Unca Harlan's Art Deco Dining Pavilion
John
Eric, you have a point. Check out this from the Washington Post (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A26264-2003Jul22.html).
The part that infuriated me was when Laura Ingraham talked about the "anti-Christian entertainment elite." I felt that was clearly an anti-Semitic code phrase. No wonder the Anti-Defamation League is upset with Gibson. For years, fundamentalist leaders like Pat Robertson and Donald Wildmon have evoked ugly myths about Jews in their attacks on the media, academia and Hollywood. Does anyone feel that Dan Quayle's "cultural elite" remark was also intended to evoke those myths?
The worst of this is the "Left Behind" series. This crap is filled with hateful stereotypes, like financiers meeting in secret, and journalists and scientists dismissing Christianity as superstition. Every few chapters, a different Jewish character dreamily describes his or her conversion to Christianity, in the tone of "Gee, what was I thinking, being Jewish." The scary part is that these books are read by millions.
Sorry for ranting for so long about this.
Hollywood loves Republicans! Charlton Heston, Mel Gibson, Kelsey Grammer come to mind...these guys have made an awful lot of money. And the scripts we see filmed now and in decades past are hardly "liberal." If anything they are conservative to the core. The history of Hollywood filmmaking is a history of supporting God, the flag, and homespun apple pie values. If anyone is shut out from screen-writing consideration, it's the radicals.
Very rare is the Hollywood film that actually subverts. Can anyone name one (made in Hollywood) from the last two decades?
Troublemakers
Harlan, I got my copy of Troublmakers. Mahalo nui loa(for the book and for the words of wisdom you just posted).
Cheers, Colleen
Never thought I'd find myself quoting Frank, but...
How fun is this place?
Thanks, Harlan... once again your words have made my day.
best to all,
Michael
FROM THE CENTER OF THE EARTH, A MANIFESTO
STAN in OAKRIDGE, OREGON:
While I find your strong assertion that "I'm a Republican and a Conservative and NOTHING WILL EVER CHANGE MY MIND" a statement of profound sadness, a statement of blindered and concretized closemindedness -- Bernard Berenson: "Consistency requires you to be as ignorant today as you were a year ago" -- I assure you that what I say here would be identical in tone and passion to what I would say if someone had posted "I'm a Democrat and a Progressive and NOTHING WILL EVER CHANGE MY MIND."
Can you, in fact, perceive the intensity of my sincerity when I urge you to abandon that dead-end intellectual cul-de-sac? I truly do not give a hoot what you believe to your soul's depths, nor care what useless labels you attach to yourself -- realist, solipsist, republican, anarchist, democrat, liberal, socialist, libertarian, conservative, vegetarian -- because at one time or another we become each and every one of these labels ... AS WE LEARN, AS WE MATURE, AS WE GROW MORE INFORMED AND WISER ... labels so broad that they are as much gibberish as the catch-all categorization "science fiction," which means nothing, utterly nothing, save to people racking books at Barnes & Noble or at Borders.
My compassion for you addresses in NO WAY what you perceive your political stance to be, but only, solely and absolutely the tragic and harmful statement NOTHING WILL EVER CHANGE MY MIND.
Nothing? NOTHING?!!? No one thing that might cause you to question a regularly-accepted "truth"? You are that imbedded in amber, that tunnel-visioned, that cut off from thought and circumstance that you are beyond the reach of everyday Reality and the Niagara of new information, revisions, discoveries, lost data, reappraisals, confessions, scientific methods of proof, revelations that inundates us daily? Are you actually taking pride in, and puffing up like Custer at the Little Big Horn because of, your clarion call that NOTHING in this universe, now or hereafter known, for all of Eternity, can force you to open your mind to ratiocination, to refocus your eyes to examine new data, to do what homo sapiens has done since the discovery of fire and the wheel -- to reevaluate an opinion? (Incidentally, it now seems fairly clear, as an example of NOTHING WILL EVER CHANGE MY MIND, that Custer's "last stand" was not, in fact, at the Little Big Horn, but on what is called Custer's Hill, next to a holding area swall between that hill and the next one over, an area called the Keogh. Archaeologists have now almost absolutely verified this revision of "widely-held wisdom" that previously would never have been up for examination by anyone who would say NOTHING WILL EVER CHANGE MY MIND.) Are you, unbelievably, claiming hero status for being thick-headed? Because that's PRECISELY what your post claims: I know what I know, and neither god nor man can show me anything that will loosen my feet from the quagmire in which I'm trapped.
I truly hope you were only blowing off blowhard steam, trying to shame your fellow Webderlanders with a passive-aggressive, "You won't have good ole Oakridge Stan to kick aroun' no more, but even so, I stand tall onaccounta NOTHING WILL EVER CHANGE MY MIND!" Nothing, I tell you, through my bloodied lips, NOTHING!!
I'm not putting words or thoughts into your head, sir, I'm repeating WHAT YOU SAID.
And I find that no less than tragic; and I urge you, no, I BEG you to reconsider what you meant, truly meant, by those horrible words. And if you need an example of how dangerous such a stance is ... to YOU ... only to YOU ... not Society at large, nor gullible youths nor the body politic, but simply YOU ... consider this:
The concomitant of NOTHING WILL EVER CHANGE MY MIND is that (because it requires ignoring or rationalizing the aspects of Reality that don't gibe with your rock-hard world-view) anything you don't know, anything you don't understand, anything that thwarts you ... becomes twisted and redesigned by paranoia to fit INTO this System you've accepted wholly and without human question. And it has already happened to you.
How do I know this?
With only one posting to judge from?
