all pause and thank the Lord for the good folks in Kansas rising up off their haunches and standing up against the ANTICHRIST COMMUNISTIC KABBALISTIC JIHADISTIC ATHEISTIC NO GOOD FILTHY LIBERALISTIC EVOLUTIONISTIC attempt to pull the hogwash over the eyes (how's that for a mixed metaphor) of the simple folk who know better cause well hell Pastor Collins down to First Assembly woulda told us if any that muhlarky was true!

Can a sponge think? (Sorry I stole that from INHERIT THE WIND.)

HE:

Here is a direct link to the Diana Schutz mp3.

http://www.wordballoon.com/media/wbDIANASCHUTZ.mp3

Depending on what web browser you are using, different things will happen, but in general you will be asked to either save the file to your computer so you can listen to it later, or open it immediately. (This may be the incomprehensible crap you mentioned in your post)

If you choose to open it immediately (or indeed even if you save it to your computer and choose to play it later) you will need software that can play mp3's. In which case, there are many free applications available if you don't have one already. Downloading and installing winamp prior to clicking the mp3 link from http://www.winamp.com would be a quick solution.


Brent

NATHAN PITTS:

Sorry, kiddo, but punching up that website takes me right back where I was before; and punching the 10/12 Schutz legend only brings up more incomprehensible crap. Do the idiots who design these sites not understand that not everyone is a zombie-fudgehead who instinctiverly KNOWS all this runic nonsense?

So Diana's comments are beyond my reach.

h

Segue To A Rapturous Rupture...

I grew up watching Laurel & Hardy avidly while it was on regular tv in NY.

I finally stumbled across 3 dvds with tons of their stuff. I am re-experiencing the ecstacy...the incredible ruptures of laughter...while noticing much more...

There is sexual subtext in a bunch of their stuff. The women...they cannot handle women. I mean, Stan...he doesn't know a man is not supposed to kick a lady in the ass, and proceeds to do so, only to get her retribution straight to the jaw. And there is this short called Chickens Come Home, in which a vampish flapper girlfriend from Oliver's past reappears to blackmail Mr. Hardy who is now married and, incidentally, a mayor. At one point, when she is unconscious, they prop her on Mr. Hardy's shoulders, her legs suggestively wrapped around him (this was still early 30's pre-Hays); they throw a coat over them, so that Mr. Hardy's legs (with pant legs pulled up) now appear to belong to this chick; "she" wobbles toward the door with the incongruous gait width of a horse. Oliver's wife suddenly enters and thinks she's hallucinating. Suddenly Oliver's head drops from under this lady's dress at a 90 degree angle to the floor! Looking at his wife upside down, he screams in terror and his head disappears back up the chick's dress! It looks both odd and...um...VERY tantalizing.

I gotta tell ya, man, that shot took me off guard. It was fuckin', freakin' hysterical.

So...with that, I got these gorgeous digital masters of The Music Box (which got an Oscar), Another Fine Mess, Sons Of The Desert (their best), Way Out West, Blockheads, and several other shorts that weren't quite as good as those already mentioned.

I totally treasure this stuff. I'd taken care of Chaplin 3 years ago for my collection and had waited since for these guys to come along. It's friggin' about time.

Well...I HAD to spout off. I is outright tickled.

Brian wrote:
"when I heard the news that the cousin I'd held as an infant was now dead, I thought of this incident... and wondered if they'd ask me to be a pall-bearer."

My GOD that is the singular most awful thing I've ever READ!!! Just BAD. I thought I was going to rupture an eyeball laughing.

Cindy


Shout out to Faisal-- where you been kid?

This past week, a cousin of mine died, and a friend's mom passed away. Y'all don't have to post anything like condolences; I know they're meant well, but my couin and I weren't close, and condolences make me feel a little uncomfortable.

I was talking about this with my friend, K-- how we don't seem to fit the expectations of how the bereaved should be bereaving. K knew her mom was going this year; her mom had severe emphysema and insisted on stoking up on a pack a day, so it really was a matter of months. During that time, K had made some preliminary arrangements for the funeral. She got her mom to sign the proper Do Not Resuscitate paperwork, and start lining up the records indicating the disposition of the estate.

Amazingly, when she told a co-worker about this, the co-worker opined that K must be a very cold person. How could she _plan_ for her _mother_ to _die_? Never mind the simple pragmatics-- that when her mom _did_ die, she _might_ go to pieces, and it's best to have as much taken care of when she's in her right mind. And, when she did go to take care of the funeral issues, she scrupulously avoided dealing with the female relatives-- because they tended to dwell on the mourning and misery, and what a _loss_ it was, and how _awful_ she must feel... And that was the last thing she wanted to have thrown at her.

And we talked about how we _never_ feel the "right" way at funerals. She asked me how I deal with the Heaven chatter since I'm an atheist. I said that I keep that stuff to myself, but I don't participate in the prayers, or even take the Host. I -could_, having been confirmed in the Catholic Church... but at some point I realized that taking it would be "faking it," or _lying_, about one of the holiest acts in the Church, and it'd actually be an _insult_. But, I always worry that some relative will be offended that I don't, and that I should take the Host... if only to make relatives feel better. (No one has, by the way. It's never come up, and that's good.)

So we talked about how there's just so much _wrong_ with the popular wisdom about what mourning people "need." There's this assumption that what people need to feel better are simulated goodbyes and assurances of an afterlife. But even the most religious people are trying to sort out the lack of closure, the seeming randomness and unfairness of a death, the fact that a loved one is _no longer there_... and while the happy afterlife chat can help mourners from getting too unruly, it doesn't really _help_ address that.

I read her a piece of Harlan's introduction to _Angry Candy_, which echoed a lot of our conversation. At this, the worst of times. it's as though some of us exist under a tyranny. The cheap sentiment rules, and will be broadcast to the accepting and unquestioning public. But the things which mean something, which help, which explicate what we are and what we need and what we could become if we face the facts of mortality... that has to stay underground, spoken quietly and in private, and shared directly.

And to end this note with some levity: I first met my cousin when I was six, and my uncle brought him over when he was less than a month old. I asked if I could hold him... and I promptly _dropped_ him. Uncle was furious. And when I heard the news that the cousin I'd held as an infant was now dead, I thought of this incident... and wondered if they'd ask me to be a pall-bearer.

click her name
Sorry to post again Rick, just wanna help Harlan out real quick.

Harlan,

At http://www.wordballoon.com/SCHUTZ.html, there are the words

"NEW 10/12 DIANA SCHUTZ"

That's a link. Click it and presto, the voice of the Lovely Lady Diana, Princess of Darkhorse in mp3.

Nathan Pitts

"Strange Wine" in Panama City
...So my wife and I are wrapping up a 2-week trip to Panama (yes, the country), and were walking around Panama City yesterday. On the corner of a major street downtown is a great bookstore called ExedraBooks, which features a large selection of both Spanish and English-language books, as well as some music CDs and a nice cafe.

As you walk in, there´s a table set right inside the entrance with "featured" books, which included bestsellers by Dan Brown, Jeffery Deaver...

...and the Edgeworks Abbey imprint of "Strange Wine," sitting right up front. They also had a second copy of the book in the general Fiction (NOT Science Fiction) English-language section in the store.

Anyway, I don´t know who runs the store, Harlan, but I thought I´d pass along the info that you seem to have a fan among the bookstore staff, here in the steamy metropolis of Panama City. I took a digital photo of it that I could probably send to Rick, or post on a server space, so you could see it (but I´ll have to do it after I get back home tomorrow night.)

Take care,

-- Jon

Thank you, Mr. Ellison
I'm sending this again, in case Mr. Ellison missed it the first time around. If he did see it, but simply chose to make no comment, then that is okay, too.

Thank you, Mr. Ellison, for replying to my comment and question.

The editor of the issue I was referencing was, indeed, Mr. Robert Lowndes.

I have found a letter you sent to the editor of FANTASTIC Science Fiction magazine, published in the October, 1957 issue. It's a lengthy letter, some four pages, where you take to task the people who had been complaining about the cost of FANTASTIC going from 25 cents to 35. It's a really neat letter.

It begins: "Sitting in an Army barracks in Kentucky, so far from New York and the writing game, the perspective shifts, and a lot of things became clearer. One of them is the sound of some of the letters in the August FANTASTIC."

You later say, "Charity does not pay off. Hard work and talent do."

You wind up with, "But be tolerant. And in some cases, fellas, kindly, grow up a little, willya?"

In addition, I found the August, 1957 issue of SCIENCE FICTION ADVENTURES: 3 COMPLETE NEW NOVELS BY TOP WRITERS! It includes your story "Forbidden Cargo." (Fargo Jeffers hated war, and didn't relish the job of ferrying hundreds of war-torn corpses back to Earth - that is, until a hidden enemy tried to stop him!)

But, what I thought was most interesting, was this note from the editor, found on the first page of the story:

"As this issue goes to press, Harlan Ellison is leaving for Army service. He hopes to continue writing science fiction in spite of his military duties - at least after he finishes basic training. We hope he can too; we want more Ellison stories! Harlan's vast output makes it hard to think of him as a 'promising' writer, but as a matter of fact, his career has been brief, and we fully expect even greater things to come from him."

As a Vietnam veteran, I'd like to thank you for your years of service to our country back in the 50s, and for making good on that editor's prediction of "greater things to come."

Okie

Old news, Jeff, and hardly worth mentioning in the first place.

In this day and age, why should sexual orientation matter? Shouldn't we, as a self-proclaimed "advanced" society, care nothing at all about who is Gay or Black or Latino as long as that person harms no one and contributes in some way to our society?

Sulu is gay? Oh my......

OPEN LETTER TO THE MYSTERIOUS GREG STROUD

Dear Greg:

Every year your untraceable birthday gift arrives, every year Susan and I indulge ourselves in decadent dining, and every year I try in vain to locate you. I don't pursue the chore obsessively, because it's clear to both of us that you do it with a generous nature and a desire to remain a shadowy figure of largesse.

But this year we went to MAX, as your gift certificate properly directed. It's been a long year, with a lot of out-of-towning, so though the certificate arrived in May, we didn't get to the elegant MAX till late last week. Belated 71st birthday gift.

Our good friend Charles Edward Pogue, and his wife Julieanne, are leaving Hollywood for the wilds of Louisville, Kentucky --and with Julieanne in Ky. to do some prelim work on their new house--we hosted Chas. Edward at MAX.

I cannot begin to enthuse with sufficient prolixity anent the spiffy comestibles, save to asssure you that I had TWO blindingly superb appetizers, two desserts, and side dishes to sate a satyr. The steak was au poivre. The only thing that would have emboldened the evening more would have been a way to share a toast--coffee please--with our mysterious benefactor, the estimable Greg Stroud.

It is my fervent hope that somewhichway this note-in-a-bottle gets to you.

Thank you again, and again, and yet again.

Yr. pal, Harlan

REPLY TO MIKE LANE
MIKE LANE:

Your purchasing habits affect me not at all. SFBC pays an advance...small...keeps reprinting for years...provides no understandable royalty statement...provides no advisement of how many reprint editions they've sausaged-out, nor pub dates of same...and if they pay any roaylties at all, they are minuscule.

Used book stores provide zero money to me, but I have no prob with that. I think used bookstores are terrific, and I like to keep them in business, which is why I usually sign a copy or two for reputable shoppes. But if I get EVEN a smile and a thankyou, I'm ahead of the game, since virtually ALL bookstore owners delude themselves that they are earning ME a living and I should be overwhelmed with joy to sign on for hours and hours without them even offering me an emplyee's discount for books I might want to purchase ... when, in fact, I'd estimate what I get--after 75 books--from ALL bookstores, new, used, internet, whatever, is less than a hundred bucks a year.

Buy a new book, and I might get a royalty of a buck or so after they've recouped their advance. If I make the wheel squeak loudly enough.

Buy a used book, from anyone but Susan and me directly, and I get squat. That's why I started selling my own titles, out of print, personalized and in mint condition.

Does this information, known to virtually everyone with even a passing association to the world of publishing, come to you fresh and new? How surprising.

Respectfully, Harlan Ellison

REPLY TO EB , ET AL

The website for looking at Diana Schutz's "wordballoons" chat that mentions the upcoming final issue of HARLAN ELLISON'S DREAM CORRIDOR, as given by EB, only gets me to a dormant site that contains the Dillon's cover of an old issue of the Dream Corridor. I can't get ti to do anything else, and the stupid set-up at the website offers no other path to the material EB apparently glommed. If anyone can provide SIMPLE directions, in an alternate way, I'd be relieved and grateful.

Goddam interfriggingnetsumbitch!!

Yr. pal, Harlan C. Magnon, gnawer of ivory artifacts

REPLY TO MICHAEL CAHLIN

Easily done. Get either/both your phone number and address to us via Rick Wyatt, our webmaster, and/or ask Rick for our phone number, and we'll make it as easy as 1-2-3.

For a pittance.

And thank you for going through channels. Bravo!

Harlan Ellison

I just received my latest packet of offers from the Science Fiction book club today. In it is an offering for an illustrated Spider-Man authored by Adam Troy-Castro, plus the info that the next release to be offered in the SFBC 50th Anniversary collection, will be Deathbird Stories by Harlan. I sure hope it will be in the next issue in just a few weeks time so I can get a new copy ordered. Yes, I do have the original, but with the new forward, how can I resist. Did I read the new issue of Dream Corridor will not be out till next year? I was really getting pumped about getting a new one. I'm reading a series of novels by Kristine Kathryn Rusch right now, the Retrieval Artist Novels. I picked up my first one at a used book sale and liked it so much I went out and bought 3 more in the series. Oddly enough I'm not reading them in the order they were printed, I started with the third one published and am on the second, The Disappeared right now. Next will be Polaris by Jack McDevitt and then two from Dan Simmons, Ilium and Olympus That would be unless I get something, anything, new by Harlan in the near future. Harlan's stuff always goes to the top of the pile.

John Fowles and F. Scott Fitzgerald
Dang. Having just now learned of John Fowles' death (and me right in the middle of DANIEL MARTIN), I came here to spread the news, only to find that I have been scooped. You folks are too up-to-the-minute for me.

* * *

A few weeks ago, I read something in F. Scott Fitzgerald's novel, TENDER IS THE NIGHT -- written a lifetime ago -- that seemed to me to describe perfectly George W. Bush and his presidency: "The strongest guard is placed at the gateway to nothing. Maybe because the condition of emptiness is too shameful to be divulged."

Just thought I'd share that.

Re: "Twilight Zone," here's an interesting press release (scroll down to the bullet points):

http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=109706&p=irol-newsArticle_print&ID=779357&highlight=

must've had silver on the brain
Serling...no t. duh.

"Too"
When congratulating people on literacy, you should be literate yourself...

Humor of the Day
This person deserves Website of the Day status:


If Fox News Had Been Around Throughout History

http://mysite.verizon.net/vze1ldyn/id2.html
___________________________________________

Also, kudos for teaching "Jeffty...". All to often kids today believe good literature is for little more than decorating the mantle.

Who needs an electron gun when you've paper?
Today I found Rod Sterlings 'More Stories From the Twilight Zone', Alfred Hitcock's 'Happy Deathday' AND 'Noose Report' anthologies.

I'd love to see Dick Wolf edit a Law and Order anthology; that'd be keen.

Michael Cahlin,

I cannot answer your question, but I do want to give you a pat on the back for teaching "Jeffty is Five". Back in 97/98 (my senior year), I showed "Jeffty" to my English teacher, asking her if we could use it in our class. I lent her my Essential Ellison, and the next day she gives the book back saying "I don't get it. Is the kid always five?" and some such dumb shit.

Using "Jeffty is Five" in my class`
I would like to use "Jeffty is Five" as one of the short stories in my lesson plan for 11th and 12th grader college prep class. How do I go about making LEGAL copies so I can expose my students to Harlan without making Harlan crazy.

Question for Mr. Ellison
Dear Mr. Ellison

I recently picked up a copy of Dangerous Visions at a used book store and found that it was a book club edition. This reminded me of a question that I wanted to ask you. Book club editions of hard backs and paperbacks are usually offered at some savings to the reader and I was wondering if there was any difference in payments to the author for copies sold in various editions offered by the publishers. Also, you obviously don't get compensated when I buy a used book that you wrote and I assume there is some difference in compensation for hard cover versus paperback sales. I purchase books both new and used and also through one book club. But how do my purchasing habits affect you and other authors?

Fowles has flown

Hmmm. Well, I have been one of Fowles's champions on the Web; I didn't recall his coming up here all that often, though. (Somewhere or other, Harlan placed his name on a list of authors he admired. . . .)

I only just learned of his passing less than 15 minutes ago, from a post by a regular on rec.arts.books. Very sorry to hear about it, but Fowles has been struggling ever since a big stroke 'way back in 1988 (nasty habit, cigarette smoking), closely followed by the death of his beloved wife Elizabeth.

I saw him speak here in Portland in the spring of 1996, and he mentioned working at a leisurely pace on at least one novel, and perhaps as many as three. I hope one or more of them is in sufficiently polished shape to be published before too long.

And of course, someone else could go on editing his journals and bringing them to print. (I must admit I have a copy of volume 1 but haven't gotten around to reading it. Right now I'm enjoying Poe and Collier, and slogging to the end of Gao Xingjian's Nobel-winning _Soul Mountain_, which I did not much enjoy, for a book group.)

John Fowles
David Loftus--I heard about John Fowles death yesterday and immidiately thought of you. Odd, I suppose, because I only know of you through Webderland. I was sorry to hear the news.

(Will introduce myself on the users page soon, but now I gotta stop reading posts and get to work. Damn.)

--Bret

. . . . the twilight of the word . . . ?

Check this one out - caught this tonight on BBC World here on Foxtel :

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4294818.stm
'US school swaps books for bytes'

and

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4295084.stm
'Diary of a laptop school pupil'

Cheers,

Dougie.

Lloyd Bochner
I am sad to report the passing of LLOYD BOCHNER on October 29th of cancer. Mr. Bochner, the father of HART BOCHNER another good actor usually in television movies, was a staple of character actors in character roles both on the big screen and in television in the 50's, 60's and 70's. He played the part of the hapless future gourmet meal of the alien in the episode TO SERVE MAN, in the original TWILIGHT ZONE. You can find out more on this excellant actor of character roles on IMbd, THE MOVIE DATABASE on your computer.

http://www.wordballoon.com/SCHUTZ.html

An interview with uber-editor DIANA SCHUTZ. Topics include Will Eisner, Michael Chabon's "The Escapist", Jeff Smith and "The Art of Bone", and the next volume of HE's "Dream Corridor" (to be released....next summer...damn; why oh why must we wait so long?)

"Here, of course, we are models of decorum and maturity, critical readers of progressive literature, and just all-around back-slappin' pals."




Oh, man, god-bless, effing coffee. Effing-friggin' blankety-blank-blak nostrils....

People who've lived in the Los Angeles area for awhile, people who enjoy Mark Evanier's work or people who enjoy reading interesting anecdotes about restaurants and LA may enjoy this section of Evanier's webpage I ran across when he updated it:

www.povonline.com/larestaurants/larestaurants01.htm

It's basically Mark Evanier's anecdotes about famous and not-so-famous Los Angeles restaurants that no longer exist and that he went to at some point. Enjoyable stuff, and I say that as someone who's never been in LA. He's also updated his Kirby FAQ (to which I can only add that Evanier's Kirby biography, when it comes, will be worth a hearty hurrah).

Cheers, Jon

>where we make asses of ourselves, bicker, whine<

And how constantly we do that, too. Thus the gift for Mr. Wyatt, in appreciation for providing the pen.

Here, of course, we are models of decorum and maturity, critical readers of progressive literature, and just all-around back-slappin' pals.

For those, like Todd, who know not where to turn in regards to receiving a Private Message (PM), herewith a quick five minute block of instruction:

1) On this very page, there is a link that says "another place". It is not the Phantom Zone. Well, maybe it is, but the point is, the other place is the board where we make asses of ourselves, bicker, whine, and otherwise make fun of Rob and Frank.

2) Click on that link. You know...the one that says "another place".

3) If you do not know who you are, you can check the "Memberlist". It can be sorted by username.

4) If you forgot your password, there's a nifty link for those that don't remember.

There you go. Easy as 1, 2, 3. And 4.

"Check your PM's on the Forum."


What if we don't go onto the forums? I don't even know my user name and password.....or maybe I know my username, but not my password. I don't usually spend any time in the forums. So, how do these PM's go out?

Just interested.

-TODD

"The history of film as a self-conscious art, as a major financial institution, as a significant shaping force on the modern mind and the modern world begins with D.W. Griffith.

It may be argued that his contribution-a contribution that may be summarized by saying that he had the insight to understand that a technological novelty could be converted into an instrument capable of sustaining complex narrative development-would ultimately have been provided by someone else. But no matter. The stubborn fact remains that it was he who made this contribution first, this strange and even unlikely man. And it was a great achievement, one that has few parallels in the history of art."

Richard Schickel.

"D.W. Griffith, a magician of tempo and shadow. A revelation."

Sergei Eisenstein.

Dream Corrider to be A TV Series?
From the WebSite Dark Horizons, talkign about new Dark Horse Media Projects:

"Ellison's project is a "Twilight Zone"-type anthology called "Dream Corridor," on which pre-production is set for early next year."

I don't check in as often as I would like, but I thought if anyone could shed some light on this exciting news, it would be this fine group of people.

Is this information true, or has reality started to crack?

Please let me know so I can stop taking my medication.

Scott

For any of you out there who still find time to read books, Viking has published a new translation of Borges' BOOK of IMAGINARY BEINGS in a nice hardback edition. The translation is by Andrew Hurley with illustrations by Peter Sis.

If we're going to start copyrighting plotlines, I've got dibs on that "boy meets girl" thing.

Faisal,

"As far as I am aware, Eisenstein didn't do any work on War of the Worlds beyond Paramount forwarding the book to him (or according to one biographer"

My post - that is what I was trying to claim - may have been a little confusing since the opening reads that Eisenstein "started filming an adaptation of Wells' WAR OF THE WORLDS"; I tend to use that line, even when I refer strictly to preproduction without any shooting. But I did say - I thought with a LITTLE clarity - that Eisenstein worked on the script, then dropped from the project before any filming began.

I read about it a few nights ago in Filmfax - a reputable mag cranked out by the same guys who do Ouvre. According to the piece, Eisenstein was brought over here by Paramount (Hollywood was interested in his talents now) - they'd owned the property from the point DeMille picked it up to when Pal finally filmed it (and, who, incidentally, almost had to shut down production when a lawyer approached him and said Paramount ONLY owned the SILENT film rights to the novel, not the SOUND version!) - and he actually did work on a script (unless my ADD kicked in while I was reading; one gets distracted when he's trying to hit on girls in a bookstore while perusing a mag at the same time).

Tell your friend about that piece so that he can match his info with theirs.

...and tell us what goes down with you in Uzbeckistan.

JONO-

Sorry; overlooked your response. Thanks. I don't think your Canadian address has anything to do with the estimated ship date. I think Amazon has a warehouse in neighboring Nevada and I'm still looking at a late December/early January ship.

As far as the storyline patents are concerned, well...damn, that's just scary. I hope the whole monstrous concept gets shredded under scrutiny, but after watching the copyright extensions stretch on and on in recent years I'm not so optimistic. Cultural stagnation, ho!

--
Ever your purveyor of pessism and sweeper of generalizations,
Ryan

Make that "disappears".

And speaking of Frank, where the heck is he?

I post him a genuine hand crafted black helicopter haiku and he up and dissapears.

Wait a minute, you don't think...

Ambrose Bierce
I wish A&E, The History Channel or even Hollywood research and develop the "true" story on the life and death (or disappearance) of Ambrose Bierce. I know they tried it with Gregory Peck, Jane Fonda and Jimmy Smits in the film THE OLD GRINGO...But hey! As far as I know, that was all fictional because being an avid reader of World History, I never heard of a Mexican Revolutionary General by the name of Tomas Arroyo (played by Smits)...I believe Pancho Villa was resposnsible for Bierce's disappearance and death in a big way.

er...errata
that's "though" not "thought."

So, Rick...
Two quick stories, one common lesson:

1. Nine months ago I loaned a friend at work the first 4 seasons of the Sopranos DVDs, because he and his wife had only gotten into it at season 4. I got the DVDs back in dribs and drabs as they got through them.

2. Two months ago, I had the faulty air-conditioner blower in my car replaced at a local gas/garage. The mecahnic gave me a great deal on the part (I checked and would have paid almost twice as much at the Ford dealer), so after I settled the bill in the office, I found the mechanic and gave him a $20.00 tip, and a hearty and sincere thank you.

When my friend gave me the season four DVD set back, he also gave me season five, shrink wrapped, that he bought for me in appreciation of loaning him the first four. I was flabbergasted and very grateful. A few weeks ago, going to work, I pulled into the gas station to fill up, and my battery died right at the pump. Car would not start. I went into the packed garage (3 bays, 3 cars deep in each bay), found a mechanic (it happend to be the one I tipped many months ago), and he came over, diagnosed my car, hooked up a temp battery, drove it over and put it at the end of one of the lines, and got it out in 15 minutes, ahead of everyone else. I thanked him profusely.

So, Rick. Thought neither of my initial acts was intended to gain anything for myself, kindness and gratitude was reflected back like the light from a dozen mirrors over a lantern.

Thank you, for Webderland.

-Keith

You're exactly right, Rob. You and Frank were the primary motivators in our desire to acknowledge Rick's efforts on the boards.

By the way, an item of interest to Ellison fans. Apparently the BATMAN Anthology has mention of Ellison in one of the documentaries of the making of. To quote from the review:

"The immense effort begins with "Legends of the Dark Knight: The History of Batman," a 40-minute look back of the character, from the page to the small screen to the big screen and everywhere else. An impressive roster of participants, including Harlan Ellison, Frank Miller, Kevin Smith, and Stan Lee, put the character into historical context and talk about what makes Batman the cultural icon he is."

Hitchcock / GOOD NIGHT AND GOOD LUCK
The prospect of an Eisenstein or Hitchcock WAR OF THE WORLDS fills me with deep sadness. (Sigh). It joins the long, long list of other discussed but abandoned opportunities, including the Welles version of the story that became DEAD CALM, Hitchcock's own version of the sinking of the TITANIC, and (perhaps the single most heartbreaking unmade film of all time), Kubrick's NAPOLEON.

Seconding any recommendation for GOOD NIGHT AND GOOD LUCK. One of this year's very, very few indispensable films.

Rob,

As far as I am aware, Eisenstein didn't do any work on War of the Worlds beyond Paramount forwarding the book to him (or according to one biographer, H.G Wells offering the rights to him and Eisenstein offering it to Paramount). Bernard Rose may know more about this so I've emailed him about this.

If Eisenstein did shoot anything, its safe to assume that Jay Leyda, Ivor Montague and others would have pursued a copy if possible. Look at how diligently Russian film historians and Eisenstein's colleagues preserved many of his notes and fragments of Ivan the Terrible Part III. Or even now there are film buff's who'd love to get hands on the (badly preserved) rushes of Que Viva Mexico.

Was a script done for War of the Worlds? I can't say but if so, why wasn't it released like his adaptation of Theodore Dreiser's An American Tragedy (seen as one of the classic unmade Eisenstein projects)? It should do, I'd love to read it. Any chance you can send me the source of this story and I can investigate further.

Incidentally, I'll be working in Uzbeckistan in late December at the same studio's where Sergei Eisenstein was working during WW2.

FAQ

Rick, that's the payoff for the years of ulcers we've given you.

**I just learned that the great director Sergie Eisenstein came to Hollywood in the early 30's and started filming an adaptation of Wells' WAR OF THE WORLDS. He actually completed the script. Then, for whatever reasons, he dropped from the project before any shooting could start, and the property went back to the shelves.

Wells was constantly approached by filmmakers from all over the world throughout his career, and this story was probably the most frequently sought. Cecil B. DeMille first bought the rights in 1927. It got shelved. In the late 30's, yet another of the world's greatest directors, Hitchcock, pushed hard for the rights (this was before 'ol young Orson came along with the radio show); and this is the tale that really gets me: Wells insisted that his book was too dated, and he could not be convinced - however determined Hitch was on the issue - that WOTW could be updated. I'd REALLY like to know what Wells was thinking. I mean how close can an author get to his story before he forgets what a GREAT story it really is? It blows my mind.

When I imagine what kind of take on the book we'd have seen from EITHER Eisenstein OR Hitchcock...JEEZUS!

(Another item that was news to me: Wells disliked Lang's METROPOLIS. When Alexander Korda made a deal with him to do THINGS TO COME, the author said, "this is where I correct Lang's mistake". Of course, after Korda's movie was done, Wells was displeased with the treatment of his script as well. While I remain an obssessive fan of ALL these guys, I will never figure out some of you authors)

***Just saw GOOD NIGHT, AND GOOD LUCK. Beautiful anatomy of early tv journalism and its potential stakes. Clooney is a great guy.

Prince Myshkin and George Clooney
I came home this evening after my wife and I went to see George Clooney's incredible "Good Night, and Good Luck" at the Edwards Towncenter, a film I'd urge every red-, blue- and possibly green-blooded person on this planet to see not only once but twice and maybe a third time. A challenging topic, superb acting (esp. David Strathairn who was literally channeling Edward R.), intelligent writing, striking cinematography, and a whale of a jazz soundtrack featuring the incomparable Diane Reeves. This is a classic in need of an audience, kids.

Anyway, as we were heading up the walkway, escorted by our feline alpha pet Frankie with his tail held highly in the air to announce that the "three" of us were home, I stopped by the mailbox and retrieved a padded yellow envelope.

At first my heart dropped. "One of your cd's was sent back," I told my wife.

She looked down at the proffered package.

"Not unless it was addressed to you," she retorted.

Which is just my very lengthy way to tell Susan that I got the cassettes she sent, laughed out loud at your note, tested the tapes (both worked) and I will be returning the requested/required postcard with the appropriate box checked off. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

Can't I please just win the lottery and spend every day like this? Please?

SB

Just thought I'd let people know--if it hasn't been mentioned already--that there's a very brief mention of Ellison on the DVD for Stone Reader. In an excerpt from Roger Ebert's film festival, Ebert talks about a mutual friend of his and Mossman (the subject of the movie) with whom Egbert drove to some midwest science fiction convention to meet Ellison.

Hope this isn't old news to everyone. Stone Reader is a darn fine movie, by the by.

Rick: We loves ya, man. This gift has been too long in coming. I hope you now get the sense of how much we appreciate all your hard work on our and Harlan's behalf. Enjoy your trip and let us know all about it when you get back. You deserve a nice, all expenses paid vacation.

Todd: Check your PM's on the Forum. You were contacted. We did our best to attempt to get word to everyone. This isn't the only way to say thank ya, either. Use your imagination.

PAB

INFOMITE: Thanks, Mite - I was SO hoping that it was just a nasty dream or a reaction to my meds or some bizarre halucination.

RICK: Congrats, bubie! Let me know when you're hitting LA - maybe we can finally meet face-to-face!

Cheers,
Doc

My take on the essential Ellison
Dear Mr. Ellison,

Thank you for your excellent stories. The first piece I read of your's was 'The Deathbird'; it was collected in a shiny silver paperback I found, no kidding, in a drugstore rack in 1974. You'd probably recall. It was one of Terry Carr's, and had Gene Wolfe and James Tiptree Jr. and Ursula K. Le Guin and Jack Vance et al. 31 years later, that book still resonates with me.

If you will, here's my list, after considering your work over three decades.

I Have No Mouth, and I Must Scream
All the Lies That Are My Life
Seeing
She’s a Young Thing, and Cannot Leave Her Mother
I See a Man Sitting on a Chair, and the Chair is Biting His Leg [with Robert Sheckley]
Along the Scenic Route
Jeffty is Five
Grail
The Beast That Shouted Love at the Heart of the World
Shatterday
The Whimper of Whipped Dogs
The Man Who Rowed Christopher Columbus Ashore
Croatoan
“Repent, Harlequin!” Said the Ticktockman
The Region Between
Pretty Maggie Moneyeyes
Flop Sweat
Mephisto in Onyx
All the Birds Come Home to Roost
A Boy and His Dog
From A to Z, in the Chocolate Alphabet
Paladin of the Lost Hour
The Resurgence of Miss Ankle-Strap Wedgie
Hitler Painted Roses
The Hour That Stretches
Shattered Like a Glass Goblin
Soft Monkey
Brillo
Adrift Just Off the Islets of Langerhans, Lat. 38, 54 N, Long. 77, 00, 13 W
The Deathbird

I'm grateful for the many fine hours I've spent with your stories. Kindest regards.

Well, I think we made Rick blush, anyway.

