Unca Harlan's Art Deco Dining Pavilion
"It is mankind's cognition and creative abilities, which enable man to have power and control over the universe"
Holy paralogism, BATMAN! NOW we're masters of the UNIVERSE???
WHAT does one DO with this equity?
"I shall show the world that I can be its master! I shall perfect a race of people! A race of atomic supermen that will conquer the WORLD!"
"HAAAAAAAAAAAAAA-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-haaaaaaaaa-ha-ha-ha-ha-haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!"
Intelligent design assumes that the universe is orderly and intelligent. It most certainly is not. It's a seething pot of randomness. A collection of accidents and raging chaos. It is an unmitigated mess. What kind of intelligence would have designed the platipus?
Even more secular (ie: not traditionally religous) proponents of Inteligent design fall into the trap of assuming we are the pinacle of evolution. Evolution is not a process of progress towards higher life forms. It's a process of adapting to change.
That's what I say to those dimwits who ask "Why are there still apes around?"
Looking around nature and saying "Wow! Look how ordered it all is!" does not constitue evidence or observation. So any theory based on that concept isn't even remotely scientific. All one has to say is "no it's not." And we're right back where we started.
Steve E.
Book Shippin'
Books arrived in great shape + within days of Susan's posting. The ...ah...Disney box threw me off course, but the return address said it all. I plan to enjoy these tomorrow along side a hot carafe of special blend. Too much activity today, if you can imagine an antique show in Northern Michigan via a 140+ mile ride up + down the coast of Lake Huron. I thank you both very much!!!
ID & shit
Tom Waits offered the following w/ the whole faith vs. philosophy vs. reason vs. blah, blah, blech...:
"Don't you know there ain't no devil, there's only god when he's drunk." Amen.
Not that I believe in the whole "I yem whot I yem" horseshit; I'm more of a observe, mearsure and repeat in a lab sorta guy. However, I've seen a couple of burning bushes (Praise Be!)
Do What Thy Wilt,
E.K.
Overheard at the Time Travel Cafeteria:
"We wanted to see what'd happen if Manson got into the Monkees instead of the Beatles. He opened a rehab clinic and day care center."
Reply to Harlan
I was pointed to your post of August 4th, requesting my contact info. I'm only too happy to oblige. My address is 11204 Crossland Drive, Austin, TX 78726, and my number is 512-336-7098.
REPLY TO HEATH FODOR
I do indeed continue to write exclusively on various OLYMPIA manual models. Sometimes on an office standard full-size, of which I have seven or eight, all in top condition, sometimes on an Olympia portable with bookface type (called Congress Pica), of which I have a dozen or so, sometimes even with a wafer-thin Olympia portable designed to be carried by war correspondents in a hot-fire zone, of which I have three or four. (I even have one that was made in pink...ostensibly for female reporters under fire. Sheeesh!)
Yr. pal, Harlan
John:
I appreciate the spiritual needs of man, and recognize God as a necessary extension of those needs. All stable cultures practice God worship. Since God has always been present in human culture, the relevance of God in human life should be recognized and respected. Whatever the greater context or sense of connection that is necessary for giving the life of mankind meaning … call it God and his Mighty Works and get on with having a satisfying life.
I fall off the religious logic train at the point where proponents of religion begin to assert that our intelligence proves higher intelligence, or that this higher intelligence can be invoked from physical principles or that it can be linked in a scientific way to the theoretical structures that science is exploring. Religion is of the heart; it exists in and for the heart, and for building and maintaining a durable sense of community that enriches our very human experience.
Intelligent Design relates to none of that.
It is not related to science, nor is it concerned with the well-being of the human heart. It is simply a tool designed by fundamental Christian institutions to help force the teaching of Christian belief systems in our public schools. It is the successor to “Creationism”, which has already been rejected from inclusion in most public school curricula. The goal is to create the illusion of uncertainty regarding the integrity of evolutionary science and thus prevent the faith of developing Christians from being affected by evolution in a way that might undermine their acceptance of the traditional Christian mythology, in which God made Man and Man is the immortal center of all creation.
Well, an institution is alive, and like an animal it will do what it has to do to survive.
Situation normal. Ave Maria, and ix ipsit carborundum.
Lee: Your comments remind me of something C.S. Lewis once said. I paraphrase but basically what he said was that if the universe were truly meaningless and senseless we would never be able to deduce such a thing. The mere fact of our, as humans, ability to reason, create, and solve problems is evidence (along with the Golden Section) of a higher intelligence. The concept of humans being created in the "image and likeness" of god does not mean god "looks" human. Only a fool, religious and atheist alike, would think that. It is mankind's cognition and creative abilities, which enable man to have power and control over the universe, that make man in god's image and likeness.
Caution: If one goes looking for an intelligent design, one will, of course, find an intelligent design. Caliban will see his own face in the mirror, afterall.
But (to steal an idea from Douglas Adams) nothing would disprove the existence of God faster than actual evidence of an intelligent design. All faith would immediately be negated by such a discovery, and God would necessarily cease to exist "in a puff of logic."
But, as an atheist, I must ask why anyone would exchange a transcendental deity for an immanent deity? For then, believers would be left with a small God who fits into this universe, with all of its cruelty and stupidity. In other words, they would make a "Pain God" of the worst sort--a god not unlike the one in which many fundamentalists believe.
Steve Dooner,
Proud Atheist
THE GOD QUESTION
It just don't matter....Intelligent Design....anthropomorphic principles...quantum mechanics....gravity vs. anti-gravity...time travel....wormholes... Relativity...it all comes down to one thing that I believe.
I believe God came in a UFO...he or she or it, found a near human animal called homo erectus...decided to manipulate the gene pool of erectus by injecting "their" genes and wah...la!
Here comes Homo Sapiens...us....the most difficult animal on this planet to understand...and to contain for any length of time before it rebels and will fight all, even themselves to be free.
Yes....if God is out there somewhere....He came in a UFO.
Erika,
Randomness is indeed at the heart of what drives reality, and as a scientist I’m sure you are aware that we have proven that by experiment. When you were taking scientist lessons, didn’t your quantum theory professor insist that that all possible random values exist simultaneously, with the act of observation influencing which quantum state resolved into “reality”? Even though that damn cat that is and isn’t in the box is just a theoretical construct, black body radiation, spectral absorption bands, quantum transistors, SQUIDS, and those weird dual light slit experiments that your evil professor forced you to solve in Quantum Mechanics 101 are all quite repeatable proofs of the theory. Light. It’s a particle. It’s a wave. It’s a wavicle. Whatever you like. Both or neither. Your choice.
Though I’m far, far away from being able to comprehend the details, my impression of superstring theory is that it extends the potential of quantum mechanics to include the simultaneous existence of all possible universes in an abstract quantum realm of all possible states. We experience the universe we are in because it is the one in which we are able to exist. This is called the “anthropomorphic principle”, which does not require a God, unless you want to cast him in the role of creator of quantum mechanics.
The problem with Intelligent Design is that it demands that the universe make sense.
But if making sense is what the universe is doing, it’s DEFINITELY not doing it for us.
This time I have to applaud a review (for Deuce Bigalow: European Gigolo) by Roger Ebert for its candor and the information it reveals.
Rob Schneider...what a third-rate dipshit.
Thank you, Susan and Harlan
Susan,
Got the book(s) today, in great shape as usual. What a nice Friday surprise. And then I saw the postage sticker...jeebers! First dinner, now this. You guys are really taking it for the fans!
-Keith
Olympia De Luxe portable typewriter
Dear Harlan,
Was wondering if you still use these typewriters. Just found one at a Church Garage sale down the sreet. I usually use a Sears manual typewriter that once belonged to my Grandmother.
The Olympia moves like Walter Payton. My Sears is more like that tumbling touchdown The Fridge made in Super Bowl '85.
Heath Fodor
>So, I'll oust myself and say that I'm a scientist <
If it's not too toward, I was wondering what your doctoral degree was in, and where and in what you do research.
Steve,
Hubbard did not invent the universe, but he may have channeled it. After all, this is the same Ron Hubbard who participated as "scribe" in the black magic rituals of rocket scientist, JPL founding member, and Aleister Crowley devotee Jack Parsons.
Ha! Just kidding all you litigious Scientologists. He never did any of that. Really, he didn't.
Really.
Frank writes;
"My other Cindy, you know, the one in Texas: did you know that Texas is now minority white? I'd say within 30 years you will see a radical hispanic President."
That's fine by me as long as he wears a wrestling mask - then I can body double for him.
I liked the rest of that post as well.
- Barney
Al Franken just said that when he was a kid, the existence of Sputnik scared the bejeezez out of him, because that meant that the Russians were beating us.
That was the line at the time; the government used Sputnik as an excuse to spend more money on the defense, as a boondoggle to corporate power. The propaganda worked--this was basically NSC-68 at work.
He also said that Sputnik made America care more about science, which is bunk. Science is one thing this country has never cared about, unless you count the science of UFOs.
We saw science in the eyes of Spock, but only as a cultural conceit. Science to us was a bunch of serious guys shooting ray guns at strange Alien beings.
Now we have ID, the science of myth in a petrie dish. The boogens under a microscope aint truth. Rattling minds in a haunted house of illogical bumps in the night do not equal the pursuit for a high purpose, but does contort the myth into our own American brand of pretzel logic.
Sure, I believe in God too, and my God understands that things have to begin using a natural process. Actually, I have always thought God was a pretty rational cat. I cannot prove it, and that is why I usually keep my religious opinions in the closet. My other kinks are out and rather obvious.
--------------
Cindy Sheehan, now there's a patriot.
----------
My other Cindy, you know, the one in Texas: did you know that Texas is now minority white? I'd say within 30 years you will see a radical hispanic President. Trust me sugarlump.
Apoloies for posting twice.
I need to clarify. I don't wholly subscribe to every idea within ID, nor do I wholly take science as the empirical perspective. My belifes are a highly debatable combination.
The very idea of the universe being created by 'chance' is amongst the most laughable bullshit I've ever heard. So, I'll oust myself and say that I'm a scientist whom is very attracted to the idea of ID. My reasons are complicated, and maybe I'll explain myself at the other forum. {shrug}
Question the world not only with science, but also with your heart. Science is but only one perspective.
Chance. Randomness. Puhleeze.
The Truth of Intelligent Design
It came to me in a flash overnight. According to the tenets of ID, life in the universe is much younger than the big bang would technically allow (let's say 10,000 years, a nice round number). It required a guiding hand which miraculously created all forms of life in an instant, out of nothing at all.
Since the name of the "theory" is Intelligent Design (without naming God) we have to find the responsible party by using logic. The Creator has to be Intelligent, with a wild imagination -- say a member of a society reputed to be technologically way ahead of their time.