Because your belief -- and NOTHING WILL EVER CHANGE YOUR MIND -- and the System you live within, has twisted and redesigned the difficulty of breaking into the screenwriting business in Hollywood (something we ALL have to suffer with) not simply, logically, truly and actually as a little fiefdom just like the duchys of automaking, shipbuilding, state politics, working for comic companies, banking, real estate, lifeguarding, etc. etc. etc. but as part of a great, invisible, evil cabal, ostensibly run by malevolent Democrat/Liberal forces that spend most of their time preventing enormous talents such as yours from reaching their true destiny as an Oscar-winning scenarist.
Now if THAT ain't bullshit paranoia, kiddo, then nothing is. But it's where your NOTHING WILL EVER CHANGE MY MIND mind went, instantly. That is just one example of how you consistently and automatically distance yourself from the Reality of Your Potential, by wallowing in a pit of regurgitated status quo thinking. It is an instant reaction-formation that I would bet is banging against your melon right now! I tell you with all the fidelity I possess, sir, that indeed there is an inarticulate conspiracy of johnny/jane-come-latelies, semiliterates, poseuers, know-nothings, power-brokers and just plain idiots who rule Hollywood. But their politics don't enter into it. They would hire Idi Amin or the Anti-Christ Beast itself if one or the other could give them a script that could be made into a Bruckheimer bombshell. Consider: if "Liberals" in this secret alliance were determined to stop good, honest Republicans such as yourself from ever making a buck, how come Schwarzenegger has made billions as a staunch Conservative, and may be running for Governor of California, just as successfully before him did Ronald Reagan, who was the pride and joy of every Conservative in the nation? Do not these blatant contradictions of your paranoiac conception -- engendered by the fact that NOTHING WILL EVER CHANGE MY MIND -- force you to stop and rethink what you said, to give you even a moment's pause before you twist and redesign demonstrable truths, these unarguable dollops of Reality, into another cobbled-up superimposed pre-continuum of conspiracies and shadowy assassins?
I WILL NEVER CHANGE MY MIND, I suggest, are the most tragic words any human being can utter. Worse for him, for you, sir, than for all around him.
Respectfully, Harlan Ellison
That's "impugn" not impune. Sorry for the 2nd post.
On Giving It All Away
When an artist is treated like a dog--thrown a few scraps of meat for his physical needs and then commanded to bark for the emperor--we are then living in a sick and debased society.
James Cameron made millions, the studio millions more, and the Terminator franchise has broken a billion dollars based on one "free" idea from Harlan. The exploiters and the thieves and the Ayn Randians would love someone like Harlan to roll over and play dead and low-rate himself. They have no souls and no creativity and so they must vampirically suck ideas out of real creators.
Your teaching metaphor is poorly thought out too. Take a moment to really consider what you're saying, you're not talking about higher salaries for teachers at all, you're saying something much more extreme--that artists and teachers should work for free all the time. Sadly, most artists and teachers live lives of quiet desperation because they do exactly that. But the real truth is that teachers are horribly underpaid in this affluent society, and right wingers, who sound remarkably like yourselves, would love to dismantle public education with arguments just like, "Good teaching doesn't require higher salaries." When education is privatized and the class system locked forever in place, this little statement will be the last nail in the coffin of democracy.
One other point: Haven't you ever noticed how the ruling class and the Ayn Randians always talk about a thing called the "Production of Wealth," which always seems to happen magically thanks to the inherent benefice of capitalism. Well, Marx had an answer to that. He said excess wealth comes from surplus labor--that's when workers (or artists) aren't paid the full value for what they do and are paid just enough to cover their physical needs. The wealthy then reap the excess as profit. This is what is meant by exploitation.
What is the real value in Harlan's ideas? One thing is is clear: the value is far in excess of what he has been paid for them. Despite this, Harlan has said in the papers that he would "go away" for a nominal fee that shows that the artist is still respected in this world.
Harlan is fighting to elevate the status of all writers and artists, not just himself. He is willing to give away everything he has to fight this battle. To call him a "sell out" or a "prostitute" is to insult a man of true ideals and to impune the dignity of all artists. As a frequent contributor to this board, I am embarrassed by your remarks and mortally ashamed.
You folks can sit in a comfortable little womb and say things like this only because you have never taken the time to understand this problem and because you have had your heads filled with nonsense by pirates like Napster. Ideas don't rain from heaven. People like Ray Bradbury, Gabriel Garcia Marquez and Harlan Ellison are special, and they need to be cherished.
Try a little harder--think about it some more, and you'll see that Harlan is fighting to save the soul of this generation. He is a true teacher for us all.
Hathor: You said, "You mentioned Doctors and Lawyers in your response to Bruce's statement. Doctors and Lawyers have a SPECIFIC CRITERIA that needs to be met on a national level before you can call yourself one. (Not so with some medical tech positions, teachers, or security guards, but that's a BIGGER beef for another time)"
In the U.S., each state sets out rather SPECIFIC criteria for their teachers' certification. New York State requires a Masters degree in either your subject area or in education, several grueling and expensive tests, a video submission (which costs around $300), a fingerprinting check with the FBI, and a few other fun items after you've already gotten your provisional cert in order to get your permanent cert.
If I have to go through all that bullshit, I might as well just get an MBA (which requires no testing and no fingerprinting) and make six figures, instead of making $35,000 and having to deal with the disrespect of people who don't have the slightest idea what I had to do to get my job and lump me in with security guards.