Please keep in mind that we tried to contact everybody thru email or PMing over on the other board, but that universality was always either going to be impossible or was going to require that the gift was going to be sent sometime in the Year 3002 when we finally tracked Frank Church down to his hiding place in the trackless sewers of Angkor Wat. As this came together in three weeks, two conference calls and 1211 emails (I counted; my hard drive is now full), it's about as good as a freshman attempt was going to get without stretching everything out into a never-arriving future.

Thanks again to Rick and to the contributors.

Cheers, Jon Stover

Silly lawyer, ideas are for artists...

Doc,

I saw that earlier today on Fark -- it is exactly what you think it is -- this concept is earnestly proposing that talentless people should be paid money -- serious money -- from their artistic betters simply because they imagined they thought of a cool idea...

At plotpatents.com, it says this under the 'about us' link: "Since then, he has conceived of a variety of unique fictional storylines. Recognizing that fierce competition for publication and financial reward focused on the quality of storytelling, as opposed to the quality of the underlying storyline itself, and further recognizing that even the world’s most skilled storytellers (of which he is clearly not) rarely turn a profit, his unique fictional storylines have matured into pending patent applications instead of novels or screenplays. He thus seeks reward on the true value of his innovations—the underlying storylines—instead of forced, sub-par expressions of these underlying storylines."

---

And after all the legalese under the link 'legal analysis' these three paragraphs distill his entire theory down to relatively understandable language:

"There is currently little motivation for artistic inventors to innovate new plots, themes, and methods of expression. The value of an innovator’s copyright, if he in fact embodies his invention in a particular expression (such as a novel or movie) is far less than the value of the invention itself, because the invention umbrellas every possible embodiment. Further, and perhaps more importantly, the value of his copyright depends on his ability as a performer, not as an inventor. An artistic inventor who invents a fantastically original and compelling storyline may not be a particularly skilled writer. He may, for example, have a very limited vocabulary and a poor understanding of grammar. Any book he creates will be avoided by any potential buyer who reads the first paragraph, such that the copyright value of his extremely valuable invention is nil. Any Hollywood producer who sees through the book’s garbled sentence structure to the excellent and creative plot beneath the surface may steal the only value the book contained: its inventive plot. The producer may then moderately alter the expression of the plot in a subsequent movie—while keeping the plot’s essence fully intact—and obtain unearned financial benefit from the inventor’s unrewarded hard work and innovation. If there is any evil that the United States patent system ought to prevent, it is this.

"Said another way: the value of a singer’s performance or a dancer’s performance or a writer’s performance or an artist’s performance is in the performance, while the value of an inventor’s invention is in the invention, not a single instance, embodiment, expression, or performance of the invention. The value of a performance is protected by copyright; the value of an invention is not. An artistic innovator is given but two choices absent patent protection: to sacrificially innovate for the unearned benefit of thieves, or to not innovate. Both options are morally and practically repulsive.

"A patent system that sanctions and defends patents on artistic inventions, such as new and nonobvious plots, will spur an array of never-seen-before, never-experienced-before, intellectually inspiring forms of entertainment. A patent system that lethargically clings to an as-of-yet unarticulated rule that artistic inventions are not patentable subject matter because they are not closely enough related to a mechanical gear or an electronic integrated circuit will guarantee our nation the same repertoire of mind numbing movies and dime-a-dozen boy bands."

---

You needn't read any further to understand what he's trying to do. The sad, sad thing is that the legal arguments appear to be based on sound precedent -- and may actually sway some judges -- because largely, patent law has already stumbled merrily and drunkenly down the path of idiocy...

There are a number of reasons why it'll never work -- most of them having to do with the incredible cost of monitoring and litigating every conceivable "infringement" of the patented idea. It would be a money pit of unmeasurable proportions, and it's just silly, to boot... But -- it's also completely wrong on the face of it -- Hollywood remakes endlessly not because there's a dearth of original material out there to be adapted -- it's because the art is controlled by talentless beancounters who are afraid of innovation and are comforted by the notion that if the public bought the idea once, they'll do it again and again...

informationally,
the mite

Could someone have a look at this tripe and tell me I've misunderstood, or that it's a horrible dream or, or,... or just not what it looks like? This thing makes my head hurt - it makes me want to make Andrew Knight's head hurt. I feel outraged, but I get so lost in legalese, I can't say for certain whether I *should* feel outraged, or if it's just frustration with the jargon. Nevertheless, the ocncept seems loathesome...

http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20051103183218268

or

www.PlotPatents.com

Cheers,
Doc

Package Received
Harlan, Susan:

Your lifesaving package arrived in today's mail. Thanks again. It's understating the case to say I owe you one, more accurate to say I owe you one more. Catch you soonest...!

Adam

HARLAN-

Thanks for the reply.

OKIE-

"I have found a letter you sent to the editor of FANTASTIC Science Fiction magazine, published in the October, 1957 issue."

Is this the issue bearing the space-gladiator-with-a-sword cover image and with the top story banner of "A WORLD CALLED VICIOUS"?

Thanks.

--
Ryan

Rick - You're A Peach
Rick, As one who has been on the board since 2001, I also toss out a grand THANK YA.

I wasn't invited into the ticket fund team, but if I was, I woulda.

-TODD

a herd of gift horses


Ahhhhh, shut up, Rick! Whether you deserve it or not -- and it's our call, really -- you're getting it.

I'm not one for trying to hunt up old issues of skiffy pulps, so I don't know how difficult it would be to find a copy out my way, but if the provenance of the HE letters and references in these old magazines turns out to be true, is there any way of getting a copy of the text, at least? Maybe getting the content typeset and put on Webderland somewhere?

Yay Rick! Hope you have a most excellent time with The Man! I'd also like to second Steve's request for a report afterwards. And pics! We want new pics!

Jon - We really need FOOR buttons! Or maybe a coffee mug.

Ryan - I ordered mine October 5, and the estimated arrival is Dec 5 - 20, but maybe that's because I'm happily located in Canukistan.

ATC - The only complaint I have with the Val Lewton set is the crappy and cheap packaging, but I've only watched the documentary disc (which was pretty impressive!). That may have been a mistake, as I haven't seen any of these movies.

luv to all,

jono

Read This
http://www.emediawire.com/releases/2005/11/emw303435.htm

Instructions
Rick - Naturally, we here in Webderland expect an extensive "what I did on my Harlan vacation" report upon your completion.
________________________________________________

Cookie, just getting something into the mail today.
________________________________________________

It can't be November already. It just can't.

I'm not ready.

>don't think I deserve it<

You deserve it, pallie. Down a few sidecars in L.A. and toast the many ghosts in that fine town.

GOG

Holy shit
Nothing makes a cynic feel stupid more than people being amazing.

I saw a forums post from Paula a while back with an address like "palsofrick" so I thought someone might be doing something like getting together a card or invited me to a con or doing a special e-mail. I deliberately didn't look into it because I am not the sort of person to look in the closet for presents. But I knew SOMETHING was up.

However, I'd forgotten about that. And I never DREAMED it would be something like this!

I hope it goes without saying that I am moved. I handle people doing nice things for me about as well as Harlan - which is to say I get embarrassed and flustered by it, don't think I deserve it, and don't know how to respond. I feel like I am more of a dedicated hall monitor these days than a webmaster. The site desperately needs updating, and I need to take better care of people like Tim Richmond and Michael Reed who could really benefit from some attention and exposure in the good work they are doing. But the e-mails and forum stuff takes up too much of the time I have to devote, and I no longer have more than 10-15 hours a week to spend. These are all things I hope to rectify if my job and life ever slow down again, but in the meantime I feel like I am not doing enough.

That you guys think despite that I still have done anything worthy of having something this nice done for me, well, I'm flabbergasted. Really. I don't know what to say. I am capable of running on for pages when I'm pissed off but praise and kindness stifle me.

HARLAN - I have an absolutely KILLER weekend ahead but I will give you a buzz Monday or Tuesday to discuss. I don't have a lot of vacation time at the moment but I feel it would be criminal to not use this gift in the spirit in which it was offered. We'll talk.

THE REST OF YOU - thank you. You've made my day, my weekend, maybe my year. And this has been a good year for me.

Harlan, met up with Bob Andelman last weekend at the St. Pete. Festival of Reading. He wrote the authorized Will Eisner bio., A Spirited Life. He mentioned he wanted to interview you for the book, but the schedules didn't mesh. Anyway, if you keep track of these facts, you're mentioned on p.298 regarding a script for the Spirit movie.

Adam: Can't wait to see your review (although it's POST Halloween now...but I guess that's WB's fault for not releasing the DVD set sooner.) I have only watched two of the DVDs so far (and that was just the movies not the commentary) but one of them WAS I Walked With A Zombie/The body Snatcher so I know exactly what you mean! The psychological horror of the relationship between Karloff's character and the doctor is really chilling.

I'm saving Cat People/Curse of the Cat People for when I don't have to get up the next morning!

Kristin

Thank you, Mr. Ellison
Thank you, Mr. Ellison, for replying to my comment and question.

The editor of the issue I was referencing was, indeed, Mr. Robert Lowndes.

I have found a letter you sent to the editor of FANTASTIC Science Fiction magazine, published in the October, 1957 issue. It's a lengthy letter, some four pages, where you take to task the people who had been complaining about the cost of FANTASTIC going from 25 cents to 35. It's a really neat letter.

It begins: "Sitting in an Army barracks in Kentucky, so far from New York and the writing game, the perspective shifts, and a lot of things became clearer. One of them is the sound of some of the letters in the August FANTASTIC."

You later say, "Charity does not pay off. Hard work and talent do."

You wind up with, "But be tolerant. And in some cases, fellas, kindly, grow up a little, willya?"

In addition, I found the August, 1957 issue of SCIENCE FICTION ADVENTURES: 3 COMPLETE NEW NOVELS BY TOP WRITERS! It includes your story "Forbidden Cargo." (Fargo Jeffers hated war, and didn't relish the job of ferrying hundreds of war-torn corpses back to Earth - that is, until a hidden enemy tried to stop him!)

But, what I thought was most interesting, was this note from the editor, found on the first page of the story:

"As this issue goes to press, Harlan Ellison is leaving for Army service. He hopes to continue writing science fiction in spite of his military duties - at least after he finishes basic training. We hope he can too; we want more Ellison stories! Harlan's vast output makes it hard to think of him as a 'promising' writer, but as a matter of fact, his career has been brief, and we fully expect even greater things to come from him."

As a Vietnam veteran, I'd like to thank you for your years of service to our country back in the 50s, and for making good on that editor's prediction of "greater things to come."

Okie

RYAN:

RUN FOR THE STARS is indeed shipping. I got my copies several weeks ago. There shouldn't be any problems getting a copy.
----------------------------------------------------------------
JON STOVER, ET AL:

Youse guys is swell-tacular! Rick, gimme a call: I'd like to add a few bucks to the kitty.

Hot diggies, Ricksie's comin' to visit!!!!!!!

Yr. pal, Harlan

OKIE: I think Keith Cramer has it right. I recall no such letter, and the time-frame is a bit wonky: by March of 1957, I had been inducted into the US Army and would've been in the middle of Ranger training at Fort Benning, Georgia when that issue of the magazine came out. To have written it, I'd have had to do it late in 1956, given the editorial lead-time of periodicals. But since I was LIVING in NYC prior to Army service, I would merely have called Doc Lowndes, editor of the magazine--or was it a John Raymond-published digest size, edited by Lester del Rey or Harry Harrison or Damon Knight or Algis Budrys (all of whom were my friends, with me on a daily conversational basis)?--and would have expressed my opinions mano-a-mano.

So, I think Keith's guess is much more than a guess. Logical deduction leads him, as it does me, to the certain belief that the farthead who signed "Cordwainer Bird" was acting precisely as Keith has opined.

Harlan Ellison

Run for the Stars?

Is the 'Run for the Stars' audiobook shipping? I see it listed on Amazon with a 5 to 10 day ship delay, but in Amazon-speak that typically means 'we don't have the thing but we may be able to get it'.

Has anyone ordered and received it?

Thanks.

--
Ryan Leasher

Three cheers to the man who good naturedly (and with only the occasional back-o-the-hand)puts up with all our crap! -- Duane

Thanks, Webmaster Rick Wyatt
Dear Rick Wyatt,

About a thousand years ago (well, September 2004), I PMed Harlan to solicit his input on what sort of group gift Webderland could get Webmaster Rick Wyatt for his work here, through all the blow-ups and warm fuzzies, all the -- well, enough of my yakking.

Harlan responded with: "Get him a cheap round-trip ticket to come visit Susan and me. We haven't seen him in quite a while, and it would allow me to take him out to splendiferous dinners, sit and chat, introduce him to a high-powered group of our friends, stretch a simple gift into an adventure. Jus' a thought... Yr. pal, Harlan"

More than a year later, complete with one false start and a lot of emailing and PMing, it's as done as it can be. As Rick can much more easily and productively get his own airline ticket (and work stuff out with Harlan) under his own power, $580.00 US was sent to Rick this evening. A couple of checks are still in the mail, and they'll be added to a later-posted contributors' list, but it seemed like a good idea to get going on closing the books on this enterprise.

The following contributed to the gift: Alex Krislov; Chuck Messer; Cookie; Daniel Barron; David Loftus; Doug Harrison; Duane; Earl Wells; Eric Martin; Faisal Qureshi; Jay Smith; Jim Davis; John Gillespie; Jono; Jonathan Stover; Keith Cramer; Mike Jacka; Paula Berman; Peggy; Rich Weems; Steve Barber; Steve Jarrett.

Thanks and good wishes to all contributors, and an extreme and whole-hearted thanks for all your work on this board, Rick.

Cheers, Jon Stover for Friends of Ol' Rick (FOOR)

Val Lewton Boxed Set Continued
I just e-mailed my wildly positive review of the Val Lewton boxed set to Scott E. at SCIFIWEEKLY. My favorite film of the bunch may be THE BODY SNATCHER, with Boris Karloff's incredibly sinister portrayal of the grave robber.

Apologies for the 2nd post, but just to clarify: I meant that Schulz is not listed as a writer on the page for Ligotti. Given that Ligotti has repeatedly mentioned Schulz as a major influence and that Schulz's work does, indeed, share certain of Ligotti's thematic concerns, this looks like a botched job.

DVG -

Schulz is there

Questions are a burden to others Answers are a prison for oneself
INFORMATION

You won't get it.

Who just get the Prisoner box set?

That would be telling...

Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

That map's a bit rubbishy. Checked for Thomas Ligotti, and the closest writer was Jeff VanderMeer while H.P. Lovecraft was whirling around the outer orbit and Bruno Schulz was nowhere to be found.

Nonsense. That's like saying that Richard Neutra had a real thing for Henry Hobson Richardson and, yes, had once heard of that Frank Lloyd Wright chap.

Who loves you, baby?
(From: http://www.literature-map.com/harlan+ellison.html)

According to cutting-edge AI associative tools, these are the results of where Harlan Ellison lives in the 'literature-sphere'.

Closest writer: Lewis Carroll

Furthest writer: Ayn Rand

Most unusual inclusion: Groucho Marx

Have a nice day, everyone!

HARLAN'S QUEST FOR INFORMATION
HI, SUSAN: Tell Harlan that if he _does_ want to talk with Mr. Brock, maintenance dept. of the Kansas City Star (and pump him for information about working on and with Babcock-Wilcox, Superior and Keweente brands of that sort of equipt), and that if they miss talking with each other tomorrow, it is _imperative_ that Harlan catches Mr. Brock _before_ Nov. 9th. That's when an operation -- on his throat! -- is scheduled to take place. (The number provided is Mr. Brock's home phone).
In the meantime, I'll continue following leads and tracking down more suspects.

Yours in secrecy,

Dorman (field operative #112 -- who STILL hasn't been outed by the decidedly unctious Mr. Novak)

Republican control
Steve,

While I was not aware of Bush's plan to restrict travel should there be a pandemic of Avian Flu, the additions to the Patriot Act have received quite a bit of attention. The reason why I do not think it has received a ton of media exposure is because it is simply proposed right now and has not left Committee hearings.

This is still a dangerous message, but I am hopeful that the more extreme measures within this bill (such as the one you highlighted that would impose the death penalty for someone contributing, even unknowingly, to an organization that committed terrorist acts) would be scuttled by the Democratic minority. It is probably too much to hope that they would be able to tie this bill up in Committee indefinitely.

I finally am starting to have some hope for the Democrats, as their play to have a closed-door hearing on the investigation into the reasons we entered the Iraqi War was a brilliant one. My hope is that they continue this stance through the "Scalito" hearings. The truth is that he will probably be confirmed, especially with a number of the Republican centrists saying that they will not support a filibuster.

However, the Democrats can force Frist to trigger the so-called Nuclear option, which would override the filibuster. In that event, Democrats could use various procedural tricks, such as the closed hearings they recently used, to bring Congress to a standstill. They could then say, in all seriousness, that since the Republicans decided to throw all decorum out the window, they don't have to play nice either.

Bush's approval rating this morning hit an all time low of 35%, with the approval ratings for Congress even lower. If the Democrats can craft a coherent message and say, "This is what we stand for," then I think we could see a seismic shift in the political landscape, similar to what happened in 1994.

However, one of the legacies of Bush will be his effect on the judiciary branch. By this, I mean not just the Supreme Court, but also all of the federal courts and the courts of appeal to which he has consistently appointed those whom Attila the Hun might consider right wing. That, and the shambles of our relations with other nations, may be the most enduring and injurious of Bush's actions.

notes....
Erika,

It's doing just fine (I have yet to find a thread relating to it, or buttocks in general, but I'll keep sniffing around for it.)

In the mean time, keep your nose clean.

To reply to Okie. I think you'd do well to assume that it was someone OTHER than Ellison who wrote that letter. Here's my inductive reasoning: 1. Cordwainer Bird was used by Ellison when he wanted to let everyone know that his work was butchered so much that the steak had turned to hamburger. So why would he send a complimentary letter to the editor and sign it thus? 2. If you know anything about Harlan, he's not one to hide behind a fake name when expressing an opinion, negative or positive. 3. Ellison has been a target of crazed yahoos since his early days. His peculiar personality tends to grate on the insecure and make them want to lash out at him. It also attracts sycophants like myself and Eric Martin (to name a few fawning fanboys). Conclusion: It is likely that some jackass wrote to the magazine and used Ellison's pseudonym.

I'd bet on it.

-Keith

Threads
Harlan is exactly right that what differentiates his "Elements" quote is the humor. Einstein, or anyone else who may have said something similar, lacked that one key ingredient. Have you ever read Einstein's bestselling "Theory of Relativity"? Dry, very dry. Could've used a few yucks spread here and there to keep the reader's interest. And that, Ladies and Germs, is why HE is not AE, and wouldn't want to be.
__________________________________________________

I woke up this morning and am a little concerned that the person looking back at me in the mirror is now in the sub-classification of "Conspiracy Theorists". Did anyone else note the item in Bush's Bird Flu plan that allows the government to restrict travel? Or the 41 additional riders to the Patriot Act that the GOP is trying to add without public knowledge? Things like you can get the death penalty for merely contributing to an organization that later commits a terrorist act (whether you know they were going to or not). (Hmmm. I wonder if that includes taxes...)

I'm really beginning to consider West Coast independence a viable alternative. (And NorthEast as well as other Blue-tinged regions.)
___________________________________________

Lastly, I don't have TiVo, but can someone clue me in as to whether the TiVo guide is similar to the DirecTV channel guide? If so, we've learned to live with and even prefer that sort of channel surfing. We know, for 'zample, that "Lost" is on Channel 7 Wednesdays at 9 (though we also have the East Coast feed and can watch at 6). "Gilmore Girls" and "Supernatural" are the WB at 8 on Tuesdays (she watches former, he watches latter). Otherwise, we simply check to see what's on whenever we feel the need to veg-out for a while.

It's so much nicer not planning TV days in advance. Trust me. (Wait. Sounds too GWB.) Err, Try It, You'll Like It.

Have a wunnerful day. I have a giant cup of coffee I need to explore...

SB

I never said HE or anyohe else SHOULD rely only on interactive or online tv listings....only observing that TV Guide seems to think they should. As soon as technology makes something possible, it becomes mandatory. (Pity the poor soul caught on the freeway in a road emergency without a cell phone. Those yellow call boxes on California highways are being removed because "no one uses them anymore.")

Knight Ridder? that's the company that owns the San Jose Mercury News, our local paper....they are getting rid of their freebie Spanish-language weekly and ditching the weekly "neighborhood" sections distributed in different communities aruond the area.

"Hydrogen and stupidity" or whatever paraphrase exist(S) is only one of many quotes attributed to more than one person. I think these things tend to get back-dated and pasted onto somebody else; it seems much more Harlan-esque than anything Einstein would have said, and besides, Einstein died when Harlan was only 20 or so, so if Einstein stole the saying he was robbing the cradle!

Was it Jefferson or Franklin who said something like, "Those who trade their liberty for security deserve neither?" Because at Foolscap, I saw 2 t-shirts for sale side by side; one had the quote attributed to Benjamin Franklin while another had a slightly different version supposedly said/written by Thomas Jefferson!

Brian: Did I or did I not see you mistype your own name???? I loooove it! Can't wait for the next episode of Pinky and the Brian..oops, wrong series ;)

Kristin

Keith:
Speaking of derrieres in general, how's your ass?

>:)

Cordwainer Bird
Mr. Ellison, This is my first time to write, though I've hovered over this site for a couple of years.

I understand that Cordwainer Bird is a pseudonym that you have used over the years for various reasons.

I have stumbled across a pretty early use of the name and was wondering if this was you.

It's a letter to the editor in the Spring, 1957 issue of FUTURE Science Fiction magazine. The letter is "signed" Cordwainer Bird, New York City, N.Y.

It begins, thus:

"The occasion for this - the first letter to a science fiction magazine since my first year's acquaintanance with the genre - is my complete amazement at issue 31 of FUTURE. By amazement, perhaps I should qualify the word with 'pleased,' because I read the entire issue at one sitting, something which I have not done in five years. I found the issue strong throughout, stimulating, and unmarred by any of the ludicrous editorial prejudices that seem currently to be plaguing your competitors."

This is the earliest use of the name that I've personally seen ... I'm just assuming this is you, Mr. Ellison. Would you care to comment?

Thank you for your time.

>By the way, the Grand Tetons National Park is in Wyoming.

That's why the one in Idaho is such a friggin' riot.

Anyhow, at the risk of appearing a toady, I find DVG a friggin' riot. Keep posting.

Harlan - You should read Theodore Dalrymple's "Holmes and his Commentators" in the latest New Criterion. I think you'll enjoy it.

Le Grand Tetons

That is correct, the Grand Tetons are just outside Jackson, Wyoming. I beleve they were named by a lonely French voyageur.

Very lonely.

Chuck

re: DVG and his French friend
Don't forget the French also consider Jerry Lewis to be a comedic genius. By the way, the Grand Tetons National Park is in Wyoming.

I stands corrected, re: things and elements. This will teach me to quote stuff from memory.

And now, having not only misparaphrased our Unca Harlan but also broken the one-post-per-24-hours rule, I slink away to brood in my dank grotto for a few days ....

At the risk of appearing trollish, I always perceived stupidity as a complex compound, rather than an element, consisting of elements of laziness, mean-spiritedness and ignorance adjoined to misinformation.

According to a French friend, the Grand Tetons National Park in Idaho is considered gut-wrenchingly funny. In France, anyway.

beg to differ
I was in the Idaho panhandle in '96 and saw and Elk humping either the effigy of Bob Dylan, or a scarecrow. Either one of which is funny.

REPLIES TO MARCI KISER & STEVEN UTLEY

Marci: It may very well be that Einstein AND a congeries of others expressed the aphorism attributed to me, in different words, long before I trumpeted the thought in my own FUNNY words...but...

If such existed, I wasn't familiar with them, though I would not for an instant suggest they weren't extant. Merely that I came up with mine independantly. And mine is FUNNIER.

But...I truly DID express the thought, and in the form used by the Flash comic, truly DID express it frequently, widely, and loudly. So I deserve the kudos, if not for absolute originality or fecundity, surely for being FUNNIER!

Steve: as one of the Webderlanders noted, "things" is NOT FUNNY. And I didn't say, "The two most common 'things' in the universe are hydrogen and stupidity." I said (and I'm repeating this correction for the fucking millionth time, so don't make the mistake again or I'll play whack-a-mole with yr Texican noggin, mo'fodduh!) THE TWO MOST COMMON ELEMENTS IN THE UNIVERSE ARE HYDROGEN AND STUPIDITY.

"Elements" is funny. "Things" is sloppy and NOT funny.

I know from funny.

Trust me on this.

Elements, not things.

Get it right, Utley, or move to Idaho, where it won't make any difference, because NOTHING is funny in Idaho.

Yr. pal, Harlan

Steven Utley posited:

> Somewhere, I'm sure, a brilliant scientist is trying to
> determine whether stupidity is evenly distributed throughout
> the universe or tends to clump, and also -- if the latter
> circumstance obtains -- whether or not the Earth is currently
> ploughing through a clump of stupidity, which would mean on
> the one hand that eventually people will get smarter and
> things will get better, or, on the other, that people are now
> as smart as they're ever going to be and are, in fact, going
> to become even stupider as soon as the Earth hits the next
> clump. Place your bets while you may.

Hmmm. Perhaps you should define your terms a little more precisely. I suspect most people would assume that when you posit clumped stupidity ("evenly distributed throughout the universe"), you are speaking geographically (that is, in terms of space) rather then temporally (i.e., in time). But in the passage above ("whether or not the Earth is currently ploughing through a clump of stupidity"), you clearly veer into temporal clumping.

(Yes, I know time and space are inseparable in cosmological terms, but I doubt any terrestrial scientist could measure theoretical clumping of stupidity at that level.)

Since, as far as we know, stupidity is a function of consciousness, then clearly it has to clump geographically. Where there is intelligence, there is also stupidity; where there is no consciousness at all (let's assume for the sake of argument that such is the case on Pluto and Phobos), one will find neither.

The question of spatial clumping of stupidity thus becomes one of perspective. At the galactic level, one obviously will find stupidity clumped within certain systems, and on certain celestial bodies. But at the level of the universe, all such bumps (singularities, if you will) may indeed flatten out and appear regular.

Satisfied?

The Quote
Just wanted to comment quick on quote from HE:

It is often misquoted as "things", when elements is the accurate word. Elements is funny.

I'll have to swing by a comic shop and check out the latest issue of Flash...

B

Ellison's Theorem?
Is that really considered Ellison's theorem?

Because it seems very similar to the Albert Einstein quote: "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."

I love Mr. Ellison very deeply, but I doubt he wants something attributed to him that wasn't his to begin with.

Hydrogen and stupidity
Michael D. Blum reports that Ellison's Theorem ("The two commonest things in the universe are hydrogen and stupidity") has percolated its way into the comic books. And just the other day I cited it (properly attributed) in an online political forum to account for polls that tell us 38 percent of Americans still think George W. Bush is doing a heckuva job. Somewhere, I'm sure, a brilliant scientist is trying to determine whether stupidity is evenly distributed throughout the universe or tends to clump, and also -- if the latter circumstance obtains -- whether or not the Earth is currently ploughing through a clump of stupidity, which would mean on the one hand that eventually people will get smarter and things will get better, or, on the other, that people are now as smart as they're ever going to be and are, in fact, going to become even stupider as soon as the Earth hits the next clump. Place your bets while you may.

Newspapers and their future
Kristin and others,

I happen to work for the local Minneapolis paper (Star Tribune), so I have a unique perspective on newspapers. While circulation numbers are, without question, declining, the numbers are not as dramatic as you would think. Our paper, for example, has remained relatively stable in its circulation for the past several years.

The Star Tribune just launched a redesign and had a huge response from the community. While there was a lot of negative response to certain aspects of the redesign, many people realized that we were trying to make the paper more accessible to a younger generation and accepted those changes (our average readership age is approximately 55).

I have talked with a number of newspaper executives about the decline of newspapers and while they all acknowledge that there may be an inevitable shrinkage of readership, they unanimously agreed that newspapers, on the whole ain't going away any time in the near future. There is just something special about the physical act of reading a newspaper, especially for me on Sunday mornings with my kids.

Having said that, everyone acknowledges that the newspaper industry is in need of updating. The news this morning that Knight Ridder, one of the largest newspaper chains in the nation, may be forced to sell off many of its key properties was a sobering realization. For this reason, we are constantly looking at ways to improve our papers' content, both online and print, and to examine how we can best leverage technology to best reach a younger audience

box of treasures
Harlan & Susan:

Package arrived yesterday; many thanks. It was the perfect anodyne for a day I would describe as nothing less than woebegone.

-Brent

I too need a good, paper listing of the upcoming week of television. One that I can sift through while watching a game or some other fluff (I never watch teevee without reading material in my lap.....unless it's something worth paying attention to like Lost or a good movie on DVD). I especially need to sift through a good listing of movies for every cable channel; all the variations of HBO and Showtime and Cinemax etc., not just the mother channels. My local cable company used to put out the official TV Guide that covered all of the movie channels. They stopped, probably in preparation of TV Guide changing formats.

Yes, I can go onto TV Guide Online, pop in my zip code and cable company name, and get the entire listing I need for the next 10 days, but dammit I can't seem to get comfortable with that heavy PC and terminal on my lap in my favorite recliner! No, I'm not going to buy a laptop just to sift through teevee listings.

Doing this online sucks. It wastes my computer time when I get home....and even though TV Guide Online has a movie section that allows you to sift through everything alphabetically by day, that's still time consuming and I actually need to bring my portable DVD player to my tech desk and watch a movie while I'm playing with the Guide.

Sure, it's nice if you have cable/satellite and have a listings channel to click on, but that's not how I watch teevee. I don't think I watch a single program on teevee when it's actually airing, other than some sports (and I mostly tape my Yankee games to watch when I get home from work, thanks to the time difference). I plan my handful of shows, my movies, and tape them to watch at my convenience.

Last week, the mother-in-law was visiting and she is one to turn on the tube and go straight to the TV Guide channel to see what's on tonight. I can't live that way! I can't sit in front of the tube and say "OK, now that I'm here, what's on?" Nope, I have to sit in front of the tube and say "OK, I've got my Lost tape, my Daily Show and Colbert Report from last night, Oh, how about that silly movie I taped the other day. No plan, no tube....but there's always a plan.

So, maybe it's anal, but it's my own low-tech version of TiVo. If you have 3 VCRs in the house hooked up to 3 teevees that receive 200 channels, you can afford to coordinate things yourself. It's empowering.

I don't lament the loss of TV Guide's listings, as they were beginning to bite the big one anyway (sticking to Prime Time only, and only the most popular cable channels), I only lament that I have to struggle to find a comfortable way to catch that a movie is playing next Tuesday on SHOWTIME18 or whatever the obscure channel may be.

Too many words on such an insipid topic....I say adieu.

-TODD

I'm about halfway through Bob Spitz's new biography of The Beatles, and it's already supplanted Philip Norman's _Shout!_ as the best such book available. This is a good, serious piece of work, well-written and apparently exhaustively researched, and if you appreciate the Beatles-- that is, if you're an intelligent person with taste and a healthy soul-- you really ought to read this.

And now it's time for "Brain Gets Peevish," where Our Hero takes offense at some minor detail or comment and works himself up into a lather far out of proportion to the actual event. This week, Brian notices that people seem to have ignored his reasons why he wouldn't recommend a TiVo to Harlan.

In our last thrilling chapter, Brian explained that getting TV listings in print offered the pleasures of browsing... something that the otherwise wonderful TiVo does not offer.

This week, Brian has noticed that several people have suggested that Harlan rely on electronic TV listings, or that he buy a TiVo. Clearly, he thinks (and as we all know, Brian is _always_ thinking clearly), further explication on this crucial topic is required. Education of the Masses, and all that.

So:

By browsing, one can occasionally come across some previously unsuspected delights. If one has his or her browsing "filtered," then one is essentially constraining one's field of vision. One may be more likely to find things that one is actively looking for, but one is less likely to be surprised. One loses those moments when, by glancing at a page of print, a particular word jumps out of one's peripheral vision and catches the eye

And while TiVo is a wonderful machine, it does _not_ afford the joys of random browsing. Yes, one can page through the listings by channel, or by category; but one sees only a dozen or so shows at a time on the TV screen.

Yes, one can have TiVo recommend shows that fit one's interests; but this is filtered to fit one's previously established interests, and to correlate with those of thousands of others, so it isn't exactly "browsing" in the wide-ranging, joy-of-randomness sense that browsing a used bookstore or densely-packed catalog would offer.

In Summary: while TiVo offers a lot to a serious TV viewer, and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend one to the Ellisons, it doesn't fulfill the role of decent, in-print TV listings.

Elijah! If you didn't read TV Guide where else could you get fat pictures of Kirstie Alley and incisive interviews with Ted Danson and Bronson Pinchot?