The Creator would have to have some Design sense, as well as an off-beat sense of humor. And a good deal of creative energy to boot.
The Atlantians are out, for obvious reasons.
It's right in front of us: The universe, in all of its variety and wonder, was invented by L Ron Hubbard at a dinner party in the 1960s.
Like Lennon said, whatever gets you through the night is all right. If people want to believe that a creator deity put the universe together, that's their right and their choice. If they believe a particular set of commandments or a holy book with the ideals of treating one's neighbor as they'd like to be treated is the way to go, I say run do not walk.
What irks me, and raises my ire, is when people try to cram their belief structure down my throat. Myself, I believe in God and I like to think he's pulling for us, waiting for us to realize that this world is ours and the greatest gifts he gave us are common sense and self-determination, but that's me. The Catholic upbringing is hard to shake. But I keep my faith private. I don't force my beliefs on others, I keep my relationship with Yahweh/Buddha/Allah/the Way to myself. People tend to get religion mucked up and mixed with spirituality. You don't need the former to explore the latter.
Blech, enough religion already. Anybody pick up the ADAM STRANGE: PLANET HEIST trade paperback? It's good reading, and you have to love any comicbook featuring a guy with a rocketpack and a finned helmet shooting blasters and fighting alien scum. I mean c'mon, we're not talking rocket science here. It's a nice breath of Classic SF fun, making for a nice break from the Sturm und Drang DC Comics have been putting out lately. But that's a whole other kettle of bitter we really don't need to be getting into. I've still got Astro City, though this new Dark Age series is setting of my Angst-o-meter.
Okay, so it's not Proust but I know what I like. :p
Sincerely,
Stacy
Wowee
My shipment came today....I'm re-experiencing the overwhelming awe,wonder,terror of having fifty (now) years of Harlan wash over me in an instant, which eclipses even the epiphany I had when I actually started *reading* in the 35 year version that had sat on my shelf for five or seven or maybe it was ten years, and TRULY discovered what took most folks here decades....I remember reading a footnote (was it??) in my CITY ON THE EDGE OF FOREVER book, about Harlan being a runaway kid, wondered what kind of horrid parents would drive their kid to run away, opened ESSENTIAL at random and in true ancient fashion a la the conversion of Augustine or something, stumbled on the essays "My Father" and "My Mother". OK, whatever you are Harlan, you aren't their fault. ;)
Bash me for a dunce, I hadn't figured that out about what to do with the Herc Bonus book. Most kind of you to sign&date it. I recently read in a guidebook to Japan that the Japanese word "arigato" (thank you) literally means "You have put me in a difficult position," but OK, I'll find a good home for it . :))
On Intelligent Design, how about Insidious Deism? Or Insidious...something or other. It's an attempt to sneak creationism into the schools in a different...Insidious Disguise?? All right, you IDers, quit hemming and hawing and come out and say it. You mean God, don't you, guys???
Hmm, "the devil can cite Scripture for his purposes" is a quote from Shakespeare's Merchant of Venice...they're talking about Shylock! And what a great answer! lol
Kristin
to Keith Cramer
"Like if I wrote that my... offering me tubes of Preparation H"
I'm going to be laughing myself to sleep tonight. Thanks.
I though ID stood for Imbeciles and Dolts.
Yes, there are scientists who believe in ID. They're just not good scientists, as Penn & Teller might say.
Learn the truth about ID from Vic Stenger, author of "Has Science Found God?" and "Not by Design" (both excellent).
http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/cosmo.html
What's next? Believers trying to convince people that Noah put dinosaurs on the Ark? Oops, too late, they're already doing that.
intelligent design is for dum dums
Great quote from The Book, Duane. I love it, always have, and use it with such alarming frquency against the Pharisees that I've had one or another of them fire back, "The devil cites Scripture for his own purposes."
To which IIIIIIII usually respond, "I use it for my porpoises!
Who happen to be smarter than you."
I laugh inside. IIIIIII think it is funny.
Yr. pal, Harlan
It's funny that Voltaire devised the perfect answer to the philosophy of "Intelligent Design" 250 years ago, back when it was called Deism. Everytime we wish to think this is "the best
of all possible worlds," replete with an "intelligent design," we should think of the inane Dr. Pangloss and his postulations about the logic of everything in the universe.
Most absurd of all is the assumption that certain biological constructions are "irreducibly complex." Guess what? They're all "irreducibly complex" and they're all "not irreducibly complex." Saying anything is "COMPLEX" is a subjective judgment that has nothing to do with science.
To us, a star fish's eye might seem "irreducibly complex," To us, certain organelles in a cell can reek of "irreducible complexity." Yet, why stop at biology. Rock formations can be "irreducibly complex" and the flow of rivers can be "irreducibly complex." The whole bleedin' universe could seem "irreducibly complex." That doesn't mean that a some man-shaped deity made it. It just means that we, as humans, can be awed by the nature from which we came forth.
It's funny to see so many people baffled by this red herring just because an ersatz mathematician and a pseudo-scientist have put it forth. When Heisenberg could not measure atomic particles he didn't say magic bunnies control proton movements, he left it as a necessary uncertainty, and that is why he is a scientist. When mathematicians think that they can infer god just because something seems extremely complex, they have entered the realm of the ridiculous.
Steve Dooner
ID and Lost Books
... and here I thought Intelligent Design was a show on HGTV. As an evolutionist I can still respect the faith of those who believe in Creationism, but ID is a masquerading pseudoscience alongside astrology, parapsychology and the study of Atlantis -- it cheapens the value of true faith in an effort to coerce people into thinking unsubstantiated conjecture trumps scientific evidence. The Bible ain't a textbook.
...................................................
Any list of Lost and Lamented bookstores would have to include A Change of Hobbit in Santa Monica/Westwood; Richard Kyle Books here in Long Beach; and Moonstone Books in Washington, DC. (Added to Dangerous Visions, of course.)
I'm a Christian and even I think ID is crap
Intelligent Design actually contradicts the Scriptures. The Book of Isaiah states that "My ways are not your ways; my thoughts are not your thoughts." (Isa. 55: 8-9)
Intelligent Design is God's brain fart...
Intelligent Design is Evolution to chimps.
Intelligent Design Is...
Intelligent Design is just Creationism in a party dress.
Chris B.
Chuck, thanks for the love, pal.
--------------
Intelligent design? Sounds like the name of a houseware boutique in SoHo.
Creation myths have no place in a classroom. Sure, O'Reilly equates that with fascism, but truth puts the foot in the door, separating the light of reason from the dark corridor of bad ideas.
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Harlan writes friction, not fiction. friction is when the real world butts up against the land of Nod.
Harlan is our eye opener.
Keith--book on the way. Thank you.
Now don't start going on about dearly departed bookstores, you'll have me weeping about the old Oxford Bookstore in Atlanta. Sniff....sniff...
Kroch's & Brentano's
TONY RABIG:
I discovered and purchased my very first Unca Harlan book at Kroch's & Brentano's bookstore. I cannot tell you how much I still miss the flagship store on Wabash Ave. I worked (and still do) about a block away and spent many a lunch hour and a dollar there. The staff was incredibly knowledgeable and could tell you where a certain book was located without the aid of a computer database. They just plain knew and loved books. Also, the best damn art book section anywhere. Christ, I miss that store.
Amen.
Keith... Funny, are you. ;)
But seriously. I knew that almost everyone would leap onto Harlan's simple, well-said tenet; over-analyzing it, and what seems like even trying to explain what he actually meant! Sigh. Instead of building a wildfire of chatter, as is usually the case with Webderlanders, shut up already and just *hear* the man.
Respectfully said,
-Erika.
Shelving / D'Onofrio
Harlan's not alone here. You can also cite the novel GLIDE PATH, by Arthur C. Clarke, a non-sf account of World War Two, which when in print is ALWAYS shelved in science fiction. Haldeman's 1968 is also always shelved in science fiction. Writers who write in several different fields are almost always shelved in the field where they made their name, frustrating attempts at crossover success. Even Westlake, writing a comic fantasy novel a few years ago, had it shelved among his mysteries.
I've always wondered how the brilliant Dan Simmons has managed to escape that trap. His sf masterworks (HYPERION, etc), his horror novels (CARRION COMFORT, others), his private eye books (HARD CASE, etc), and his historical thriller THE CROOK FACTORY (Ernest Hemingway vs. Nazi spies in Cuba! Woo!) are not all crammed in the same section, but spread around the bookstore, where they can attract readers with wildly divergent interests, in addition to the weird ones, like me, who simply track down and read everything he writes. Either by design or good fortune, he was able to arrange a career where he could do whatever the hell he wanted and not find himself faced by publishers who said things like, I'm sorry, we don't mysteries from you, you write SCIENCE FICTION, stick to that. (As someone just getting into book-length work, now, after years of hopping around the genres at short story length, I'd like to know how he managed the arrangement -- -- if it's not just blazing, undeniable talent, in which case I'm probably screwed.)
One note on the D'Onofrio discussion: alternating episodes of LAW & ORDER: CRIMINAL INTENT had less to do with him "burning out" on the character and more to do with his body "burning out" from the punishing schedule. He made headlines twice last season, when a couple of collapses on the set sent him to the hospital. The new status quo on the show came about because people were beginning to wonder if he'd drop dead.
I would guess that HE was pegged as a "science fiction" writer a long time ago, when he was first composing paragraphs. And the publishing companies cater to the lowest common denominator when they do cover art. I mean, how else to explain my copy of "Spider Kiss" with its goofy alien holding onto a microphone? I bought it (shelved in the science fiction section back in the '80s by the way) 'cause it had the name Harlan Ellison on it and it was a by god novel. A damn fine one at that and wishing in an adolescent, geeky, selfish way for other novels by HE. Of course, I'm also wishing for a million dollars and the restraining order Scarlett Johansen has against me to be lifted, but neither is likely to happen either.
Harlan in the stacks
I think this might be a case where Harlan has harped on something that bugs him, and people are taking it way too seriously. Like if I wrote that my ass itches one day, and then for 30 years people are popping out of the woodwork asking how my ass is, and offering me tubes of Preparation H (which stands for hemorroid, by the way)..
Keith
What killed Peter Jennings?
It may have been a regular form of lung cancer (is there such a thing?) I may have been blinded by my own Ahab-like hatred for the cancer that stole a friend from my life long before he should have had to check out.
And yes, there is more than one form of lung cancer. They're all nasty and the only difference between them is level of lethality.
And Frank:
Quit the cigs, you fool.