I'm not sure what your point is about having to meet criteria on a "national level." What the hell difference does that make? I have plenty criteria to meet, don't you worry. Bruce's point, which had nothing whatsoever to do with the process of becoming a teacher, was that no talented teacher would ever claim that better salaries would make better teachers. My contention is that better salaries (like those made by doctors, lawyers, and entertainers) would attract a more highly educated, qualified, and ambitious pool of applicants, and it sure would make people like me, who do it for love, more comfortable as we pay off the massive student loans we incurred so we could educate other people's kids.
I apologize that this conversation has veered off the Ellison-related. Originally, I was trying to debunk the idea that people who will do work that's valuable and uplifting, like teachers and writers, should get paid for it, and paid well. I'm really unclear as to why that's such a hard concept.
PAB
Hey, Neil, you old dunderhead you!!! How's it goin?? Is Neil Elliott your real name or did you just use it on the internet so your feelings wouldn't be hurt like I did. I bet you named yourself after Neil Young and Chris Elliott. I saw Neil back in '88 in Capitola, CA with the Blue Notes. What a show!!
I ain't singin' for Pepsi
I ain't singin' for Coke
I ain't singin' for nobody that makes me look like a JOKE.
And who could forget those late nights with Chris Elliot. Remember "The Regulator Guy"--"Hey, don't do that". Great stuff, eh. Well, I could go on and on--and I intend to--right here and nowhere else. I'll be the filibusterin'-est Strom Thurmond (HY''D) type in Webderland.
Don't forget to write back soon.
Yr Pal,
Bruce
NO FAIR, DIANA. Castle Guards, Foo Dogs, and I have a credo....
Aw, what the f#%$! I already broke the "one post" rule....
BAAAAA-hahahahhahahahahaahhaah :# (weg)
Heh heh
Dear Mr Ellison,
My friend Ray The Perverted Pagan tipped me off to something funny...
"Try this soon, before Google fixes its site:
1) Go to Google.com;
2) Type in (but don't hit return): "weapons of
mass destruction"
3) Hit the "I'm feeling lucky" button, instead of
the normal "Google
search"
button.
4) Read what appears to be a normal error message
carefully."
Check it out.
Diana
Just because I sleep in garages does not make me a mechanic.....
P.A. Berman:
You mentioned Doctors and Lawyers in your response to Bruce's statement. Doctors and Lawyers have a SPECIFIC CRITERIA that needs to be met on a national level before you can call yourself one. (Not so with some medical tech positions, teachers, or security guards, but that's a BIGGER beef for another time)
In a forum where THE PRINTED WORD IS THE MEANS OF CONVEYING A MESSAGE, I find no problem with Mr. Ellison's fight.
If I have to pony up extra cash to read THE CRAFTED WORK over this EXTREMELY EXPENSIVE VIDEO-PHONE, fine. Makes sense to me.
(Then again, you'll find me in a biiiig mosh-pit with the rest of verbal bedlam shooting off stuff that would get me beat up at my local bar. Daaah....HAVE Ellison...Definitely Definitely HAVE Ellison....)
I surrender!
Okay guys and gals...no more political views from my end. I am Republican...I am Conservative...and no way in hell is anyone going to change my politics or my mind about it....end of discussion....I surrender.
I probably won't ever get published or produced in Hollywood, because of my politics...but what the hell...there are worse things...like being dead!
Rick:
If I want to look at the archives on the conversation that took place about "I,Robot" how can I do this?
Bruce, I gotta take you up on this gem:
"True talent cannot be held back to the highest bidder. Would a truly talented teacher make the statement, "Better teaching requires higher saleries". "
Without much modesty I'll admit to being a pretty talented teacher and yes, I'd say that better teaching requires higher salaries. Not everyone with an Ivy League degree is willing to work for half what he or she could make in the private sector to enlighten the youth of America; in fact, most aren't.
Most of my co-workers are the product of state school systems. I'm not knocking it, but if you want a "better quality" of teacher, you have to be willing to pay for it. There is no financial incentive whatsoever for those who shell out big bucks for the highest quality education to go into teaching.
You can rant and rave all you want about how we should all just do it for the commonweal, but when one has to go into massive personal debt to finance a Masters degree that is REQUIRED for one's teaching certification, it would be awful nice if salary were commensurate with other professional fields with similarly high mandatory levels of education. As Bush put it, it's tough to put food on your family these days. People can complain all they want about how crappy teachers are these days, but you get what you pay for, generally.
The same goes for artists. Sure, they're going to produce that art no matter what compensation they receive for it, but why shouldn't they be able to profit handsomely from their work? Why shouldn't they make whatever the market will bear for their work? When doctors, lawyers, baseball players, mediocre guitarists, vacant-eyed models, and all manner of talentless human detritus make lavish salaries for less socially redeeming achievements?
Bottom line is, don't spout off when you're talking nonsense. But you knew that and thought it'd be fun to do anyway, right? Ah, I don't know why I bother...
PAB
radio and movies
Harlan:
Thought you might appreciate an update on Robert Cannon and Marc Rose. They've revived "Dry Smoke and Whispers," and have 18 episodes in the can and ready to air on the XM satellite radio network headed by Lee Abrams this fall. The "Sonic Theater" channel apparently also airs the Firesign Theater, LA Theater Workshop, shows from the BBC, and lots of other fare coast-to-coast. (I don't think they're Web-based, though.) Supposedly, they have a contract for 2 years worth of shows.
I haven't met Cannon, but I did some voices for Rose on Sunday -- joke advertisements and brief news breaks that will serve as filler for the first 18 shows -- and he wants to use me more heavily in the next set of shows, which Cannon is writing. As I suspected, they will also re-do some of their classic shows from the 1980s, now that they have the technology to do them up right.