Some people can live without culture but not me!

perplexed
um. I think I'm about to be the target of many a rotten tomato, but what was so great about TV Guide in the first place? Not to knock personal tastes but this is the last forum I would've expected to see it discussed, much less lamented. Am I, culturally deprived quasi-yoot of an offending generation, missing something?

The march of technology
The Internet is killing newspapers. Readership is migrating away from the paper editions to online which the papers can't make money from either through subscriptions or classifieds (online ads are a whole different business model).

What killed TV Guide (as a paper publication) was cable and satellite. There isn't enough room to print listings for 500 channels. People now use the interactive program guides that come with their cable or satellite boxes or with devices such as TiVo. THere are also searchable/customizable (you enter a zipcode and get listings for the satellite or cable system in hour area) guides online for those who do not have a box connected to their tv. TV Guide actually provides the listings in many devices (and even a rather crude guide built into our JVC set - it's based on the old StarSight engine) so I guess they are mostly abandoning the paper magazine business to become an "interactive content provider."

Kristin

The current issue of The Flash (#227) has Dr. Alchemy quoting the line about hydrogen and stupidity - yet another example of how HE changes the world!

best to all,
Michael

That's awful to hear about Michael Piller. Awful way to go.

Not to veer to abruptly, but my rewason for stopping by was to point people to The Victory Old-Time Candy Store: http://www.victoryseeds.com/candystore/index.html. It looks liek the kind of thing Harlan and some others here might be interested in.

Literature Map
Looking on the first page, I see an "Ursula Guin" and a "Micheal Moorecock". That hardly bodes well.

I suspect that the newspaper will be dead in a decade, with perhaps the exception of a few big-city papers like the New York Times. Sites like craigslist are destroying one of their main revenue streams and with the AP wires easily available, few papers have all that much to offer.

Personally, I read yahoo news for factual stuff as one AP feed is as good as another. I read the electronic version of the SF Chronicle for local news. For opinion/columnists, I read wherever the blogs take me. The only time I ever handle a dead-tree paper is to read the one left in the toilet at work.

The New York Times has started carging for some of its web content. It'll be interesting to see how that shakes out.

Michael Piller, 1948-2005. Worked on the first three Trek spinoffs and co-created DS9 and Voyager. Head and neck cancer.

Literature Map?
http://www.literature-map.com/harlan+ellison.html

Has anyone seen this? Not sure what it means (probably nothing, but you never know....)

British newspapers and periodicals are not notably superior to their American counterparts in my opinion. The Economist probably comes closest to offering a comprehensive and objective review of world and domestic affairs; the Guardian is a bottomless well of spiteful sniping, idiotic stunts (letters from readers to random addresses in Ohio begging the state’s populace to vote for Kerry, for God’s sake) and rock-bottom cultural standards all round. As for such as The Spectator—well, one is merely reminded of the old ditty (attributed variously to Belloc and Ogden Nash):

You cannot hope to bribe or twist
(Thanks God!) the British journalist.
But seeing what the chap will do
Unbribed, there’s no real reason to.

We sent them Edward Murrow, they sent us Toby Young. Not really much of a comparison, I’m afraid.

Harlan.

You should try subscribing to a few British newspapers, which seem to be of a much higher standard than their American counterparts. THE GUARDIAN is probably the best of them (their Saturday book review section is just superb), but THE INDEPENDENT is also worth reading.

Shocking Halloween
When I bought eight large bags of candy on Sunday my wife rolled her eyes and told me I was being too optimistic. By 8:30 I was at the local Rite-Aid buying two more bags. I knew we were in trouble when large SUVs began congregating in the street outside our house.

One of the patterns I DID notice was that kids fourteen, fifteen and sixteen were happily ringing the bell and Trick or Treating just like the other kids. I kind of figure (as a non-parental observer) that the kids know when it's time to give it up, and any pressure from parents just contributes to the overall demise of childhood at an early age.
________________________________________________

"I put on a black hat and alligator trench coat and ---poof! Alicia Keys!"

Coffee through the nostrils again. Again!

________________________________________________

Bestest NPR program (runs on KCRW on Mondays at 2pm here in LaLa Land) is "Says You". No contest.

the printed word
HE: Your reply to Ray Carlson was a fun read.

I was curious what your thoughts are on the CBG's new format. (Well, not so new anymore I guess...)

Even though it was never on time, I miss the weekly.

Whew! I gave out 300 units of candy within an hour and a half last night! I made up 100 bags, then had some extra packages of chocolate bars if that wasn't enough. Well, it wasn't enough. I gave out the 100 goodie bags, cleaned out the rest of our chocolate bars, and sent my husband out for more. *He* cleaned out the grocery store. I hated having to turn out the light because I truly love to see the costumes. Even when we turned out the light, the doorbell kept ringing so my husband put up a sign that said "out of candy--sorry!" I had never counted our visitors before, but I honestly believe that had we not run out, we probably would have encountered at least a hundred, maybe a couple hundred more. I could hear them out in the streets until at least 8:30. So next year, I'm planning for 500. Tip: I found that kids get really excited when they get their candy in a goody bag. It might just be a couple of lollypops, but something about the goody bag makes it super special and elicits many oohs and ahhs!

I don't so much mind the older teenagers, especially if they take the time to dress up (some of them were very creative!). What ticked me off was the mother dressed like Glinda the Good Witch holding out what was very obviously her own bag for candy (all her kids had their own so she didn't appear to be collecting for someone else). Now, I don't mind it when parents are holding the bag for their very little ones on their first or second Halloween (and they are sooo cute those li'l teddy bears, tigers, and dragons!), but this woman was a bit over the top (and hill). I gave her the candy anyway because there were probably 6 kids on the porch (they come in droves) and it was just easier than telling her off and killin' the buzz.

One thing I did demand of all our guests was that they utter the words "Trick or Treat." I had to coach some of them. I said, "You have to say the words otherwise how am I gonna know what you want? I mean, you might just be standing out there in a costume for the heck of it. You gotta say the words!!!"

I didn't really dress up, but since I'm now wearing my hair in long braids (a birthday present to myself on my 40th), I put on a black hat and alligator trench coat and ---poof! Alicia Keys! I thought my youngest was going to be Darth Vader (I bought him the voice changer and everything!), but he opted for the freaky ghoul mask that scares all the little kids. The oldest (disguised as a preppie) went to a Halloween party armed with about 8 cans of silly string.

Anyway, it was a fun one. I'm really glad I moved my rehearsal to tonight. It really took both my husband and myself to get our kids where they were going and to keep the candy flowing. 300! In an hour and a half!!!

Imagine (and feel pity for) those poor teachers who have to deal with those kids in school today!!!!

On Halloween and age... I was listening to a bit on NPR about this just yesterday, only rather than suggesting Halloween is childish the concern was that it was becoming too inappropriate for children. Cited were horror movie prop costumes, gorier than the homespun hobo/cowboy/sheet-with-two-eyeholes-ghost costumes of the speakers' childhoods, and the sexualization of young ladies' costumes.

They ascribed this particular evolution of costumes to the 'boomer generation who had a good time as yoots and were unwilling to let go as they grew up. They got jobs and money for better costumes, more adult tastes and tolerances, and there you have it.

I say let kids celebrate Halloween until they feel lame. It might never happen - I think the nature of the holiday changes to accomodate them as they age, but at its core it's an Inversion Festival, a night when everything is upside down; you can beg something for nothing, talk to strangers and stranger than strangers.

Did I dress up for Halloween? Yep, was a Tourist all during the day - but then I work at a school, so a certain immaturity is part of the job description. Wish I could've handed out candy, but we live in a condo so there's no way for kids to come to the door. Favorite costume that I heard about this year? The three-year-old daughter of a friend is dressing up as a mailman... ferociously cute because, you see, she thinks there is only _one_ mailman in the world who delivers _all_ the letters and packages, a la Santa Claus.

hee.


On an unrelated side note:
As we're tossing around the subject of how newspapers, tv guides and such have changed over the years, could I be so gauche to ask how Playboy has altered over time? Seems like I hear about a good many authors, including our honorable host, who got their start writing for it. Back In The Day, was it just another girlie mag who'd throw a couple bucks to a starving author, or was there an element of status to writing for them? How about today? Did they/do they take unsolicited manuscripts?
I'm trying to balance two perspectives: one which says all these now-greats who used to write for it at some point in their careers and so it must have some aspect of a literary magazine, vs. another perspective which holds the more common *wink wink, nudge nudge* I-read-it-for-the-articles comments. Just wonder if there's been some fundamental shift that's gone on, I guess.

Unca Harlan,

Thanks for your rapid reply to my query regarding newspapers and for sharing some of your reading list with us. I share your enthusiasm for THE WEEK. It’s outstanding.

Again, thank you.

Dorman:

At the age of fifteen, a kid is still a kid. Maybe they need to start learning all that non-fun stuff they'll be responsible for when they are adults, but I think they ought to be able to enjoy being kids while they still are. More power to ya.

When I think of Halloween, I think of our house in Evergreen, Colorado. It was a trilevel home with a dutch door in front. Our Saint Bernard, Hannibal, enjoyed halloween. To him, everybody in the world was a potential pal. "Oh, boy! Somebody to pet me and be my friend!"

So, when the doorbell rang, we'd open the top half of the door and Hannibal would prop himself up on the lower half with those huge paws and greet the trick-or-treaters. Even kids we'd never seen would say, "Hello Hannibal!". He was our official Halloween greeter.

He hated Christmas. We'd bring a *TREE* into the house? And hang shiny stuff on it that would fall off every time he walked by it. He hated that tree. We also had a decoration that was a music box in the shape of a bell. You'd hang it up at the top of the door jam and when you pulled the clapper, it would play an obnoxious, tinkly version of Jingle Bells. He'd start crying and looking for a place to hide.

Halloween was his holiday. He LOVED meeting trick-or-treaters.

Chuck

Mr. Ellison--I lived through the 1970s, thanks. More than enough singing for me. Let me tell you, you haven't learned to hate a decade until you've been expected to milk a goat at some point during it.

Facetiousness aside, I have a certain amount of respect for the people and places of those times, and a great deal of affection for them--but I remember how the solar power and home-schooling, the folk dancing and Latin lessons, the champagne socials and the parent-sanctioned same-sex crushes lay at the end of a steep and narrow stair on the very edge of the American continent, and how few people passed that way. I simply do not accept a view that the 70s (and previous decades) were chock full of intellectja-mals--the people my parents knew and the children with whom I played were part of a shadowy subculture that existed outside what my parents dismissed as the modern mainstream. Nor do I think that their retreat from that mainstream was necessarily the correct or (I must say) honorable thing to do. It is easy to dismiss the proles when one is an aristocrat. This is the lesson of facism as well as my parents' progressive socialist tendencies. Lily Bart's Seldon and his Republic of the Spirit were no more a refuge for her finally than were the vulgar excesses of her friends.

In the end, whatever song the sixties sang, the books that spoke first to me were those that stressed the meaninglessness and destructive force of social divisions in earlier times: "The House of Mirth" and "The Great Gatsby," "The Sound and the Fury" and "The Golden Bowl."

As for my recollections of the 70s--cross "The Ice Storm" with "The Stepford Wives," pour Edie Sedgwick and Ossie Davis another Long Island Iced Tea and kiss them for me.

I may be delayed.

A Halloween Question for Harlan & one for ALL the rest of you
HARLAN: Just got cleaning up after walking around with my daughter (who is fifteen and in all probability did her last night of trick-or-treating -- not for the candy, mind you, but for the fun of dressing up in costume; she made one _very_ cute Wicked Witch of the West, wearing an outfit similar to that worn by Margaret Hamilton in "The Wizard of Oz" and green makeup), and after taking a peek at the message board tonight (and noticing how many people were as saddened as I by the lack of participation of late in my favorite holiday)...where was I?
Oh, yeah! I couldn't help but smile when thinking of trick-or-treaters showing up at your door.
Do you and Susan participate in handing out candy on Halloween? (I'd guess yes, but I don't want to assume). If so, who answers the door? (For some reason, the picture of you swinging open your door and greeting a clutch of kids dressed as vampires, werewolves and other assorted monsters with, "YEAH?" --the way you answer the phone-- makes me chuckle.

Hope you and the Electric Baby had good time tonight, no matter what you did (or who answered the door). And the next time my mother and brother call to talk to you as they did today, howzabout sparing a little time for the 90 year-old battle-ax who gave birth to a sweetheart like me -- allright? Okay, then.

Best,

D.T(rouble) Shindler

P.S. TO ALL THE REST OF YOU WEBDERLANDERS: Do you guys, like so many other adults, think kids should stop trick-or-treating before 15? I've always thought of 16 as the true cusp of teenage-hood, and every age before that is still part of childhood. But I've heard more and more parents tell their children (at 13 or 14) that they're too old to do that sort of thing (those are the same parents that scream bloody murder when those kids --- who've been told to growup and act your age -- start dressing in hip huggers or half-shirts, showing more skin, drinking booze, playing at sex, etc., in imitation of "grown-ups"). And I've seen quite a few of my daughters friends (especially last year, when they were fourteen) balk and visibily struggle with the urge to go out and have fun the way she does. All of those friends have older sisters or brothers who probably say cruel things and expose them to peer pressure if they do still have the urge to childlike things at the ripe old age of fourteen or fifteen -- either that, or parents like those of Amanda, another of my daughters friends, who told their daughter, when she was thirteen, that she was too old to go trick-or-treating. What a sad fuckin' commentary on the mindset of American parents: on the one hand, they tell their kids to "act thier age" and that they are "too old" to do this or that; and on the other hand, they wig out when these "tweenagers" try to act like the older (16,. 17, 18-year-old) kids in order to fit in.
Sorry about the rant.
So what do you guys think? Am I alone in the notion that kids should be allowed to be kids at lest through the age of fifteen? Or have I been living in a glass bubble and missed the boat when it comes to proper parenting skills?

Harlan,

'"Just tell him when a woman who's ninety years' old calls, he oughtta talk to her and not give her that kind of message, and if you don't think this will be written up, you've got another think coming"'

..."Why ME, God?"

Why am I sitting here laughing my ass off, y'poor bastard?

Clearly, somebody mistook you for the OTHER Harlan Ellison ....

If all you need is TV listings . . .
. . . why not just get TiVo? They practically give the boxes away these days, and the monthly subscription couldn't be much more than getting the Times delivered. The listings are searchable in a number of ways and are more useful than print TV listings. You can, for instance, store a keyword (say "Val Lewton" or something like that) and it will give you a list of all listings in the next ten days that include that word. Plus you get the functionality of the machine.

A CHARMING INTERLUDE w/ GARGOYLES

Okay, here's a beauty for y'all.

I offer it a priori, as bulwark against...

Well, you'll understand why in a moment. My tale is a brief one, but typical of what We Godlike Celebrities have to enfuckingdure:

I'm in a pre-production meeting for a tv/movie thing--here at the house--today--couple of hours with a couple of guys--and at some point late in the day, maybe 3:30 or so, the phone rings, and Sharon answers it, and comes in to tell me (approximately) as follows:

There is a guy with a sorta kinda "flat-affect" voice who says he's calling for some woman in her nineties (he apparently stressed that several times with Sharon), who avers she is the mother of someone whom I knew sometime long ago in the past, or like that. And she wants to talk to me, he says; but he won't say about what. And he won't give his name.

So I yell to Susan, "Would you plizz grab this, I'm in the middle of this session...just tell 'em I'm in a meeting and if they wanna leave a number, I'll call them back."

So Susan goes and takes the call. I don't get out of the meeting till 5ish, and I find an indecipherable scrawl on a post-it, so I ask Susan what's what with it.

And here's the story. Susan goes to pick up where Sharon left off, and the old woman is now online. She says she's the mother of someone named Paul Devinny, and her name is Margaret
Devinny. And Susan asks what it's about, and (my wife says to me later) it "was like pulling teeth," I suppose because the woman is 90. But apparently she just wants to "chat" with me.

About WHAT...no idea...because: I don't KNOW any Paul Divinny. And if I knew him so far back ago that not even his name rings an echo, then we couldn't have been too close, and heaven only knows why his mother is calling me now.

In any case...

Susan was polite to her. You know Susan. That's her thing. Polite. With that Brit accent.

And she tells the old woman I'm in a meeting, or a conference, or whatever, and if she'll give Susan a number, and a precis of why she needs to speak to me, she'll give it to me when I surface.

Apparently the woman says something like, "never mind," and hangs up. I think I'm recounting all this with fair accuracy.

A little later, Sharon catches ANOTHER call, this time from the droning guy, who proceeds to threaten Sharon with (this is a close proximate as related by her, hours later) "Just tell him when a woman who's ninety years' old calls, he oughtta talk to her and not give her that kind of message, and if you don't think this will be written up, you've got another think coming," and HE hangs up.

Well.

Since I am PARALYZED with fear that this will be "written up"--if not in some half-assed blog or fanzine website, then certainly carved in letters of fire on the Stone of Eternity--I thought I'd let y'all know about it so if you run across this "fit of pique" umbrage ...

...does this sound familiar, friends...?...

you'll know what happened. I wouldn't want you to think I'm one of Those Godlike Celebrities who blows off intrusive strangers who interrupt my workday with phone calls I never solicited, with people I don't know, for purposes in which I have zero interest. Heaven forfend that I should put my own concerns before those of random obssesed idiots who have gotten my phone number to assuage their own trivial curiosities. And when a 71-year-old tells someone to go away, you'd think his advanced years would receive SOME respect; and if you don't think this has been "written up" then you have another think coming.

Exhausted, Yr. pal,

Harlan

P.S. Why ME, God?!

Todd

No one here either. (Except, as I was taking a picture of our pumpkins, the neighbor walked by with his kid on his shoulders and didn't stop. Must still be upset about that whole fence thing...)

Read the same article and thought, "But I LIKE Smarties..."

Mike

Wow, was that last posting fulla typos or what? The spirits have possessed my fingers, I tellya, and now they want to close slowly around Deb's......no....noooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!

Halloween
Where are all the fuckin' kids?!?! C'mon, ya little bastids, I got my M&M's ready to go....Peanut and Plan. Take yer pick. Even got the Smarties as back-up, not that I'll need 'em now (and thank the Gods for that, as the local paper made sure to rate all candy types this morning, and Smarties were rated one of the big Your Neighbor Is A Loser candies. At least the M&M's got some raves.

Geez, when I was a kid we would have been halfway through our 3 mile round trip trek, pillowcases already heavy with the goods. Now? Damned kids and their damned parents and their damned safety parties and street gettogethers......C'Mon, getcher asses over hear and get some fucking candy! Can't you see I luv ya's?

-TODD

(oh well, Steelers in an hour.....)

A Boy and His Dog Aust DVD

OK no worries, Harlan. Three copies will be sent over...I might have to visit a few shops to get that many units (this DVD is not as omnipresent as I, ROBOT sadly). First, I'll mail them to the HERC address, then we'll go from there. I'm sure a trade can be worked out to cover the transaction.

Brian, sorry to break it to you but its not the Gamble House in the film. But boy is that house a gem.

For those who want to see it... http://www.gamblehouse.org

Brent, my fav Holloween tunes include The Kronos Quartet's recording of the theme from Psycho and Mike Oldfield's Tubular Bells.

I get my news from NPR mostly, through both the radio and checking out their website. Any of you guys ever listen to the NPR news quiz show "Wait, Wait...Don't Tell Me"? It's always a hoot. http://www.npr.org/programs/waitwait

I think the Lion, Witch & Wardrobe film should be regarded with trepidation, one of the associated websites calls Turkish Delight "addictive" as if it were heroin or cocaine. Not a good sign. A tie-in CD of gospel singers? Bizarre. This is Walden Media's doing probably. While Disney just wants to capitalize on the Lord of the Ring's films. Also I'm getting tired of seeing bucolic New Zealand landscapes.

Architectural Note of the Day: They're running ads for the upcoming movie _Zathura_, which has only one attraction for me. They've obviously filmed a lot of it in the Gamble House, an architectural treasure in Pasadena designed by Greene and Greene. Can't say that recommends the expense in seeing the thing, but it's a detail that interests me. (It's the one reason I sat through _Casper_: middling movie, but _great_ Art Nouveau set design.)

Just to concur with Harlan a little on newss and TV listings. I find my newsprint intake's a lot less these days, but that's mainly because of the Web making news sources much more available. I go into work, hit a slew of sites, and print what I want to read in detail. The nice thing about this system is that my daily sites include places with decent daily reporting (the NY Times), the opinion weeklies with frequent updates (The Nation, Slate) and places where the essay holds sway (NY Review of Books, Arts and Letters Daily).

A side note about TV listings: The computer age has enhanced an interesting paradox of intellectual life. Thanks to database-organization and terminology-searches, computers enable us to zoom right in on Stuff We Want. This is great when we _know_ what we want. But, most of us enjoy _browsing_ stuff, like books in bookstores, because we'll come across something that we've never thought of. We delight in surprise and variety. So browsing TV listings _in print_ has a lot of pleasure for most of us; we'll see a movie we haven't thought of in years, or a documentary on a subject in which we were once interested, and enjoy it.

That's why I won't suggest a TiVo to Harlan. He's probably up on the product already. And for all of its wonderful strengths, it's not exactly conducive to the simple pleasure of browsing. (I've suggested a remedy for this on the TiVo company's website, i.e., enabling users to download the schedules and print'em out. Dunno if it'll ever come to pass.)

DAVE and EZRA:
http://www.fantasticmetropolis.com/i/ligotti/1/

Ezra,

Looks like we've been reading the same books. The new Ligotti collection is super duper drad, top of the line weird. I've not yet had the chance to crack the Hodgson collection. I finished THE NIGHT LAND a few months ago. It was good, genuinely weird, difficult.

All Hallows
"And now… a high pitched scream? Could it be the fool from the village did not leave my property with as much dispatch as he ought?"

Um, no. Sorry. (I was using a pushpin before drinking coffee this morning.) Please go back to sleep.
_________________________________________________

Cookie - No worries. Keep your eyes on the mail. I may spirit a copy or two your way if I can do it without Cris noting the disappearance (it IS Halloween, after all). Looks like she's being submitted for a SoCal Music Award by her label. (Shhh. Keep your fingers intertwined...)

I envy you being swamped with Jazz -- so nice to die doing something you love, no? The household cd of the moment is Diana Krall's Live in Paris, which features a friend of Cris' on bass. (And I'm spending a lot of time with Manhattan Transfer's Offbeat of Avenues.) Have a wonderful time tonight, especially given the Halloweeny neighborhood! I miss those. Give my regards to the Goblins if you would.
____________________________________________________

And so this doesn't descend into Unca Harlan's website o' other media, I'm reading AE van Vogt's novel Slan at the moment -- which HE once cited as one of his favorites. Slogging through, but hoping it gets better (sorry, Harlan). And just gave a copy of Mind Fields to my cousin who is an artist in his own right.

HAPPY HALLOWEEN!

REPLY TO RAY CARLSON

Oddly enough, Ray, just two weeks ago my "situation" vis-a-vis newspapers changed. I was brought up reading two, three different papers a day, I actually worked as a reporter for a while, and always started my days with newsprint.

But when they started collapsing one paper into another, narrowing the focus, imitating USA TODAY and the tv morning shows, I grew weary of them. I had always subscribed to a plethora of magazines--SCIENCE NEWS, HARPER'S, PLAYBOY, SKEPTICAL INQUIRER, TV GUIDE, COMICS BUYERS GUIDE and then, wonderfully, THE WEEK, just to name a few of my regular reads. So my need for the dailies grew even less pressing.

When I moved to LA in 1962, there were a few papers here. Now there is only the LOS ANGELES TIMES, which is awful, except for the book review (which they keep slimming down every year). So I relied on books of current events, Sunday discussion shows and the Lehrer News Hour, and the on-the-hour CBS feed to KNX-AM to keep me abreast of current events. Magazines filled in the needed "deeper insights," particularly via THE WEEK, which I set considerable store by. Highly recommended!

But when TV GUIDE went to that awful new "entertainment tonight" format, and stopped the local listings, we cancelled, after 50 years' being a subscriber, right from the first issue. They've lost 60,000 subscribers in the first 2 weeks, according to one of my pals at TV GUIDE, and they don't seem to give a shit, because they're saving a fortune not having to assemble all those regional editions. It was NEVER a vade mecum, but now it's just utter trash, a hand-maiden to the apparat that considers the bowel movements of Josh Duhamel more important than the growing dislocation of civilization.

But to cover, for the need for tv listings, we're now getting the awful LA TIMES on Friday, Saturday & Sunday.

So, yes, NOW I'm back to reading newspapers...somewhat.

Yr. pal, Harlan

All Hallow's Eve
Anyone have any favorite tunes for today?


Nick Cave - Knoxville Girl
Warren Zevon - Roland the Headless Thompson Gunner

BOO!
On this unhallowed evening, this accursed portion of our mindless orbit around the uncaring star which we arrogantly call “the Sun”, when the membrane that shields all that is clean and wholesome and sane against the nameless measureless void is thinnest and most easily penetrated; two manuscripts have been left by the simpleton from the village who delivers my mail, hastening away not sure but that the gargoyle on my stoop eyes him speculatively.

Thomas Ligotti, THE SHADOW at the BOTTOM of the WORLD

William Hope Hodgson, ADRIFT on the HAUNTED SEAS

Both of these are edited and introduced by Douglas A. Anderson for Cold Spring Press.


I only became aware of the work of Thomas Ligotti myself less than a year ago. He dwells in relative obscurity, mostly out of print. Finding his stuff is difficult which is a shame because he is a hell of a writer. Ligotti has accomplished something I would have thought impossible. He has been influenced by Lovecraft, without becoming a clone or a parody of HPL. Ligotti has swallowed him alive, and shat out something strange and wonderful. This collection is a “best-of” with some newer work added. If you count yourself a lover of the macabre and the unsettling and don’t mind good writing as well please help make this guy some money and keep him in print.

Hodgson is one of the “old masters”, doing all his work before he was 40 years old, fated to be vaporized in a field at Ypres in 1918 by a German artillery shell. He left home at thirteen and endured eight years at sea. He spent the rest of his short life writing about it, both realistically and otherwise. This collection contains the best of his supernatural sea stories. It also includes two fascinating essays, one about what it would have been like to be on the Titanic, and the other reminiscence about experiencing a cyclone at sea. Hodgson is the master of the creepy mood and his great novel HOUSE on the BORDERLAND is one of the few successful attempts at sustaining this mood at novel length. (It also anticipates everything in HPL except the tentacled vaginas but we had that argument already didn’t we?)

Congrats to Mr. Anderson for his taste and timeliness. And both of these books together will only set you back about $20 so don’t say you weren’t warned!

Hmmmm… the sound of sliding stone and crunching feet fast disappearing into the distance. And now… a high pitched scream? Could it be the fool from the village did not leave my property with as much dispatch as he ought?

REPLY TO ROD

YES YES YES! Please buy me two or three of the Aussie A BOY AND HIS DOG videos. Doesn't matter if they're in PAL, because they're for my archive and Tim Richmond's bibliography.

Payment in advance, if you require it.

Payment after-the-fact, including cost of mailing, if you'd prefer.

In US or Australian $$$$, whichever is a better deal for you. Let me know and I'll either get one of my pals downunder to send you the reimbursement posthaste, or I'll do it by bank transfer...or whatever...

In any case, you won't get stuck for this largesse.

And thank you, thank you.

Also, thank you.

Yr. pal, that sweet old cobber, Harlan

>It was "Bright Corners" by Monk.

Alex - I believe you mean "Brilliant Corners". My favorite Monk recording. I was listening to it before I left for work this morning.

Great minds think alike...

Happy Halloween, folks!!

Today's the day I read "Pillar of Fire" by Ray Bradbury (which Harlan turned me on to right here on Ye Olde Weberlande").

I live in one of the greatest trick or treat neighborhoods in the world. I moved my Monday night rehearsal to Tuesday just so I won't miss anything. When the kids get home from school, we'll carve up pumpkins and make ready for the wild rumpus to begin!!


________
Steve Barber: I really should get in touch and am sorry I haven't. I'm just swamped with jazz these days. I enjoy reading what other people here have to say about their music (of all kinds), but I'm sort of wrapped up in it all day long. When I come here, it's more or less to escape my "dayjob". I *am* glad to read that Chris is doing well and landing some good gigs. She deserves it. So thanks for sharing the info. Sorry I haven't bought a disc yet, man. I want to, but I just plain ol' haven't gotten around to doing so. Forgive me. Like I said, I'm swamped in jazz and somedays I feel like I'm on the verge of drowning!! So much music!! For me lately it's been Ahmad Jamal, Ella Fitzgerald (a kind of semester-long focus related to my teaching), Billy Strayhorn, Henri Salvador, Stevie Wonder (the new one!! I love it!! "Moon Blue" alone is worth the price of admission), and sundry other things I'm either studying or just happen across. The new Coltrane/Monk at Carnegie Hall is interesting too.

Heinlein story
Edward,

If my fading memory serves, the Heinlein story is probably "They," which you'll find in THE UNPLEASANT PROFESSION OF JONATHAN HOAG, and in THE FANTASIES OF R.A.H.

--tr

Newspapers

Unca Harlan,

If it's not too personal...

A few years back there was an introduction to a book in which you stated you don’t read newspapers and get your news from CBS radio. Just wondering why no newspapers and does this still hold true today? Thank you.

Help!!!
I recently finished reading Jim Thompson's "Now and on Earth" and I need some help from those in the know. There is a passage in the book where the main character makes a reference to a Robert Heinlein story about a guy who is talking to his doctor about how he only gets enough food and sleep to keep him going through the work day and how he makes just enough money to pay his bills and that his wife, boss, kids, friends, etc. are demons that are controlling his life; Anyone know the title of this story?

Brent,

I'm sorry about giving up teaching, too. I may get back into it, just in an alternate manner.

We'll see.

Keiti

A Boy and His Dog Arrive in Australia
The Australian DVD release of A BOY AND HIS DOG has hit the shelves in retail outlets down here. It has been put out by Shock and Umbrella Entertainment, distributors who specialise in cult titles.

Link to the cover:
http://www.shock.com.au/releases/info.asp?release_ID=130627

In case you can't quite read the text at the top of the slick, it says, "Harlan Ellison's Classic Sci-Fi Tale". Too bad about the use of "skiffy", but at least Harlan's name is on the cover.

Harlan, let me know if you want an original copy of this DVD. It is in PAL video format and coded for region 4. The cover says it's not an anamorphic transfer, so it seems that our distributor has recycled the same letterboxed transfer doing the rounds in all territories.

Rob: I just got this link from a yahoogroup advertising jobs for technical writers of all things; someone had (knowingly) posted a slightly (for them) offtopic message announcing it. Check out

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/graphicnovel/

I think it's just starting up, but if people pass the word it will become more active. As for jobs, well writing things like technical manuals does pay the bills, but it's not exactly creative!

Brent: Yup, I saw that page - the Google search engine actually is good for something some of the time. As for the album, one can seek out used record stores and put in a request to notify you if they get a copy in. I couldn't find any on Ebay or in the inventory of a couple mail order stores at the moment.

I don't think any "popular" genre of music is likely to *really* outlive the generation that grew up with it. Classical can hopefully be immortal and perhaps jazz as well since it isn't totally tied to an adolescent experience (I suspect people listen to "music" more with hormones than with their ears!)

Kristin

I've been supplementing my living for the past 30+ years as a musician, and cannot afford to be ignorant about the state of the art.

But I have also found that Sturgeon's Law applies at least as much to music as it does to writing. The bands and songs that not only survive for more than a generation, but are accessible to more than a narrow slice of the populace are the ones that I'll take seriously. The flash in the pan "Ain't I cool!" bands that follow trends don't much interest me, and generally for a good reason.

Give me Gershwin, Tchaikovsky, Brahms, Clifford Brown, Louis Armstrong, Billy Joel, Fats Waller, Vivaldi, Beethoven, Paul McCartney, Paul Williams, Bach (JS and PDQ), Billy Holliday, Billy Strayhorn, Billy Preston, Gustav Holst, Steve Kupka and Gordon Goodwin any day. But I can leave Shaun Combs alone, and I have a feeling few will remember him more fondly in 30 years than we recall most of the flash acts of the disco era now.

Note "many of".

Huh?
"As far as music goes...many of the posters have shown a gross ignorance of musical history post 1975."

You've GOT to be kidding.

Do you really want to go mano-a-mano?

Britney Spears doesn't suck, she rules. 50 million fans can't be wrong. I've got all her albums, can't wait for the comeback.

4th season of the Brady Bunch coming out on Monday. Can't wait.

Listening
Brian Siano - The trouble with the Baby Boomers is that they stopped listening around about 1980. I'm Genx myself, and watched my generation get accused of being lazy (Slackers) first and then greedy later (damn dotcom millionares) without anyone apparently noticing the contradiction.