Chuck
HE in the bookshop sf sections
When I worked at the late lamented Kroch's & Brentano's in Chicago, I made it a point to stock Harlan's works in the correct areas (Gentleman Junkie in fiction, Glass Teat in film/tv, etc.) But I also made certain that each title was also in the sf section, simply because the books seemed to sell more quickly there. As to why they wind up in sf more often than not --
Check out the covers. Delightful covers, every one, but so often they seem to shriek "Fantasy may be found here!" The Dillon and Shaw covers for the Pyramid and Ace reissues just had that look to them, and I'd guess that look would tend to get them shelved in the sf sections in a lot of book stores where the staff might not give each title a more careful examination before shelving. Once in the sf sections, the books would of course be seen by long-time HE readers, but never seen by folks who wouldn't set foot in the sf section even if they knew it would cure their cancers; outside the sf sections the covers could tend to put off those same readers.
Many moons ago I met Leo & Diane Dillon at a library convention, and we talked briefly about the Ace SF Specials line (and the Dillon covers were worth the price of the books all by themselves); Diane Dillon said they didn't do quite as well in the market as expected, and DD thought this was in part because the covers weren't even close to the traditional "sci-fi" covers, and that a number of the books had done much better when reprinted later with more conventional sf covers. Go figure.
Should HE's work be in the correct areas? You betcha. But probably better if possible to have the work in sf AS WELL AS the right shelves, for roughly the same reason a story like "All the Lies That Are My Life" appeared in F&SF when it should have been published with all possible fireworks in the New Yorker or the Paris Review. He's got a large number of readers in the sf world, and it makes sense to place the books where they'll be seen by as many likely buyers as possible.
Bests to all
--tr
Harlan Ellison and John McPhee
When I go into a bookstore looking for authors like Harlan or John (whose books can be found ANYWHERE) I first ask at the info desk. Of course that is problematic in many a used store. All I care is that they are represented.
Respectfully,
Neal
Ellison doesn't just write "science fiction," but his work appeals to the science fiction sensibility. I think that's why he's shelved there. Harlan is a bit like E.A. Poe, who if he wasn't being shelved in "literature" because of his historical standing, would also be sitting in the fantasy racks.
Kind of like Brian Eno's ambient work sitting in the rock/pop section of the record store. It's hardly rock or pop, but that's the market that buys Eno, not the classical or jazz markets, even though some of Eno's work is a lot more like composers in those genres.
My point about seeing Harlan's books in the general fiction section - whether they were fiction or not - is that he has expressed in the past how much he loathes constantly being shoved into the narrow SF category, when most of his fiction should be in the Fiction section.
Yeah, The Glass Teat books are non-fiction, but believe me when I tell you that you wouldn't want to be in the non-fiction section of this particular used bookstore I was in. The books would never be seen, or read.
Thank you, Susan. Will keeps both eyes open for its arrival.
The Amazing Vincent
It was D'Onofrio's jump from FULL METAL JACKET to THE PLAYER that made me sit up and take notice. Holy Cow, I thought -- that's the same guy? No way!
Vincent D'Orofrino
Who could forget Vincent's incredible acting as the obusive husband-turned-alien bug in the original MEN IN BLACK. That was the first time I saw him act...and everytime LAW AND ORDER: CRIMINAL INTENT comes on...I still see that ability in his acting that will make him a great character actor that could make him star in his later middle life. He is right up there with Brennan, Buchanan, Elam, and the just recently deceased
KEVIN (Doc on Little House)HAGEN, plus a myriad of others.
I wondered how long it would be until Vincent D'Onofrio got tired of being a supercop. My favorite performance of his was as an addled time traveler in Brad Anderson's HAPPY ACCIDENTS from 2000. Of course the fact that Marisa Tomei was also in it didn't hurt.
Kristin, Doug, Ray and Greg--your books on the way.
Susan
D'Onofrio
D'Onofrio
Apparently, he's a bit burned out in his current role on "Law & Order Criminal Intent," as Dick Wolfe is bringing back Chris Noth from the original L&O to do the show every other week next season. D'Onofrio, though, can really get into a character. Remember his portrayal in "Mystic Pizza" of the fisherman boyfriend/eventual husband?
Larry
Larry
D'Onofrio
When I saw D'Onofrio in FULL METAL JACKET, I thought, cool performance. Too bad we'll never see the guy again. He was too fat, too much of a specialty character.
Of course, his very next performance was as a simulacrum of the Marvel superhero, Thor.
I had known that he did not provide the voice of Orson Welles, but as far as I'm concerned he earned his permanent place in the acting pantheon with his performances as Robert E. Howard in THE WHOLE WIDE WORLD, and as a doomed subway rider on that searing episode of HOMICIDE.
(Meanwhile) Am psyched. 'Tis been a GOOD day so far...!
Welles in Ed Wood
The voice of Welles was supplied by the incomparable Maurice LaMarche, better known for his portrayal of the Brain from the cartoon Animaniacs.
---Peter
Vinnie and the Dubs
>He was the guy who played Welles in ED WOOD <
He mimed the role. The voice was dubbed by an impersonator.
Don't fret about it, though. Also dubbed by other actors were Ursula Andress and Gert Frobe, in Dr. No and Goldfinger respectively. Happens more than we know.
BTW, Disney is closing down its last hand-drawn animation unit. The end of an age.
Strain? I thought a strain was something contagious, like a virus. Lung cancer isn't contagious, is it?
Susan: after writing on the blackboard "I will not get impatient" 500X..i only want to know did my order reach you yet?? No big deal, really and I know you're great with fulfillment.
Kristin
Lung Cancer
I always thought that there is only one strain of lung cancer...but I guess if you add emphezeyma, asthma, bronchitis
and a myriad of other names into it...there are quite a few different strains to lung cancer.
Because of my politics...I was never a fan of Jennings...of all the liberal or those who say they are liberal journalist in television...he rankled my fur more than they did. I am, however sorry that he had to go in such a horrible way...I too smoked while serving in the U.S. Army....four almost five packs a day. I quit when I married my present and only wife in 1968.
The AMA just recently came out with a survey or a paper that even if you quit as long as forty or fifty years ago, you are still not out of the woods as far as lung conditions go...I can attest to that...I have had more lung problems in the last five years than I have had before. Had a lung condition this year that they still do not know what it is...almost did me in.
And ....Frank? Speaking now as a fellow human being and not as a political adversary....why don't you quit smoking? I know ...I know...it is not easy.
Having said everything I have to say about "well-intentioned misreckonins", self-appointed guardian angels where there had been no sour sentiments (nothing more than the defense of a good adage), and lemmings apparently clueless about the complexity of a topic (just compare the two different ways CS Lewis and Freud reconciled their fears of death as an example. They sought the device that would allow them to move forward, one radically different from the other. MOST of us have our fears; that's the simple REALITY I'm trying to address. Each of us, then, have to find a way to address those distinct fears, or we OSSIFY. Thus, what worked for Harlan does not quite work for me; I agree with his final argument; but it isn't quite ENOUGH for me to say, "don't be frightened", because it fails to address the reality...well, MINE and others, I don't know about YOURS)...
I was just looking at a film and had come upon one of the most camelion-like character actors I've EVER seen, Vincent D'Onofrio.
He was the guy who played Welles in ED WOOD as well as 'Pyle' in FULL METAL JACKET. That's one helluva stretch. Remarkable actor.
Okay, let's assume that a cig habit killed Peter Jennings. Here's a fun thought. Imagine if the ratings go way down. ABC loses millions in advertising revenue, bargaining leverage, and the like... so the network initiates a lawsuit against the tobacco companies, holding them liable.
I know, it won't happen. For one thing, the tobacco companies would simply hire John Stossel as a friendly witness. He's cheap and affordable.
Neal--No problem.
Chuck, you may be wrong on this one; Dan Rather and Tom Brokaw were on Larry King and they both mentioned that cigarettes were the cause of the lung cancer.
-------------
I smoke, so I look even dumber.
Alex - Saying that Harlan "cares" is a very general statement and far be it from me to say he doesn't. Like everyone he has a number of things he cares about, in the process of writing about them he makes us care about those things or people. But he also writes very effectively about things he doesn't care about, which doesn't mean the writing's less personal then. Caring is an important aspect of Harlan's work, but in my opinion it's not up there with fearlessness (and perhaps fear). That's what sets him apart.
No, Rob, Todd is right. He didn't say it 'cause he's polite, but you were being a dick.
And, yes, I'm sure Shane is a big boy and can write his own retort, but it does help sometimes when there's at least a couple of people that can agree when someone was being rude.
(By the way, Rob, be thankful not too many people actually read your post regarding fear. I guess you figured mentioning it as a stereotype made it ok to say it.)
I'd agree with HE regarding his words o' wisdom: "You must never be frightened. Not of anything. Not of the chance you'll fail, not of the consequences, not of the cost." I would add this caveat: But you damn well better know what those consequences and costs are.
That separates the knuckleheads from the thinkers.
Todd...
There. There. There. There. There. There. THERE...
Ol' Shane can handle his six-shooters all by his lonesome, n' he can recognize a well-intentioned misreckonin' when he sees one!He don't be needin' no self-promoted guardian angels...so get OVER it. He'll be alllllllllllllright.
Y'know, not everyone here is a fragile tulip.
...and Frank,
"I kinda agree with Rob, you cannot really be angry at someone who is scared"
That's not QUITE what I was getting at. You might want to read my post more carefully.
SUSAN AND RYAN
i am just getting back on my feet financially and had no idea we were talking about such an expensive edition
i can be of no help at the moment--should have kept my yap shut
i am so sorry Susan, i was trying to help Ryan and just added confusion-please don't yell at me
things are tough here (and all over, I know)
contrite be the,
Neal
Peter Jennings and cancer
The cancer that took Peter Jennings is a vicious, fast-spreading killer that had nothing to do with his smoking. The cigs probably didn't help, but this is the same cancer that took away a friend of mine -- who also smoked, but again this had nothing to do with sucking on a cancer stick -- not this cancer. It was this strain, or something like it that killed Andy Kaufman, who was a non-smoker.
It hits like a panzer division and kills fast. It's hard to treat. I already have a grudge against this swift, mindless killer. I certainly hope this doesn't mean it's becoming a more widespread strain. It used to be quite rare.
Chuck
Hugos
Hugo awards came out yesterday. Susanna Clarke won best novel for "Jonathan Strange & Mr Norrell." Charles Stross, Kelly Link, Mike Resnick, Ellen Datlow, The Incredibles and Ansible in some of the other categories. 684 ballots.
query on a quote .....
The following quote is taken from Neil Gaiman's episode of The Sandman entitled 'Soft Places' :
" Any view of things that is not strange is false ... "
[ it's on p129 of the 1993 softcover edition by the way ]
does anybody know if this is attributed to another writer, artist or the like ?