Movie notes: I watched DVDs of the original "Invasion of the Body Snatchers" and "Honey, I Shrunk the Kids" over the weekend. I noticed that Miles (Kevin McCarthy) misquotes Oberon in the first, and that composer James Horner's score for the second liberally quotes a whimsical motif from Nino Rota's main theme for Fellini's "Amarcord," which tickled me no end. Nobody else had noted these on the IMDb, so I wrote up items for there. . . .
How much fun is this place?
-------------------
"Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and consciencious stupidity."
-Martin Luther King, Jr.
hat trick for Harlan
While I just started reading the 35th anniversary edition of _Dangerous Visions_, I noticed that HE scored 3 mentions in the current issue of _Entertainment Weekly_ (#720/July 25, 2003):
1) In the article "Fallen Star," discussing a revamping of the Star Trek: "The franchise needs to get back to the provocative scripting that marked the best episodes (Like Harlan Ellison's classic "The City on the Edge of Forever")."
2) Under the comics column "Graphic Novels You Have to Read," _Vic and Blood_ was listed with Eric Shanower's _A Thousand Ships_, _Across the Universe: The DC Universe Stories of Alan Moore_, and _Fallout_ by Jim Ottaviani et al.
3) Also under the comics column, a review of _Al Williamson Adventures_ (EW gave it an "A") including "scripts by Harlan Ellison, the late Archie Goodwin, and others."
Hey Eurobeast:
sa·pi·ent [ sáypee ənt ]
adjective
full of wisdom: wise or learned
[15th century. Via Old French from Latin sapiens- , the present participle stem of sapere “to be wise, taste.”]
Obviously used for irony....
And here's a question for Harlan and Charles: I have learned from my moles in the Evil Empire that AOL is currently shutting down the accounts of their clients whom the RIAA is reporting as having downloaded uncopywrighted music. Does this strenghten your position for the ongoing struggle?
best to all,
Michael
Mark: Don't worry about it. I ran into a similar sort of thing, years and years ago. I was working as a stock monkey at a Winn Dixie in Louisville. Flash back with me: Clinton was in the White House, I was a pimple-faced buffoon--far removed from the cultured Eurobeast you see before you--and Ellen Degeneres decided to come out of the closet. Remember? I guess it must've been a slow news week because Ellen made the cover of Time, I think it was. So a bunch of cretinous suckfish from the local God Squad decided to launch Operation Dykewash: the removal or defacement of every copy of Time we had in the Winn Dixie. Copy after copy was scuttled off our unholy shelves, and those that remained often had the most hideous things written on them in black magic marker.
Don't let that sort of thing bother you. Whatever it is these people believe in so fervently, it's not enough to give them anything better to do. It should give one the yuks, not the creepycrawlies.
Can somebody please tell me what "sapients" means? It's not in the dictionary. Harlan strikes again. I do have "saponite" (a hydrous magnesium aluminum silicate occurring in soft soapy amorphous masses and filling veins and cavities), a great word I plan to popularize in the near future, but that one just doesn't match the context clues.
HARLAN,
LOL!!!!!
I wantcha to know I copied and saved that one.
BRUCE, I'D LIKE YOU TO MEET NEIL ELLIOTT:
Here's a nice rubber tire to swing on, and a squishy toy for you to masticate. Now be good little sapients and go off and play nicely together. Oh, and Bruce, before you go, take this pooper-scooper, and clean up that, ahem, "unfortunate aspirant" you left on the floor.
Harlan, aka "The Phantom Prostitute"
Harlan is listed as one of the contributors to the revival or Argosy magazine. For more info check out the following link:
http://www.locusmag.com/2003/News/Markets.html
Alejandro
"I really didn't want to get involved in this dispute, in truth I have no opinion about it whatsoever..."
Hey, Bruce, if you have no opinion about the matter then why ask a loaded question about it? If you have no concrete position concerning the topic, then why chime in with an insulting obfuscation that has nothing to do with the state of reality?
"Would a truly talented teacher make the statement, "Better teaching deserves higher salaries?"" Does this mean you're against rewarding achievement?
"I say, "LIBERATE THE ARTISTIC TALENT FROM THE CLUCHES (sic)OF THE EVIL ARTIST MAN." Give him enough for his physical needs and make him give his art away for free." Ok, now I see, you're living in fantasyland, buddy. Who's going to give artists enough for their physical needs? And what do you mean about "physical needs?" What person or persons chooses the artists in question? And who is going to "make (them) give (their) art away...?" Are you talking about yourself? Are you, like, one of the richest persons on the planet who can support all of these hypothetical creators who will freely surrender their works for the "greater good?"
Talk is cheap. Facing the economic realities of existence is hard. Most of us all have to do it, and those who work freelance, who sell the wares they create, who exist by their talents, wits and hard work donnot deserve to be stolen from. Stolen from so that others can enjoy that work absolutely free of charge... so that a john like you can get his trick.
R.Wilder
Gimme that ol' time religeeon
Stopped in at my local Broders the other day to check out the new magazines. I found the new edition of Scientific American, the one with David R. Begun's article on evolution and picked it up only to find that someone had taped a note on the cover that read "I LOVE JESUS". I looked at the second and last copy and found another taped message saying "JESUS IS GOD CREATOR OF ALL." If there had been ten issues on the newstand, I'm positive I would have found each with its own taped message. I turned the magazines into a employee that I know, saying "A coupel of fan letters from the faithful." Needless to say he was pretty cheesed off. So was I. Well, not so much pissed off as troubled. The persistent, mindless application of dogma increases. That's the real closing of the American mind. As a college teacher, I try to do my part to open the minds of my students, and get them to think for themselves, but with each year I come across more students operating under fundamentalist dogma and closed-minded approach to world, and it worries me deeply. It's as if they are terrified to consider anything outside what that their reveredn/minister has drilled into them. I'm presently covering the Renaissance thinkers in my philosophy class and when I think of our present situation, with all the Pat Robertsons and Jerry Falwells and Ralph Reeds infusing ignorance into people and contributing to the fear that motivates someone to leave messages on magazines in bookstores, wow. How far we have fallen from that Golden Season of Humanism.