Steve Barber - Interesting statistical tidbit: television viewership among today's youth is way down. Where my generation (and your generation) sat staring at the boob tube, today's generation sits killing zombies, blogging on live journal and reading webcomics. Which is worse? Who can say?

As far as music goes...many of the posters have shown a gross ignorance of musical history post 1975. Not surprising. It's normal behavior. At fourteen, we listen to pap, and call it classics. At twenty-five, we discover what's new and good and proclaim it new and good. We then spend the next sixty years complaining that the music the fourteen-year-olds listen to is pap and utterly missing what is new and good.

Sure, you're fourteen-year-old nephew has no clue who The Velvet Underground was, but then, you've got no clue on today's equivalent. Just because you haven't found them, doesn't mean they aren't there. It means you are ignorant of them, most likely because you've dismissed anything modern because Britney Spears sucks.
If you want to make the case that the music of the sixties is far superior to that of today, you can't compare the critically aclaimed of the past with the top of the charts today. You've either got to compare just the pop hits of then to the pop hits now or, better yet, you've got to do some legwork and actually learn what is out there that is good. Though I suspect it's easier to ignorantly dismiss those damn kids.

It's common behavior. It means that all of the college radio music lover types that encounter this thread are going laugh at you old fogie. And talking about all the great sixties acts isn't going to stop the laughter because a) the college radio music lover types damn well do know about it and b) you display gross ignorance of anything that has happened musically afterwords.

I know that the comment down thread about how "unexperimental" modern music is had me in stitches, as the CD at my elbow was by a pop star who'd recently released a virutally a cappella featuring two songs in icelandic.

Honestly, this all amuses me to no end because if there was ever a generation that was the target of raving polemics about the fall of America's youth, it was the baby boom. To have the same generation point the exact same charges at the generations to follow just shows how utterly un-self-aware most people are.

to HE
I ran into David tonight while out shopping, we talked and I passed on your message to him. he sounded pleased to have got the message.

I need a job.

Harlan, please find me a writing job right away.

I can write barbing column reviews. I can write self-righteous film reviews. I can write yellow journalism. I can write slander. I can write smut. I can write twisted romance. I can write dialogue for porno. I can write sf or fantasy. I can write ace suicide notes.

I need the work right away, so please don't take your time about things. And don't want any of this shit about "unsolicited" material or experience. I can handle the work.

The payment arrangements: I work by pay-or-write. Anyone wishing to acquire my services will have to send me a check for $1.5 million along with an outline of the assignment. If I really like the project I'll cash the check. The client will then owe me another $1.5 million. If he cannot come up with the other half I will forfeit the assignment and keep my half.

I'll wait by the phone for your call. Don't be too long - I have to hit the can.

Val Lewton Boxed Set
Am currently making my way through the Val Lewton boxed set, preparatory to a review: a real labor of love for me, since I've always wanted to see these films and have never managed to catch up with any of them other than CAT PEOPLE. (A shocking hole in my movie buff experience, I know. But I lived most of my life in the days before DVDs, and none of Lewton's movies but CAT PEOPLE were ever in heavy rotation on the midnight movie). Anyhow, so far I've seen GHOST SHIP, THE LEOPARD MAN, and BEDLAM; GHOST SHIP is so far my favorite of the three. Was less impressed with LEOPARD MAN than I expected to be, though I dearly loved the suspense sequences, including the one involving the locked door that our host has praised in many venues.

Stephane


That Stringsville article refers to Grappelli as "sirup" (sic?). And here I thought I had good taste in jazz violin.

Ever the humbled one,
Neal

Typos
Please forgive 'em. As stated, 4 hours sleep and only on my first cup...

Bled Jazz
Four hours sleep last night after a late evening roadying for me esposa, so, yeah, good topic for the day. We just made a deal for distro to fifty or so college and internet jazz "radio" stations. Hopefully I can point you towards some of 'em for a airplay. (Cookie, email me...)

Oh, and she may be playing at the Beverly Hilton and a guest-spot at the LA Hard Rock (?!?) in Feb.

(I know. Shameless.)
_______________________________________
On the other hand, I can't resist posting one more thought on dem damn yoot...

Would it be fair to make the observations that a) kids today aren't necessarily dumber than previous generation, just less motivated to learn and more motivated to watch tv/play video games? And b) that we're all echoing the exact same complaints previous generations level at the "youth of today"? I can remember some pretty scathing reviews of the "Youth of the '60s", and most of them worked out okay (though some with fewer brain cells than the rest of us...). The same with the self-indulgent '70s and the new-wave '80s.

SOME of today's youth are pretty lacking, there's no question. Have they read the great authors? Do they know from Hemingway, Shakespeare, Flaubert, Tolstoy, Cervantes or Thackery? No, not likely. The messages posted by the younger-skewing PA fans inevitably began "I don't know who Harlan Ellison is, but..." The vast majority of the '60s generation may have recognized the name Kerouac, but did they really ever red his stuff? God knows enough people DID read Rod McKuen' poetry and labeled it great literature -- so youthful tastes and education WERE questionable in that generation.

On the other hand I'll go back to the motivation thingy. In all honesty, I think kids today are as smart and potentially as edumacated as older folks, but they seem to be (vast generalization and I can give many examples of exceptions) less inclined to excel, and a good portion of this comes from our society's message to them: Self-indulgence is okay, get rich quick with a lawsuit, criticism is a no-no according to psychologists, and pressure/punishment is something reserved for adults since we don't want the kids to grow up -- gee -- like we did.

USA Today gives headlines instead of analysis. MTV gave us the three minute attention span. Pokemon instead of Curiosity Shop and Schoolhouse Rock on Saturday morning. George Bush -- a noted slacker, alcoholic and drug user in his youth -- was an acceptable president to the majority of Americans AFTER demonstrating his incompetence in office.

Folks, it's OUR view of the world these kids are growing into, and in many ways complaining about the quality of the kids today is a reflection on what WE created. The kids didn't invent this world, they're simply adapting to the one we gave 'em. That doesn't make 'em dumb, just evolutionary.

if you're cut, do you bleed jazz?

Fun article on Stringsville:
http://www.jonroseweb.com/c_articles_stringsville.html

It is indeed a tasty album.





Keiti- Sorry to hear you're giving up teaching.

My Own Two Cents (for what they're worth)
I haven't posted here but once, so you may or may not recall at my last post I had just started teaching high school english. That was about three months ago. Suffice to say, I've had the current topic of today's youth on my brain. I also told Harlan that I would get back to him and let him know whether I got the okay to teach "I Have No Mouth" to my 11th Grade Honors Kids. (For the record, I never got the official "okay", but I did read it to them as a last hurrah.) After a mere three months of teaching I'd decided I'd had enough. Perhaps my reasons of choosing not to continue teaching make me a selfish bitch. So be it. Self-preservation kicked in and took hold.

In some ways, I fall into the abyss that is today's youth. I am 34 - not the brightest person on the planet, and mis-spent much of my youth goofing off and doing not much else. I have, however, spent the past 10 years playing catch up, or trying to. For whatever that's worth.

At any rate, I'll skip posting my complete tirade here, but should you want to read it, you can visit http://lucretiaisme.blogspot.com.

Have to go continue cleaning up post Wilma.

Keiti

One thing I've noticed about the younger generation is that profanity has become punctuation. I heard one twentysomething talking to a friend on his cellphone. The conversation went something like this: "Yeah, man, I fuckin' went to the bank yesterday and this hot fuckin' chick was standing in line, and we fuckin' said hello to each other, and I was fuckin' psyched!"

Musings
If the shift to a white collar (and services) economy sucks the life out of youth, is that a statement against technology (above a certain level?)

Many jobs are sent overseas, but more are lost to automation.

The economy is increasingly technical and scientific, which means that increasingly only those with advanced degrees - or at the very least a lot more science background than our schools give people - can earn a living wage. There is a polarization between high and low paying jobs with the middle class rapidly disappearing.

Science education is failing and more and more people are taught to believe in Creationism even as the biological sciences are the fastest growing (with the things like an aging population needing new medicines, etc.)

Also, I sometimes wonder how people who have been science fiction fans can be Luddite, and why political activism is more important than a good general education.

Just thinking,

Kristin

Are the Yoots of Today legions of morons? Well, gang, I've devoted some serious thought to this. Really. I noodled on this one for a few hours today, on and off, while I ironed my shirts, watched _I Walked with a Zombie_, oversaw the Roto Rooter man drill out my sewer line, washed out my basement with a hose of hot water, helped a friend deliver goods to a goodwill store, and did all kindsa other boring stuff. But all though it, I was wondering, "Okay, _are_ today's kids creeps compared to those of Those Fabulous Sixties?"

And it's a sad admission to say _yes_. It's sad because I come from the cohort at the tail end of the Baby Boom. I say this _admitting_ the failure of my generation to meet and surpass the challenges of that great decade.

I'd like to point out that most of the movers and shakers of that time were not, precisely speaking, Baby Boomers. The Port Huron Statement-- that wonderful distillation of the aspirations of postwar America-- was composed by those born just before or during World War II. The leaders of the Civil Rights movement-- King, Abernathy, even Malcolm-- were born in the 1920s. The artists who stepped forward as New American Voices were also prewar babies, perhaps in the 1920s or the 1930s. In some cases, they were the same men and women who'd fought in World War II, and knew the stakes then. The 1960s weren't an aberration, or something that popped up from the shitload of Baby Boomers who'd made it into college; they were the last and highest reach for greatness of the men and women of the 20th Century.

The main virtue of the Baby Boomers is this: they had a damn good sense of who to _listen_ to. This may be because they were the last _literate_ generation, where print carried an authority that we now give to television and movies and music. This doesn't mean that everyone they followed was a king among men (Timothy Leary, for example). But they did seem to have a slightly better bullshit detector than those who've followed.

I won't say all of the kids are Fer Shit. There are always percentages of activists, agitators, thinkers and doers among any large cohort. But to me, it seems that those people are comfortably marginalized by their peers; the rest of the subsequent generations are more content to leave the Big Questions up to those in power.

I have a strongly-Marxian theory that this has to do with the rise of our service economy: office clerical work has never been conducive to labor unrest or worker solidarity, and the fruits of that labor feel empty and pointless, so perhaps its rise has met with a general lack of spirit and a disconnectedness from real life-and-death issues. It grinds people doen, and the people who aren't ground down _yet_ see others being ground down, and figure that's the Way of the World.

So yeah. I'd say we've gone downhill. Just not without cause.

Old News
I've been looking at the comments here, those that are savory and those that are vapid little things, and I find that the best way I can answer them is to include part of my own exchange with Harlan, from right here in 2001. And I note that with the passing of years, I now think I was dead wrong, and Harlan, as so often, was deadly right---


Alex Krislov
Stray Cur Heights, Ooooooooo-klahio United States - Sunday, July 29 2001 11:20:42
Okay, okay, so the kids today ain't got no culture. It's true, I don't deny it. What bothers me a bit about these comments is that I always hear my generation muttering along these lines, and, damnit, neither did we. I squeak, of course, of the Baby Boomers.

Harlan wrote, in THE GLASS TEAT, of finding reason to bless television when a waiter in a restaurant sported a t-shirt with the words "Rick's Cafe American." For all the boob tube's manifold flaws, it did help maintain the past. Where else, in those pre-cable, pre-VCR days, would this youngster have seen "Casablanca?" Bubelahs, Balbatim, that's not kids, that's _us._ That's the boomerbaby generation, the self-absorbed coterie that invented sex, proclaimed the church of pot-smoking, and outlawed tobacco. Think our generation has cultural depth? Hah!

Whenever someone challenges me on my skepticism regarding astrology, I point out that I'm a twin. My sister, born five minutes ahead of me (pushy, even then), raised with the same enormous family library, educated at the same schools, holder of two degrees, reads a book as often as twice a year. During the OJ trial, she stretched out and read _three!_ We've got the same sign? Hah!

I know boomers who talk about today's damn kids, but who wouldn't know Also Sprach Zarathustra (except for the main theme, for obvious reasons) from the Moonlight Sonata. This year, they know Dizzy from Satchmo because they've heard the gospel of Ken Burns. But it won't last.

In 1995 or 6, Harlan told me his great "Lost Horizon" story--and how it was totally lost on the staff of White Wolf publishing, where the oldest member of the staff, publicist Kim Shropshire, was several years shy of thirty. Delighted, I repeated the yarn to my wife....who said, "What's 'Lost Horizon?'"

Yeah, the damn kids don't know nothin' today....but are the boomers in a position to talk?

Okay, I'm feeling cynical today. My older daughter asked what I had playing in my office this morning, and my wife said, "More of daddy's weird music." It was "Bright Corners" by Monk. Faz baz.

--Just ranting, Alex


Harlan Ellison
- Sunday, July 29 2001 18:46:13
Cookie and Alex K.:

I am about to turn you on to a thing that you will never forget, that will roll your socks up and down . . . if you can locate a copy.

Monk is one of my passions. Heard him play live at the Five Spot, the Showplace, the Village Vanguard, and other venues, in the '50s and early '60s. My favorite Monk composition is, predictably, "'Round Midnight."

And the best version of it---after Monk's original, of course---appears on an Atlantic album (circa late '50s) by violinist Harry Lookofsky titled STRINGSVILLE. The number of memorable jazz violinists beyond Grappelli and Joe Venuti and Stuff Smith and the occasional piece by Tal Farlow (and one other famous one, whose name has fallen out of my head just when I need it) can be counted on the fingers of one hand with enough digits left over to pick your nose.

This, as far as I know, was Lookofsky's only pressing as a leader, though he was a much-valued, much-hired, much-respected studio musician and first violin in several world class symphonic aggregations. How and why this offbeat album was cut, I have no idea. But when Atlantic released it, I gave it a "highest recommendation" in my jazz columns and in reviews for METRONOME. It is, simply, breathtaking. Haunting. Imperial.

If you two enjoy Monk, then take it as your life's work to locate a copy of STRINGSVILLE. You will honor me for the advisement.

(And to all those of you with an unquenchable egalitarian mien--much like the one I sported for fifty-plus years--who think that "babyboomers" shouldn't be dissing today's dunderheaded tots because YOU were vapid in YOUR teens, well, as I've said repeatedly, LIFE IS NOT A COMPARISON OF CHAMBERS OF HORROR!!!

(Just because YOU were shallow, does not make the emptiness, surliness, arrogance, cultural illiteracy, violence, fatheaded antics, outright ignorance, blatant stupidity, and random disrespectful belligerance of today's punks any less objectionable, any more pardonable, any nobler or permissable.
There is a qualitative difference, as well as a quantitative one. Things ARE worse. More jerkazoids, and the level of jerknicity asymptotically higher than a cat stranded in a belfry. Even in the '60s and '70s, when addressing a high school or college crowd, I could expect a level of understanding and curiosity and cultural ethic that today would get such kids a place on The Weakest Link or Who Wants to be a Badly-Informed Millionaire. Today, the plague sowed by rock'n'roll as religion has taken its toll. Kids are, in fact, dumber, less informed, less literate, and snottier about it than they were in times before The Gap and MTV and the dynamite pr of this week's shitty movie blockbuster. They are a corrupted constituency mesmerized and potty-trained to be nothing more glorious than conspicuous consumers of seasonal faddish food and tune and clothing, to want nothing more than a Lexus and partypartyparty; and it is only the anecdotal exception--such as Justin, who is ANYTHING but a punk--that keeps me from pressing the red button to blow every one of the orally-challenged little pismires to Kingdom Come.

(Stop excusing the rampant cultural moronicity just because there were shitheads and dumbkopfs and assholes when YOU were in high school. Remember what it felt like to NOT be one of their ravenous clique? Pre-Columbine horror situations. Remember?)

These are the soulless doofuses who go to work for rapacious law firms like Latham & Watkins. Who buy acromegalic SUVs to show how big their dicks are. Who litter without a thought. Who see no Big Picture, see no Little Picture, see only their own avarice as worthwhile. Who have everything, but are still riddled with umbrage. Who cannot accept responsibility for their actions, much less their lives. Who know nothing, but have never had a star shine in their eyes, or a dream illuminate the arid wasteland of their inner moral desert. They were ignorant and amoral as an asp when they were kids, and as adults they are as free of ethical imperative as aluminum siding.

You excuse them, you let them off the hook, at your peril. Nathaniel Brazill was not unique.

Yr. pal, Harlan, who daily grows more pragmatic as the darkness creeps toward him.

DVG:

It is time someone rapped your pinkies with a steel-edged ruler.

Your asseverations and "observations" about the society of the 1960s--1970s are ignorant AND no more accurate than any other politically-fomented Urban Legendry that serves the current loathesome apparat. Which is to say, as we used to say in the slam, "you are talking outta the side of your neck."

But sanity is available to you. Help is on the way. I have written a long essay. It is called "The Song the Sixties Sang." It is accurate and even-handed, down to the smallest jot of minutiae. It originally appeared in Playboy.

It is one of the selections contained in THE HARLAN ELLISON HORNBOOK. If you do not own a copy, and cannot take one out of the nearest library, we will cheerfully sell you a copy at a reasonable price, right here at this website.

But do avail yourself of this wonderful, fact-&-fun-filled testament to a period about which, clearly, you don't know squat.

Respectfully, Yr. Pal, Harlan

DVG

Please play by the same rules the rest of us are expected to obey---1 post per day.

Thank you.

"Okay. I am going to stop myself, because I could go and on and on and on..."

Thanks! Duly noted.

I really have no idea what sort of cave you'd have to live in to think kids only listen to what's on the radio or MTV. It couldn't possibly be a cave in New York, where every 20-something is busy giving me a pass to their friend's cousin's aunt's cat's alto-techno-ska-rock-opera concert and where the acclaimed queen of the cabaret revival, Maude Maggart, checks in at the ripe old age of 28.

"DVG - Because in the sixties youth created great artistic triumphs like "Herman and the Hermits."

I'll climb onto my soapbox for a moment. I'm very disappointed in the musical awareness of kids these days. If it's not on MTV (for what little music they even play anymore), or on the radio, then it's obscure and unworthy. I'm just so disappointed in today's generation, because sterotypical attitudes rule their openness to and judgement of music. For example, classical and bluegrass. If hasn't a beat, then it's not "normal" music. Sure, a lot of other forms of music are an acquired taste, but that requires a slowing down and focusing; a lot the most popular, mainstream alternative/pop-rock music gives kids a quick, two-minute music high. Fast music for fast moving lives. A lot of kids in this latest generation are nursed on it during their early exposure to music; it's addicting, and therefore breeds ignorance, limiting their spectrum of awareness and appreciation. It's all so disappointing.

Okay. I am going to stop myself, because I could go and on and on and on...

Honor your forefathers (and foremothers)

Steve Burnap cracked:

> DVG - Because in the sixties youth created great artistic triumphs like "Herman and the Hermits.


That was "Herman's Hermits" (as distinguished from Paul Revere and the Raiders, The Mamas and the Papas, and and Dion and the Belmonts), led by Peter Noone, whippersnapper.

Just the other day, I was thinking about how I ought to do "Mrs. Brown, You've Got a Lovely Daughter" on karaoke night. . . .

The young are impatient with, and dismissive of the old. The old are jealous and fearful of the young.

Same as it ever was.

Ignorance is always bad but old ignorance seems to do a lot more damage than young ignorance.

And every generation is simultaneously slip slidin' into the arms of ole scratch and sprouting wings flying to glory.

Same as it ever was.

Now that that's settled...

S.P.I.D.E.R. Forums
Hey everyone,

If you are new to the board or haven't visited in a while, might I recommend a visit to the SPIDER Forums located in the Forums (see the top of the page)? The service is slow, but the conversation is lively the company slightly mad, but fascinating, and the meat... is an Ellis-ATION!!

Come in and bring your own dish. Take a bite off someone else's plate. Hell, take a bite out of someone's ass. It's all haute cuisine at SPIDER Forums.

Da Forumz: Where the Elite Meet for Spider-y Treats!

Alex Krislov:

Okay, be more specific. Your complaint, in substance, is no different from the one people were making ten, twenty, and, I suppose fifty or five hundred years ago. Are 87% of today’s kids dunderheads, as opposed to 83% thirty years ago? I think this sort of comparison is useless. It tells us nothing. Also, again, and this is obviously a matter of personal taste, the attitude reeks of paternalism and condescension, which irritate me.

You should take a look at David Brooks’ Atlantic article on Princeton students. Which many people took as a portrait of a generation of organization men (and women.) Well, maybe, but they’re a bunch of very smart conformists. “Overachiever” seems an understatement. Twenty years ago I managed to get into Columbia. Today I think I’d be lucky to be admitted to UC Berkeley, which was my safety school in 1984.

I’m also reminded of Vonnegut’s retort to Allen Ginsberg, which went something like “Well, I saw the best minds of MY generation become particle physicists and biochemists.”

Eric Martin:

You’re right. It’s a sorry picture. And I’m sure in trailer parks all over America people are losing sleep, asking themselves “How did I let Eric Martin down?”

Let me suggest a slogan for the 2008 Democratic presidential nominee: “Prove you’re not an idiot...vote for me.”

That’ll be a big winner.

Artistic Culture
DVG - Because in the sixties youth created great artistic triumphs like "Herman and the Hermits.

"Harlan told me I was kidding myself. He told me to examine today's kids more closely, and compare them to the kids of the sixties and seventies. He said they didn't measure up.

And y'know what? He was right."

In what way precisely?

Bad dancing? Illegitimate children named "Moonbeam?" VW Bus ownership? Later BMW ownership? Ugly haircuts? Multiple marriages? Herpes transmission rates? Illiterate New York Times Op-Ed contributions? Greenmailing? Whining? Having an old fondue pot somewhere that they haven't used since 1978?

And precisely how did this "close examination" take place? A detailed checklist titled "Ways in Which you Are Inferior to Dirty Hippies" passed out to the Senior Class at Yale? Or was this one of those "candy and a long dark car" things weird old Uncle Harry was always going on about?

Are kids self-centered ignoramuses?
Yep, by and large - but no less than their parents. I don't envy kids.

I had a discussion a couple of years ago with a mom who heatedly advocated for home-schooling and railed against public education. Well, I pointed out that when I grew up in the '60s public education was a fine and productive thing, going back to FDR. It was dismantled by the extreme tugs of political factions in the '70s (I watched that happen from the inside, moving as I did from parochial and public schools, even doing a two-year non-ROTC bid at the same Jesuit/military high school from which Antonin Scalia graduated.) But long argument short, the point being that public schooling COULD work, if people didn't whine about paying for it.

"But since you don't have any kids," she countered, "it's not really your problem then, is it?"

And I answered, "It's my problem when stupid kids grow up to be stupid adults."

And my point to all of you is: The world is run by stupid, self-centered adults NOW, many of whom are as subbornly ignorant of history as toddlers. Where did they come from?

But rather than wait for more on this tiresome topic, I direct you all to this splendid profile of my heroine, Sarah Silverman, from a recent issue of the New Yorker:

http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/articles/051024fa_fact

History
Steve D - I kind of wonder if this isn't a recurrent question generation after generation. The "kids" never seem to get "it", and the parental types always tend to believe that we're losing touch with our heritage.

I think there's valid concern that younger people don't have a real appreciation of historical events, and part of this has to do with age and maturity. But it also has to do with exposure and experience.

Growing up I moved around quite a bit (Navy family). What I discovered is that people who grew up in places of real historical value (Washington, DC; Newport; Boston; Philadelphia, etc) tended to have a better understanding of what had gone on before because they were literally surrounded by it. When I moved to SoCal I found that a lot of my friends just didn't care because it was all textbook, no reality.

Inner city young people who have never seen anything but pavement and cards are never going to understand what it's like to stand on the edge of the Grand Canyon, the middle of the Shenandoah forest, or the coast of Maine. Just no reference. Jamestown becomes just an animated backdrop to Pocahantas.

I grew up with an appreciation of history because history was all around me and it was important to my family. It isn't "Black History" that's in danger -- it's American history. If it isn't real, if it isn't living, then it's not of relevant importance to somone who is dealing with gangs, poverty, racism, drugs and the world at large.

Most (if not all) of the Webderlanders have a better appreciation of history and education simply because we've all been lucky enough to encounter the world as something to be explored and wondered at, not as something to be feared or ignored. I've always thought that the most valuable learning tool is travel. Sadly, not enough of us do it, and not enough of us do it well.

My 2 Centavos.
_______________________________________________

Glad to read the news that Chez Castro is alive and well, if a little damp...

I just had an eighteen year old "African American" student in my class hold forth on Huey Newton, Marcus Garvey, Rosa Parks, MLK, "The Letter from a Birmingham Jail" and "The Autobiography of Malcolm X." HE IS ALSO NOT ATYPICAL.

So many of the assumptions being made here, on both sides, show that the "wise posters" of the pavilion are being misinformed by the exact same media that they decry.

Is it that "black history" is dead in the "black" community or is it really that history is dead all around?

Steve Dooner

Jack Skillingstead, the very notion of a "working class" is a generalization. But I think the numbers would bear me out on most, if not all, of my unfair lumpings.

Class
Eric Martin, your list regarding "the working class" is an unfair generalization.

This is what Alex K. said in his original post: "today's African-American youth don't appreciate the legacy she won for them..."

What he is referring to specifically is a sample space of inner city black youth. But he didn't say that. He made an otherwise valid argument by pointing at "today's African-American youth". A rather all-encompassing label, if you ask me. As such, it is imprecise; however unintentionally, it marks everyone with a presupposition if he or she is young and black. This is, as I was trying to argue, the construct of stereotyping. I have black friends who'd sit there shaking their heads.

This is NOT a difficult point to follow.

To be clear on the rest of Alex's issue, he is right about how people, in general, can forget the struggle that pre-dated them and gave them the advantages of the present day. Happens all the time.

Hmmm...
Hmm. This dialogue about ignorant/attentive youth does stir my thoughts, but at almost-twenty-five, I don't consider myself experienced enough in life to comment up to the level that some you others are. But I'll toss in my two cents: I will agree that there's a massive plague of ignorance in today's youth. However, there are some very empowered and intelligent kids out there; the "bright stars" who will influence society. One single person can't change the world, but they can influence others who may put forth the same effort towards betterment of society. That's truly how it works.

Sociologist Herbert Spencer said that Social Darwinism was The Way for societies; fuck that shit. We are creatures of reason, and are entirely empowered with abilities to mold our societies. So, my point: There's a lot of youth out there whom know that, and are rising up to the challenges. Again, it's not just up to them. They'll influence and inspire, and hopefully that'll spread more and more, as the generations go on. But I'm not wearing rose-colored glasses; gotta be realistic: it's a choice. Free will is bittersweet.

Checking In
Have been without power since early Monday AM, when the hurricane knocked us out, but the lights came on a few short minutes ago. All is well here. Thanks for the queries, and thanks to Harlan and Susan for a necessary service to the temporarily electronics-deprived. --ATC

What you mean by "we," Kemosabe?
-------------"Yes, I'm sure you and your wife have encountered plenty of ignorant young folks, and old folks, of every race. What grates on me (and I might be guilty of reading more of it into your post than was actually there) is the paternalistic, condescending tone of "why don't they appreciate all we've done for them?" ----

We? Do I look like Rosa Parks? Nope, not nearly as pretty, and certainly nowhere near as impressive. Say, friend, I used to sound _just_ like you--and on this board, too! I spouted the "well, today's kids may suck, but they're no worse than we were" and "every generation pisses down on the next generation" bit, too.

Harlan told me I was kidding myself. He told me to examine today's kids more closely, and compare them to the kids of the sixties and seventies. He said they didn't measure up.

And y'know what? He was right.

There's a real lack of curiosity and intellectual rebellion in today's kids. They're not nihilistic--they're not giving their fatalism enough thought to rate that term. It's no wonder Bush is in office. He fits.

(Well, that ought to get me some hate mail.)

The working class have also been very disappointing what with all the drowning in the streets they've been doing recently. And those higher levels of mental and physical disorders--what's up with that?

Really, if only the super-rich controlled all of society. Things would be so much better. Well, for us, anyway.

Perhaps we could kill off the poor by sending them to a meaningless war someplace, preferably where there are a lot of other poor people?

See you poolside.

Caviar-flavored martinis--what won't they think of next?

>Oh dear...the working class is such a disappointment to me<

Well, what HAS the working class been up to these days? Let's see...

--a total decline in union membership
--the rise of idiot reality television and pseudo-sports like wrestling
--resounding votes for Bush and his administration for two terms running
--jingoistic support of the Iraq war
--a complete disinterest in environmental issues
--fervid anti-abortion lobbying
--gay-bashing as a matter of course
--tacit compliance with the surveillance society
--crystal meth epidemics in trailer parks across the land
--local lobbying to replace evolution with Christianity in the classroom

Yeah, I'd say the working class has been a disappointment to me too.

Alex - Yes, I'm sure you and your wife have encountered plenty of ignorant young folks, and old folks, of every race. What grates on me (and I might be guilty of reading more of it into your post than was actually there) is the paternalistic, condescending tone of "why don't they appreciate all we've done for them?" I think it's best summed up by that wonderful moment in "My Beautiful Laundrette" when Roshan Seth's disillusioned alcoholic journalist looks sadly at Daniel Day Lewis' reformed skinhead-turned-"underpants cleaner" and says "Oh dear...the working class is such a disappointment to me."

Some buried bones and a follow-up
*** Jay *** Thanks for the "SMILER" post on the other board. The hair part and pin make it almost too creepy.

***Mitch***
I'm posting the link to Harlan's story, ALL THE SOUNDS OF FEAR.

http://www.scifi.com/scifiction/classics/

Since you're hitting that archive anyways, you may want to check out this little ditty by Manley Wade Wellman with Halloween so close upon us. It's a nice tight little John the Balladeer tale.
A wonderful series for the uninitiated and just as good on the re-read.

http://tinyurl.com/9aawk

----------------------------------------------------

I stuck my Rosa Parks thing up on my blog and got a great letter from a friend of mine about how I should have tagged or "screenshot" the page I referred to, so as to capture the moment and so that he could hit the link. At first I thought this was a netiquette thing - not that I have a problem with that, since I firmly believe they are excavating new levels of hell for spammers and ALL CAPS screamers - but, he brought me up to speed on the power of blogs to track Orwellian revisionism and how more imbedded links can sometimes equal more veracity. Oh hell, I'm just going to quote him;

>> Kev to me: "I believe you. It's just that, having been tipped, I wanted to see what you were talking about, and one of the strengths of web-based reporting is that you, the reporter, can link to what you're talking about so we can see for ourselves. Could be because we want more detail; could be because we don't trust reporters' ability to summarize what they're told by people working on things the reporters have no background in (which is most things).

Once you start spending time on blogs, you develop a habit of clicking through to see whatever it is the blogger is talking about, instead of just taking their summary. And once you've developed that habit, you start to wonder why you CAN'T do it on NYT and CNN stories.

Especially stories about controveries triggered by blogs and community sites (DKos, FreeRepublic, DemocraticUnderground). Why don't they have links in their online stories and URLs in their paper editions? When they're reporting on documents and speeches, why are links to scans of the documents and transcripts of the speeches so rare? I think it's just being slow to get with the times, but a cynic might wonder if it has anything to do with how often such scans /transcripts are the basis of debunkings (Rathergate, canonically).

Rumsfeld (and Wolfowitz, when he was at the Pentagon) makes his own recordings when he's interviewed by the press, and the Pentagon posts the transcripts. Why don't the reporters do the same?" <<

Me again. Now, to some of you this is all old news, but it REALLY got me to thinking. I don't plan to use my blog as a reportage/investigative tool but rather, as an archive. But his point about the imbedded links as footnotes, or points of potential verification and their use (or, lack of same) got me excited about the [forgive me] blogosphere, in a way that I really hadn't been.

I know Harlan sees MOST of this as backyard washerwoman gossiping, and sometimes I'm in that camp myself, but if one of my smartest friends is going to give this new information environment this kind of thought I really have to at least consider its potential value.

The "follow-up" on the Parks thing was that just after I wrote that piece yesterday, Ms. Parks got bumped down from the national news [above the fold] section of the Google news page to the "people" section. Nothing sinister there, that's just the news cycle, doing what it does. But the USA Today link took me to a photo gallery of 12 shots. The fingerprint shot, mug shot,

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/mugshots/rparksmug1.html
I'm using this link only because the USA Today photo gallery section is not copy/pastable.

and the ubiquitous "riding the bus" shot, but also, 9 color photos of her looking older - and happier.

So, no particular apparent malice on the part of USA Today unless they assigned some sort of value algorithm to the gallery shots. For all I know, Google tracked me checking some other "perp-walk" link and said to it's AM-like self, "Give Barney mug shots. He likes mug-shots." Brrr.

And if none of this process is fascinating to you, I'm sorry, but the idea of algorithms tracking and possibly altering our shared realities or personal realities sure is interesting to me.