Cheers,
Dougie.
Adam, don't worry, I love you too. I know, you are still new here, for the most part, but I do love you.
------------------
I kinda agree with Rob, you cannot really be angry at someone who is scared, some people are just less brave then others.
Now, if this fact were not true, we would have a better world, but that's another story.
----------
Peter Jennings may have been part of the machine, but he did do it with grace and style.
See, what those fucking cigarettes do to you? Cancer stick bitches.
Hey, Rob, mellow with the response to Shane as if he is a fanboy who doesn't pay attention: Shane is well aware of Harlan's many comments. He is a Friend of Ellison, not a fanboy; such a friend that when Harlan visited our Valley Of The Sun two summers past, Shane's little fender bender with a local nut resulted in Harlan flying back to Phoenix on his own dime to help (alas, to no avail) Shane win his day in court.
I met Shane that day as well (not to drop names, but when the wife and I shared lunch with Mr. Ellison, Susan, Shane and Justin-of-this-board-at-times), and he's a mensch who should be talking down to you rather than the other way around.
Knowledge of Harlan Ellison and his writings/comments is not supposed to be a competition on this board, Rob, so take a deep breath and a chill pill and let the world go on in relative calm.
-TODD
Of NASCAR and Being Afraid
AJ: Question?
You once opined "Now, I absolutely despise NASCAR and Formula 1 racing with a hot and unholy passion. I hate the fact that it's put forth as a sport when it is a pastime; that its drivers are called "athletes" without needing to exhibit any real athletic ability."
Can we safely assume, then, that you also detest golf, skeet shooting, billiards, bowling, archery and baseball? Lord knows, each of them involves a fraction of the athleticism of auto racing. And may we assume you readily agree that ballroom dancing -- a very athletic event -- must now be legitimized as a sport? Just asking...
...........................................
Being afraid.
I, for one, am accepting Harlan's success quote at face value. I agree with it, for one thing, but for another I don't think he's literally saying "don't be afraid of anything" -- I have a nasty suspicion he'd feel a bit of fear were he locked in a tower with the entire onscreen staff of Fox News, f'r instance. The difference is he would face the fear and overcome it, hopefully leaving a few bodies strewn in his wake.
Short but true story: A year and a half ago I was working for a company (formerly known as WorldCom) that was draining the life out of me and virtually every other employee. We'd been through scandal, bankruptcy, the death of a much-respected interim leader, and public humiliation. Layoffs were common, meetings were conducted with a semi-threatening tone, and I was sick each morning the alarm clock went off. Ignoring the entreaties of the "alumni" of the company, I stayed out of loyalty and shear fear of walking out the door.
I was a fool of the highest caliber -- I admitted it then and I admit it now. The happiest day of that year was the day in April that I finally resigned in anger. It was too much, but my fear had kept me rooted there a good two years longer than I should have stayed.
I will never do that again. Harlan's right. You must "never be afraid to go there."
(BTW - I'm lifting that quote and may include it in a book I'm writing about my photography... In the event I'm fortunate enough to find a publisher I'll ask permission to use it.)
You must never allow the fear to dictate your life -- and you may feel it, but never, ever let it drag you down. My wife, whom I greatly respect, is a person of recognized talent and vocal skill, but she used to suffer terrible stage fright before a performance. Almost debilitating. Then she discovered how the fear was affecting her performance. She's a strong woman and confronted it, turning that fear into raw energy right before taking the stage. (Cookie can probably identify.) Since that time she's recorded several cds and won a few awards and is headed for even more.
So, I'll take the quote, Mr. Ellison. I accept it as is, and thank you for the lesson.
F1 Racing
I'll cop to not knowing much about NASCAR (oval tracks bore the hell out of me), but F1 is both nationally and racially diverse. I realize that Michael Schumacher and Kimi Raikkonen get a lot of press time, but Fernando Alonso is the points leader. Even Narain Karthikeyan gets his onscreen time, though it's usually because he fucked up a corner (of course, Jordan cars ain't great). I'm sure Takuma Sato and Juan Pablo Montoya would be amused to be tagged as white bread, too. As for athletic ability, I would LOVE to see a hobby driver handle a track that includes a bunch of 4 1/2G turns for two hours at a shot. F1 drivers have to handle some of the most high-performance vehicles in the world. They are required to have incredible stamina, reflexes, and strength.
AJ (Foyt) Berman
I love when anyone who has driven 10 miles over the speed limit thinks they can make assumptions about NASCAR. The G-forces alone after the first ten minutes would have you cryin' for your mama. Also no one has ever called a driver an athlete, unless it was that McCrumb babe. Going to a race does not make you an authority any more than going in a bookstore makes you an author. That's stupid, but it is a sport. You have to be conditioned. Sitting on your ass eating cheesedogs and swilling beer makes it a pastime. Baseball is called a pastime by some too, but I don't see too many geezers or CURVES drop-outs out there. Country music began to suck when Buck Owens hung up his guitar. Some airheads need a little deflating now and then and sometimes it takes a dead man to do it.
Oh, the things I overlook for objects of beauty
(scoff and smile) Next you'll be telling me The Wird can Overcome who tells it. Like UFO's and Winning The Lotto the world would be a better place, but not in the next two minutes.....
You know, I've been thinking.
And I've come to the personal conclusion that you're all wrong. Yes, even you, Harlan.
The secret, I think, to the success of our Esteemed Host (EH=HE?), is NOT the hard work, but rather, to what it is which DRIVES him to do that hard work, and to what it is all that work is aimed TOWARD:
Caring.
Harlan CARES. He cares deeply, intensively, about the Work and about life. And because he cares, he works his craft with that same depth and intensity. And in doing so, he makes YOU care. About his stories, his characters, and his--and our--world.
That is what makes a great writer.
(Give you an example: I just finished a novel set in and around the world of NASCAR fandom. Now, I absolutely despise NASCAR and Formula 1 racing with a hot and unholy passion. I hate the fact that it's put forth as a sport when it is a pastime; that its drivers are called "athletes" without needing to exhibit any real athletic ability. Further, I absolutely hate the fact that this pastime has been, of late, embracing the same damn-the-roots hypocrisy that is seen in another target of my ire: Country music. Both have eschewed their Southern-fried, working-class backgrounds to become glitz and gloss, going Hollywood vanilla.
[and, speaking of vanilla, both are the most racially-exclusive pastimes in this country outside of perhaps polo.]
But I dearly loved the novel I just read, despite its subject matter. Why?
Because it was written by the excellent Sharyn McCrumb, another writer who CARES. And whose tales make YOU care.
[* the book is the newly-released ST. DALE, by the way--and the redoubtable Ms. McCrumb was no NASCAR fan herself before beginning the book, seeking only to write a modern Canterbury Tales about the current-day process of beatifying secular saints like Elvis, Princes Diana, Dale Earnhardt, but in the process became a devotee, because, in trying to see why OTHER people cared so much, her own caring takes center stage in her book.])
Rob, It wasn't me,it was Jay Tea's blog at Whizbangblog.
SHANE,
"...Harlan Ellison once opined that "Everyone is not entitled to an opinion. Everyone is entitled to an informed opinion." ...
Once? ONCE?
Seems to me you've been here for sometime, yet you MUST be a newcomer.
Harlan has vocalized that argument a lot more than once. He repeats it when he's out on the road, and often in interviews, simply because it occurs to so few out there. I don't mean to take anything away from you, but if you've followed Ellison MUCH, this is hard to miss. Yeesh!
"You must be at least this interested to vote"
by Jay Tea
...Harlan Ellison once opined that "Everyone is not entitled to an opinion. Everyone is entitled to an informed opinion." ...
http://wizbangblog.com/archives/006643.php
Jan,
My list is based purely on personal observations made during the fifteen years that I spent working in the arts. I was fortunate to train with New York City Ballet, and dance for American Ballet Theatre in the late 70’s and early 80’s. This was a time when most of the great American dancers were with one of those companies, and most great choreographers created or staged works there. For years, I worked, watched or talked with artists like Balanchine, Robbins, Petit, Tudor, Baryshnikov, Villella, Makarova, Gregory, Nureyev, MacMillan, Loring, (Agnes) de Mille and many others. Though they used vastly different approaches, the qualities that I mentioned are simply things that they all had in common.
After giving many years of my very best to becoming an artist, I achieved moderate success of a craftsman-like nature, and knowledge of my limits. I found that some limits you set on yourself, others are hard and real and you discover them only by trying as hard as you can to surpass them, until you look back one day when it’s all over and see that you never did. Somehow the great artists surpass the hard limits. To them, it seems clear how they did it, but there is no way to teach someone else how.
Harlan’s point about fearlessness reminds me of another time, in a class that Baryshnikov was teaching. He was very frustrated with all of us, because what it took to do the step in question was so obvious to him. And he did the step repeatedly in chain, to an extent that was pretty much impossible even for a top principal, and he talked to us the whole time. While he was doing it. Saying, “You see, I know my center. I am right here. I know where I am. You cannot knock me off.”
Baryshnikov was saying the same thing that Harlan just said.
Or Stanley Williams, without a doubt one of the greatest ballet instructors of the last generation, saying, “I think before I go. But then, it’s time. And I just go.”
Williams was saying the same thing that Harlan just said.
Or Robbins, really wanting to use me in his ballet ‘Opus Jazz’. Looking on in frustration as I struggled with the movement style and saying, “Don’t you hear the drums? The movement will happen when you hear the drums.”
Robbins was saying the same thing that Harlan just said. And I didn’t get the part.
I finally settled on being happy that there are great artists, and never mind how they got that way.
Dear Neal and Ryan:
Please, please, in the name of THE OLD ONES, please work this out and tell who needs what.
Yours in confusion--Susan
David, interesting essay about discipline. What’s lacking, though, is any mention of passion.
Lee’s list - and we don’t know where he got it - mentions inhibition, which I suppose is another word for fear. After Harlan said that the secret is to be unafraid, Rob seemed to argue that fear can be both helpful and bad.
Fear is, of course, an inhibitory force, which is why your life turns awry when you let fear make the decisions for you. You end up never leaving your comfort zone. A writer’s life in many ways needs to be an explorer’s and risktaker’s life, otherwise the well will run dry and the artistic potential is never fully explored, either. However, when writing one presumably needs to be in touch with one’s fears, and Harlan has shown us through his writing that he has plenty, most of all perhaps fear of death, loss and destruction.
If we are to draw any use out of defying fear, the whole package of our personality needs to be there, because fearlessness and courage cannot be our main motivations. We cannot be machos, we need to know what to be fearless about, that is, like Rob said, we need convictions and worthy goals.