Sorry for the rant but it's been on my mind and I had to vent.
Thanks for your time.
Mark
*** Bruce *** That one of the most poorly reasoned arguments I've come across in months. Apart from making no sense whatsoever it also manages to simultaneously get wrong how Harlan has lived in Hollywood as a creative artist AND misconstrue the motives and "terms of engagement" of Ayn Rand's fictional characters. Her wooden one-dimensional characters, I might add. That's a lot to get wrong just for a discussion you admit to having no vested interest in. Nobody discussed I, ROBOT because it was covered by Harlan himself - on this board - in detail - awhile back. No new news is all.
*** Brian/Jay *** That's me but webderlander's are welcome to bid against me. Not only do I already have a RUMBLE but anything that drives Ellison prices up or establishes prices will benefit my wife and daughter someday. Gotta look at the big picture. For me it's just having the biggest pile of stuff. Sure, it's speculating, but it doesn't do me a damn bit of good nor will it.
My eBay rating is because I sell books on-line mostly through Half.com. I have about 5,000 presently listed.
*** Rick *** I was wondering if the WSJ article would stand after getting pinky slapped last year for making the same mistake. There is a free printable version of the article at;
http://online.wsj.com/article_email/0,,SB105882058352830200,00.html
*** Harlan *** Received your "item" and note. Thank you. I am sending the BLB package before the end of the week. I know I had said it was sent but things kept getting added to it. I know you know how this is. Also, I picked up hard copies of yesterday's WSJ. I have one for Tim and my copy. If you need additional copies I have 3 extras. Let me know. If I hear nothing they go into the basement shot at the end of the first Indiana Jones film.
- Barney Dannelke
Portrait of the artist as a prostitute.
Dear Harlan,
Not everyone considers becoming a Hollywood sellout a virtue! Some people think that artistic talent comes from a place higher than the belly. Why do you think corporate foundations give huge grants for the arts? Why is there PBS? As long as we're name calling--You're an AynRandNik if I ever saw one!
True talent cannot be held back to the highest bidder. Would a truly talented teacher make the statement, "Better teaching requires higher saleries". What if your wife were to say, "Gee honey, our marriage is really falling apart, but if your salery were to reach six figures. . ." Saying the creator is solely responsible for what he creates is like saying a super-model created her own body. It's true it takes alot of work; diets, make-up artists, practicing smiling in front of a mirror,etc, but what is the true source of that beauty?
I say, "LIBERATE THE ARTISTIC TALENT FROM THE CLUCHES OF THE EVIL ARTIST MAN." Give him enough for his physical needs and make him give his art away for free. A true artist can no more withhold his art than an e-lax eater can withhold his you-know what.
Respectfully,
Bruce
P.S. I really didn't want to get involved in this dispute, in truth I have no opinion about it whatsoever, but no one was talking about what I wanted to talk about (I,Robot) so I had to vent my frustrations elsewhere.
Yeah,
I'd say the person responsible for that article in '72 got it right--all right--"5 feet 5 inches of charisma, wit and sarcasm".
I love it.
Still laughing over the Roget's reference..and the breeze of intelligence remark.
God- you KILL me.
yer pal,
Cindy
TROUBLEMAKERS
Harlan,
The first edition copy of TROUBLEMAKERS that you sent me arrived today. Many thanks for the gracious personalization. I'm glad I was able to help out.
Steve J.
HARLAN ELLISON RESPONDS
TO NEIL ELLIOTT:
I have made it a lifelong policy never to answer moronic, lamebrained, idiotic, ignorant, mischievous, smartass, duplicitous questions asked by dunderheads. In case the word "dunderhead" is not part of your vocabulary, look it up in Roget under "asshole."
Otherwise, have a lovely day, and do try to permit a breeze of intelligence to blow between your ears, across that arid savannah you call a mind.
Respectfully, Harlan Ellison
Stan, this is why I am not a republican:
"There's an old saying in Tennessee—I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee—that says, fool me once, shame on—shame on you. Fool me—you can't get fooled again."—Nashville, Tenn., Sept. 17, 2002
"We're concerned about AIDS inside our White House—make no mistake about it."—Washington, D.C., Feb. 7, 2001
"Natural gas is hemispheric. I like to call it hemispheric in nature because it is a product that we can find in our neighborhoods."—Austin, Texas, Dec. 20, 2000
"It's important for us to explain to our nation that life is important. It's not only life of babies, but it's life of children living in, you know, the dark dungeons of the Internet."—Arlington Heights, Ill., Oct. 24, 2000
"If I'm the president, we're going to have emergency-room care, we're going to have gag orders."
"I think we ought to raise the age at which juveniles can have a gun."
"I mean, there needs to be a wholesale effort against racial profiling, which is illiterate children."—Second presidential debate, Oct. 11, 2000
"It's clearly a budget. It's got a lot of numbers in it."--Reuters, May 5, 2000
"The senator has got to understand if he's going to have—he can't have it both ways. He can't take the high horse and then claim the low road."—To reporters in Florence, S.C., Feb. 17, 2000
"The most important job is not to be governor, or first lady in my case."—Pella, Iowa, as quoted by the San Antonio Express-News, Jan. 30, 2000
Your President's many stupid quotes. Scary.