- Barney

http://barney.wordpress.com/

The unsettling thing about the Miers withdrawal is the reason: Bush was bowing to pressure/lack of support from the extreme right. Kind of indicates how weak and disorganized the left continues to be in this country.

On a brighter note:

This coming weekend, actors and technical people from the Willamette Radio Workshop will perform a new adaptation of "Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde" by Portland playwright Sam Gregory, in the style of an old-time-radio show -- with actors reading scripts and doing live sound effects before an audience at several venues.

The shows will include the crackle of thunder and clip-clops of hansom cabs, gunshots, a large body falling down a staircase, and other exciting noises. (We're probably going to waste a few melons to get the sound of a head cracking open on the cobblestones after a fall from a roof.)

Shows will be at 7:00 p.m. on Saturday, Oct. 29th at the White Eagle Saloon (long reputed to be haunted), 836 North Russell Street; and at 5:30 and 7:00 p.m. on Halloween night, Monday, Oct. 31 at McMenamins Kennedy School, 5736 N.E. 33rd.

And yes, I will be reading a number of different roles as well as doing sound effects.

For more on the Willamette Radio Workshop (you can order CDs of their past shows, including last Halloween's Ogle-award-winning performance of "Frankenstein") at:

http://www.radiowork.com/index.php

The first comics adaptation of "The Hobbit"
First, I see it's being reported that Harriet Miers has withdrawn as Supreme Court Nominee. Credit her with some sense.

Now, I think that I may have asked this here before, but I'm trying to track down a comics adaptation of "The Hobbit" that appeared in a children's magazine in the mid- or late-1960s, when I was a wee lad growing up in Albion, NY. Obviously, this has nothing to do with the Eclipse Comics adaptation by Chuck Dixon and David Wenzel (of which, I have two copies--surely I have a nephew or niece who could use one). I thought that someone--perhaps the esteemed Mr. Ellison, himself--might remember this.

What I am trying to find out, is: 1) Who produced the adaptation; 2) Where and when was it actually published; 3) Was the adaptation ever completed; 4) Was it ever collected; and, 5) Does anyone know where I could obtain a copy?

I know for certain that this actually existed; I once possessed several issues of the magazine that serialized the story. Unfortunately, I have long-since lost the issues, and cannot even remember the publication's title. Help!

OUR History
Ummm.

Since when is teaching about Rosa Parks, Martin Luther King, Malcolm X, Harriett Tubman, the underground railroad, the civil rights movement and the slave trade only African American history? They are AMERICAN history.

(Damn, where are italics when you need 'em.)

I've always felt the two-word approach to a sub-group's ancestral heritage (African American, Asian American, etc) detracts from us as a whole, and lets the divisions remain intact...

The fact that the schools may or may not be teaching specific parts of history -- it becoming increasingly difficult to teach anything controversial -- doesn't let us off the hook as a society. WE'RE the ones who need to make sure that the history isn't forgotten.
_____________________________________________________

Harriett Miers figured out that a lack of support from both the left and the right makes the process kind of worthless.

Tomorrow we (hopefully) get some justice from Prosecutor Fitzgerald. Delay, Frist and maybe Rove all indicted. So much for Bush's much vaunted ethical administration. Wasn't it Harlan who once observed that he would happily vote for any candidate with the cajones to tell us he/she would steal from us, but steal less from us than the other candidates???
______________________________________________

Lets hope the continuing silence from Florida is merely reflective of a lack of access, not a more significant problem.

Fun Shops
Mark,

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad places like Dreamhaven are around, I'm just find it amazing that they stay in business. Maybe they have decent rent since they are in a not-so-nice part of town. In days like today, the Cub and the Rainbow and the other super stores have put out the mom and pop grocery stores out of business. Same thing applies to book stores and everything else that has a fun quality to it, being a unique locally owned business versus a huge corporation.

However, Dreamhaven doesn't really carry much for "new" books, other than a niche selection, so I don't see places like Barnes and Noble really taking much of its business. Personally, I find their selection to be sub-par; all of it at priced at market premium or above. That is just my opinion. The Nostalgia Zone operates on a similar business model, I call it The Museum, because they price everything at top dollar or above. The difference between the two is that I know Nostalgia Zone will have just about every oddball obscure comic from 30 or 40 years, so long as I'm willing to pay through the nose. Dreamhaven prices the same, but caries a much skimpier selection, I find their comic selection in particular to be pretty forgettable. At Dreamhaven I see stuff way overpriced sitting on their shelves for YEARS! Years man! That is just crazy to me. Places like Uncle Hugos still operate with the frame of mind, that they are turning product over, constantly. Run by fans for fans, if you will. I'm not giving the Uncles a huge pat on the back or anything, I'm just pointing out the difference. eBay of course has changed how collectors interact.

One thing that I do like about Dreamhaven a lot, is that they publish stuff from time to time that is pretty fun. I'm not sure if you've read "Now we are Sick" or "Shelf Life" but stuff like that is pretty cool, unique and only happens at once place. But for finding some gem paperback or comic from the 60's or 70's, it just isn't the place to go. They have a small stock of it, and what they do have, is priced at a premium. Which is too bad, because to me that seems like what the main function of a store should be to the consumer - but in reality I'm guessing the main function of the physical store these days is to buy - buy up collections from people off the street.

I find the stories of the people who own and operate these stores to be pretty interesting. Greg from Dreamhaven seems to be a pretty connected guy. The feuds that took place between the owners of the Comic City/College of Comic Book Knowledge/Nostalgia Zone and the beginnings of Shinders are all fun bits of Mpls collectors history.

Sorry if I tend to ramble.

P.s. You mentioned Neil Gaiman - he is going to be signing at Dreamhaven, I think a spurt of the moment thing - in the next couple of weeks. Might want to keep your eyes peeled at Neil's blog or Dreamhavens website if you're interested.

The rap artist was KRS-One, who also provided the ad-lib commentary at the end of REM's "Radio Song."

I actually don't like rap particularly. But then it isn't really addressed to me.

If kids don't know about X, then there is something wrong with the people and/or organizations who are teaching them the subject. How this doesn't immediately present itself as a fact will never cease to astonish me.

I count myself as fairly well-read but if my mother hadn't taken the time to instill a sense of reading as a pleasure in me at a young age and also indicate what books were and would be important, I don't know that I would have come to it by myself. Most kids would rather run around outside and play than sit indoors with a book. This probably has something to do with hormones, etc., than it does deeply rooted character flaws.

Arguments to the contrary have a whiff of Mrs. Joe about them. "Ungrateful! Why is it that the young are always ungrateful?"

Bookstores in Mpls
Brent,

I know Uncle Hugo's and its brother store Uncle Edgar's very well. I usually take a trip there 3-4 times a year and have never left there empty handed. When my Dad makes his annual visit up here, I know that I will be spending at least one afternoon at Hugo's, so the place is very special to me. They can be found on the web at http://www.unclehugo.com/prod/

Dreamhaven is a bit different as it is not solely focused on books. They have a huge inventory of collectibles that I love to browse and their comic book catalog is very impressive. Due to the fact that the owner of the store is friends with both Harlan and Neil Gaiman, they have a substantial offering of works from both authors, with much of the stuff from Neil signed.

Dreamhaven is, without question, one of the best stores for fans of the speculative fiction genre that I have ever found. For those interested, the website is http://www.dreamhavenbooks.com/ and has a nice little quote from Harlan at the top of the page

Hip-hop
Y'know back when hip-hop got started, MCs took offense to being called "rappers". Last last week there was an excellent show on NPR about Kwaito (a South African hip-hop/house/world music hybrid); one of the big Kwaito artists said that in their music there are no "bitches, hos, or n*gg#rs". FOr them it is perplexing and sad that American hip-hop is so negetive, violent, and self-degrading.

As a side note, Japanese hip-hop is very interesting. There's a lot of cool stuff that comes out from the Land of the Rising Sun. Check out DJ Krush and Toshinori Kondo's album 'Ki-Oku'. Hip-hop beats and amazing trumpet playing. (Kondo also did an album with Bill Laswell that features spoken word vocals of His Holiness the Dalai Lama. Which I give 2 thumbs up.)

========

I must give George Bush props for not using the passing of the Rosa Parks to further his agenda. For him, it must have been tempting to say "Rosa Parks would want us to stay the course in Iraq" or "Rosa Parks would want Miers to be on the Supreme Court".

It is indeed tragic that young people today - especially African American youth - do not learn about the history of the civil rights movement. Looking back, I realize that the schools (well this was white suburbia though) did a good job of educating *me* about it; my 8th grade history text covered civil rights pretty well. (I also read about Kitty Genovese in some other book about the same time - i don't remember which, but the story is so haunting I never forgot it.)

I wonder if it is a failure of education in general or just inequity in education (minority students do not do as well and go to schools with fewer resources). How could they leave such things out of the school *curriculum*? Is it that African American history isn't being taught, or that the young aren't learning anything???

Rap: I always thought the music (or noise if you prefer) was hip hop if you like it and rap if you didn't! "Rap" started as a noun, not an adjective...it means the rhymes spoken over the music/rhythm beats. I can't stand the hardcore gangsta stuff and am especially offended by the misogynistic language (women are "hos" and "bitches") as well as the violence, gunshots, etc. It *is* a generational thing though (the popular music of people much younger than you is generally considered noise anyway). Not all the lyrics are negative; gangsta is just a sub-genre. Of course, gangsta is something heavily identified with Los Angeles (south central and compton) but you can't blame musicians or street performers for the gang activity; crack cocaine was more responsible. And no, I do not approve of gang violence! And given where Harlan is coming from I don't expect him to like rap, or blame him for calling it noise. I have been reading his late 80s essays in Hornbook (what's interesting is that they were written before the riots, which were a kind of logical outcome to what HE and others were perceptive enough to see coming.)

Kristin

"Has anyone spoken to the Castros?"

Yeah! Hey, A.T.! Are you all right?


DVG:

Who WAS that rap artist? I'd like to know.

DTS in Subterranean Magazine #2


For those who may not have seen it yet, our own DTS (Dorman T. Shindler) debuts his "On Books" review in the above mag, same issue. Publisher/Editor Bill Schafer says that DTS's review column will cover "small and large press releases with an unwavering critical eye." Check it out! Note: This is also the special Caitlin R. Kiernan issue.

Rosa, them damn kids, und so weiter
ROB--No, I haven't taken a comprehensive survey, but my wife teaches in the inner city, here in Cleveland, and she's aghast at how little the kids know of the civil rights movement. They all know of Martin Luther King -- and that's good. But they've barely heard of Rosa Parks, and the name Frederick Douglass is meaningless to them. So, yeah, I DO have a basis for my comment, thankew kindly.

Mind you, the public schools here in Shaker Heights aren't entirely disimilar. Black history month tends to be Martin, Martin, Martin, with a side order of Martin. I like the guy, too, but it seems to me that the focus is far too exclusive.

Maybe Tony Isabella or Bob Ingersoll can chime in and let us know if the focus in their Cleveland suburbs is better distributed. But I'd be surprised if that were the case.

KB,

'Yeah, today's African-American youth don't appreciate the legacy she won for them.'

"Is this based on a comprehensive survey?"

I think that's a damn good question. Do we sit there and characterize the situation from an assumption because we hear someone else say it, or do we actually get out there and talk to "THOSE" people so that we really know what we're talking about?

Stereotyping is a fine gradient with many hidden buttons; it's danger is that we're OFTEN stereotyping with out our realizing it or when we think we AREN'T stereotyping. And it's ground in - readily imbedded - by the fluidity of word-of-mouth (how often do we research ANYTHING to confirm its validity? It's too ez to hear something and then repeat to someone else, wherein he, likewise, will assume it must be so). That's a malady, man; and a mark of EVERY society.

Having said that, then, are we assuming we White Boys appreciate black heritage and UNDERSTAND it better than today's black youth? Once again, our race is apparently ahead in the game. Smarter. Faster. Stronger.

For the record, needless to say, I've met plenty o'black folk - most of them in their 20's - extremely informed about their own heritage, with a GREAT deal to say about people like Rosa Parks.

My guess is, those who aren't into that history are no greater in proportionate number than those of any OTHER group. Of course, I haven't done my research on that.

I apologize for making this the second post of the day, but would like to make the following example:

Here are selections from the lyrics of two songs, both performed by African-American artists.

One is a widely-aclaimed jazz classic, the other a rap song.

Hush now, don’t explain
Just say you’ll remain
I’m glad your back, don’t explain

Quiet, don’t explain
What is there to gain
Skip that lipstick
Don’t explain

The truth is that police must serve and protect
REALITY is black youth is shown no respect
The truth is government has a war against drugs
REALITY is government is ruled by thugs
With all this technology, above and under
Humanity still hunts down one another
Rappers display artistic cannibalism
through lyricism, we fight each other over rhythm
Through basic animal instincts, we think
So the battle for mental territory is glory, end of story
Reality, ain't always the truth

Please tell me which of the two better sums up an apolitical, self-deceiving and superficial lifestyle.

And yes--I'd reach for Miss Holiday's record first on a Friday night. But characterizing rap as somehow innately antithetical to Rosa Parks (or, more to the point, Angela Davis) is absurd and indicative, in my opinion, of nothing more than a John Betjeman-like philistinism in the face of contemporary black art.

Eeewwww. You should refrain from the using the word "them" when referring to an extremely diverse and poorly defined group of people that have historically suffered from being collectively referred to as "them". Even though you know what you mean, it puts you in bad company.

TO KB:
No, they're certainly not ALL a bunch of gangst rap lovin' dumbshits. But don't you think that far too many of them ARE?

Recommended reading...
Hey guys/gals--Just wanted to pipe up and let you know about a story I just finished. It's Jeffrey Ford's 'Boatman's Holiday' and it can be found in the Oct/Nov issue of the magazine of Fantasy & Science Fiction. I've been reading alot lately, namely the latest Year's Best Fantasy and Horror and the new Mieville short story collection, as well as 'Anansi Boys' by Gaiman. But this little gem is one of the best stories I've read in a long time. Just thought I'd pass the word.
Also, Scfi.com's Weekly Scifiction is offering an Ellison story
"All The Sounds of Fear" as well as a homage story to Terry Bisson-Michael Bishop's "Bears Discover Smut". Take care people. Happy Halloween!

Mitch

Baby Steps
Rosa Parks, like so many others, took a small but very essential step towards changing a society she saw as wrong. In refusing to give up her seat she might very easily have disappeared into the fabric of history without so much as a single asterisk to her name. In taking that very small, crucial step she participated in a movement that her actions helped galvanize. There would have been no way of predicting that her gesture of defiance would prove to be a rallying point any more than a thousand other actions by similarly motivated people.

We tend to forget that it's the seemingly insignificant acts which may have the most profound implications. It's the dreams we dream that create a reality as it is meant to be.

There are always detractors of any societal action, no matter how selfless, giving and inspirational the individual's actions may be. Martin Luther King, Gandhi, Mother Teresa, Rosa Parks, the anonymous shopper who stands down a tank in Tiananmen Square, the thousands who gathered to surround the Russian White House in 1989, and the countless millions of other revolutionaries which give grandeur to the smallest of acts to change society -- and all have been lightning rods for the hatred of those who resist that change.

We take a small step. If others see it and rally around it the step becomes significant. But it takes a resolute person who can not only take the step but accept it for what it was.

Rosa Parks had a profound impact upon American society. And while America has a very long road left to travel, her simple action made it possible for others to forget her act of defiance because they have no frame of reference to its true significance.

That is the legacy of her contribution.
______________________________________________

Has anyone spoken to the Castros?

A day of mugshots
Couldn't help but notice that USA Today, with 50+ years of Rosa Parks file photos to choose from, opted to go with her 1956 mugshot. Let's not give the woman a little dignity a day after her death. Hell no. I do realize the historical signifigance of the photo. I'm just saying I'd use that if I were doing an article with perhaps 3 photos. Using that alone, and having that be the Google "go to" photo, says to me that things haven't changed as much as we would sometimes like to think.

Certainly that feeling was reinforced last night when I was in my local drinking establishment for some much needed live music and got to listen to some of my "liberal" friends hold forth on their feelings about Ms. Parks after one too many beers. Scratch the surface around here and it becomes "Pennsyltucky" mighty quick. Sad.

The bizarre bookend to the Rosa Parks mugshot was Tom Delay's mugshot plastered all over the media. I couldn't help but think of Warren Ellis' THE SMILER from TRANSMETROPOLITAN. That book gets more prescient by the week. If only I could get a bowel disruptor gun, life synching with art would be so much more worthwhile.

- Barney

>Yeah, today's African-American youth don't appreciate the legacy she won for them.

Is this based on a comprehensive survey? If Trent Lott told me today's black youth were all a bunch of gansgsta-rap-listening dumbshits I might think he was, uh, racist.

Just something to think about.

Brain Surgery

DVG-

I'm sure that everyone here would happily inform a young person of just who Rosa Parks was and what she did. Indeed, it is not brain surgery. It is also not germane to my original point: That most Grown People I know are unaware that Rosa Park's actions were not improvised on the spot, but rather the result of a very intelligent, dedicated, and righteous plan. That she was a smart, active American Hero, and not the passive, tired, woman that so many attempt to pass her off as, simply because they can't be bothered to know any better.

Like I said in my original post, I was once a child who bought this line. And now I'm a little bit older, and have managed to learn more, and to correct my thinking. And I lament the fact that more and more people seem to simply not care enough to make the effort.

Diggin'
TONY RABIG:
Thanks for the suggestion, but to be quite honest, the day I read a book on a computer screen will be shortly after the world unites in perfect harmony, cancer becomes good for you and cheese grows on trees. Besides, I bet those eBooks would omit the great intro from Harlan, which sometimes is just as much fun as the story itself.

ERIC MARTIN:
Lists like the one you linked exist, lacking all chance of soul, simply to draw people and get have them look at the surrounding advertisements. "Best" lists pop up all the time for that reason. I saw a "100 best" book list recently that Watchman was on interestingly enough. The fact that you see Star Wars but nothing by Akira Kurosawa (see: The Hidden Fortress) makes it immediately not interesting. Goodfellas is not Scorsese's best film in my opinion, and it's what, 15 years old? Where is Duck Soup? Where is Rules of the Game? Only movies you'll see are mainstream American ones, not the better original ones that influenced many of them.

BRAD STEVENS:
That is some neat info. Interviews with authors of interest don't pop up very often. Too bad I don't have satellite tv... or live in the UK... =-)

MARK GOLDBERG:
I also enjoy Matheson. I'm re-reading I am Legend and Hell House this week. I'm shocked you found something for a decent price at Dreamhaven, I went there recently looking to fill in a book I'm missing from Harlan's pyramid paperback series in the mid seventies (10 total, great cover art and quotes on the front)... their prices are as frightening as some of the material in the novels! Places like Dreamhaven, that have very limited sales (99% of their older books were bagged, thus not on sale when I visited there a week or so ago) and the Nostalgia Zone and most wall comics at Shinders and a number of other places are nothing more than a Museum, in my opinion. If you venture down to Chicago Ave (heavy construction and not the greatest part of town) Uncle Hugo's is a lot more affordable, but their stock is even more picked over. But if you hit it right, it can be a fun place to pick things up. I got a James Sutherland book there last week.

More Cheesesteaks
Alex Jay,

Thank you for jarring the old memory cells, yes, it was Steve's Prince of Steaks. Damn good food, even if it does take years off your life to eat too many of them.

However, I was surprised by your endorsement of Jim's Steaks on South Street. As I remember, that establishment chopped, rather than sliced, the meat for their cheesesteaks. While I know of many who love Jim's, that difference in preparation ruined the steak for me.

For those in the Minneapolis area, I would recommend taking a trip over to Dreamhaven within the next week or so, they are having a great sale on many of their used books. I picked up a Richard Matheson novel, Hunted Past Reason, and so far it is as good as I expected (I am rarely disappointed by Matheson).

Just because
During the 1950s, whenever my Air Force family wasn't stationed abroad, we lived in Tennessee and Kentucky, which are not quite in the Deep South, but certainly weren't (and aren't) bastions of progressive thinking. I was utterly bewildered by my first encounter with segregated civilian society: why (I wanted to know) mustn't I play with the black children down the street? Because, I was told; just because -- the least satisfying answer that can ever be given to any important question. This happened along about the time I was six, seven years old, and also, incidentally, though I didn't know it for a good while to come, along about the time Rosa Parks was ordered to move to the back of that bus -- just because.

Rosa Parks: Civil Rights Angel or Blunt Weapon?
It seems whenever somebody of note dies these days, their primary function is to serve as yet another club to hit American Youth over the head with.

What the kids don't know, Mom and Dad didn't teach 'em.

I don't recall the generation previous to mine being made up exclusively of zither-playing aesthetes who discussed Tolstoy in bed. I seem, indeed, to remember them as being the people who stood around, flowers in their hair and fingers up the collective nostril, while Pennsylvania Station was carted off to New Jersey.

And I am a litle bored with lists of references I'm evidently too stupid to catch. I could sit here all day name-dropping Valerie Solanis, Georges Bataille, Thomas Ligotti, Polly Delano, Lee Krasner and Amanda Forsythe. If you know who they are, fine. If not, feel free to ask.

If a child of your acquaintence knows nothing of Ms. Parks, may I be the first to suggest you let them in on the secret.

It's not brain surgery, really.

DARK DREAMERS
According to the U.K. Horror Channel's website, a forthcoming episode of Stanley Wiater's series DARK DREAMERS is going to include an interview with Harlan. The episode in question will be broadcast on November 25th at 9 PM.

The episodes of DARK DREAMERS that I've seen so far have included intelligent interviews with Clive Barker and Richard Matheson. There's also a Peter Straub interview scheduled to appear on November 18th.

The Horror Channel's website can be found at:

http://www.thehorrorchannel.tv/main/thc_welcome.htm

MARK G.: If it was one block south of the Roosevelt Mall (the only mall worth the name around Cottman, a nice open-air monstrosity which used to host carnivals in the Seventies), and laid up against a rowhouse block--and I'm pretty sure it must have been--then it was Steve's, Prince of Steaks.
One block from where I grew up and lived for a quarter-century.
(Jim's, on the edge of the mall, is good, if not as good as its South Street [yes, the street of the Orlons] location, and across from the mall is Hollywood Bistro, a bar that makes a pretty good steak sandwich themselves.)

And yes; any steak sammich worth its meat uses Amoroso's, with the exception of a few places who bake their own rolls.

MIKE: Our own Paul T. Riddell posted a pithy couple paragraphs on his Sclerotic Rings weblog about the impending Voice sale which pretty much said it all.

BRIAN: The redoubtable Ms. Parks' blemish-free life is what led the Montogmery Improvement Association (whose formation brought the even more redoubtable Dr. King to national prominence) to convince her to fight the charges; she was, in effect, scandalproof, and this would seem to have continued throughout her subsequent life as beloved midwife and godmother to the civil rights movement. If they attempt to smear, they'll have to do so by association only, by bringing in someone like Jesse Jackson. And that'll be seen as the pernicious bullshit it is. So they're laying low, not even mentioning Parks.

I think they've started hedging their bets, and have plotted out a course which will allow them, in times hence, to claim themselves as the men who saved conservatism from George W. Bush.

MARK W.: Thank you for that ray of hope, and thank the kids, for all of us.


You know, there's a lot of currency being given the whole "Rule of Threes" when discussing deaths of famous folk happening close together, with little thought given to the fact that millions of people die every day and that, by necessity, some of those will be famous.

But for some terrible reason, I had the sudden thought ... "August Wilson, Rosa Parks ... is Joan Didion next?" Boy, I hope my ill-conceived thoughtpulse was wrong.

Rosa Parks lived to see...
...okay, so she lived to see the deprepadations of gangsta crap and historical illiteracy. But she also lived to see people like Chip Delany and Ishmael Reed and Toni Morrison--and you know, you just know, what her example meant to them in the 1950s. She lived to see Octavia Butler and Maya Angelou (So I'm oriented on writers. This is news?)

Yeah, today's African-American youth don't appreciate the legacy she won for them, but this is nothing new. Harlan, your own fights for the ERA are largely forgotten today. That amendment never did pass, but today's young women take for granted the things the feminist movement won for them.

When I was a kid, there was a popular riddle involving a doctor who was in the emergency room of a hospital when a man and his son were brought in from an automobile accident. "Oh, my God, it's my son!" the doctor says. The riddle was--if his father was in the accident, how could his parent be in the hospital?

You remember that one, I'm sure; today, it's meaningless. Today's kids don't understand that the notion of the MOTHER being a doctor was downright shocking in the fifties and early sixties.

So it is with Rosa Parks and civil rights. Today's youth take everything she won, at incredible personal risk, for granted. And maybe that's a good thing, in a way--that it doesn't even occur to them that it should be any different. But it is sad that they just don't know how great a risk she took.

A Sign of Hope
I opened class today by saying that we needed to take a few minutes and discuss an important person who passed away yesterday. No sooner did I have those words out of my mouth when roughly nine of my eighteen students all said "Oh, you mean Rosa Parks." I asked them to tell me who she was and why she's important. And they did -- in considerable detail, the information coming from black students and white alike. One of my students even knew how to take her 'excuse' of being tired to mean. I thanked them and told them they made my day.

There is hope, folks. Specks of light in the gloom. Here's to those specks becoming a constellation of stars.

Mark W.

The tale of Rosa Parks being merely a "tired" woman was kind of the conventonal wisdom when I was growing up: William Manchester's wonderfully readable history _The Glory and the Dream_ recited this bit, which was where I'd first heard of her. It was years until I read of Parks's involvement with progressive civil-rights efforts, her education, her seriousness about civil rights, and the planning and discipline that went into the bus boycott.

That's why I hate cheap sentiment. It keeps people stupid. It patronizes the fine, brave human being who was Rosa Parks by describing her as merely a simple, weary woman accidentally sparking a movement. It tells us that Martin Luther King was a a "great spiritual" leader, so we can ignore the fierce analytical intelligence that ignited his work and brought him to address injustice beyond civil rights. And it even downplays their bravery, because they were _more_ than smart enough to know what they were facing. When the tremendous capabilities of these people are ignored, the conventional wisdom is free to tell us that those edumacated radicals jes' ain't worth squat, when it's the simple folk who git things a-happenin'.

Jeff R., I know exactly what the right-wing journals'll be saying about Rosa Parks. They're driven to smear whatever they can of the civil rights movement. So, we'll probably hear about Parks's involvement with groups linked to the Communist Party. And if Rosa Parks ever made any bad judgements or strange public statements, I'm sure we'll be reminded of them by the good people at the _American Spectator_. Happily, though, the _rest_ of us can remind _them_ that they were on the _wrong_ side of the greatest moral issue this country's ever faced.

Harlan, Rosa Parks may have lived to see the depradations of gangsta culture. But we both know everything _else_ she lived to see. She helped bring forth the Civil Rights Acts of 1964 and 1965. She saw the establishment and growth of an enfranchised black middle class. She saw black men and women elected to high office, even in her home state. Before she had to endure the likes of Suge Knight, she witnessed dozens of black entertainers rise in America not as novelty acts or minstrel performers, but as exemplars of talent and genius.

Sorry for posting twice in a day Rick, just wanted to answer Mike Jacka's question

Mike, the quote is from "Hey Jealousy" by the Gin Blossoms

MORBID CURIOSITY
Can't help wondering how NATIONAL REVIEW and other conservative publications are going to treat the news of Rosa Parks's death. They probably broke out the champagne as soon as they heard the news. Bastards.

S.P.I.D.E.R. story discussions
There are currently two stories waiting for discussion/comments from you in the "other place" (see link above):
The Face of Helene Bournouwe (from Deathbird Stories) (bottom of page)
and
Paulie Charmed the Sleeping Woman (from Approaching Oblivion) (top of page)

Cheers,
Jan

A question and a “wonderin’”

Question – Does anyone know the source of the following quote? “The past is gone and something might be found to take its place.” Some quick research has yielded no results.

Wonderin’ – I was wonderin’ what people outside of Arizona are thinking about the proposed merger of the Phoenix-based New Times Media with Village Voice Media. We hear rumblings that those who love the Village Voice see it as the end of times (no pun intended). Those of us growing up in Phoenix have always seen the New Times as the only real alternative to Arizona (read conservative) reporting. And my understanding is that this continued with their expansion into San Francisco, Denver, etc.

Then again, maybe we in Arizona are the only ones noticing this is happening.

Thanks

Mike

Jason,

"by teachers in elementary schools and parents of white kids - to a woman who was tired and didn't want to move from her seat."

I can at least report - admittedly, from my OWN naive, vacuum sealed world - that I'd never heard that. The recounting of Rosa Parks given to me was always in the context of her courage, and the mentality she was up against. The SAD part of it, on the other hand, is that I'd never heard or her until I was in high school. I don't remember anyone in elementary school telling us about her.

Over the last several years, what's come to intrigue me is the set of conditions in the northern and westerns states in the early 60's while the civil rights movement was dealing directly withe South. Places like Chicago - a particularly dangerous place for blacks at the time - and Los Angeles were ostensibly free of the Jim Crow laws gripping the South but imbedded in racial hatred; a state of segregation differing from that in the South. The latter was instituted through law enforcers, giving King, the NAACP, and many black groups a clear legal target to blueprint a strategy. But in the north, what the law claimed and what was being invoked by both police and white neighborhoods ran on 2 different rails. No one, it seemed, quite understood what was going on in these regions - even as progress was made in the South - and, so, from what I took in, Watts confused President Johnson and most of Whitey World; the fuse had been going for sometime but no one noticed, figuring all the trouble was resting in the Southern states.

...and confronting ALL those issues directly was owed to Rosa Parks.

Cheesesteaks cont. & Package Received
Alex Jay: I would agree that Geno's and Pat's are not once they once were, but they are still light years ahead of anything I can find here in Minneapolis. Don't know Tony Luke's, but may give it a try when I am back in Philly in December. My last trip in, my dad took me to a very good place just south of Cottman Mall in Northeast Philly. Don't remember the name, though.

Susan: Edgeworks 2 arrived yesterday, thank you so much for sending it so promptly, I cannot wait to start re-reading it.

Adam-Troy: hopefully you made it through the hurricane OK. The stories on CNN made it appear that the storm caused more damage than originally anticipated.

Finally, it is a happy day, as news broke that "Scooter" Libby may have lied to the Fitzpatrick in the TreasonGate investigation and that his notes showed that Cheney was involved. I know the chances of it happening are very remote, but the idea of Rove and Cheney being prosecuted for perjury and/or treason is enough to put a smile on my face. Of course, I do realize that both of them would receive Presidential Pardons before they would ever serve jail time....

Courage
Mr. Ellison -

I beg to differ. When I was a few years out of college, I saw, on live TV, a Chinese man standing in front of a tank, holding bags of groceries. That was the same kind of courage; not a planned protest, but a simple refusal to give in by someone who could just have easily gone on along his way.

Sadly, it's also a lesson in how not all heros succeed.

I suspect that for every Rosa Parks, who said "enough is enough", stood up (er...well, sat down) and fought for her rights, there were hundreds of black men and women who stood up, said "enough is enough" and were lynched or beaten.

This is not a reason to honor Rosa Parks less. This is a reason to honor her more.

Many may not see the courage because they have been raised on a diet of movies where the heros always win and where courage and standing up for your rights is always honored with success.

I don't understand the impulse behind trying to pick the "greatest movie of all time". In fact it seems to me to be a monstrous waste of time.

Assuming you can even get two people to agree on their choice, what the hell criteria do you use?

GOODFELLAS wouldn't even make my top 50. Good god I don't HAVE a top 50!

I still say it should be "The Spirit is Willing."

http://movies.yahoo.com/mv/news/ap/20051024/113017896000.html

Rosa Parks
Today's Detroit Free Press addressed the issue of Rosa Parks having been "tired" that day, recalling a 1995 interview with her. Quote:

Parks has said one of her biggest regrets is that numerous news stories reported that she refused to give up her seat because she was tired after a day of work. She was not. She was tired of the mistreatment of black people.


"I was not tired physically, or no more tired than I usually was at the end of a working day," she said in her autobiography. "I was not old, although some people have an image of me as being old the. I was 42. No, the only tired I was, was tired of giving in."

Unquote.

It would seem that over the years people either misremembered what sense of the word "tired" she was using, or had misunderstood her meaning in the first place.

On the other hand, I remember a statement from Rosa Parks herself in which she'd essentially said she hadn't planned to kick start the Civil Rights Movement. Some people may have interpreted that to mean she was just tired. To me, it meant she'd decided to make a personal protest.

But now, back to work. The paper I work for is busy putting together stories about Rosa Parks and her importance to the country, the world, as well as to people on a personal level, and I've got a 1 p.m. (eastern) deadline.

Rick

P.S. I met her briefly in 1993 during a lecture by Archbishop Tutu at the Masonic Temple in Detroit.