Dear Susan...
Since the subject of Harlan's fearlessness has been broached, speaking from your own privileged vantage point, is Harlan afraid of anything?
Does he have an irrational fear of sock puppets? Or double-A batteries? Perhaps he gets the shakes whenever he sees a wild monkey?
up too late, hope my ramble is worth a chuckle
When Ellison writes, I listen.
Hiya, Harlan. I visit this board because I often enjoy reading the essays you've written more than your fiction. Galvanizing, ennervating and irresistable, they are a powerful tonic.
But everyone here knows that and you scarcely need the reassurance, so I wonder why on earth I felt it needed to be written. A need to feel like I'm hobnobbing with my betters? Making noise to be noticed? Rubbing shoulders in hopes something will rub off on me? (and then there are the even more obnoxiously self-centered questiosn: is doubt fear? a lack of self-confidence the same thing as a lack of courage? hm hm hm... i'm all questions, all conversational thumbs, tonight. I'm up past my bedtime.)
Off to feed a hedgehog, ponder a narcissistic nexus of fear/doubt/hero-worship, and then fall asleep. Hopefully in that order.
Harlan,
What you wrote made me cry. That's it and I won't forget it.
Cindy
The Secret
Harlan, that fearlessness is a big part of what makes you such hot stuff. It definitely sets you apart from the herd.
(Rowr!)
Harlan:
"You must never be frightened. Not of anything. Not of the chance you'll fail, not of the consequences, not of the cost. You must never be afraid to go there."
Respectfully, I would like to tweek that just a tad.
It is only natural for human beings to be frightened, to feel those sharp blades of trepidation; I don't think we're capable of completely ELUDING fear. I don't think it's possible (depending on the baggage). It's COPING with those fears; DOING the thing regardless of that trepidation; confronting the ghosts and FOLLOWING THROUGH in SPITE of them. THAT'S what really defines COURAGE. (Having the ability to formulate back-up plans when imagining possible consequences, of course, is a good reserve for confidence; a good weapon in coping)
We each obviously live in our personal domains; the heritage of our individual pasts: what means nothing to you may be a Daliesque NIGHTMARE to me. Yet, knowing what I want in life, could I really live with myself if I folded and refused to confront that nightmare? Our reluctance to acknowledge and examine our fears is the simple reason many people fail to be what they COULD be.
Some fears, of course, SERVE to override other fears. My fear of what could happen if I don't achieve a long-run goal might be greater than that of the immediate consequences. Thus, that fear in itself could be a strength.
I guess my reaction to the thesis is a strong one, because it is so pertinent in MY life. (My mother was a weak person; and that can leave some nasty barnacles on a kid growing up alone around that)
Lemme tell you a quick story here: I KNOW someone - a neighbor - who'd shown great potential and promise as a kid, but has turned himself into a social handicap. While growing up he was an ace in school. NOW, although he continues to appreciate art, politics, science, etc, he no longer reads (except for the Jewish newspapers) where ONCE he read voraciously. He has vast talent as a poet, yet makes no effort to expand his writing skills OR his understanding of poetry. He's allowed all his potential to disintegrate.
Between great negligence from his parents and years of his own laziness, he refuses to TRY anything that might lead him to some type of career. He FRACTURES the stereotype of the "hard-working" Jew! He has rarely worked in his life. He is in his late 30's. He is essentially living a Cliff Claven-like existence under his mommie's wing (she owns an apartment building, so he gets a free apartment of his own). He receives a certain amount of money each month from his family (for doing nothing); anytime they try to urge him into some type of work, he refuses. He hasn't a single bankable skill. He WON'T go back to school (in the 80's he went to school in Europe for 2 years). He goes about day-to-day socializing (rather like a house wife) on the phone or on the streets. And he has no comprehension of the discipline of a schedule (Fuck! He used to call me as late as 2am, even when I'd have to work the next day). Now his brain is mush: he can't focus (to the point where, now, he tends to crash his father's car into pylons or other vehicles; he nearly ran ME down once at street corner, and I was ready to beat the shit oughtta him!); he argues irrationally, putting up insurmountable barriers; he fires political diatribes without checking facts; and his manners, though he is often well-meaning, are horrendous.
And he attributes his inability to resolve these problems - these emotional blocks - to his fears. He succumbs to them completely. But that's because he can AFFORD to; EVERYTHING is given to him (he isn't wealthy, though; neither his mom nor his dad nor HE has much cash. Their apartment building is their key resource). Let there be no mistake here, he isn't happy (though he claims to be enjoying life by getting out to talk with people); there is no woman in his life, and now-and-then he is distraught about what he should DO about all this.
Yet, since he FEARS fucking up, and he knows he is likely to do this in any undertaking, he chooses to avoid the effort completely.
I've confronted him about this for years. He resists all suggestions because, he asserts, he has no confidence.
I get angry when he dumps this on me.
"You think I'M not afraid?", I keep telling him. "I've lacked confidence since I can remember. I'm afraid of a lot of things. But I confront those fears by seeking solutions to cope with each one. Then I move on". I have goals I want to achieve. Coping mechanisms are stronger when you have goals in your life; you take more risks regardless of the consequences.
Since SURVIVAL in the material world is not a priority for him as long as he lives in that place for free, it's easier for him to NOT do things than to TRY and do them (Homer Simpson philosophy!). So, he allows his fears to dominate his choices. The results are quite pathetic.
"A MAN EITHER LIVES LIFE AS IT HAPPENS...MEETS IT HEAD ON AND LICKS IT. OR HE TURNS HIS BACK ON IT AND BEGINS TO WITHER AWAY"
- Dr. Boyce talking to Captain Christopher Pike in Star Trek's THE CAGE.
SUSAN AND NEAL:
Okay, I'm confused.
I had initially inquired about the 35-year Essential Ellison (with the pale melon DJ, not the burgandy 50-year DJ). Neal jumped in, offered to send me the DJ if he purchased the final copy, and all appeared fine (if odd).
Now I've seen the price for the limited edition 50-year quoted to Neal and I am, as stated, confused.
Is the final copy of the 35-year EE headed to Neal? Or should I be writing the check for it as was the original intent?
Me poor befuddled brain...
--
Ryan
Neal:
If you still want THE ESSENTIAL ELLISON.
The cost is:
Outside of California $153.00.
CA Resident $165.38.
Send to: THE KILIMANJARO CORPORATION, P.O. Box 55548, Sherman Oaks, CA 91413.
Thank you.
Susan, just letting you know I got the package in the mail. Thanking you a Trillion for your kindness. Glad you guys got the Asimov Wolfe Ellison tape. Oh frabjous day!
best ever,
MF Korn
www.geocities.com/rachmaninoff_70815/
Ya know, I was writing something, and it as good. So good. More delicious than food, it was so good. The, I accidentally selected the back button on my browser; my poorly coordinated brain tonight guided my fingers to click the wrong icon.
I hate it when I lose something so well; so satisfyng and something that I'm proud of. And I don't often feel so pleased as I did tonight, with my writing. So, it's like a knife to the gut. I want to mentally berate myself, such as saying that I have a poorly coordinated brain.
Fuck.
Fuckfuckfuck.
I am going to try again, but it was... so good. How can I re-write at the same level now? Sigh... Maybe I need to give my brain time before a new attempt. Now I'm all so melancholy...
the missing element
ELLISON:
leave a strong moral sense out of the equation and you are like the sound of a deflating balloon.
a lot of noisy nothing.
Harlan Ellison is a moral writer. That more than anything else, in my estimation.
pfft,
Neal
The Secret Revealed
HARLAN: That's the secret all right: but it's not just the secret to success in writing. It's the secret of how to approach everything in life: work, love, friendships, hardships, everydamnthing. And I've been suprised (and a bit dismayed) to find that so many people don't live that way (as the comments below prove -- no offense, Jeff).
--DTS
Let's just say you're a guy who absofuckinglutely KNOWS he's gonna make it Big Time in a field of creative endeavor, specifically Writing, and let's just say this guy is afraid of finding someone in his kitchen one night holding a shoebox with wires coming out of it and calling it a bomb(Stephen King's wife) or of having your ornate, wooden front door splattered with eggs (Harlan Ellison). Is the fame worth the art?
Why not create and have some other schlep be the personality? Did this crazy kind of shit happen in the 50's in this American culture? Why can't artists be allowed to create and then be left-the-fuck-alone by those who pay for their creations?
Anybody who's in the business of writing, movies, music, etc. has got to be bug-fuck stupidcrazy, Herculean-brave or both.
Kudos to Harlan for doing all this and more.
He's one of my few remaining heros.
But I still get scared sometimes...
THE SECRET REVEALED
Only now do I know what it is, looking back.
It is this:
You must never be frightened. Not of anything. Not of the chance you'll fail, not of the consequences, not of the cost.
You must never be afraid to go there.
Harlan Ellison, 5 August 2005, 6:00 PM, Los Angeles, California
The secret to Harlan's success is the same as for any great artist:
1) Inhibition
2) Talent
3) Craft
4) Ambition
5) Market awareness
6) Stamina
7) Longevity
Chris Roberson
Harlan, there is a hit for "Chris Roberson" at www.switchboard.com. Enter the name in the "find a person" section, enter Austin and TX and an address/phone is displayed. Dunno if it's the same guy, but probably. I didn't want to put the info here, if that's OK.
This was just posted at the Asimov's magazine forum:
http://www.worldscreen.com/newscurrent.php?filename=idt715.htm
"Masters of Sci-Fi will one-hour films based on works from some of the greatest writers of science fiction, including H.G. Wells, Isaac Asimov and Ray Bradbury. Initial works chosen include Bradbury’s Dark They Were, And Golden-Eyed, Harlan Ellison’s 'Repent, Harlequin!' Said The Ticktockman and Wells’ The Crystal Egg."
Forgiveness, if this was already posted.
Mr. Sassone, I'm not sure how happy he'll be to know that THE GLASS TEAT and THE OTHER GLASS TEAT, two volumes of TV criticism, NON-FICTION, were to be found in the "General Fiction" section.
Book Bonanza
Hey gang,
I haven't commented on this board in...who the hell knows how long. I've been lurking and rummaging around for a bit lately, but I thought I'd tell you of a treasure trove I recently found.
There's a new used book store that opened not far from me. Well, it's "new to me." Been around for a few years, but it was so small and local-themed that I never went in there. But while walking home I decided to give it a shot. Am I ever glad I did, because here's what I found, all in great condition and pretty damn cheap:
The Glass Teat (both volumes)
Hardover of Slippage
Paingod paperback
Dangerous Visions
I snapped them up. Now, the fact that I have all of them *already* didn't make a difference.