About that WSJ article...
um...
i hate to point this out, but your posting of the full WSJ article here is a copyright infringement, and given Harlan Ellison's current legal efforts, I don't think it would be wise to keep a copyrighted article on the message board of someone who is suing AOL for not removing copyrighted materials...
if someone's got admin powers to remove that WSJ article (or edit it down to an intro/summary with link to original), you might wanna do that pretty quick...
Truth is Stranger than Fiction
Saw this... made me think of sci fi and this board...
The following is an intro; click on the link for the full story.
SlugBot: Enemy of Slugs
By Louise Knapp
Story location: http://www.wired.com/news/gizmos/0,1452,47156,00.html
02:00 AM Oct. 08, 2001 PT
In the near future, the very mention of SlugBot could send waves of terror through the slug community, while farmers will sing its praises.
A prototype robot capable of hunting down over 100 slugs an hour and using their rotting bodies to generate electricity is being developed by engineers at the University of West England's Intelligent Autonomous Systems Laboratory.
The SlugBot is an attempt to build the world's first fully autonomous robot. When completed, the SlugBot will be the first robot to work completely independent of human care. It won't even need help to recharge its batteries....
[click link above to read entire article...]
WSJ Article
Ray Carlson, thanks for bringing that article to our attention. I also heard that Harlan had several mentions in the latest EW, regarding Vic and Blood and also a collection of work by Al Williamson, anyone see that issue?
Rob/Stan,
Could you guys please take this discussion to the other board? This isn't really the place for these long, political tirades.
Thanks guys... :)
Stan,
"would you ever have thought of becoming a conservative or leaning back and just maybe we conservatives are right about a few things?"
Oh, now and then I caught a conservative being correct about something. But so long as he or she still maintains Copernicus' heliocentric theories were wrong I can grant that individual very little.
I could go through every "argument" you rattled off, from Communism early in the 20th (and how Capitalism was, shortly before, failing in HORRIFIC ways, thereby INVITING an alternative) to the American flag (as if to suggest only a conservative could be passionate about our country; if I don't wag a flag in everyone's face I guess I don't give a shit!) and tell you where you fucked up. But I agree, this thread already went on too long.
But your summations remind me of some words by HARLAN ELLISON on the Moral Majority (from his column in Future Life): "If you fought in Vietnam you're a patriot...as long as you don't stage a sit-in on the lawn of the VA hospital and demand to know why you're rotting away or going insane from exposure to Agent Orange. At that point you become a freako troublemaker. If you're a woman who got raped and knocked up and want the fetus aborted, well, that's sad as hell, sister, but your womb has citizenship...so have the kid, even if it's born without a nose..and shut your mouth, bitch."
libraries question
Does Unca Harlan think libraries should be shut down if they don't pay authors' royalties each time a book is checked out?
Didn't Stan just invoke Godwin's Law and therefore has to end the conversation? I mean really, equating abortion rights to what Hitler did, that would be silly if it weren't so wrongheaded and downright meanspirited. Give it a break, Stan. Talk about Harlan Ellison for a little while, won't you please? Or, if you must go on and on about your political beliefs, do it on the other board. There's quite a bit of discussion going on there that would interest you.
PAB
Wall Street Journal Article
That explains why I've picked up a few donations from the Kick site this morning after a long drought. It would be nice to be able to send the Ellisons a big check for the fund since there hasn't been enough activity to merit one for a long time.
UNCA HARLAN: FRONT PAGE NEWS
The Wall Street Journal July 22, 2003
Battle-Scarred Author Takes On Web Pirates Harlan Ellison Has Scrapped Over Terminator, Star Trek
By ANNA WILDE MATHEWS Staff Reporter of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL
Copyrighted material posted from WSJ deleted by Management, Department of Irony
Write to Anna Wilde Mathews at anna.mathews@wsj.com
oops
Crap...new ebay, my bad. Seller's on the right... Barney's the high bidder. (Impressive rating, btw...you buy your groceries on Ebay, there, Barney?)
The "Rumble" Auction
Brian,
Check the name of the seller... ain't that Barney?
Again...To Rob
Tell me Rob....would you ever have thought of becoming a conservative or leaning back and just maybe we conservatives are right about a few things? I think not. You are so established in liberal thinking, it is you who has his head in clay. Look what liberalism has brought us in the last Century....in 1917 it brought us Communism which we fought tooth and nail for over seventy years...until they themselves found it does not work.
Freedom to jump on the bandwagon of abortion rights, of which now we in the U.S. must be proud to have killed more babies than Hitler killed people in Europe at least ten times over the six million...free love comes along and now we have AIDS to contend
with....oh and I could go on and on, but I won't. I am proud to be conservative....I spent three years in the service of my county back in the sixties....I am proud of that too....and I am proud to associate myself with a party who will get the government out of my back pocket (believe me...the rich are not the only ones griping about tax relief...we working poor also have our gripes about taxation)...most of all Rob, I am proud to be an American and I put my flag out on my front deck to show that pride. I will not comment anymore, because I believe this page is to discuss the work of Harlan Ellison, so if you answer this Rob, I will not respond.
Virus
Hi all,
Diana, the virus warning you recieved is a hoax. Lots of these are sent around the internet like chain letters. If you wish to know more try here. http://www.sophos.com.au/virusinfo/hoaxes/ittakesguts.html
Cheers
Kerry
Coupla things. First of all, someone's got a copy of _Rumble_ on sale at Ebay:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3539574092&category=1135
Second, this chat about heart problems has made me VERY worried, especially since I ain't got health coverage, and every little twinge or weird numbness sorta stimulates the imagination in ways I'd like to avoid. (If anyone knows what an emergency room visit costs, lemme know.)