Planned
Jason Michelitch,

I don't know that kids today are being taught about Rosa Parks at all. From my school memories, I remember being taught that Rosa Parks was a black woman that refused to give up her seat in a day that black people were expected to do so. Not much more, not much less.

I don't think that the idea that she planned the refusal makes the action any more admirable. I actually think the opposite.

Anyway, I never got the idea that many people think of Parks as someone who just didn't get up because she was tired.

Islands
Brent, if this was Islands by Marta Randall (I think it was and I betcha HE will correct me if I'm wrong), you'll find it as an ebook at www.fictionwise.com for about $7.50 or $8.

Bests,

--tr

Discovery
Does anyone own a copy of Islands from Harlan's Discovery series? Seems to me that was a part of it, a 5 or so book series that had great intros from Harlan, with tasty stories inside. I've been reading the other books in the series again, which are fantastic, and can't seem to find Islands. I think Marta Randall was the author. Anyway, I could be imagining the whole thing.

Brian Siano:

"As for the story's style, I kept wanting to know where he'd published it first. I have a lot of odd vignettes and sketches (which aren't gross-out bits like Palhaniuk's) that could probably stand publication."

I read that the story "Guts" was first published in Playboy.

ROSA PARKS

What I find most frustrating about the common memory of Rosa Parks is how her role in the civil rights movement is always reduced - by teachers in elementary schools and parents of white kids - to a woman who was tired and didn't want to move from her seat. Almost everyone I know (including myself, until I got set straight) grew up ignorant of the fact that Parks's refusal to move was a planned protest, and that it was not only her personal dignity which caused her to refuse to be moved, but her intelligence, bravery, and dedication to a righteous cause which kept her rooted to that seat.

If there is a god, surely Rosa Parks gets a permanent place at his dinner table.

She was an angel, and a true hero.

It boggles the mind that it was only 50 years ago she defiantly stood up...or rather sat down...for her right to dignity and respect. (50 years, its only twice my age...my parents are older than that) Only 50 years, but the average American treats the event like it happened a million years ago. It scares me how many kids out there don't grasp the magnitude of her actions (popculture has already trivialized her in rap music and in film) and worse yet....there are kids out there that don't know who she is. Dammit, f*cking morons worship 2Pac as some sort of messiah, but Parks....it often seems our society downgraded her to a Trivial Persuit answer. A factoid more than the L*E*G*E*N*D she is.






She was beautiful....just beautiful.

No one under the age of fifty can today even BEGIN to comprehend
the freightload of courage it took to do the simple, deadly dangerous thing Rosa Parks did. It was an unparalleled act of personal heroism that not even men under fire on a beachhead can
approach for sheer in-the-face-of-death. It makes me damn near weep to watch the gangsta crap and hip-hop "outrage" of history-ignorant black kids ... that this is what Rosa Parks, a great American hero, had to live to see become of her people.

Truly, a Rosa Parks is humanity at its noblest, its most decent, its most golden and, yes, it's most black is beautiful.

Requiescat in pace.

Honoring her greatness,

Harlan Ellison

Thanks all for the book/story recommendations. (And to Barney etc for the fannish lore! There are filk songs about Harlan too.)

Wandering through Costco I stumbled on the Val Lewton collection for $38.99! I snapped it up - that will keep my happy for several nights! Tower Records didn't even HAVE it! (Anything there that is not on sale tends to be a rip off; up to 30 bucks for stuff that's not even recent and has few extras! Though they were having a Criterion Collection sale and I drooled over the 3 disc premium director-approved edition of BRAZIL. Not to mention weird things like the Elvis Monopoly set, where the Boardwalk space is Graceland...naw, I'm not an Elvis worshipper.) my b-day is 11/28 so my wishlist is always for both that and Xmas....

Oooh, there are a lot of wonderfully creepy Harlan stories...several of those in STRANGE WINE for instance, as well as the aforementioned ANGRY CANDY items. And IHNMAIMS freaked me out too...I read it on the plane on my way home from the 92 Worldcon because it was in the 50th-anniversary greatest Hugo Winners anthology.)

Hum, several of MY Harlan signed books are autographed in blue or turquoise (Felt tip?) ink and they are ALL personalized, bought at conventions, bookstore signings or Susan's wonderful mail order service....Harlan, no offense but I was looking at you, not wht you were using for a pen! My MINDSCAPES art book (the ABAHD/Repent cassette set too), purchased at Foolscap is signed in silver-tip like that for signing photos. Do they make blue-green fountain pen ink? Or glitter silver fountain pen ink? (My STRANGE WINE from the L.A. store signing definitely looks felt tip but I'd have to ask those who were there since I ordered it long distance) No, I don't mind! I don't care what ink it is since I KNOW for SURE they are genuine and treasure them!!!

Would love to hear from Adam-Troy but it looks like a lot of electricity in Florida is out right now.

Kristin

While I love the first BORDERLANDS volume, after all, it has an Ellison story in it, I'm sort of partial to the fifth one...

farewell
Rosa Parks died today, of natural causes, at the age of 92. With her simple but incredibly brave gesture, a catalyst for other's actions, she demonstrated the ability for an individual to make a difference. Would that her legacy will live on in others and in ourselves.

BRIAN: I first read this Palahniuk story in Playboy. Can't remember if it was early this year or late last year. I don't know if Playboy would generally go for something like this, but they do love Chuck. Sometimes I think their taste in fiction is really slipping--not based on "Guts," but on a very short piece about a fisherman and a genie a few months ago. For the most part, I enjoy their selections. And I'd loooove to have that paycheck!

Two memorable horror tales from the Borderlands...
The first and best BORDERLANDS anthology kicks off with a story I have never forgotten: 'The Calling' by David B. Silva. That one got through the armour and festers still.

A more recent BORDERLANDS book (vol #5 I think) features another memorable tale, 'N0072-JK1' by Adam Corbin Fusco.

At present, I'm reading more Clark Ashton Smith...just working through my collection of yellowed UK edition paperbacks while I commute to and from work.

David Loftus -

Thanks for the link. I miss reading Simon in New York Magazine.

The Pinter "poem" he quotes reminds me of another Simon quote, apropos of (if I remember correctly) Robert Creeley. Something like:

"There are two things to say about the poems of [Creeley?]: 1. They are short. 2. They are not short enough."

Aussie bait?
Mark,

You an aussie? You said something about uni the other day, reminding me of Aussie slang.

I saw the Sherlock Holmes episode of which you speak. I loved Basil Rathbone in the role of Holmes when I was a kid watching Saturday morning matinees. However, when I saw Jeremy Brett's Holmes, Rathbone's performance suddenly appeared a hollow mask to Brett's fully realized character.

Rupert Everett was a decent Holmes, but the mystery was disappointing. I was ahead of Holmes and Watson (and the killer) the whole way. There were no surprises. And about half-way through, when it became glaringly obvious that there was a "twin" scenario, I about laughed my ass off: surely, I thought, they wouldn't be pulling the old "twin" scenario. I thought it a ruse, a little M. Night Shyamalan misdirection. But no. Sadly, it was, as Don Adams as Maxwell Smart might say, "the old twin-serial-killer-in-the-fog-along-the-Thames trick."

I did like that they were marrying off Watson to an American Doctor, and that at the beginning Holmes and Watson seemed to be coming together again after what appeared to be some time gone by. A series with them has potential. But Jeremy Brett WAS Holmes. Everett merely plays him. Just like Tom Baker IS Doctor Who. If anyone wants to argue that, I'll meet them out in the parking lot.

And David Silver: Thanks for the joke.

-Keith

I don't read much horror, but I do remember being spooked by Jack London's short, "The Red One". It's from 1918, or thereabouts, but still has the power to thrill.

Gotta go with Simon on this one. The Pinter nomination is a disappointment. I'm not a world-lit reader so I can't compare to the non-English writers that have been awarded recently, but when I think of V.S. Naipaul, or Seamus Heaney, or Toni Morrison, or hell, William Golding or Saul Bellow or Isaac Singer...I don't also think of Harold Pinter. Kind of a yawner, this pick. Underwhelmed.

dogfight

John Simon goes after Harold Pinter in his inimitable fashion:

http://www.radaronline.com/web-only/kulture-klub/2005/10/ignoble-nobel-let-us-pause.php


I seem to recall that Harlan has expressed respect and admiration for both men's work. It's always a bit bewildering when one writer you admire goes after another you also admire. With whom to side? Who's right?

First of all, here's hoping the Castros are alive, healthy, well-sheltered and maybe even _dry_ in Florida.

Second: The Palhaniuk story. It's a nice, vivid image, and it's always fun to write something to elicit a severe, visceral reaction (like "Bleeding Stones"). But I was reminded of a story that turned up on rotten.com, complete with photograph: to put it with as little shock and fanfare as possible, a weightlifter had experienced a sudden and violent prolapse of his lower intestine during a weightlifting competition.

As for the story's style, I kept wanting to know where he'd published it first. I have a lot of odd vignettes and sketches (which aren't gross-out bits like Palhaniuk's) that could probably stand publication.

Working my way through the Val Lewton collection. Wonderful stuff, especially Karloff in _The Body Snatcher_.

In related news, the website for Peter Jackson's _King Kong_ remake tells of how collector Bob Burns, shooting his cameo in the film, brought along the metal skeleton of what is purported to be the original King Kong model. (I'd always thought it had been lost, or remade into Mighty Joe Young.) There's a neat film there, downloadable at http://www.kongisking.net/perl/newsview/15/1129998737, as Jackson and crew all get to touch and handle the structure... and just at the end they, decide to try animating it old-school. And for that brief, wonderful moment, King Kong Lives Again.

I read the story "Guts" online.

I think CP's goal was to come up with the most shocking gross-out he could. In this he succeeded.

The story does have an amusement factor, amidst all the eewwww. Is it great literature? Uh, no.

I'm still getting the YB Fantasy & Horror #18, as I normally do every year.

For the atheists on this board I recommend Diana Narciso's book LIKE ROLLING UPHILL. It's an honest statement of unbelief that I think you'll enjoy.

Readers: I commend your attention to PAPER FISH, by Tina De Rosa. This little-known book is possibly one of the most gorgeous things in the universe. It's available on Amazon.com for a song. You'll thank yourself.

Auguri,

Justin

Coupla' things
I have a general question which youse learned types may know the answer (I know, I'm kind of treating this board as a Shell Station, but I think you'll understand why this one): I heard today on the KTLA Morning News that the founder of the Crips, Stanley Williams, was a nominee for a Nobel Prize. I was under the impression that nominees weren't to disclose that fact, either before or after the fact. No?
________________________________________________

Note from this morning's headlines: "Keys Residents Say Wilma is No Katrina". Hopefully the same sentiment is found in the Castro household.
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Went to the Tut exhibit at LACMA yesterday. Very disappointed. Went to the Pissarro/Cezanne exhibit as well. Thrilled by it. Tut = $30 each, Pissarro = $15. A good ad campaign does not an exhibit make...
________________________________________________

Reread "Skeleton" and "I Have..." over the weekend. Yup, them's good scareys.



SB

sundry
Alex Jay Berman: Not to knock your wurst, but I'd be doing half my family a disservice if I didn't proclaim the braut as the best of the wurst. Here's why: sweat - but don't saute - some onions in a saucepan whilst grilling the brauts; I recommend the Johnsonville brand. Shortly before you pull the brauts off the grill, add a can of cheap Wisconsin beer to the onions; throw the grilled brauts in and let them simmer for twenty minutes or so... the longer, the better. Serve on a bun thick enough to hold it's own in a fight with the stewed onions and mustard on top. Saukraut, too, if that's how you roll but those onions are all I've ever needed.

David Silver: Hee. I'll be sharing that with teachers today; you'll have inspired a laugh or three among those that need 'em on a cold October Monday.

Sean: Short fiction horror? Not to be needlessly pedestrian, but my vote goes for King's early work, Richard Matheson and Clive Barker. With King, it's for his use of crowds and ugly human nature ('The Mist' always comes to mind, though there are better examples); Matheson for the almost campy, oogy thrill of it (; Barker for incessantly playing with sexual themes. There are others, but for a general top three those are the who and why for me.

Did anyone watch the Quill Awards on NBC this past weekend? What a sad affair. It looked like it was held at a disused VFW lodge. Every time a nominee was mentioned there was this pathetic smattering of applause that begged for some audio sweetening. Al Roker single-mindedly gushed about Harry Potter the whole time, stopping just short of sticking his dick in the book.
There was a four minute homage to Deepak Chopra.
Elmo was a presenter. Fucking ELMO.
The chance to make a book award show a major event was utterly wasted. At no point was the thrill of reading a book even mentioned. They should drop the concept. I'd rather see MTV run a book award show that see another dry, unenjoyable Quill.

Peg and Alex Jay

Thank you.

Mike

ATC: Keeping a good thought for you and your wife and hoping you both get through Wilma unscathed.

HARLAN: Did you watch the Sherlock Holmes movie on PBS? I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on it. Of course that invitation also extends to all fellow Webderlanders. Personally, I thought they should have titled it "CSI: Baker Street." And, like me, I'm sure devoted fans had other issues with the production. But I thought Rupert Everett was good as Holmes.

Best,
Mark W.

Harlan & Susan:
I'm sending off a typo-free, spiffier version of the essay in the proper mail. You may do with it as you please.
To those who asked about the flood: I think I can easily replace the comics. I've yet to attend to about eight other boxes that were sitting in 8 inches of water; I'm kind of afraid to. The only Ellsion related items were the Kent Bash lithos for "All the Lies." I appreciate the concern as well as the nice words regarding the BU appearance. Cheers. TR

ON HOT DOGS: Don't eat 'em.
I'm spoiled, see, because what I DO eat are Hebrew National Knockwurst. Boiled, Broiled, grilled, makes no nevermind to me; they are to hotdogs what a peppercorn-crusted steak in brandy sauce is to the late-night special at Friendly's. Truly, knocks are the ne plus ultra of meat by-products.
(Though I will on occasion partake of a hot swawsidge from a vendor's truck ...)

Oh--and either (spicy brown) mustard, mustard with hot sauce, or chili. Anything else would be uncivilized.

MARK: Sorry, friend, but Geno's and Pat's (and even Jim's) have become tourist traps, shades of their former gustatory selves. You want to go to Tony Luke's, where the cheesesteak is a thing of beauty unto the tongue; where you will see monosyllabic truckers ordering their steaks with broccoli rabe without hesitation or pretension.

But yes; the White House still makes good steaks.

ADAM T-C: Well, Wilma's weakened, but a Ct 2 or 3 is still nothing to laugh at. Take care, wouldja?
(Oh--and am I a bad person for, as I saw at several places where Palahniuk was going with his story, laughing?)

JON: Horseradish is good; I recommend you get some daikon and make your own.
(I made habanero horseradish a few years back for a party. Grown men wept and howled; it was a beautiful thing.)
Ooh! 'Nother recommendation: Go out and get some wasabi.
(But be aware that you will almost never get real wasabi in America; because of the short supply of the very temperamental wasabia japonica plant, the "wasabi" paste you'll get in restaurants or supermarkets is actually made up of mostly horseradish, Chinese mustard, and green food coloring. There are a few places starting to farm it in North America, though ...)

TIM: Allow me to add my somewhat envious thanks.

EZRA: And thank YOU for the beautiful picture of the celestial coming of the Flying Spaghetti Monster; may His Noodly Appendage touch us all.
(I'm kidding; it's really a picture of Invader Zim.)
(and yes; I was looking at the picture for October 23)

ANGRY CANDY: Love it. I would say more, but I've already written FAR too damned much about it in the Reviews part of the site.

MIKE: I'm very happy for all your happy endings, and am sorry you and your friends had to push through all those shitty middles.

>I don't know: maybe I have a different definition of a horror story, or maybe I'm unnerved by different things, but I read Palahniuk's "Guts", thought it was gross, deliberatley shocking...and nothing more.<

Ditto. Palahniuk takes his reputation one step farther away from any thing resembling literature and a possible claim for a lasting place in letters. Next time keep it in the drawer, Chuck. You don't have to share everything. You show your wife your soiled toilet paper, too?

Staggering down Memory Lane...
HARLAN: I'll cough up a fiver for the full song and dance.

Thanks you guys for sending me down memory lane to the library of Carolina Elementary School in Hartsville, SC, where during the 5th and 6th grades, I lost myself in those very Alfred Hitchcock collections--along with The Three Investigators (wicked cool tales).

Just got back from a spin around the Web seeing what has accumulated on the detecting trio over the years.

Wow...

And my fave from ANGRY CANDY is "Paladin of the Lost Hour", though it fair near makes me weep every time I read it--as it should.

Thanks in advance for DREAM CORRIDOR!

Kind regards to you and the missus.

Long days and pleasant nights...

A joke from an old lady that MUST be shared...

I stopped by to see my mom this afternoon, and she had some visitors there for coffee. Among them, an 88 year old woman told this joke, and I almost wet my pants when I heard it!


This guy hears about a popular new pub, and he wants to try it out, but it uses robot bartenders instead of people. He's skeptical, but a buddy tells him the robots are absolutely brilliant and make the best drinks in town.

So the next day, right after work, he wanders in, steps up to the bar, and one of the robots leans over to ask him, "What can I serve you?"

He thinks about it, and says, "I'd really go for a vodka martini."

A minute later the robot pours the drink for of the fellow, who takes a sip and realizes it IS the best he's tasted in years. Then the robot, seeing the guy is sitting alone, asks him, "Would you care for some conversation?"

The man thinks, what the heck, I have nothing to lose, and says, "Okay, sure, let's talk."

So the robot asks, "May I first know your approximate IQ?"

Well, this dude isn't a dummy, he's a very successful businessman and he knows his IQ was measured well above average at 120 when he was in high school, but he decides to play a little trick on the robot and says, "Oh, no problem...my IQ is 160."

The robot immediately inquires, "Then would you like to talk about philosophy, physics, world literature, or fine arts?"

The man chooses philosophy, and the robot talks him around in circles for nearly an hour.

He returns to the pub another night, orders another martini, and once again the robot asks if he would like to engage in conversation. When the topic of IQ comes up, this time he tells the truth and explains that he tested around 120. The robot asks, "Then would you like to talk about politics, space, popular literature, or travel?" He chooses travel and has a wonderful conversation to complement his tasty drink.

Another evening, same bar, same drink, same question about conversation, but this time the fellow is curious and tells the robot his IQ is a very average 100. The robot asks, "Then would you like to talk about sports, television, movies, or girls?" He chooses girls and enjoys a good laugh through much of the conversation.

He returns to the bar yet again, orders the same drink and listens to the same inquiry about conversation, but this time decides to REALLY have some fun with the IQ issue. So he tells the robot his IQ is only 50.

The robot immediately blurts out, "Why the hell did you vote for Bush?!"

Hitchcock anthologies
*** Steve Barber & Rick K ***

The Robert Arthur edited anthologies you guys are remembering are the large HC's that were distributed pretty widely in children's libraries in the 1970's. They were great. I still remember where I was when I read THE BEHINDER. But the anthologies Harlan refers to were the ones done mostly as BOMC HC's from... Random House, I think, with all the PB editions coming from Dell. In the early 1960's these were what I think of as the "sawed off" size and usually had some photo cover of Hitchcock. The later Dell PB editions had funnier painted covers. I've got at least 30 of them and they went through tons of reprintings. They're really pretty good. There is some Alfred Hitchcock's Mystery Magazine filler but tons of great stuff by Gerald Kersh, George Mac Donald, Robert Bloch, H.R.F. Keating, Donald Westlake, John Wyndham and at least one from our patron.

Oh man. I just did a little biblio-surfing on Gordon R. Dickson. Ninety six books? Not counting the ghosting? If you can't get ahead of the curve with 96 books to your credit why the hell even start?

- Barney

Who once filk-sang the Gordy Dickson drinking song to the tune of "Oh My Darling" with some of his friends and Filthy Pierre on piano.

Gordy Dickson Gordy Dickson
Gordy Dickson is the one!
Others passed out on the sofa,
Gordy Dickson's having fun.


Goodnight Gordy.

I don't know: maybe I have a different definition of a horror story, or maybe I'm unnerved by different things, but I read Palahniuk's "Guts", thought it was gross, deliberatley shocking...and nothing more. It didn't resonate or illuminate or move me to think about the human condition in any way as much as it gave me a brief, nasty aftertaste in my mouth, like the time I tried uni.

Now, "A Distant Episode" by Paul Bowles - jaysis. "I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream"? Couldn't read a n y t h i n g for about a week after I finished that one. Conrad's _The Heart of Darkness_ never loses its power to disturb me. And include me with the group that loves "The Function of Dream Sleep" - unsettling, but deeply humane and compassionate.

For What It's Worth,
Mark W.

Sean,

Horror? Some, though I'd call much of it weird fiction.

I'm currently reading the new Thomas Ligotti collection "The Shadow at the Bottom of the World." The book collects several of Ligotti's previously published stories...and let me tell ya, there ain't a bum in the lot. Ligotti is a genius.

Also on my reading list is Neil Gaiman's "Anansi Boys," a new collection by Caitlin R. Kiernan (To Charles Fort, With Love), the 18th Annual Year's Best Fantasy & Horror (on order due to the recent comments on the story "Guts" by Palahniuk, which I now MUST read), plus I'm working my way through the new three volume "Encyclopedia of Supernatual Fiction," edited by S.T. Joshi and Stephen Dziemianowicz. On top of all that I'm just finishing Lovecraft's Letters from New York.

That about wraps it up for the month of October.

Thank you
Harlan -- Rick K is right that there is a reference to Arthur's "invaluable assistance" in the dedication. Dickson may have edited, but there's no reference I can find and several websites seem to confirm Arthur. No matter, Dickson gave us a the marvelous Dorsai and will always be one of my favorite authors.
_________________________________________

Tony - Thank you. Now, however, I genuinely do feel like an idiot for having not made that pull. it was all there for me: skeletons, Bradbury, and my own little collection of shots I've called October Country (http://www.photosig.com/go/users/viewportfolio?id=146793). It's one of those moments of stunning clarity a day too late. Thank you, though, it's now on my "to reread" pile.
_________________________________________

Last evening my wife was playing a private party for artist Phillip Luth. I had a wonderful reminder of how very fortunate I am to be married to this person. Just thought I'd share...
_________________________________________

(Best wishes to the Castros and any other Floridians as Wilma turns northeast. Keep the galoshes handy.)

Horror
Hello all.

Just wondered what you people liked in the way of horror short fiction (without getting too bogged down in the genre defenition thing). There's a hell of a lot of good stuff out there, but not always easy to track down.

Incidentally, Mr Ellison, (if you're reading this), thanks: when I started reading your work as a little boy it made me feel that it WAS possible to be angry and to have opinions others would disagree with without being a damn fool about it. Keep up the good work, if it pleases you to do so!

Hitchcock anthologies
Harlan,

You wrote that the Hitchcock anthologies were ghost-edited by the late Gordon R. Dickson. I have to disagree- at least with regard to the two anthologies Steve Barber cited. Both “Alfred Hitchcock's Ghostly Gallery” and “Alfred Hitchcock’s Monster Museum” were edited by the late, great Robert Arthur, creator of the “Alfred Hitchcock and the Three Investigators” mystery series (far superior to the Hardy Boys), and co-creator (with David Kogan) of the “Mysterious Traveler” radio show.

Information about Arthur’s involvement in these anthologies can be found at his daughter, Elizabeth’s website: http://www.elizabetharthur.org/bio/rarthur.html

I believe the books themselves also confirm Arthur’s involvement (through a “special thanks to Robert Arthur” or words to that effect on the indicia page). However, I don’t have the books in front of me as I write this.

Could you be thinking of some other Hitchcock anthologies that Mr. Dickson was involved with?


For the record, some biographies confuse Robert Arthur with a man named Robert Arthur Felder. These are two different individuals.

Information related to this confusion can be found here: http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:ovrxYBMMbWMJ:www.threeinvestigators.net/SD.html+%22Robert+Arthur%22++%2B+%22Startling+Discoveries%22&hl=en

(this is cached file; for some reason, the actual site- also run by Elizabeth Arthur- is currently down).
Rick

fountain pens
Hmmm, I have a signed copy of "All The Lies That Are My Life". I don't go to book signings, I just picked it up in a book shop many years ago. Thing is, the signature is scrawled in turquoise felt tip. How rare can that be?

I don't care. I bought the book to read, and enjoyed the story - though probably not as much as Harlan obviously enjoyed writing it.

Ash (owner of a dozen or so fountain pens, but only one refill)

LIFE HUTCH DREAM
The other night I had a dream...whereby the theater of my mind was open ... paid to get in ....gave the ticket to the taker at the gate and proceeded to my middle-of-the theater seat looked upon the screen and the credits came on.....LIFE HUTCH...starring me because everything was from my POV. I walked out of the crippled starfighter...and just as I entered the hutch...that damnable robot comes out of his niche grabs me and throws me over the pool table....it was then I woke up!
My wife of 37 years snoring in blissful slumber next to me. I just smiled and didn't dream the rest of the night. Wife of course asked me why I kicked her in the leg last night...again...I just smiled. This has happened to me before, and usually after reading an Ellison story. Whenever I read and re-read his stories, it amazes me how he can evoke a REM like dream just in the way he tells a story. May you and your muse live long and prosper Unca Harlan.

STEVE BARBER:

The "Hitchcock-edited" anthologies were ghost-edited by the late Gordon R. Dickson, a wonderful guy, a smart and classy writer, a long-time friend of

Yr. pal, Harlan

Guts Short Story
Someone mentioned the short story guts... I went out and bought the anthology today, and then I noticed the sotry is free online on his website.

So, if you want to read it:
http://www.chuckpalahniuk.net/books/haunted/guts.php

Susan - thanks for the lowdown. Think I'll be ordering one of the trade paperbacks then.

Mike Jacka - congratulations on your successful treatment! (but keep an eye on the bastard...) I can empathize with you, about the weight of such a time bearing on you. Hope the load lightens soon...

TIM: Great post. I saved that one. I'm really sorry to hear that your things got trashed by the latest flood. Obviously I can't do anything about YOUR work, but is there any "stuff" (comics, etc.) in particular you're looking to replace? E-mail me if you like; I don't mind looking. I've got "Finder" creds and everything. ;)

Skeleton
Steve,

Believe that story is "Skeleton," by Bradbury and you should find it included in THE OCTOBER COUNTRY.


Bests,

--tr

And re: fountain pens. I use 'em too. Waterman low end models are nice and affordable. One of these years, when I can figure out some way to justify it to my bank balance, I'll spring for a Pelikan or a MontBlanc.

Scary Stories
I have on my bookshelf, just two levels above this computer, two books from my childhood that set the tone, literarily, for my adult tastes. Both are aimed at young readers, though even now they can give a good scare, especially on the right kind of night.

Whether Alfred Hitchcock actually edited either book is doubtful, but "Alfred Hitchcock's Ghostly Gallery" and "Monster Museum" rank as two of my all time favorite childhood books, reprinting such classic spook stories as "The Man Who Sold Rope to the Gnoles" by Idris Seabright; "Shadow, Shadow on the Wall" by Ted Sturgeon; "The Desrick on Yandro", Manly Wade Wellman; "The Upper Berth", F. Marion Crawford; and twenty some-odd others of equal merit. Truly raw material for a deranged adult mind.

The single most frightening image I have ever gotten from a book came as a man wanders down a dark street encountering a strange individual sucking at the marrow of a bone and making a flute from the ivory. It has to do with a doctor who promises to rid a patient of the cause of his misery: his skeleton.

Lord help me, I don't remember the author [embarassingly, I think it's either Ellison or Bradbury] or the actual story name, though someone out there surely will set me straight -- ? I've pulled six books each from my Ellisonia and Bradburiana and can't readily find it.

(Okay, kids, tell me how ig'nant I am... what was this?????)
____________________________________________________

Susan - Thank you. Clearly, this indicates the rest of the tapes are okay, which is a good thing. Hopefully a head didn't roll but merely flopped to the side for a moment or two....

Dream Sleep

the thanatos mouth still haunts my nights

Angry Candy
Todd,

"The Function of Dream Sleep" is one of my favorite stories in Angry Candy. I'm not sure if I like the written story better, or the recording. After pulling my copy off the shelf last night and paging through it again, I ended up putting down "Kite Runner" (which I have only just started), and started re-reading some of the Ellison Classics in Angry Candy.

Add procrastination to my list of faults.

One of my other favorite stories in Angry Candy is "Quicktime," and I always end up with a huge smile on my face at the end, even though I KNOW the punchline. It seems to me a Laumer-esque story, with a hint of Bradbury and a Collier finish.

But of course, it's impossible to classify Harlan. Legions have tried, but he keeps moving too fast.

Harlan, I forgot to mention: loved the song. I got a ducat right here fo ya, pal.

-keither

The Function of Harlan Ellison
Last month I had the opportunity to combine a business trip with pleasure. My business trip was to Montana and my pleasure was a visit to Yellowstone NP – a bizarre landscape that constantly fascinates me.

I flew into Billings and the next day drove to Yellowstone. To keep me company, I brought along “The Voice From the Edge” – five discs of Harlan reading. I will not go into the extended surrealism that occurs hearing these stories as you are led by columns of steam into the geyser basins. Instead, I’ll move forward three days.

I tried to check in at my hotel in Bozeman, but the room wasn’t ready. With no where to go, I parked in front of a K-Mart and listened to the last disc – “The Function of Dream Sleep”.

No distractions, no concerns. Just listening to Harlan read the story.

I’ve read the story many times before, but listening to Harlan’s interpretation (as well as the postscript) brought new meaning to me. I’m sure part of this is because it struck home more. You see (and I apologize for what this is turning into), the department I work in has had kind of a rough time of it. There are twelve of us (counting our Director and VP, who are close friends and, in a second, you’ll see why I included them) and, in the last year and a half (in chronological order), one person was diagnosed with lung cancer (it wasn’t, but they didn’t find that out until they took out half his lung), another died of a heart attack (at 40 years old), I was diagnosed with prostate cancer (two weeks ago I found that the treatment seems to have been successful), the wife of the individual diagnosed with lung cancer was herself diagnosed (one year to the date of his diagnosis) with breast cancer (a successful surgery and she is now clean), and, last month, just before the trip, our VP was diagnosed with colon cancer (and his surgery was likewise successful).

We cannot wait for 2006.

All but one of these have happy endings, but the weight of that history followed me into that K-Mart parking lot.

I started this intending to just share an appreciation for the story, and it has turned into a little more. But I guess that is the power of words, and the power of Harlan’s writing – it has the strength to speak different (important) words at different times in our lives.

A lot of words to just indicate that this is an incredible story.

Mike

Todd, "The Function Of Dream Sleep" is one of my favorites, too, and one that isn't usually mentioned.

Angry Candy contains one of my favorite Harlan stories; a story whose words remain the same, and yet the emotion it drags out of you will differ depending on your mood when you read and re-read.

Disturbing? Uplifting? Horrifying? Lyrical?

Yes.

The Function of Dream Sleep.

-TODD

Steve: I will send you another copy.

Peg: WE have a few copies of the limited ESSENTIAL ELLISON available. The HERC discounted Trade Paperback is available from Morpheus. As for a Hardcover: Morpheus did do one in 2001, you could try contacting them, or try online...but WE don't have any for sale.

Lost HERC member: Paul J. Nelson from Falls Church, VA. If you're reading this Paul, please contact HERC.

Thank you.

Susan

The Region Between
Because I have the attention span of a quark.

-cramer

Do not ask me what happened. I hit the furshluginner button once't and only once't. I try, kids, s'help I do try, but the intercrapthing is clearly beyond me. But I do know all the words to "Silver Dollar," a great Jack Teagarden number.

"Ohhhhhhh you c'n throw a silvuh dolluh DOWN t'the groun'...an' it'll roe-ell...cuz it's rownd...

"Uh woman nevuh know what a good man she got, until she puts him dowe-n...

"So lissen...

"Lissen...

"Lissen't'me...ah'll trytuh make yew unnerstan'...

"Duh WAY a silver dollah go fum han' tew han'...

"Assa way a WOMAN go fum man...tew man!"

---------------------------------------------------------

For one dollar, I comes to yo howse an' sings six seven choruses, A cap-uh-luh, maybe even two, three cap-uh-luhs.

---------------------------------------------------------

Lyrically, Yr. pal, Harlan

KEITH:

Ooooooooo, this sounds Goooooode, Keith!

Tell me, do tell me, which what story am it in ANGRY CANDY you cannot (as yet) (after all these years) read?!!!????

Inquiring mind (namely mine) wanna know.

Yr. pal, expectantly,

Harlan

KEITH:

Ooooooooo, this sounds Goooooode, Keith!

Tell me, do tell me, which what story am it in ANGRY CANDY you cannot (as yet) (after all these years) read?!!!????

Inquiring mind (namely mine) wanna know.