And Harlan, you'll be happy to know that all of these were found in the general fiction section, and not off in the sci-fi corner.
Praying for cooler temps,
Bob
Peter,
Aplogies in my delyed reply; frequent heat-induced power outages. =/ Your post was very helpful, too! :) Thank you. I actually do have a few more questions, so I'll get an e-mail to you soon.
The not-so-sweet smell of the "secret" to success...
Harlan's success is not any sort of "secret".
First of all, the fact of his success is not now, or ever will be, an issue. In his lifetime he has won many awards, sold many books (despite whatever bizarre standard of sales numbers Frank Church uses...Harlan's printed pages have certainly pulped entire forests, to the point that ANY savvy participant in the publishing trade would readily recognize his sales record as an unqualified MAJOR success), motivated many other writers, been analyzed and scrutinized by many critics, effected mass media, had stories anthologized over and over and over again, etc. And most importantly, certainly within my own little world, whether for good or for bad, Harlan's life and work has caused MANY of us to see things differently, question things more effectively, yearn more sincerely, and generally to get off our collective asses and THINK.
Now I'm aware of Harlan's discomfiture in the face of open praise, but damn it all, that's SUCCESS by any standard, and I don't care how much it makes the man squirm and shuffle his feet to hear it! Harlan, I love you enough to admit that I haven't always agreed with you, that I wouldn't hesitate to go toe to toe with you if I thought my view of reality was better informed than yours. However, I never doubted that things MATTER to you, seriously, passionately, and always with good reason, and I know all about whatever feet of clay you might have that makes you as merely mortal as the rest of us, but I'll gladly break bread with you any day, and that's the most sincere compliment I can pay any person. Take it or leave it, my door is always open to you…
As for that "secret" to success…you can have all the talent in the world, all the good breaks, all the great ideas, but none of it means a damn thing if you don't have DISCIPLINE. That's not a secret, ANY successful writer will tell you it all begins and ends with discipline. Writing requires the discipline to make the time, the discipline to use the time, the discipline to finish, the discipline to submit, the discipline to immediately start over again, but that's still not enough. You also have to have the discipline to walk away from your friends when work calls, to lock yourself in your room when the mission requires it, to tell your lover or spouse that you don't have time for them, to skip meals, pee in a can, live in your bathrobe, to shut yourself off from the rest of the world and DO IT!
Minimal talent, usually acquired through regular practice, is good enough. Fairly decent ideas, usually acquired through osmosis and reading, are good enough. Neither good luck nor bad luck, both avoided through basic research and a regular submission routine (buy that Writer's Market!), is part of the formula. But without discipline, you ain't gonna do any of this anyways, so don't be foolin' yo-self!!
I moderated two highly successful writing workshops here in San Francisco in the late 1980's and through the 1990's (the Marina Writers Workshop and Write Now), and we saw an amazing 50% rate of all the participants going on to actually publish. Not freebie works or for contributor's copies, but real paying mass market sales to major periodicals. The topic of the "secret" to success came up often, and the debate raged between the ones that had already succeeded (science fiction author Mary Caraker and romance writer Beverly Sommers among them) insisting that it was discipline and the neophytes countering that it must be, well, something else. However, without exception, every single one of the folks who finally published for the first time came back to the group or me and admitted that it was finding the DISCIPLINE that got them through it.
Does it seem all too simple and easy to you? Oh, it's definitely simple, but it is NEVER easy! This is where it gets ugly, and this is where the sweet smell of success turns foul and unappealing. Writing is a lonely life, a solitary existence, that can't be shared and is ALWAYS misunderstood by the general public. But it is also a remarkable conceit. For the truly disciplined writer NOTHING is more important or sacred than the time to write, and the very discipline that breeds success for the writer also breeds contempt and loathing in the people in the writer's life who do not drink from the same fountain of manic motivation. Lovers leave, friends disappear, gardens go untended, neighbors sneer suspiciously, and life is never quite, well, normal for a writer. Many writers have spoken about it, how the discipline wore them down, isolated them in such a way that they finally desperately abandoned their work and went screaming back into the real world. Even a few of the newly published writers in my workshops admitted that they couldn't stand the stress of that level of discipline and wanted to give up!
Okay, perhaps I exaggerate, perhaps I take hyperbole and stretch it as thin as I can, but not TOO far, folks, not too darn far from the honest-to-gosh truth.
Ask Harlan and I'm certain he will concur. A soup sandwich isn't all that crazy for an author anxious to get back to his work.
Talent, great ideas, and eye-opening ideologies may mean the difference between truly superlative, life effecting writing (obviously insert Harlan's name in this category), hack piece work for pennies a word, and everything in between, but ANY level of regular writing success requires discipline bordering on obsession. There are no "secrets" to the process, just darn hard work, all alone, over and over and over again.
One last note, if I had to ponder the special nature of Harlan's singular success, I'd point out his honesty, his searing, unrelenting, unblinking, unyielding honesty. A great author probably has as many readers who hate him as love him, such is the nature of the successful effect of the writing, and the power of Harlan's convictions and honesty is certainly no small part of his particularly potent success.
Watch your Syntax, Frank
Frank wrote --
"Harlan has always been an outsider, and that is what attracts him to me."
You got it backwards. His outsider status may attract you to HIM, but there's no particular evidence of any overwhelming attraction going the other way...!
Clarification
Before anyone suggests it, I'm not accusing Frank of being a troll, it's a metaphor...
(apologies for the double post, but insults, not intended, should be headed off at the pass with this board.)
Ellison's Success
I disagree with Frank's post (big shock). And not that Ellison's relative success warrants defense, but once again I must point out the obvious (and will likely be accused of annoying the troll...)
Howsomever:
Ellison IS considered to be a success otherwise a) the website marked EllisonWonderland would be a one man masturbatory exercise; b) he would be living in a small rundown shack in Des Moines; c) Susan would be single (or married to another lucky schmuck) and -- most significantly for the people who're reading this -- d) there would be an empty shelf on a lot of bookcases and a lot less money in corporate pockets.
Those companies what published his works, printed his articles/stories, shot his scripts and listened to his commentary would never have fronted the cash/moola/greenbacks if he was not, in what we view as contemporary society, successful at making them even more cash/moola/greenbacks.
Is he a brand-name like Stephen King, Tom Clancy or Dean Koontz? No -- but artistically speaking: could he be? I defy Clancy to write something as profound as Jeffty. Koontz, good as some of his stuff may be, would be pressed to write "Demon With...". King, Koontz and Clancy are all good writers (my personal issues with Clancy notwithstanding), but success is not defined solely by the numbers of books bought. That's a very narrow definition, and doesn't even hold up very well in the current discussion.
Ellison's sold and seen and writ a lot, the vast majority of which made somebody's shareholders money -- which makes him far more successful than the vast majority of writers anywhere.
In our society, Harlan would not be considered successful. This is a country that counts everything based on book sales, not on the sheer talent of an author.
Harlan has always been an outsider, and that is what attracts him to me.
A note on "A Boy and His Dog" on the Sun-Sentinel website
Miami photography exhibit gives paws to dog lovers
By Oline H. Cogdill
Staff Writer, Sun-Sentinel
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/features/booksmags/sfl-dogbrief1aug04,0,4478681.story?coll=sfla-features-books
. . .A Boy and His Dog with Don Johnson and Jason Robards will be shown 8:30 p.m. Saturday. If you have never seen this sci-fi movie, don't expect a heart-warming tale a la Lassie or Old Yeller. Instead, the 1975 film based on the classic novella by Harlan Ellison deals with a post-apocalyptic America, an underground society, sex and, well, food. . .
SUSAN-
You can pass the hold on the 35-year Essential Ellison to Neal. We'll see how this works itself out.
Thanks.
--
Ryan
Foolscap readings
** David **
Man, I don't want to be disrespectful to con activities - after all, in the last 25 years I've done everything from acting as tapster at an S.C.A. meeting to filksinging and was once even a walk-on Darth Vader [costume provided] for a large convention musical - because I was the tallest guy they could talk into it if you must know - But a 24 hour Ellison reading sounds like a kind of thankless task. Especially the 2AM - 8AM shifts and whoever catches hour 23. Then there are the problems of who reads what. There aren't that many Ellison pieces that clock in around an hour so you'll have lots of people doing 20 minutes and vacating or reading stories that have already been read.
There is a sick part of my soul that 10 years ago would have gotten up at 3AM to do a dramatic reading of THE VENGEANCE OF GALAXY 5 or DOOMSMAN just to say I did it - provided there was at least ONE other person in the room - but those days are gone.
- Barney
Everyone KNOWS them Greek sisters actually come from Schenectady, NY!
BTW, we're all learning about ESP, and Fred and Ethel Mertz on the other board in case anyone here is interested in the higher things. If you're on crack you'll stand a better chance of following it all.
Harlan's Success
Some say he was an adventure aviator who crashed in the Orient and learned how to spellbind people with words alone.
Others say he attended Esther Braithwaite's Finsihing School for Fabulous Writers in Pekin, North Dakota.
I once heard that his talent came from singing the blues with Blind Harlowe Allison back when he was still riding the rails.
But the best guess I've heard is that he frequents the slopes of Mt. Parnassus and flirts there with several Greek sisters who give him all his ideas.
Steve Dooner
Barney,thanks for the correction. I'm looking forward to meeting you and other webderlanders at FOOLSCAP next month. The convention is in Bellevue an eastside suburb of Seattle. Not much to do there other than a great place for hot-dogs. Plenty to do in Seattle. The EMP/Sci-Fi is worth a visit.
One of the things happening at FOOLSCAP will be a Harlan Ellison Read-a-Thon--24 fans who would read 1 hour each of a Harlan novella, ending with Harlan doing the last hour. I voluntered for this...
David
Disney's chronicles of "Narnia" is complete redolent garbage and filth, child actors gone bad on E! entertainment tv (a Disney company) is more enriching. Another bloodless cold product off the assembly line of Homosexual corporate executive Michael Eisner. Now running an underage sweat shop in "Narnia".
Harlan's Success?
Being bugfuck is a way of life,man! And, he knows the answer to the question that Willy Loman asked but never learned.
Mark W.
The secret(s) of Harlan's success?
a) HE is absolutely passionate about what he does.
b) HE knows that he's only going to live once.
c) Susan
Lots of sub-reasons related to all those, but dems de utmost, IMHO.