Third, read Michael Chabon's _The Amazing Adventures of Kavalier and Clay_. A marvel. A true marvel. Read this. It'll make you a better person.
It's Tough To Say Jesus
Dear Mr Ellison,
No hi-jinx today. My son's dad's girlfriend sent me the following e-mail, I thought I should pass it on. You can tell those who've been missing me (I know some of you have :=P) that I have a new personal web site. I got sick of my old one so I dumped it. I didn't like it anyways. When I was designing it I was all the time worrying about getting things right (whatever THAT is), focusing on making a good impression or something (on WHO?????), and other boring things of that sort and I never had any fun working on it, but now I've decided..."Screw it!". If you want to see my new site, which I JUST just started (so there's like NOTHING there yet really, but I still think it's cool, and it's actually expressing ME this time, not me worrying, "What will they THINK?!?") well you can. If you want to. I'm not assuming anyone does, I'm just saying in case... It's heavy on graphics, and slow to load. If you don't like wav's you might want to turn down your volume before you visit. Okay?
Alright,so here's the e-mail I was telling you about, which said to to pass it on at the top, and I think that's a good idea, so I am.
Sincerely,
Diana Graham
(http://dianagraham.homestead.com)
"If you receive an email titled: "It Takes Guts to Say
Jesus"
DO NOT OPEN IT. It will erase everything on your hard
drive.
This information was announced yesterday morning from
IBM; AOL states that this is a very dangerous virus,
much worse than
"Melissa," and that there is NO Remedy for it at this
time. Some very sick
individual has succeeded in using the reformat
function from Norton
Utilities
causing it to completely erase all documents on the
hard drive. It has been
designed to work with Netscape Navigator and Microsoft
Internet Explorer. It
destroys Macintosh and IBM compatible computers.
This is a new, very malicious virus and not many
people know about it. Pass
this warning along to EVERYONE in your address book
! and please share it with
all your online friends ASAP so that this threat maybe
stopped. Please
practice cautionary measures and tell anyone that may
have access to your
computer. Forward this warning to everyone that you
know that might access
the Internet.
Joyce L. Bober
IBM Information Systems
Pittsburgh Mailing Systems
412 - 922-8744"
Harlan,
TROUBLEMAKERS arrived today. Thanks a bunch. And, again, glad I could help.
Take care,
Bill
Irony is its own motherfucker. I was driving down the "Urban" part of town and noticed two billboards, side by side; one had a blurb about "Stopping the violence, and spreading peace", and the other billboard was a Colt 45 Malt Liquor ad. Sigh.
---------------
"The trouble with born-again Christians is that they are an even bigger pain the second time around."
---Herb Caen
Correction!
In my e-mail yesterday, I was speaking of Golden Age artists, so I should have said the Harry G. Peter Wonder Woman, not the Marston Wonder Woman. Of course, Marston dreamed her up--she was his brainchild, but Peter did draw her. I think it's important to keep these things straight. DC also plans a C. C. Beck Captain Marvel action figure. Wow, this should be quite a run.
Steve Dooner
DAVID,
Yeah: "MOST people" would have been more accurate phrasing. To back up your point, later the very day I posted my comments about SM Farmers Market, the news interviewed an elderly man, a retired doctor in the early stages of Parkinson's, who STILL carries an active license but now refuses to drive, conscious of the responsibility. He leaves the driving up to his wife.
Sure...there's a few out there with enough sense to do that. MOST people don't (young OR old OR ill), I believe. I wonder if ANY who DO live in L.A., where a car seems like a dire need. Try interviewing seniors about the prospect of taking away their cars (I'm hardly an expert on the issue but I'd seen a detailed news report on it). A frantic response is pretty much what you get. And where frenzy strides determination tends to follow: organizations used age discrimination laws to prevent heavier testing targeted at seniors. My summary may not be PRECISE but that's what it came down to. There IS an emphasis on driving courses for seniors and safety programs. Now, with the inevitable weight of testing laws to come, more seniors will be more cognizant than ever of those programs to maintain a privileged and independent existence, I'm sure.
But your point was well taken: perhaps I was going too light on this man in Santa Monica. He already had a history of ramming his car into things. With such a history, if HIS sense of responsibility wasn't there, where was his family? Like the doctor I cited above, maybe he should have turned to someone like his wife OR one of those driving courses. I retract what I suggested as to who should be blamed (I felt sorry for him at first - and to an extent I still do - because he was so out of it). It seems to me he didn't stop to think much about his problems behind the wheel; and if his sense of responsibility was giving way to senility (when you can't make the difference between the brake and the accelerator!!) his family and/or the DMV should have been stepping in (more). The responsibility was HIS as WELL as his kin's and the DMV's.
BRUCE,
Well, Harlan DID once write a story about a fine gentleman called AM. Pleasant enough fellow. A little on the megalomaniacal side.
Harlan,
"Troublemakers" arrived in the mail today; many thanks!
Here are two quick Gene Wolfe anecdotes from Readercon. The first reminded me of your introduction to Mr. Wolfe's stories in "Again, Dangerous Visions," where you described his tremendous dignity during the Hugo Awards mix up in the early 70s. At Readercon, Mr. Wolfe was late for a panel discussion (I can't say for certain, but I think he was waiting for his wife), and when he arrived on stage the moderator had to bad taste to say "I'm tempted now to introduce the late Gene Wolfe to all of you." Some of the audience members chuckled but I thought the comment to be crass. The man is in his mid seventies and walks with a cane (as does his wife). In addition, through the whole weekend I took note of the care Mr. Wolfe took in escorting his wife from place to place and making sure she was settled in before he went about his business. So Mr. Wolfe considered this comment and in a moment replied "I am two years past the point where that joke was funny." And I said, man, what a beautiful response. Dignified and cutting.