Yr. pal, expectantly,

Harlan

Teat for Tat

Harlan:

That's cool. Standing offer. I live to grovel. Among the multitudes my large self contains is one of the great bean counters of our time, I'm sorry to say.

By the way, everybody -- the Nixon reference wasn't in either of the Teats at all, apparently. A sharp-eyed Webderlurker emailed me privately with the following piece of enlightenment:


> The column you were looking for was from "The Harlan Ellison
> Hornbook": "In Which the Imp of Delight Tries to Make the
> World Smile." It first ran the 23rd of August 1973. If you
> have Edgeworks 3, it starts on page 166. He talks about the
> healing power of good coffee and Enter the Dragon in it, too.
> (Hey, it also lambastes Dr. Atkins, thirty-two years ago...)


Learn something every day. (Or, more often, re-learn. . . .)

DAVID LOFTUS:

Indexing the TEATS. I don't have an answer. But I'll get one when the publisher, Joe Stefko, gets back from his honeymoon.

Do nothing, say nothing, just sit on that lovely Loftus offer till I ascertain the status quo of said aspect of the project.

he

BRENT:

I have more than 100 fountain pens. I use nothing else, as anyone who has ever been at one of my signings will attest.

Harlan Ellison

JONO & EVERYONE ELSE INVOLVED IN THE
"COLLECTING HARLAN" ADVENTURE, INTO
WHICH I WAS DRAGGED, KICKING &
SCREAMING:

No, I haven't sent out the "prizes," though they've all been selected and are lying in up in my office atop a box of long- unanswered mail and "deadline work," the deadlines for which are--in some cases--ten years' past. I know I know I know I know they have to go out, but to be absolutely candid with youse guys, I have bigger fish to fry, desperater work to turn out, more pressing matters to tackle.

I WILL SEND YOU YOUR FILTHY SWAG!!!!!!!

Give me time, give me a break, give me a surcease from guilt. I WILL TEND TO THIS CHORE. But at the moment I'm trying to juggle twelve balls, two of which are my own.

I would love to pay attention to Jono's obsession before I finish work on the books ready to go to print, but...well...

You'll all just have to bide. Quietly. First, THE LAST DANGEROUS VISIONS, then your Collecting Harlan goodies. Bide. Quietly.

Yr. pal, Harlan

The IRONY!
Erika (or should I say, Fiddy-Cent),

You'll like Angry Candy. Good find.

For 50 cents.

The same amount of money Harlan fined you in Cleveland for your grammatically incorrect usage of "like," twice.

Haha! Excellent.

Angry Candy contains a story I have not yet been able to read...

someday I will.

I don't know anything about book of poetry by OWH. Sorry.

-Keith

Here in the Great Political Barnyard, there are three types of creatures: Elephants, Donkeys and People. The first and second eat grass. The third's relationship to the first two is as follows:

Elephants -> great for piano keys / really gouche umbrella holders.

Donkeys -> Really cheap Mexican food or source of "entertainment" in Tijuana.

Found an me an Ellison book.
... Today here at the library book sale, for 50 cents.

Shut up, Keith. >:)

Anyway, I found "Angry Candy", paperback, 1988, Plume. It's not a familiar title to me, since I'm still discovering Harlan's works, but I'm eager to begin reading it. =)

I also found a small book, published March 23rd, 1898: "Selected Poems" by Oliver Wendell Holmes with introduction and notes by H.E. Turpin. It appears to be part of a series, published bi-weekly, by Maynard, Merrill & Co of New York.

Does anyone know anything about said series, or author? It seemed too unique to pass it up. I plan on Googling for more info about it, but I would also 'preciate any knowledge from anyone here. =)

ENOUGH!
ROB, ET..AL

I don't give a tinkers damn about any of it anymore! You guys and gals who call yourself liberal have your own agenda....I have my own agenda thank you and nothing on this big blue ball we call Earth...will ever change my mind. So there! Let us all get back to what this page is here for....discussing the works and life of Harlan Ellison.....PLEASE!

Concrete Forever

Here's a nice mention of Paul Chadwick's work, in The A.V. Club's Underrated List: http://avclub.com/content/node/41706/2

Also, thanks to Finder and Tim for recounting their experiences in Boston.

D.

Great post Tim. A memory to treasure!

Hope you didn't lose any of your HE collection in the flood. My own book collection has expanded throughout the basement and, even though I have an insurance rider for sewer backups, I live in mortal fear of rainstorms!

I've been informed that HE posted a couple of weeks ago regarding the Collecting Harlan! contest (being away for awhile, I only went back as far as the Penny Arcade fracus - went 'Yuk. Poor Rick', and continued on). So HE did get the winners-letter, then it's all good, and I'll sign off that topic right smartly before I have to throw myself in a puddle of Harlan's ire so HE can cross safely.

luv to all,

jono

Steve:
re: Typos
I hate when I add or change a few words, send something off and .. oh fuck.
"...the grandeur of the setting..." "...whose manner and visage..."
Ah well. Sorry HE. Sorry for the double post Rick.

TIM: That was a wonderful post, man. Just wonderful. It's good to know that Harlan's legacy will be preserved as it should be.

Thanks.

Mark W.

THE GOTLIEB ARCHIVES
TIM R: Thanks for sharing that story about the induction of Harlan's papers into the Gotlieb Archives at Boston University. I was properly impressed by his nomination for that literary prize which begins with an N (and shall go unnamed in keeping with the rules), but Harlan's induction into Gotlieb Archives is even more awe-inspiring. And Dr. Gotlieb's toast was one helluva compliment to HE's talents and accomplishments as well.
Thanks again for sharing (perhaps you should find a way to include the story in your forthcoming book -- in the intro or something -- if there's still time).
--DTS

Have you guys read about the "new" pterosaur? I would not want anyone to miss this! (not for the faint at heart)
photo: http://www.spiegel.de/wissenschaft/erde/0,1518,grossbild-531127-380656,00.html
story: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9739746/

Thanks Tim
Tim,

Thank you for sharing your description of what sounds like an incredibly memorable evening.

Adam-Troy, you are still in my thoughts, and it looks like the hurricane may hit with less force than originally anticipated. Even so, a category 3 or 4 hurricane is one damn powerful storm.

Susan, did you receive my check for my HERC renewal and the order for Edgeworks 2?

A god's eye view
I posted this link over at the other place but some pictures are just so awesome that it behooves us to dwell on them a while.

http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/astropix.html

So stare at this for a time, let it sink in, gaze at it until it makes you a little giddy...

Steve:

Will look into this. Heads will roll. Someone will most likely bite the big one.

Cheers--Susan

Jon Stover: As a direct result of your post I will adding the phrase "beef adventure" to my quiver.

Once, in an attempt to use up all my leftovers before grocery shopping, I grilled up some hot and sweet sausage, a little diced red pepper, and topped it off with the last heapin' spoonful of 'kraut in the bottle. Scooped the whole pile on top of a bowl of noodles with a little olive oil.
Bliss.

Eloquent
El-O-quent dammit.

Effing spellcheck never works when you need it.

Tim
Thank you. A most elequent retelling of an important evening.

Steve B





____________________________________________

Side Note to Susan:
(Everyone else can ignore this part, just carry on about your business, nothing else to see)

Thank you for the cassette of Prince M in my recent order. Unfortunately my copy is completely silent on both sides. Do not feel obligated to replace it (the rest of the package is still occupying my time nicely), but you may wish to double check your stock and make sure it's the exception and not the rule.

This is originating handwritten, on paper;only fitting. The Great Flood of 2005, the third Great Flood of 2005, has abluted my library. Lost in the wash was a box of comics, several movie posters and my computer with numerous unsaved files. Yes, I know, always save to disk, but this isn't about that. It's about last Tuesday night in Boston, an Ellison evening that clearly stands apart from any other, and trust me I've attended more than my share. A night so profoundly significant both publicly and personally, that I was reticent to write about it.
To understand the overall importance you have to understand the reason for the Ellison visit in the first place. Located in the one of the libraries at Boston University is a well-known special collection of manuscripts, letters, documents and other ephemera known as the Gotlieb Archives. Dr. Howard Gotlieb began the collection over forty years ago and is also the founder of the "Friends of the Library," a group of benefactors interested in the preservation and exhibition of literary treasures. He's been called "the emperor of the 20th century archives," and "the father of modern archiving." It was his desire to acquire a cache of Harlan's papers for the collection that initiated the BU reception and lecture.
Prior to the event, managing director Vita Paladino gave the Ellisons, my wife Andrea, daughter Alexa, and I a tour of the archive. Among the noted luminaries preserved under glass, were the likes of Freud, Poe, Martin Luther King Jr., H.L. Menkin, and King Henry VIII. The list is long and staggeringly impressive. Clearly, this is a place of honor and prestige, proper company from a sampling of Harlan’s letters.
After about an hour of inspecting the current smattering of acquisitions, we were escorted to the auditorium where the reception was held. Again, quite a departure from the obligatory convention-like atmosphere, even in the best of situations.
Hors d’oeuvres, an open bar, potted greenery, Alexa, whose done this since she was ten, looked at me and said, “Wow they really went all out for this one!” Indeed they had.
Following a photo session with the Boston Globe and a lengthily signing/meet and greet, Harlan took the stage. Throughout the hour the capacity audience, comprised of scholars, academics, students, writers like Paul Di Fillipo and Alan Steele, even Dr. Gotlieb himself, laughed, and applauded. In the end, another signing line formed without a wookie, or a vulcan in the lot. Despite all the years, the thousands of lectures, Harlan was forging new territory.
The evening culminated in a reasonably small gathering at the Algonquin Club, an exclusive gentlemen’s gathering place founded in 1886. As we stood in the foyer mumbling and attempting to absorb grandeur the setting, Dr, Gotlieb, who had been in the front row at the lecture, approached and introduced himself. “I just want to tell you I thought you were magnificent,” he said extending his hand. Harlan looked at him wide-eyed, “Really?” he said. “I didn’t think you liked me. It looked like you were scowling.”
Gotlieb, who visage and manner is reminiscent of Peter Ustinov, laughed and explained that he always looked like that and that he was overjoyed with the success of the event. Yet another moment in a long night to remember.
The trek up four flights of stairs to the dining room was worth not being in an elevator with seven other people: I have my reasons. We arrived to find most of the other guests seated in the elegant main dining room of dark wood, high ceilings and velvet curtains. Andrea and I sat across from Dr. Gotlieb, whose conversations with Susan intimated a friendship with Hemingway and distaste for crabmeat. Harlan, who was merrily eavesdropping on the conversation, leaned over to Gotlieb and said, “I love you.” The Dr., not missing a beat replied, “Yes, but do you have the ring to prove it?”
While Harlan entertained with stories of Bruce Lee, Charlie Mingus, and Tony Bennet, Andrea and I ate and chatted with the other guests, basking in the glow of a rare occasion whose ultimate purpose had yet to reveal itself.
After the meal was cleared, Dr. Gotlieb, who had been sitting quietly for some time, spontaneously rose from his seat and began to tap his glass. In a voice that resonated throughout the hall, he proceeded to deliver the most eloquent appreciation I have ever heard. “In my six decades as a scholar,” he began. “If you were to ask me what I have learned from the various authors and speakers that have come to the university I would say, not much. Until tonight.” Through the flickering candlelight I could see Harlan’ face redden, his hand covering his mouth. Gotlieb went on to note that the Harlan’s presence had established a new constituency, the first time students had mingled with academics in such numbers. “And more than just a great writer, you possess a human quality that is rarely seen.” We raised our glasses as Harlan sat speechless, wiping his eyes and trying to find the proper words. Finally able to collect his thoughts, he invoked the spirit of his mother and how proud she would be to have witnessed this moment. As Harlan humbly took his seat Dr. Gotlieb pounded the table with an authoritative palm while the entire party applauded and wiped away the mist.
The surreal nature of the evening hung without adequate description for days, it’s taken me a week to write this. I am not openly sentimental and would opt to keep most personal insights to myself, and a few close friends. Despite all that, this needed to find a forum and risk chance comment.
From my chair, I saw my friend, Harlan Ellison, son of Louis and Serita, who swung his was way from the nosebleed schoolyards of Painsville Ohio, embraced by the immortals. Harlan, in his own time, in a room where the specters of Twain, Hemingway and Steinbeck loom large, lauded outside the pigeonhole of genre by a congregation of scholars and academics, most of whom had never heard him speak.
On the way out as we walked down the stairs I put my hand on Harlan’s shoulder and said, “This was one hell of a night.” He looked at me still foggy and nodded, “It sure was kiddo. It sure was.”

Wilma / "Guts"
That seems to be what's happening with Wilma, but who knows; she is moving slower, and it may now be several days before she gets here.

Answer to Neal on "Guts": it compares very well, actually. It's not just a grossout. It owes much of its impact to the evocative power of its language, and its attention to the psychic aftermath of its terrible event. The terror lies not just in what happens, but in having to live with everybody looking at you afterward.

Fuzzy politics break out on Webderland, like an electronic form of avian bird flu. Those who haven't caught it scream in horror at what it does to their loved ones, and hope for the development of some kind of vaccine.

Anyone else here like horseradish? I seem to be developing a real thing for it when eating beef (but if anyone knows what else to do with it, do tell). The hotter the better, and finding the good stuff often involves a search.

But boyohboy, horseradish -- it makes even an inferior cut of beef into a an adventure.

Cheers, Jon

Communism not the agenda? Speak for yourself. Ah nuts, I've blown my cover. Dear Leader is goin to have my hide.

Liberals don't want to control anyone's lives, Stan. You can do pretty much what ever you want. Go nuts! We just want people to be healthy and safe; hence our push for environmental regulations, gun control, and social services that keep the poorest of us alive and well.

Besides, Stan, Conservatives tell homosexuals they can't marry. That's a form of control. Conservatives can't wait till Row V Wade is overturned and abortion illegalized. That's control. How about censorship of the media (both entertainment and news). That's control.

Rules. Both sides have them. Liberal rules concern the physical word. To help keep our bodies and our environment healthy. Conservative rules concern the spiritual world. Neo-cons do what they do supposedly to save our souls.

Stan,

"Also Liberals want the government to control everyones lives from birth to death."

This is the most obnoxious of the ignorant cliches you subspecies called Conservatives inhale and exhale day by day without ever researching the facts.

Liberals want government to protect Americans from your corporate assholes who are having a field day hording the wealth at YOUR expense AND mine right now; liberals want the programs and the safety nets for the disadvantaged. Stan...talking more from your end of it, we can go too far in EITHER direction: we can go too far to Corporate free enterprise OR we can go too far with government; BOTH lead to the same corruption, the same deterioration of the country, the same RESULT. It's about BALANCE. The majority of the LEFT wants the checks and balances held in place. That 's in danger right NOW....thanks to YOUR voting habits and disallowance of researched information.

Stan, do yourself a favor for once - possibly the first time in that vacuum you call your life...read about the situation (I don't mean from Rush Limbaugh): read the cost per person in taxes these programs (including welfare) go for versus the white collar crimes we pay for (now it's the Bush administration itself); read about the checks and balances necessary in a system like this. THAT'S what the Liberals want.

Your stupid comment enrages me because it's a byproduct of 15 years of Conservative propaganda pounded out almost daily, using generalities and distortions to misrepresent and mischaracterize the ideas, intents, and issues of the Left; while we sat here until only recently allowing that shit to go on without rebuttal from the other side. It's dangerous because these misconceptions are handing the country to those who really are destroying it.

Even if you could argue some "Lefties" would go too far in government sponsored support, that some want change but not necessarily for the benefit of all(????????), since when were the Conservatives interested in pursuing ANYTHING that wasn't self-interest; the Conservative agenda is INHERENTLY to the detriment of country's greater good.

The fuckin' stupidity of comparing the Liberal agenda to Communism - I thought - went out with the McCarthy era. You are a fossil, Stan.

I'll let you in on a couple of facts. Russia is not doing well right NOW either. Economically, they were doing FAR better when the country was Communist. The only reason it didn't hold was because of the expense of the arms race; put that aside - and I am, to make a point, leaving out the autocratic component - their economy was very strong and it would have held well for another 100 years if there had been NO arms race.

But that's another animal. NOW...the country is being run by organized crime. A FEW hording the wealth at the expense of the many. A LITTLE like what's starting to happen in THIS country NOW.

I'm very depressed. Because fossil though you may be, many people in this country think as YOU do. They hold to blind idealism like a pillow to their faces; and they never take the pillow away to learn or to see if they have the facts wrong. So, many, in fact, that, as YOU yourself said...we are in DEEP shit.

NOW...if you have anything else to say, I'll discuss it with you on the other side. Given your refusal to learn anything new I doubt you will.

No more from my end...okay?
I have had it up to my eyeballs with all this rhetoric and political football stuff going on in this room. I am going to leave it alone and go back to the purpose of this page...to analyze, critique or comment on the writings of Harlan Ellison. Enough said...no more political or religous comment from my end....okay?

Conservative "thinking"
"Liberal thinking was and is still up there...they seek change. What I have issue is...sometimes the change is not for the good of all.
Also Liberals want the government to control everyones lives from birth to death. (Hmmm sounds like Communism does it not? Russia found out after almost eighty years it does not work)
I have one question for you....Are you for or against free enterprise...the one thing that makes big business and small business possible?"

I just love how so many false assumptions can be put into so little space.
1) The GOP has, for the past 30 years, been the party most likely to say they're out to "change" things (though they use the more loaded word "reform.")
2) Though no one in their right mind can be as general as you have been, the 'left' tends to want to regulate business while leaving individuals free to do as best suits them; while the 'right' wants to control private lives, while letting big business do whatever they want.
3) Name calling (why do so many neo-cons always equate liberals to communists?) proves little save for your lack of imagination.
4) "Free Enterprise" is a great excuse or untrammeled corporate power, but as the middle ages proved, putting too much power into the hands of too few is a very bad idea.

There is increasingly a distinction between economic conservatives and social conservatives. Bush is a social conservative or "neo" conservative going more for the fundamentalist Christian crowd than traditional libertarian conservatives. He has alienated many in his own party by spending money (on the war and on subsidies for cronies businesses) and by raising the national debt. Liberals tend to favor taxation and more government programs, while conservatives say government should not spend money at all. Neoconservatives spend just as much; they just borrow the money instead of obtaining it through taxation.


I don't know how long the neo-conservative faction in the Republican party is going to hold up. It seems a very strange-bedfellows coalition that is likely to fall apart - many people vote against their own economic interests to put a fundamentalist in the White House, for instance. Republicans remain the party of the rich...and of Christians who are not all rich except for some of the high profile ones.

Kristin
but i thought hot dogs was better than POLITICS....

> Liberals want the government to control everyones lives from birth to death<

Hyperbolic, pat generalizations like these are obviously false just from a logical standpoint: there's no way ALL members of a huge group like "liberals," who we can assume comprise close to half the electorate, would agree to such a thing.

The statement also reeks of "this or that" thinking and depends on a term that remains undefined by the writer. Just what or who is a "liberal?" A union member? A Mapplethorpe funder? A tree-hugger?

And what is meant by controlling a life? Some would argue we're already there, and that the Patriot Act, sponsored by "conservatives," gave us a good nudge in that direction. "Control" is a freighted word, and I think it's very incorrrectly used here. Is your gripe the proposed National ID? Social Security? HMOs?

I recommend a good dose of mental draino to clear out the fuzzy, dark-side-of-the-force thinking. Political beliefs are generally much more sophisticated than this trope, and to lump people you evidently disagree with into some amorphous group and attribute such a motive to all of them strikes me as pretty simplistic, to say nothing of a little paranoid.

Adam-Troy:

Here's hoping Wilma withers down to a sneeze by the time it makes landfall. Enough already.

Chuck

Susan - Thanks for the nifty newsletter! Ok, so there's the trade paperback of the 50th Essential Ellison. Do you still have the special edition? And, do you offer a regular hardback edition? (Reason I ask is I prefer hardback but the cost of the special edition is, while justifiable to my own self, a bit difficult to rationalize to my better half!).

My limited statement on politics: Try being a "liberal democrat" in Texas while employed in the oil industry. ( I use the terms loosely... I am not so much moderate as I am a mix of positions both liberal and conservative, but more on the left side both socially and economically...) My colleagues forgive my supposedly misguided notions. ;-)

Peg

TO STEVE, ROB AND OTHER INTERESTED
STEVE....I bow to your incisive and intellectual remarks regarding what I posted on here. I too, am a working stiff, middle class person...I worked for years in the lumber industry and witness the lies from a former Oregon State Senator when our mill went down in 1978. By the way he was a Democrat too.
I became both Republican and Conservative on a moral issue anyway...I still believe any type of abortion is tandemount to wholesale murder, much worse than either Stalin or Hitler ever thought of doing. Nothing can change my mind about it and so long as the Republican Party stands behind right-to-life issues I will stay a Republican. Well...here I go again...posting political stuff...this is all I will say about it...there will be no more posts from me regarding politics, religion et al....

ROB...I said it all in the first paragraph (above). Liberal thinking was and is still up there...they seek change. What I have issue is...sometimes the change is not for the good of all.
Also Liberals want the government to control everyones lives from birth to death. (Hmmm sounds like Communism does it not? Russia found out after almost eighty years it does not work)
I have one question for you....Are you for or against free enterprise...the one thing that makes big business and small business possible?

A-TC

agreed Adam-Troy

definitely gruesomer than "Survivor Type"

although all that fainting stuff sounds like hyperbole; Chuck draws a pretty mean crowd, after all--but who knows

but Adam-Troy, how do you rate "Guts" on literary merit, compared to say...the gruesome ending of "A Boy and His Dog", por ejemplo?

Regards,
Neal

Harlan Ellison Strikes Back!!
5 Dooms - Great issue. But for those who don't want to spend $17 and do want to see the story in colour, it was reprinted a few years back in Avengers Volume 3 #27. Pretty common back issue; you can usually get it for cover price ($3) at any decent comic shop.

And speaking of comics... Time magazine put out a list of 100 greatest novels (post 1920-now), and one graphic novel made the cut: Alan Moore's "Watchmen".

Still Not Prepared!
http://www.theonion.com/content/node/41676

Wilma Update / "Guts"
Wilma is expected to be a Cat 2 or 3 when it makes landfall in Florida. We've ridden out Cat 2s before -- indeed, that was Katrina's strength, when it passed over our neighborhood last time. We have guarded optimism.

On another subject:

For months now, I have been hearing radio stories and reading news coverage of a short story by Chuck Pahluniuk (author of FIGHT CLUB) so horrifying that listeners have been fainting during his public readings of it.

I have read a lot of awfully horrifying stuff, and written some more, so I imagined myself immune from its effects. My interest in it was eager, but academic.

The story in question, "Guts," is reprinted in the latest Datlow/Link YEAR'S BEST FANTASY AND HORROR.

I haven't sprung for that volume yet (though I always do); but I read the story over coffee at Barnes and Noble.

Holy Freaking Mother of God.

Folks, this may be one of the two or three most intensely horrifying stories I have ever, repeat, EVER, read. During its two-page climax, I kept thinking, Oh, God, he's not going to do this. Oh God, he did just do it. Oh, God, he can't go farther than that. Oh God, he just did.

It gets darker and darker, up to a very VERY nasty eleventh-hour twist, and a last line that ties the psychic aftermath in a bow.

And GRAPHIC...! Jesus H. Mother of Christ.

All in prose as vivid and as visual as documentary footage of the terrifyingly possible events described therein.

I know a lot of folks who shouldn't go anywhere near this thing.

Posting the above comments elsewhere, I was asked if it was worse than Stephen King's notorious "Survivor Type"...and I said, "Yes."

Whoa...

Dang!

For Harlan completists: Marvel's Essential series (black-and white reprints of various series) will be releasing their latest Avengers (70's era) volume which contains "Five Dooms To Save Tomorrow" from a story by Harlan and adapted by Roy Thomas, issue #101.

--------------------------------------------------------
ESSENTIAL AVENGERS VOL. 5 TPB
Written by ROY THOMAS, HARLAN ELLISON, CHRIS CLAREMONT, STEVE ENGLEHART & STEVE GERBER
Penciled by BARRY WINDSOR-SMITH, RICH BUCKLER, JOHN BUSCEMA, GEORGE TUSKA, JIM STARLIN, DON HECK, BOB BROWN, DAVE COCKRUM, SAL BUSCEMA, SAM KWESKIN & SYD SHORES
Cover by BARRY WINDSOR-SMITH
From the Sentinels and the Savage Land Mutates to Loki, Dormammu and Thanos, the Avengers prove the universe's worst are no match for their best! Magnetic mayhem and nuclear nostalgia! Featuring Golden Age guest stars, mythic menaces and more! Plus: the Avengers-Defenders War and Hawkeye vs. Daredevil! Includes rare Marvel work by best-selling author Harlan Ellison! Collects AVENGERS #98-126, DAREDEVIL #99, DEFENDERS #8-11 and GIANT-SIZE AVENGERS #1.
600 PGS./All Ages ...$16.99
ISBN: 0-7851-2087-4

Question about the Teats

If I had known what the weather was like outdoors this morning, I probably wouldn't have gone out. But the alarm rang at 6:20, I did some stretching, and then I hit the street for a four-mile run. (There's Ellison content here, rest assured; I'm building up to it.)

After arriving back home feeling like a drowned rat, I sat on the toilet in the nude, drying off and warming up, and cutting my nails (both hands and feet). Something about that position reminded me of a memorable item somewhere in one of the Glass Teats.

Harlan is trying to cheer up the presumably depressed reader (probably reeling after something Harlan hit her or him with, a paragraph or column before), and he says: you know how you have to look back behind you at the toilet paper to see whether it's still picking up solid matter or is relatively clean? Well, President Nixon has to do that, just like you do. Isn't that comforting?

This was an image that just never occurred to me before -- with regard to ANYONE else, never mind the President of the United States -- so I found it oddly charming and obviously never forgot it.

The question is, where would one find that reference?

And I was reminded of a notice I'd seen recently that the two Glass Teats are about to be reissued, sometime in the next year . . . perhaps united into one volume? Clothbound? This raised the ultimate question, which I put to Harlan here--


HARLAN:

Will the new edition of The Glass Teat and The Other Glass Teat be indexed? So we can find Richard Nixon and Chuck Barris and Peggy Lipton and Sally Field and all the others quickly, rather than having to page madly through our copy looking for the story of your abortive appearance on the Dating Game and the many smaller jewels that don't necessarily relate directly to the title of the particular column they're in?

If that's a question that's still up in the air; if the publisher hadn't planned on it, but is still open to the idea; if you need someone to do the gruntwork, FOR FREE . . . I'll do it, just so I and the rest of The Devoted will have an edition of the Glass Teat that's truly serviceable and better than all the rest.

Fountain Pens
I just bought an 85 year old fountain pen.

Anyone else here use them?

Stan
Speaking as a liberal-leaning moderate Democrat who has, at times, paid the salaries of "other working stiffs" I would like to challenge your whole premise that only Republicans and/or conservatives contribute to the economy of the less fortunate. I have employed others and at other times been myself the employed. In fact, currently I am on the payroll of a megacorporation which I hardly detest (in addition to owning half of a small business and working in the arts part-time), and have in the past swallowed tremendous amounts of bugjuice at my own expense. And still, wow, I like big business which has been, for the most part, very good to me.

I have been a victimized stockholder, employee and citizen. I have seen my net worth increase to and drop from seven figures. On a daily basis I work quite happily with other working stiffs who are of a different political persuasion than I.

I eat hot dogs, sometimes with ketchup and sometimes au naturel.

The point I'm making is that Conservative Republicanism is a social statement not an economic one. Liberal Democratism is the same. True, the majority of upper-income individuals (though well below "all") may be republican-leaning. Many, many working stiffs are conservative as well. And many, many independently wealthy people are liberals.

Argue with the ideology all you like, but adding an economic priority and blanket social-responsibility comments to a select grouping of political attitudes (Democrats) does neither side any good.

Steve "Well-meaningandrelativelywell-offsocialliberalwithright-leaningpositionsonahadfulofissueshotdogeatingModerate" Barber

Good Wishes for Adam & Judy & Other thoughts
Adam & Judy, you are in my thoughts and I wish you guys the best. According to CNN, Wilma has reduced in intensity, down to a Category 4 hurricane, but that it is still one mother of a storm.

John Pacer, not sure why there was a difference in the rolls as I know for a fact that they both use D'Amoroso's breads. From what I have heard there is , ahem, strong encouragement to use that particular provider, notwithstanding the fact that their breads are absolutely sublime.

Stan, why do you make such broad statements? Liberals hate big business? While I would hardly claim to speak for all Liberals, I would say that claim is nonsense. We want to see businesses act in a responsible manner through such wild and crazy notions as not dumping toxic chemicals into our waterways, putting labels on food products so you know what you are eating and actually being held responsible if their product injures or kills someone. Boy, we Liberals are just wacky Communists for actually expecting responsibility from corporations, huh?

Would you like to expand this discussion to address the topic of why the gap between the top executive and the lowest paid worker is exponentially larger here in the US, as compared with any other country? How about the fact that Americans work much longer work weeks and have shorter vacation time accrued than almost any other country?

Notice I am not even bringing up the fact that there are, by some estimates, 20 million Americans who are working, yet have no health care coverage because they work for small employers who cannot provide coverage to their employees.

You ask, if we are all Americans, and the answer is yes. Unfortunately, we are also rapidly developing a caste system within this country, similar to medieval Europe or India. The last thing the framers of the Constitution ever wanted to see in the US was the creation of a Brahmin style class within its borders, yet that is what the current Administration is attempting to achieve.

Barbeque? Did someone actually suggest charring the delicate hot dog over open flame? Why not just throw ‘em in the nuker and suck the juices out that way? *blech*

No, no, my children, although I will grant the certain ambiance that comes with picnicking, if you don’t have one of these:

http://www.hedonics.com/store/prodinfo.asp?number=0552&variation=&aitem=1&mitem=1

Boiling is the civilized way to go!

Adam-Troy:

Belated conga rats on your new book contract for ‘Amazing Race’. Hopefully fleeing from Wilma won’t become part of your background research. The latest report I’ve seen suggests Wilma is lessening in strength and may not hit Florida until Monday, so I’m hoping that you and all the Webderlanders in the area will be safe and sound.

By the way, I’m not sure global warming has anything to do with the storms of the last few years; Somehow, someway I’d bet that Vossoff and Nimmitz are to blame!

What Jon said.

Hearty congrats and thanks Rick!

Hiya Charlie!

Been doing the house-husband thing for awhile now and not paying much attention to the internet. Did Harlan ever send you your prize from the Collecting Harlan contest?

Luv to all,

jono

Holy Moley!
Did the 10th anniversary of the Webderland bulletin board community go uncommented upon in late August? In any case, congratulations and thanks to Rick Wyatt for doing this for ten years with grace.

Cheers, Jon

Stan,

You are using ONE premise to make an entire argument, at the expense of far more crucial, starker realities. (And to be fair, Frank often does too; he does not always convey the level-headedness of the GREATER Left).

To begin with, your great "wage payers" often pay rates below the standard of living. The problem with poor and middle class people is that they're poor and middle class. They don't have that much in the way of assets. They chew up their assets just LIVING, and so a medical catastrophe or a car accident will wipe them out - they'll go from $2K to - $48K, not $50K to $0K. They AREN'T making enough from those wages - I mean MANY, not ALL - to pull their weight in the face of a catastrophe.

Big Businesses often give their CEOs the hikes, while lowering wages for lower level employees.

(Read how the Republicans are now pushing to cut Medicare. That was on the news yesterday. What are the people who haven't any money going to do when the only option is expensive private health care?)

AND, btw, Corporations pay just about ZERO in Fed income tax. That means YOU pay a shitload more proportionately. Where the fuck do you think FEMA could have gotten its funds had Bush not ingratiated these White Collar bastards with multi-trillion dollar tax cuts? (You guys never get this. You NEVER get this. And then, constantly, you vote against your own interests because you buy into a one-premise argument without considering the broader picture. This is the reason your votes are getting us into so much trouble).

"Big Business" is an inevitable outcome of any growing economy. No capitalist economy can grow without them. But...BUT: as it becomes part of the infrastructure it tends to eat away at its host (history has shown this to be true INVARIABLY). It's the NATURE of the beast we're going after here. Left unregulated, B.B. hordes. It uses its powerful lobby at the expense of the American people, thereby ultimately taking far more than it gives. Hey, the country's economy loses more to White Collar crime than anything else.

Of course, whether making the argument for the Left or the Right, it always helps to specify the most abusive industries.

The insurance companies, the drug companies, the fast food industry, real estate developers, the oil companies...they all TAKE and TAKE and TAKE...far more from us than they pay in wages to their humble employees.