Chris Roberson
Harlan, I don't have his number, but his website/blog (http://www.chrisroberson.net/ramble.html) states that he's not going to be around to take your call for awhile:
"Tuesday, August 02, 2005
WorldCon Bound
Well, in another two hours Allison and I are off to the airport, and somewhere around twelve hours after take-off we'll be wheels down in Glasgow (with a brief stop-over in Chicago). Six nights in Glasgow and then three in London, and then we'll be back again the end of next week. I look forward to seeing lots of folks I haven't seen since WorldCon last year, and meeting as many new folks as possible. Oh, and drinking. Naturally.
I'll hopefully have some news to report on my return. If not, at least a few amusing stories."
Sorry, -TODD
How did I do that?
Looks about bewilderedly.
Shrugs.
Beetles brow.
Turns, squirms back into cocoon.
Has unsettling, repetitive, dreams.
I am trying to find the writer CHRIS ROBERSON.
Last contact information had him at 8017 Scotland Yard, in Austin, Texas. The working phone number has been disconnected.
Any contact info y'all can pass back to me, will be appreciated.
This is not an emergency, nor even particularly urgent; but your assistance--if not too taxing--would be salutary.
Yr. pal, Harlan
I am trying to find the writer CHRIS ROBERSON.
Last contact information had him at 8017 Scotland Yard, in Austin, Texas. The working phone number has been disconnected.
Any contact info y'all can pass back to me, will be appreciated.
This is not an emergency, nor even particularly urgent; but your assistance--if not too taxing--would be salutary.
Yr. pal, Harlan
SUSAN
Dear Susan,
Please hold that copy of TEH ESSENTIAL ELLISON for me. Also please indulge me with the dollar total.
I will mail; the dj to Ryan. This should simplify things at your end.
Payday is next Tuesday. Money in mail Tuesday or Wednesday.
Goodgood?
Respectfully,
Neal
Jan:
Talent and hard work. Chance favors the prepared etc.
That said, millions of people have the Tony Robbins / Zig Ziglar success bromides tattooed on their brains. What seperates the truly successful from the rest is Deciding on a course of action, and then Taking action. It's the second one that is the hardest. It also helps to know Exactly What You Want.
What's Harlan's secret?
I wonder if any of you have an opinion on what Harlan's success is based on, that is both his success as a writer and as a person. Maybe we could discuss this? There must be certain ingedients in his stories that we respond to, and certain factors in his personality that made him a success.
I've been trying to figure this out for a long time. I once asked him about discipline here and got no reply, but obviously hard work would be one factor, although more passion than discipline may be behind it. Something we respond to in his work, particularly in his essays, would be the claim or promise of his work in general to reveal some truth, to enlighten. I think this ties into what I feel his most important character trait might be, which would be fearlessness. That translates into honesty which then translates into truth and profoundness. Fearlessness in Harlan's case may have been caused by the fact that the worst things already happened to him during his childhood. It is also often caused by strong emotions. Which lead us back to passion, and Harlan's works are nothing if not passionate. Acutally, if we go back to ultimate causes, sensitivity and a sense of justice would probably be his most important traits and they are both roots of passion. I'm curious about your opinions.
Jan
Heya Stan, just a quick word of support from another fella down in the trenches. Best of luck with the submissions!
Rejection Slip
Well everybody, I just got my upteenth or downteenth rejection notices on a story I sent to ABSOLUTE MAGNITUDE. Oh well...at least there form letter had a checklist...of course...the first one was ISN'T RIGHT FOR OUR PUBLICATION. But the next check off was NICELY WRITTEN. Maybe there's some hope for me to get published yet!
la poesy
Looks like it's time to trot out my favorite quotation from Don Marquis (best known for _Archy and Mehitabel_), who once wrote:
"Publishing a book of poetry in America is like dropping a rose petal off the rim of the Grand Canyon and listening for the echo."
Hey, I want nothing whatsoever to do with that PC person. It was pretty ugly, and unlike myself, anything but clever.
----------
Now I gotta rot my brain reading all the false diatribes about how NSC -68 aint so bad. Grrr.
Thanks Rich!
You're right, it was Stalking the Nightmare.
After a little googling I remembered that funky cover art by Jane Mackenzie.
I'll have to check that out again.
Used copies of FASTER THAN LIGHT, edited by Jack Dann & George Zebrowski, can be found - reasonably priced - at bookfinder.com. Harlan's honey of a teleplay is accompanied by lovely Tim Kirk illustrations.
Question for HE ... the sort of thing that never occurs to me to ask you whenever I see you and Susan:
Did you ever meet Dennis Potter?
I Have No Mouth...
Harlan:
Thank you! :-) I still have to get the selection approved to teach, but that's in process now. Hopefully (with every possible finger crossed) they'll approve it, and I can work on getting the copies I need.
Will let you know either way.
Duane:
Thanks for your input as well. I can't remember when I've had such a warm welcome anywhere.
Keiti
*** David R. *** No, that's the teleplay for CITY ON THE EDGE OF FOREVER you're thinking of. Still, a nice, and fairly rare anthology. FYI, Doug Lane did a nice job fielding this over on the other board.
Since I'm here - I take it that barring the unforseen that FOOLSCAP is a go? I should be booking a flight, etc? Are they any other guests besides Harlan and Gabe&Tycho? How is the dealers room? Should I be bringing an empty bag? Does the banquet do an award? Should Doug and Tim and I organize a "Talking in front of Harlan's back" panel? Is the SF museum worth the visit? Should I tack on a day just for that? Where's my propellor beanie?
And just how did that fannish icon/chapeau thing get started, anyway?
- Barney
Puzzled in Pa.
Didn't the script for THE STARLOST also appear in 6 Science Fiction Plays (I think that was the title)??
David
Outer Limits/Hunger DVDs
HARLAN: That Outer Limits DVD (with the Human Operators) as well as the Hunger episodes (Helene Bournow and Footsteps) are also available on DVD at Amazon.com
Yours in more goofy information,
the Man
Erika and Poetry
Erika (and again, others who are interested):
Beyond the normal Writer's Market, there is also a Poet's Market, which focuses on poetry and includes both the big guys and the tiny journals. I really don't think it's worth investing in unless you are a diehard poet looking to bombard journals with your verse. If you're simply looking to place a poem, then I would suggest going to the library, checking out the Poet's Market, and then after selecting a few journals whose guidelines fit what you're looking for, seeing if the library, or any of the local university ones, carry them and reading a few copies. Make sure they want the kind of poetry you write.
Then when you send, it's best to send between three to five poems to a market at once. This is pretty much SOP. Poems are usually short enough that editors prefer simultaneous submissions.
David Silver is right. Poetry makes money for no one. But it is a worthwhile pursuit. I would suggest sending to university based journals. I've gotten good responses from Mid American Review. Unfortunately The Formalist folded last Fall. I would have loved to have gotten into that one.
Email me if you have other questions. I've been at this a while.
---Peter
David Silver: Thank you! I'm too poor to buy it right now, but I'll look for it in our local library. Most helpful reply; thank you so much! :)
HE, I mentioned about the dvd for the Human Operators a couple days ago. It is still available. Last time I saw it was at Best Buy for $9.99, which contains, if remembering correctly, six episodes.
Re: Outer Limits new series for Harlan (& sorry about 2d post)
Harlan,
Amazon lists title as:
The Outer Limits (The New Series) - Sex & Science Fiction (1995)
All the best,
--tr
REPLY TO ROB
No, I think you're misremembering, kiddo.
As far as my wee weary brain can recollect (and if I'm wrong, Barney or Tim or Michael Zuzel or one of the other well-informed denizens will correct me), the script for THE STARLOST has only appeared in print in the FASTER THAN LIGHT anthology.
There is, of course, the novelization Ed Bryant did, using my script; and one day soon enough there will be a dual-edition of novel&screenplay in a gorgeous edition with a James Gurney wraparound that is a stunner, plus all the ancillary background material...but at the moment, unless I'm wrong, it is available only in the FTL antho, and we don't have any extras to offer.
Yr. pal, Harlan
--------------------------------------------------------------
Speaking of "am I crazy, or do I remember..."
Didn't someone drop a mention not too long ago about a DVD of "The NEW Outer Limits" show, the season that included my and van Vogt's "The Human Operators" under some sort of whacky umbrella-title, something like SEX AND OUTER SPACE SCI-FI FOR ADULTS...or somesuch????? If I've taken leave, let me know; if I'm remembering correctly, can someone(s) put me on to the correct title and whereat I'm can be porchessing semm? Tenks yew fuhr helbingk a newcumber to yawr shorz.
Yr. pal, Huhrlanovich Drushenko Ellisonovski
Fictionwise
Harlan,
Glad to hear that Fictionwise works well for you; believe me, it's every bit as delightful for the customers (well, this customer, at least).
Any chance you'll be making more stories available through Fictionwise? I for one will purchase every story (and essay, and script, and grocery list, and...) that I find listed for you there.
And if the rest of you haven't checked out Fictionwise yet, you really should. Plenty of nice fiction there by Knight, Wilhelm, Malzberg, Silverberg (LOTS of Silverberg, by the way), Leiber, and others. Audio too. Reasonably priced and the ebooks can be read on your desktop pc as well as on handhelds. If you've been thinking about trying ebooks, this is the place to start.
Bests,
--tr
Taking it to the source.
Sorry, HARLAN, but if I could take just 10 seconds of your time - no more than that, I promise you - I need to get my head straight on some facts; muh brain's amuddle:
I know PHOENIX W/O ASHES is in FASTER THAN LIGHT.
BUT, before Dangerous Visions bookstore closed, I spotted an anthology (a thick hard-cover rather resembling EDGEWORKS) that included what seemed to be the original pilot SCRIPT for STARLOST (what would have been, had they not meddled and botched the thing so horrendously). Is this at all accurate? If so, WHICH anthology was that? And would Susan happen to have a copy I could purchase from you? (Otherwise, I'll turn to Fictionwise.com - or - Amazon as you encouraged Keiti to do)
If I deluded myself, if the only printed version of that pilot IS PHOENIX, I'll just order FASTER THAN LIGHT.
I'll appreciate any brief word you might offer. Just place the incision RIGHT there!
Thank you.
Thanks for the pointer Robert. That was really hilarious. (I once had a Korean car radio with an instruction manual that said things like "Re-memory the desired station into the button using the manual memory methode(sic)"
Susan: the note with my order says I don't need another I,Robot; you can save it for somebody else - but thanks for the verry generious offer! you can substitute anything equal or lesser value if you insist (except City on the Edge of Forever, I already have that too) but my main reason for posting is to say thanks!
Kristin
Query...Does anyone know if "The Deadly Streets" was released by Severn House? I saw that "Children of the Streets" was released. Amazon has TDS listed as a special order. Thanks for any information.
Why "Star Wars" is better in China
is the actual subject, which was cropped for some reason - hence the double post.