Right now, probably the most notorious anti-consumer entity is the credit card companies, who have grown rich from their increasingly revolting loan shark-like tactics, don't want to pay the price of their reliance on these obscene methods. They want the ability to engage in any kind of shady marketing they can, eagerly promoting the virtues of almost unlimited debt to people they know to be unsound risks, but when the loans don't pay off they don't want to suffer the consequences. Credit card companies are among the primary backers of a bankruptcy bill about to be passed in Congress, which is largely designed to shield them from taking responsibility for their own loan portfolios.

Unless it's CAREFULLY regulated "Big Business", STAN, on the WHOLE, takes from America more than it gives.

If you want a REAL overview of the Nature of the Beast and its dynamics, read Eric Schlosser's FAST FOOD NATION. I've always seen it as the modern day version of Upton Sinclair's THE JUNGLE.

Right = Ignorance (YOU'RE the ones who got us where we are NOW)

Left = Fact gathering (rather than using ONE premise to make an argument)

A Boy and His Dog on FLIX tonight... now,actually, this moment-- in Texas. Pressing the info button a line appears;" From the book by Harlan Ellsion."

Don't know if any of y'all already mentioned it. If so, please pardon,

Cindy

TO FRANK CHURCH...AGAIN!
Frank...Frank...Frank. Come on buddy. Not all Conservatives are thinking the way Boortz is expounding on his show. It does however bring up an interesting question though...have you ever heard of a liberal Democrat working stiff paying the wages of other working stiffs? Come on now! Just like not all rich people are Conservative...some of the richest and snobbish people in the USA live in Hollywood or around it and upstate New YOrk or somewhere near Central Park in NYC....and yes...some of these people profess being both Liberal and Democrat..can you explain that? Liberals such as yourself, hate big business...yet...its big business that pays the wages to poor and so called down trodden masses of the working people in this country! I wish you would get off that liberal high horse of yours...geewhiz...WE ARE ALL AMERICANS AREN'T WE?

ketchup on hot dogs?!?!?
c'mon... is this the best topic you can come up with?!
yes?
ok, then.... never, EVER, put ketchup on a hotdog. it's mustard, you a#@! a Chicago dog is the best food invention. please don't ruin it for everyone!

For those too financially challenged to get the boxed set, there's a Val Lewton marathon on Turner Classic Movies - Right. Now. (Sorry for the late notice-I just found out about it).
Eric – I’ll have to try Mustard's Last Stand. I used to live in Chicago proper, but now I’m in Wilmette and luckily only a block from Irving’s, one of my favorites. And, yes, celery salt is vital, and ketchup is verboten, but it’s not a Chicago dog without the radioactive green relish. I grew up in Indiana, and the first time my mom took me downtown we had lunch to the soon-to-be-late-and-lamented-Marshall Field’s, where my eight year-old eyes bugged out at the glowing green goo slathered on the dog.

Veggie things
Indeed, "riblets" are as good as (or better than) actual boneless ribs from a fast food place. The Girlfriend and I were amazed at the texture and taste. I like them on a kaiser roll with melted cheese or on rice myself.

As far as veggie dogs, I have to agree that most suck. Except for the ones that I recently found. I can't recall the brand name, but they are made with portobello mushrooms (and soy) and are just fine. When I find them again I will post the name.

Kristin

You are correct. Pink's was recently advertising the fact that they are going to have a location at the Aladin in Las Vegas. Not necessarily good news. However, for those of us who have to travel to Vegas for work, it is an alternative that might represent something close to good food. (Kind of like when they put a Garduno's in the Palms. No it's not the best New Mexican restaurant - but still better than anything else I was able to find [even trying the best bet - hole-in-the-wall ones] anywhere else in Vegas.

Lee

"The quibble in bits"

Laugh-out-loud funny

Mike

(And please forgive typos - I'm entering this from the lobby of an Embassy Suites hotel)

Colbert Report - Hillarious. But I agree with Brian, its going to be tuff in the long run to keep the show running after a season or two. In an interview with Robert Siegel, Colbert said aside from the reports and interviews, part of the show is going to develop and reveal a personal life for his character. That certainly gives the show more to play with.

And here's a link to Terry Gross' interview with Colbert; funny stuff:

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4583007

Frank,


You also put the chomp in Chomsky.

The lye in lyrical.

The quibbles in bits.

And the left in leftovers.


The ham in hambone.

The sting in interesting.

The con in conversation.

And the sin in Cindy.



A Frank haiku:

Black helicopters
Whip dust clouds over mass graves
Freedom’s voices stilled


I, for one, am happy to have you back.

Why did you leave? Where have you been?

Susan: I got my first HERC package! Great stuff. Thanks for all the extra goodies. This is a sweet treat.

Mark Goldberg: I have to say I definately prefer Pat's to Geno's. Geno's rolls are to dry whenever I'm there. Last time I was there something funky was goin' on with the onions, too. Either way, though, it's all about the whiz wit'. I remember the first time I got the whiz I was skeptical and thought my friends were trying to play some cruel trick on me. I'm now a true believer.

-John

I live in the Chicago area and I usually ask the counter to hold the mustard, since they tend to slather it on like there was no tomorrow. Mustard is a strong condiment, and should be used sparingly. Specifying "easy mustard" encourages the server to make up the perceived lack of mass with an excess of something else, like relish.

Both ketchup and mustard are usually available at the counter to self-apply. That works the best. A good Chicago dog has two traits: a distinct snap after biting into it, and just the right amount of celery salt. I recommend Mustard's Last Stand (ironic title), right next to Ryan Field in Evanston.

>Yea, conservatives aren't Nazi's. Then why do they keep proving it.

Bit of a s'low learner, aren't we?

Speaking of slow learners, the conservative=Nazi formulation was popular with me when I was in high school. That was before I learned the world was sort of, you know...complex. But it's easier to think like Ann Coulter's mirror opposite, isn't it?

The One True Dog
Here I thought I would GET the answer -- but how is a sandwich meat agnostic to adopt a faith if everyone has a different sworn verity?!?! Initially I thought the best burger was delivered at the Denny's on Colorado in Pasadena around the month of October 1996, but meditation showed that it was only true for me: Interior reasons stemming from a lack of breakfast, long flight, drive across LA in dark of night, low expectations (Denny's), all conspiring to create a few moments of transport. Crispy bun. Crispy pink meat. Hot cheese. Pickles. Ketchup on the side. Vague memories of lettuce-things. And so agnosticism reigned down through the years, while I STILL long for the certainty that says the One True Dog lives at Spanky's on Michigan in Chicago, between the car park and the Kinkos and no where else. But I know it wll be only becuse I've walked too long in the rain, eaten nothing Chinese lately, lost my rental keys, seen that nifty Oscar Meyer car scooting about, or heard a wiff of jazz tune out a doorway. My faith is broken and won't start. Probably a baseball thing, I don't know.

Finder Doug -- late to the game I have to THANK YOU for the piece on Harlan at BU. Vivid pictures as if I were watching footage. It does my heart such good to hear how Harlan was honored, welcomed and dined (if not wined) among worthies and admirers in such a setting as the Algonquin -- though I've never seen, but feel as if I have. Yes, seen the whole thing. Ah, but I CAN'T imagine the lecture...

Harlan, it sounds golden. May it be and shine golden, man! We don't talk often, but you remain among my very few Northern Stars.

Mark Zug

Yea, you conservatives really love Jesus. Neil Boortz, libertarian idiot, goes on his talkshow and says that the rich deserve to be saved before the poor, when there is a natural disaster, because the poor are a 'drag' on society.

http://mediamatters.org/items/200510140006

Yea, conservatives aren't Nazi's. Then why do they keep proving it.

--------------

Kristine, I have them all around my finger. I bait, they follow. Look at all the postings started because of one of my rants. Hell, without me they would have nothing to talk about.

I am the rock in their Christmas stockings, the lump in their undies, but I am such a mild mannered child of the living Christ that I lurch into the fall leaves shaking my head at how low they think my motives are. I only march in love, I put wreathes on their doors, a song of the dolphin in their souls.

Sorry, I need a tissue.

Burp.

Kristin:

Have you tried veggie ribs? The whole idea of it seems very strange to me, but I tasted 'em and was hooked. The texture/consistency is very convincing . . . of course, the sauce is what really makes it. Can't remember the brand offhand, but Carole and I eat them regularly.

Adam and Judi: I wish words over the Internet _could_ be of some severe material help for you. Is there an evac plan in your area? How solid is your home? Think you might be able to lay in some well-protected food supplies in advance, stuff that can stay in the package and not go bad for a few days? I'd stock up on a few gallons of water, too... and make sure the administrative logistics of insurance, title deeds, checkbooks and the like are in order and in s safe location.

I don't _mean_ to sound like Mr. Survivalist. Sorry 'bout that.

Has anyone checked out _The Colbert Report_ yet? The first two shows have been terrifically funny. Colbert's got a real knack for working utterly insane patter into an impression of a clueless media-clown who _has_ to look Determined and Authoritative. As a parody of Bill O'Reilly, it's pretty good, but Colbert's thin and gentle-looking physique reminds us that most of the news pundits are manicured, college-boy fetuses. (O'Reilly's just a Central Casting "bartender" performer, needy for authenticity: he genuinely wishes that he smelled like beer nuts.)

The best parts of the show were Colbert's riffs on current issues. They started off as O'Reilly-like complaints, and quickly skated off into implosions of surreality. The bullet-points were hilarious, too. It's not as surreal as _The Day Today_, the BBC's parody news show that birthed Chris Morris, Stev Coogan, Patrick Marber and Armando Iannucci, but few things are.

The low points were when Colbert had to stray from the behind-the-desk pontificating, and fill out the half hour. An interview with a minor official in a Georgia voting district was hilarious, but it was a bit too close to the _Daily Show_'s segments. But... Well, here's what I mean. The opening show had an interview with Stone Phillips, and a gravitas-off with Phillips. The second segment was _wonderful_. But the interview, while amusing, seemed a bit pointless.

And as a recent _Slate_ review pointed out, who is Colbert going to get in the future? Jon Stewart can ask serious questions, but Colbert's character _can't_ switch from an O'Reilly parody into semi-serious interview mode. It just won't work with real guests. It would certainly work with actors _playing_ talk-show guests. Or, it might work if the guests visited remotely, as on _Nightline_ or _Space Ghost_, to puncture the authoritarian nature of giving the host a cut-off switch.

Colbert's got a _lot_ of work to do. He has to fill out a half hour, and unlike O'Reilly, he can't just spout off with ignorant ranting: he has to fill his time with severely funny material. This show could burn itself out very, very quickly, but so far, it's terrific.

Wilma

Hurricane Wilma is now a Category Five, and is according to some sources showing the lowest barometric pressures in all of recorded history.

It is expected to make a sharp turn east and hit Florida. Right now, Southwest Florida. We may be within its most intense winds.

This one may make Katrina look like a firecracker.

We expect to be hit on Saturday.

Folks: I may not believe in prayers, but we can sure as hell use your thoughts.

A-TC

Cheesesteak
Mark,

Of course, you are right. Pat and Mike seem to be interchangeable in my scrambled brain. It's probably racist, too, like calling a paddy-wagon a paddy-wagon.

Best cheesesteak I ever had was at Pat's, across the street diagonally from Geno's.

However, now it looks like I'll have to try The White House...

-Keith (ever on the lookout for new meat) Cramer

Kristin, muh deah, thatz thuh trew south, that is, JAWJUH, or in the way of the infidel, GEORGIA. Florida, psssshaaaw!

Rob is right, enough of this madness! Let's argue about something really important...

BARBECUE!

C heesesteaks and Harlan Appearance
Harlan will be appearing at Minicon in April 2006, information on his appearance can be found at http://mnstf.org/minicon/

Keith, I am a Philly native and I have never heard of Mike's. In Philly the best place to go for a cheesesteak has to be Geno's. I know many people have heard of Pat's, where the cheesesteak was born, but Geno's, which is right across the street is better.

However, I must say that the best cheesesteak to be found on the face of the earth is not found in Philly, but in Atlantic City, NJ. The White House is a legendary place that I visited all the time in my youth, and brought a buddy of mine to sample their wares about a decade ago. It remained as good as I remembered

appearances
Does anyone know if there is a list of where Harlan will be appearing? The news page here at the website hasn't been updated in over a year.

It looks like he was recently at Boston University. I also read that he will be the guest of honor at a convention in Minneapolis early next year.

Cackling

Ketchup? Mustard? Relish?


What the hell IS this? A church social? The Mickey Mouse Club? Mormons working for Blockbuster?

Steve Barber seems to be the only one here who understands a disturbing image when he's faced with one. I mean I'm actually losing sleep for having revived that little memory.

Quit goin' on, you silly twits. This reminds me a bit of the time I had to explain a Monty Python movie to my mom when I was 13.

Eastbay: Sounds to me like you're a vegetarian/vegan. Yeah, we eat STICKS OF DEAD COW AND PIG! no seriously, I wouldn't actually go around mocking others' dietary choices, especially when vegetarians tend to live longer...exactly where in the east bay are you from???

Ezra: South WEST or south EAST? I never mentioned the south EAST (Florida? Alabama?) I'll take just about any style of hot dog, (non) ketchup and chili dogs included. When passing through Chicago airport, find a TCBYs (if you can't locate a locally owned hot dog stand...those serve better ones but even TCBYs has local style dogs) and say yes to the celery salt, no to the ketchup.

Ooh, Mike, a hot dog pilgrimage!! I read somewhere (was it National Geographic?) that Pinks is selling their menu to fancy hotel restaurants in Las Vegas. Now there's a scary thought....

Frank, how come you can't ever seem to resist feeding the troll? These people are baiting, you know...

Kristin
I like veggie *burgers* (soy or grain) well enough, but soy hot dogs are...yeechy..

Ah Ha!

"Hot dogs give me gas and they taste awful."

You all mocked me when I declaimed of K.C.'s extraplanetary origins, but THERE is the proof--do you not see it?!

D.

A Day at the Races
(Just catching up on the daily feed after having spent a hellacious time over at le City of LB ECOC trying to 'splain why my employer had picked this very special day to knock out dial tone over half of SoCal. Hmm, that glass o' Burgundy looking good right about now.)
______________________________________________

From Mr Rob:
""Rob, this is sooo wrong on so many, many levels."

I...I don't understand.

Ezra,
Nevuh mind the Kezshup OR th' mustid OR any vestigial condiments. This...OBJECT...was laid to the BARE skin, BABY!
Even the BREAD - so caressing and light - seemed to drop away.
And it was the Jonah story all over again.
Not the snapshot you wanna send home to the kids."

Actually, I think you got the argument right about right, sir. Like I said, so many levels.

BTW, after a day of debate, the best dogs are Ball Park all-beef bun-length slow roasted over a barbecue 'til the burnt edges are kind of flakey while the center is still a bit raw-red, sourdough bun with a thin wisp of mustard down one side of the weiner and a thin strip of ketchup on the other, a plateful of Fritos and an ice-cold beer-of-your-choice to wash it down. (Corona with lime for the SoCal set.)

IMHO.


And as for me, it's 2Bucktime.


SB

Eastbay, right on!

Jono, nice to hear from ya.

I have to put in a word for the flat-sided hot dog bun, which is the bun of choice here in Boston. Easy to slather with butter and grill till golden brown. And speaking of heart failure, there is a seafood restaurant a block down from my house that serves the deadliest dog I have ever encountered in my frank-lovin' life. And it is this: a foot-long dog nestled between two strips of crispy bacon, covered with melted American cheese and served on said flat-sided, butter-grilled bun. I tried it once...and chewed a couple of aspirin tablets soon after...for precaution's sake.

And will anyone sing the praises of the fried baloney sandwich?

TIM: I think it was a the guy who ran the MASSPirg office at SMU who clued me into you writing for The Other One. And you know, I may have an issue tucked into a box of my college stuff somewhere. I'll see if I can dig it up.

Mark W.

Hotdogs? Yech. An Amy's veggie burger wit' Rudy's BBQ sause (sic), or tofu smothered in peanut sauce...now thems good eats.

Picked up some great reads today including this number which I recommend: "The Murrow Boys: Pioneers on the Front Lines of Journalism" by Lynne Olson and Stanley Cloud.

Ah, the joy of the humble Hot Dog!

What to coat this culinary delight has been the obsession of many, from the starving student who lathers on everything in hopes of mimicking a balanced meal to the epicurean in the stands, to whom it’s all good, as long as the Blue Jays are winning.

Those in the know in Ontario will point to Denniger’s German-style hot dogs (the ones with the crunchy skin). Properly boiled, with only a single dignified line of hot mustard but suitably weighted down with sauerkraut! Mmm, heaven!

Luv to all,

jono

Debunking the pseudo-science of CSICOP. Exposing unbalanced materialist ideologue Richard Dawkins.

http://www.alternativescience.com/

Hot dogs give me gas
and they taste awful. I'll take a Philly Cheesesteak from Mike's, please. No ketchup.

floor scraps


only oscar mayer hotdogs with equal parts catsup and mustard on a steamed bun

I am the healthiest eater in the world, except for this:
My favorite snack after a long day of physical activity: A single pull-tab can of reduced fat "Vienna Sausages," you know, the ones with the ingredient list that begins with "MECHANICALLY SEPERATED CHICKEN."

I eat all eight of the tiny little things, one at a time, then suck down the juice left in the can. Must be the electrolytes.

No ketchup, catsup, or anything else needed.

No wonder Mozart died so young.

I once had a foreign waiter at an upscale restaurant ask me if I would like American sauce to accompany my meal. "What's American sauce?" asks I. You already know his gleefully smug answer.

It's difficult to be viewed as an epicurean when you're from the land of Spam.

Hots
One of WNY's regional specialties (along with chicken wings and the beef on 'weck) is the white hot. It's made with pork. I can't abide it myself; but, many other's love it. I, personally, never much cared for mustard; pass the ketchup, please.

The real Maine hotdog is stuffed in natural casings dyed bright red. I bought 2.5 lbs of 'em last weekend at the Hannaford in Skowhegan, ME.

You just can't seem to get those things anyplace else. Lobster? Who knows? The package says "variety meats" so it could be brains and gizards and who knows what else. I wouldn't rule out lobster if one fell on the factory floor or something.

Anyway, those things are best cooked on a stick in a campfire. And we always ate 'em with ketchup, mustard, and my grandmother's relish (several varieties). Raw onion is also a nice addition.

I look forward to them every summah. Glad to have scored and froze some to eat with baked beans in the wintuh.

I always took hot dogs with my ketcup myself. Ever and always. . .

I always have ketchup or catsup on hot dogs; just never had that big a jones about mustard. To me, sour meat is an odd combination. But at times I do eat a hot dog with mustard, so that makes me one odd dude. But you already know this.

---------------

Conservative Rationalist: Yea, walking the party line and letting the powerful loot the country is what you like, eh? Why not bring back the Sedition laws and put all of us in jail. You might get off on that. Don't want you cumming all over your new brown shirt.

I guess all your buddies being indicted is a sign of great times ahead for your kind. I know, it's all a liberal conspiracy to stain your great leader, President mush.

MAINE "DOGS"
EZRA: Hate to be the one to break it to ya binky, but those aren't _true_ hotdogs you've been pushing down your gullet lo these many years. EVERY true hotdog afficionado knows that Maine hotdogs are actually made with "Lahb-stuh" meat (Mainly because in 1876, a state-wide ordinace was passed which prohibits the hunting, grinding and packing of stray poodles, dachshunds and terriers -- the, uh, mainstay of meatpackers churning out Oscar Meyers and other related weenie products).

Would I lie to you?
Informationally,

the Man

Here in Phoenix, we have a delicacy called the Sonoran Hot Dog, which I haven't sampled. Some come with beans and salsa, mustard and onions, but the most important feature seems to be wrapping the dog in bacon.

This has set vendors at odds with health inspectors, chronicled here:

http://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/issues/2004-07-01/news/news.html

I've preferred just mustard for years. But I like my burgers with both.

while we're on the subject of hot dogs...
Is Maine the only place with red hotdogs? People in other locals look at me askance when I raise the topic of my home state's hot dogs, and I'm starting to wonder.

Kristin I sprang from southern lands where ketchup is put on anything that is not physically capable of movement. I was an adult before I was initiated by some Yankees into the pleasures of the unadorned weenie.

But I ask you not to think harshly of my southern brothers and sisters. Contemplate instead the frozen, hermetically wrapped grocery store dog, full of ingredients that would have made H P Lovecraft shudder to think on them.

Naturally Bubba takes to his ketchup the way an 18th century Frenchman took to his snuffbox when facing the prospect of crossing the flowing brown rivulets of a street in Paris.

People are driven to strange and terrible actions. Heating up a hot dog in a microwave, or, and I can barely force myself to say it, putting mayonnaise on a bun.

"I run to the burnt weenie sandwich, and the burnt weenie sandwich meets me as fast...and all my pleasures are like yesterday."

I'm an ex New Yorker (downstate and upstate) and it was sauerkraut and mustard on a hot dog. Ketchup on a hot dog?? Never ever. I have to refrain from saying anything when my wife or company does it.

David

A week ago Sunday our family took a vacation to LA. We arrived early Sunday morning to ensure we were in time for the 1:00 tickets we had for the King Tut exhibit – far too early. We visited the tar pits and the Page Museum.

At 10:30 (I told you we were early) we were hungry – too hungry to wait for a true lunchtime. So I drove my wife and son to Pinks. I go there often when visiting LA for work, but no one else in the family knew the rapture. Forgive what we had (my wife went with the millennium dog, my son had something that was a combination of mayonnaise and mushrooms, and I am always a sucker for the chili dog [just chili, no onions, no cheese – just chili, dog, and bun, the way God meant for us to enjoy chili dogs]). Instead, join me in reliving the joy of their introduction to the perfect hot dog as we all sat out in the glorious California Sunday morning.

Mike

Ketchup attitudes reveal where you're from?
I have always taken the ketchup/mustard/relish combination for granted, but then my mom is from New England, which is said to be a pro-ketchup region. In Chicago, hot-dog makers consider "ketchup" a dirty word and putting ketchup on a local style dog is considered blasphemy against the Hot Dog God. In California (and the southwest) I suppose chili dogs are the regional form; ketchup doesn't exactly mix well with chili&cheese. On the other hand, many of us here are transplants :)..I wasn't raised with chili dogs especially. Philadelphia seems to side with the midwest on the ketchup issue - at least my friend from South Jersey, whose nearest large city is Philly, says "Ketchup on a hot dog? Yeech!" It is a fact, though, that ketchup (and a lot of the cheaper mustard, too) is loaded with sugar&salt so it drowns the flavor of the meat - whatever you put ketchup on, takes like ketchup. Little kids like it. As I've gotten older I've found I want to go easy on the cheap condiments.

I've found diced tomatoes so much better...or you could puree tomatoes into homemade ketchup....

Nice post, Amy!

Kristin
California Native

Steve Barber,

"Rob, this is sooo wrong on so many, many levels."

I...I don't understand.

Ezra,

Nevuh mind the Kezshup OR th' mustid OR any vestigial condiments. This...OBJECT...was laid to the BARE skin, BABY!

Even the BREAD - so caressing and light - seemed to drop away.

And it was the Jonah story all over again.

Not the snapshot you wanna send home to the kids.

...and now to the LIGHTER side:

Steven Utley,

I am in awe of Little Nemo In Slumberland, esp. as a guy with interest in the animation field. Windsor McCay: THERE'S an innovator.

Duane,

I don't care watcha' say...LA sucks!

I was flipping through the channels late 2 nights ago, and caught Bill Maher on the Howard Stern Show. Maher was debating with a member of the KKK and 3 mentally retarded individuals. Topics included abortion rights, stem cell research. It was bizare, but then again everything that happens on Stern's show is more than a bit strange.

Are Hal Foster, Alex Raymond and Milton Caniff geniuses? Of course. They didn't have abstract/whimsical/dreamlike styles of McCay, Herriman, or Cray but keep in mind the subject matter Foster, Caniff and Raymond were working with. Tarzan, Prince Valiant, Terry and the Pirates, Flash Gordon...these strips needed to be done with a fair amount of realism. All three gentlemen certainly had distinct styles; you see their work, you recognize it instantly. Take any panel from any strip these men worked on and it could stand on its on own as a work of art. Despite lacking the sense of play found in Nemo or Krazy Cat, Foster and Raymond put out genius level work in terms of overall composition and story telling.

Wally Wood got his start in strips. Genius. No doubt about it.

LA rules, regardless of weather.

TIM: I'm so sorry to hear that the weather smacked you. I lived on a flood-prone property in NY, so I know how depressing it is to bail everything out and start over. I enjoyed meeting you and your lovely wife last week. I wish I could've chatted with you both more -- that whole day was a chaotic blur to me! I hope we meet again when I'm a bit more relaxed.

DOUG: Man, you nailed it. I'm glad you remembered some of the details, because I was a little overwhelmed by it all. I only remember how the evening made me feel -- how happy I was for Harlan and Susan; how honored I felt to be there to witness it. Despite scaring Harlan badly enough to make him cry for Susan, I wouldn't trade that night for anything.

HARLAN, SUSAN: Thank you. Between the Algonquin, the company, and the priceless treasure of your friendship, it was easily worth the trip.

Still trying to finish the Boston piece. My nearest computer/keyboard is at work. Hopefully, tomorrow. I'm not messing around. I want to make sure it's just right.

Mark: Holy shit! "The Other One." How did you know I wrote for those guys? I actually thought I was a silent partner, that no one knew I was involved. It was a fun time. I got to hang out with the likes of Allen Ginsberg and Gregory Corso who were allowing us to publish their stuff. Do you have any copies? As far as I know, I only have one. Go figure. Me who saves everything didn't think enough to preserve my own work. To make it more difficult Don Machado, the editor, lost all the originals. Ah, well.

Gore Vidal and Harold Pinter are spiritless automatons and their writings have already become the literary equivalent of lava lamps. It's because of party-hacks like these that accounts for The National Endowment for the Arts "Reading at Risk" statistics. They perfectly embody the sniffing egocentric complacency that has given the humanities the intellectual slum status it well deserves. And nobody reads their atheistic unimaginative junk except neurotic ivy leaguers in Reeboks.

PS
I guess Pinter has no scruples in sharing a trophy with Henry Kissenger, but it's nice getting away to the South of France. Even the likes of Jean Paul Sartre had stronger convictions.

Little Nemo in Slumberland
It so happens that during the past week I have been re-reading my Titan collections of THE COMPLETE LITTLE NEMO IN SLUMBERLAND at bedtime (when else?). What a gorgeous goddamn comic strip. There is no doubt in my mind that Winsor McCay was one of the funny pages' authentic geniuses, alongside George Herriman and probably Cliff Sterrett and maybe Roy Crane ... but I'm not sure who else. Hal Foster, Alex Raymond, and Milt Caniff were terrific, innovative illustrators -- but geniuses? I'm just not sure. Opinions, Harlan -- anybody?

Harlan, I understand your concern, especially knowing that Rob and the others take some of my corning way too seriously, as well. I am quite ok and know that Rob is our special lil' chew toy. Aint he cute. Momma musta held him by his ears, like he was sweet corn.

Yes, I knew you were jerking his chain. But I do know that Susan keeps the lights off when you two make merry.

-------------

Lee, you lit up my neon heart lamp. Thanks for the sweet chuckle. Sometimes we need softness through all the barbs.

Prince Myshkin, and Hold the Relish.

Ketchup?

Only please fehhhhhhhh!

Don't you people read the core texts?

They contain ALL revelations.

Thoth-Harlan

Another news piece
There's a report on Harlan's B.U. appearance at http://www.dailyfreepress.com/news/2005/10/12/News/Writer.Shares.Career.Highlights.At.Metcalf-1018068.shtml

Ketchup on a hotdog? Spicy mustard surely, armoracia rusticana perhaps, but ketchup?

Yuck.

As a stockholder in Hedonism, Inc and believing as I do that quality of life trumps length of life, I must say that if you tell me the chocolate cake and the lobster will take a year off my life then I say, it's a bargain. Of course this does not mean that I would similiarly approve such a trade that involved cigarettes and eating McShit.

My sweetie was on duty over the weekend so I spent a couple of days curled up on the couch dipping into the Val Lewton boxed set. It had been years since I had seen any of these movies, and then in butchered prints on late night TV, so it was effin fantastic to see the quality with which the set was produced.

The commentaries are hit or miss as such things usually are. The documentary is mainly aimed at people who aren't familiar with VL's work and makes the case for his importance. That's ok but as someone who didn't need any convincing I would have preferred a group of say Mr Ellison, Richard Matheson and Neil Gaiman sitting together discussing the films.

Mr Ellison doesn't get much face time in the doc but typically gets off the best line ("the flesh mask") towards the end.

I won't spoil it for the rest of you by quoting it but, Well said, Sir!

TIM: First, I'm sorry to hear about your rain-related problems. Given the 500+ people who had to evacuate their homes in Framingham, we got off rather light, having to tear up and throw out the carpet tiles in our basement. A kick in the head, sure, but not much in the grand scheme of things. So, I hope your woes were closer to ours than the people in Framingham.

Second, when I read your post and got to the words Pearly Baker Band, I nearly fell off my chair. I must have seen six or seven of your shows in the mid 80s. And I can remember a morning spent in the SMU commuter cafe with my buddy Ken as we tried to remember the song that mentions PB (which, if I remember correctly today, is "Wharf Rat"). Now it's really starting to come together. Here's another name to jog your memory: The Other One. You wrote for that alternative paper at SMU, didn't you?

Damn, I never forget a face. I'm sure we must have met, but I can't say where or when.

Best,
Mark W.

Images and Weather Reports

"I was holding Harlan's hand as he was stuffing a ketchup-less hot dog down his gullet. (This is neither a concoction nor even an exaggeration)"

Rob, this is sooo wrong on so many, many levels.


No KETCHUP?

*sigh*
_______________________________________________

Also:
For those of you who have been reporting delugious weather in other parts of this fair nation, the LA metro area was hit by some pretty nasty and spectacular thunderstorms last evening. Used to be (before the advent of "no global warming"*) that we would have one or two of these a decade.

We were in Hollywood having dinner -- Prizzi's Piazza, for those who love garlic bread, is the best Italian jobber in these here parts, bar none -- and found the Southbound 101 towards downtown LA to be an inland sea of apocalypic proportions.

Later in the evening, as the tempest continued to temp, we discovered that two adults and two full-grown, previously-fearless 70 pound Dalmatians won't fit into a King bed, California or otherwise.

Who says there's a drought?



(*George W Bush, President of Ye Olde Red States and wannabe weatherman)

Brian, thanks for that info. My great-uncle from Lebanon learned English from reading the comics, including Little Nemo, as well as comparing his arabic/english bibles side by side. The pictures in the comics provided the clues to the words. The system worked well because he later became a well known speaker, politician, & attorney in Boston.

The Little Nemo book is just another fine example of self publication. I'm reading a self published book by George Tamura entitled Reflections, about his life in a California internment camp during WWII. It's such a raw, emotional read that is as relevant today as it was when it happened 60 years ago. He is also a brilliant artist and he was featured on the PBS show History Detectives.

The Road to Penury
Okay, people, between the Val Lewton DVD box set, the compleat _Calvin and Hobbes_ at Barnes and Noble, about the upcoming _King Kong_ DVD, many of us are probably about to spend ourselves into some form of indentured servitude.

So guess what comes along?
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/17/books/17nemo.html?8hpib

"But Peter Maresca, a comics collector, wasn't happy, he said in a recent telephone interview. Even the best preserved pages of "Little Nemo in Slumberland" were fast deteriorating. Soon no one would be able to see them the way they originally looked. Mr. Maresca wanted, he said, to publish a selection of Little Nemo comics just the way they appeared in the Sunday funnies: in the same colors, on rough matte paper that looked like newsprint, and at the same size."

I already HAVE the reprints of the complete run, as well as John Canemaker's biography of McCay... but Jesus Christ, this is _Little Nemo_, full-size, proper color, and pretty much as close to an original as I'll ever have.

Real Time...
Harlan, you were on PI numerious times and it seemed like you and Maher got along well, how come you have not been on Real Time? Have you not been asked or have you turned down offers?

Susan: Thank you! My H.E.R.C. package came as well, and I was thrilled. The Boston trip was a positive experience for all of us. We'll never forget it.

Steve Dooner

Harlan & Susan
Dealing with the deluge... I''ve written a piece on the rainy night in Boston. If all goes well I'll post it tomorrow. The power went out, the waters rose, my computer is toast. I'm wet, very wet.
Mark Walsh: Yes, I did go to SMU (1983-1986). Or, if you've ever seen the Pearly Baker Band, you may recognize me from that as well. We are in New Bedford at the Bullpen on Tuesday. Come and introduce yourself. That goes for you too Bill Gauthier.

Thanks to do-gooders like Harlan Ellison film's like Assault On Precinct 13 (1976) can no longer be made. With it's great little girl being shot through the chest while buying ice cream sequence.

not 'can', but came. apologies.

MW