Why
http://americaninlebanon.blogspot.com/2005/07/backstroke-of-west.html
Thanks, Susan
SUSAN: Got the new issue -- and "hi" yerself, ya Lovely Limey. Say hello to the Kosher-Pizza Eater who lives with ya. Love and kisses, and it's back to work for me.
I remain (in the spirit of Lenny Bruce, who knew how to diffuse a word),
The Hun Bastard (AKA,DTS)
Citrus,
STALKING THE NIGHTMARE was the name of the book. The essay you're talking about appeared in the "The 3 Most Important Things in Life". (And to make it even more complete, they are sex, violence, and labor relations.)
My good deed for the day. I'm all tapped out now.
I remember reading a story that Mr. Ellison wrote about "fear"
It took place in a dark movie theatre and some guy comes in mad as heck and throws another guy out of the balcony possibly killing him.
I guess it was pretty disturbing to me because I still remember it from years ago.
Was it really true?
I'd like to read it again if someone can tell me where to find it.
>That's some ugly shit, man<
Ugly, but so transparently lunatic that all we really should worry about is whether he's a licensed driver.
Thanks, Mr. Ellison
I just want to say thank you for all the wonderful stories and essays. I've accumulated quite a pile of your books over the years, most of which have been re-read many times. I'm not big on idolizing people, but you are on my short list of amazing folks.
PC Re-Educator
PC Re-Educator's semi-literate ramblings (with seemingly random use of captialization) made for...enlightening reading, if only to illustrate just how idiotic the lunatic fringe can be. I see that he (he is almost certainly male; although far from a man) feels it is necessary to hide behind a pseudonym--coward that he truly is. All hail the First Amendment! Only by allowing these freaks & cranks to spew their venom, can they be exposed as the marching morons they are.
Ugly
Ugly or not, and as much as I hate to see some wannabe grand wizard come on here and try to write like Frank Church, it doesn't break any board rules. I would suggest simply ignoring it rather than giving it any attention by making it a topic of discussion.
Can we eradicate that disgusting "PC re-educator" crap? Rick?
That's some ugly shit, man.
Unca Harlan wrote:
"I only LOVE fictionwise.com! If the rest of the internet were as well-run, as honest, as supportive of writers, I'd never have had to sue the bastards."
Okay, did anyone _else_ imagine this as a blurb on Fictionwise's site?
ESSENTIAL
UNCA HARLAN:
done and done
RYAN:
email me.
Respectfully,
Neal
KEITI:
By all means, absolutely and whoop-dee-do, buy my stories from Fictionwise.com. They have a great deal with me, they have paid me handsomely, and the money you spend DOES go--at least a reasonable royalty amount--into Susan's and my kitty.
THIS is the sane, righteous way for classes to get individual stories (in perfect, ellison-proofed versions) at a pittance price. Each copy is right in the $1 range, and if you can get each student to dowload his/her own, I make more than what I'd've made if we'd sold that many pbs when it was new.
I only LOVE fictionwise.com! If the rest of the internet were as well-run, as honest, as supportive of writers, I'd never have had to sue the bastards.
So, yes, hurry your class to Fictionwise. If they ever want actual books, though, we're happy to sell you as many as you need.
It keeps me off the streets.
Yr. pal, Harlan
Susan,
Mailed the money order this evening; it should go out with the morning mail and, with any luck, reach you before winter.
Thanks.
-------------
David,
Way to go. I'll be sure to check it out.
D.
Hey Keiti,
Here's a link to Harlan's personal store:
http://harlanellison.com/herc.htm
I think you can order this particular item directly from fictionwise (as a matter of fact, it's linked to the above page). Harlan will get his Benjamins.
Re-Educating my Foot!
Here I was, reading these perfectly nice posts, enjoying my evening, and then this person comes along with this bit of unpleasantry. I realize we all have a right to free speech, but this entry was downright nasty. Was this really necessary? The only this person impressed me with is that something short circuited upstairs! (and if this is a joke, it's not funny.)
negro commerical popular diversions for the water buffalo herds
Any white girl who sleeps with a ne-gro deserves to have a knife stuck in her throat. look at nicole simpson's strange malformed children, with their strange hair. a butcher knife wielding baboon for a daddy. living the good life playing golf in ireland. ne-gro hair begins to kink and curl as the effects of ironing wears off pretty quickly or whatever unusual sprays they use to prevent themselves from reverting to nature. i guess that was the kind imbedded on clarence thomas's nasty coke can. i have no belief in god at all i'm a completely materialistic atheist, hence the importance i attach to cultural continuity and tradition, the stabilizing keel of conservative social norms as definitized by western European cultural history. females on the whole are pretty mindless. without the tempering influence of hierarchical European cultural norms they unravel pretty quickly, allowing every migrant ethnicity to impregnate them. who is the Shakespeare of the zulus? who is the Pasteur of the african pigmy? who is the Homer of the rastafarian hottentot? What did ellison think of the affirmative action version of The Wizard of Oz presented by the jim henson (disney) company. That's the result of radical former scenarists like ellison specifically mentioning the races of actors in their screen plays. like his rotten scenario for the i robot asimov movie. anyway he got his racist wish in methodless actor will smith.
:-()
Reply to Harlan
Harlan,
Thank you for responding to my post so quickly - I actually located the answer to my original question, but now I have another:
I see that "I Have No Mouth, And I Must Scream" is available as an ebook from Fictionwise - I want to purchase it in order to teach it in my classes. Is there any way to purchase it as an ebook directly from you, or should I go ahead an order it from Fictionwise?
I'd rather my money go directly to you, if at all possible.
Thank you,
Keiti
Where to send (and possibly sell) poetry!
To Erika aka Toulouse...but anybody who wants to write may want to read this as well because it applies to freelancing in general:
If you're serious about pursuing poetry, go to a major book store or one of the major internet book sites, find a copy of the 2005 Writer's Market (the regular printed edition, not the pitiful and useless CD ROM or web access version!), and buy it! Primarily look in the small publications section, which is substantial, because those are the best poetry markets, but there are zillions of other legitimate places listed to send poetry. In a nutshell, avoid ALL listings (anywhere you find them, not just in the book!) for "contests" or "anthologies for new poets" because virtually every single one is a sham! They'll either ask you for money up front to help cover publication costs, or charge you a ridiculous amount to buy a copy (or many copies!) of the book in which you'll be "featured", but it just isn't real! The ONLY idiots who buy these books are the poor fools who appear in them, and the publishers are accomplished crooks who know exactly how many to print to serve this single purpose. A complete and vile rip-off! Look carefully through the Writer's Market and you'll find plenty of real, established, honest publications that will accept your work for consideration and treat you professionally. Poetry does NOT pay, but I've seen plenty of poets pass through my workshops and succeed in their ways. If you're lucky enough to get accepted in a paying market, it will only mean enough to buy a dinner, and probably not for two! There are a couple big markets that pay really well (the first one on most people's minds is the New Yorker), but that's like hitting the lottery. The vast majority of serious small publications that accept a lot of poetry tend to "pay" with contributor's copies, and some may also throw about five to ten bucks at you. The point is that THEY pay, not YOU! Instead of waiting for somebody to recommend a a couple of places to submit, buy the darn book, do your own research, LEARN about the poetry market, and choose for yourself. Then submit to MANY publications at a time. Unlike with fiction or mass market articles, simultaneous submissions are usually okay for poems, and the publishers usually only want one time rights. A good poem can appear several places at once, or "sell" over and over again. Have fun!
REPLY TO KEITI
I don't do e.mail, as most everyone knows.
Either post your message here, or send a letter to me:
Harlan Ellison
c/o HERC
PO Box 55548
Sherman Oaks, CA 91413
REPLY TO ANDREW LAUBACHER
When I spoke to Matt Groening lo those many months ago, he averred it was a positive idea, using me as either a guest character voice, or as myself, on THE SIMPSONS. He said he would think on it, and see if he could come up with a salutary slot. He made no promises, and I have heard nothing further. He's a terrifically nice man, a conscientious man, a mensch, yet I suspect he has a billion gnats buzzing his tete--as do I--constantly. It's possible he forgot; possible that it was put in the abeyance bin; possible he was being polite and was too overbooked already; possible that he decided it was less a swell idea than he'd said; possible that he's waiting for the right moment ... or not at all.
I have no idea. Haven't heard a word.
But it would be brash and impolite of me to nuhdz him. If he can, and he wants to, he will. If not, he's still tops in my book, and though I might wax wistful, I would never presume to nag him, or mention it again. That's how we "class acts" behave with each other.
But thank you for asking.
Yr. pal, Harlan
Nellie McKay news
Since Harlan and many others are very found of her work (as am I) I thought I would share this email I received:
NEW NELLIE McKAY album PRETTY LITTLE HEAD features duets with Cyndi Lauper and k.d. lang - In Stores Tuesday, October 18
Featuring a kaleidoscopic selection of tracks culled from 23 new songs written by McKay for the album, Pretty Little Head premieres duets with Cyndi Lauper ("Beecharmer") and k.d. lang ("We Had It Right") as well as an assortment of provocative new compositions including "Columbia Is Bleeding" ("...it's turned into a real rock tune..."), "Cupcake" ("...about gay marriage..."), and "The Big One" ("...about a tenant's rights activist...").
Working with a group of "wonderful musicians," Nellie McKay sings and plays piano--as well as cello, vibes, and synthesizer--on Pretty Little Head.
I still hope Harlan can write liner notes for her someday!
Thanks,
Tony Adams
Request for Harlan
Harlan,
I'm sure you don't remember me, but I met you briefly during the book signing at Dutton's on Magnolia back in December. If it'll possibly refresh your memory, you called me a bitch - fabulously so, I might add. :-)
At any rate, I have just become a high school teacher, and would like to speak with you about something. So as not to bore the rest of the audience, would you be so kind as to email me at my posted email address?
Thank you,
Keiti
Correction
Aside to Loftus, not Rob. Apologies for the clarificationating double post.
The Starlost
Okay, now that the title of this thing has sent a cold chill down Harlan's spine: JMS addressed this very recently on his message board. To whit:
**********************
> So, to JMS, ever spoken about The Starlost? Ever thought about a collaboration of that sort? I know it would also take a cable or network channel's interest to make it a reality, but if there were interest, might both you and Harlan be persuaded to get together on such a thing?
>
> - Jeff
We've spoken about the Starlost a few -- very few -- times. One
doesn't lightly sprinkle salt in a wound of that magnitude. Beyond that, we've sometimes talked about doing something together one of these days (aside from B5 where he was our creative consultant for five years), but so far we haven't hit on the right thi