The second anecdote concerns a comment he made responding to a question of originality. He gave several examples on how ideas can come about in the course of everyday life, like when you see an curious-looking person in a parking lot and how that alone can get the writer's imagination working. The rest of his ideas, he said with a wink, he stole from the great writers. "Except that Harlan Ellison," he said. "He's unswipable; his ideas are so orignial they can only be his own." But he did admit being tempted to kidnap you and keep you in his basement; that would be the only way he could come up with those ideas before you already wrote them down and had them published.
Thanks for your time,
Mark
Killers on the road
Rob wrote:
> ANYONE is going to keep driving if he or she is allowed
> to. This is another one of those sad lessons we're forced
> to learn the hard way.
Wrong, Rob. Some people have a little sense and, rather than march-step with the great brainwashed masses, CHOOSE to do the right thing, as anyone could if he stopped to think about it. My wife's father worked for General Motors for 45 years (which these days almost makes him part of "the enemy," because my wife has become a transit advocate and we chose to become a carless household last September -- donated our aging Honda CRX to the Humane Society to auction off in order to raise funds), and he voluntarily gave up his driver's license before he turned 80.
But there are a lot of people out there who have little sense. Up here in Portland last month, a 90-year-old man sailed off Highway 99 in the suburb of Sherwood and plowed into two young mothers walking their infants in strollers, and killed a mother and a kid.
Hey, did anyone hear about Hollywood making a movie out of I,Robot? When I heard about it, I took an old copy from the library to re-read it. I had forgotten all about the positronic brain and the 3 laws of robotics. This was probably the book that spawned the whole idea of talking, thinking computer brains. Although 50 years later the idea is silly, I guess people assumed that if you semi-conducted enough simulated synaptic type processes you could generate randomness with constraints.
Did HE ever write a story with a computer generated consciousness, or did he consider it as ridiculous as a bullet shaped spaceship?
Toy News and Kelland on the Web
Dear Harlan,
I caught a piece of recent toy news that may be of interest to you. DC Direct has plans to do a new series of Golden Age style action figures called, "First Appearnaces." These include a Joe Shuster Superman, a Bob Kane Batman, a William Moulton Marston Wonder Woman, a Harry Lampert Flash, and a Mart Nodell Green Lantern. The sculpts for the Kane Batman and the Marston Wonder Woman look beautiful. I wonder if these will make the cut for your legendary toy collection?
Incidentally, I've read most of what you've written about comics, but I would love to hear your reflections on the great toys you have, the great toys you have lost, and the great toys you always wished you had. "Jefty is Five" has some interesting references, but perhaps you might write an essay on this topic some time. (If you have written a piece, I would love to know where I could find it).
One last note of interest: Charles Budington Kelland is alive and on the Web, just barely. One work, Youth Challenges, exists as an e-book, free for all to read. So maybe there'e hope for us all.
Sincerely,
Steve Dooner
Stan,
"Nothing you say will change my mind"
Well, I already understood that.
No one can really change someone else's mind; not really. When I change my opinion or conclusions about something it's because I choose to re-evaluate it. I stand back to look at the whole picture and its details. But you've programmed yourself to impede this process. You've wedged your head into one resolute pov irreparably so that neither the logic of a counterpoint nor the light of new information will ever reach you. Absolutely: only YOU have the ability to "change your mind". But when we sink too deep into the soothing contentment of default programming it's very difficult to free ourselves. It's a trap of our own choosing.
It's nice to know you'd aspire to be a fearless crusader for the rights of the working man but it could never be until you pull your head out of the clay. That's always a loss for the rest of us.
I feel sorry for you, man.
And don't forget, at the turn of the century Pinkerton guards used to regularly shoot union workers in the back. The Ludlow massacre is another of those running sores. Unions have largely been made powerless by federal law, and the power they do have is controlled by an elite at the top; but at least their existense controls the onslaught of Hooverville shantytowns, in middle America--at least for now.
------------------
"I don't do black music, I don't do white music
I make fight music, for high school kids
I put lives at risk when I drive like this {*tires screech*}
I put wives at risk with a knife like this (AHHH!!)
Shit, you probably think I'm in your tape deck now
I'm in the back seat of your truck, with duct tape stretched out
Ducked the fuck way down, waitin to straight jump out
put it over your mouth, and grab you by the face, what now?
Oh - you want me to watch my mouth, how?
Take my fuckin eyeballs out, and turn em around?
Look - I'll burn your fuckin house down, circle around
and hit the hydrant, so you can't put your burning furniture out
(Oh my God! Oh my God!) I'm sorry, there must be a mix-up
You want me to fix up lyrics while the President gets his dick sucked?"
---Eminem.
Stan writes:
"big business Republicans have screwed the working man ...but guess what....so have the unions. And to date I have never heard of a working man paying the wages of another working man....the big businesses pay all of those who work for them."
Man, there's a lot wrong with this. For one thing, labor unions have provided the working man with job security, medical benefits, scholarship funds, an organized basis for political action (i.e., unions lobbying politicians on their behalf) and much, much more. Also, when unions go on strike, their strike funds frequently pay the salaries of the strikers. So Stan, yer wrong.
And it's worth considering just how well big business paid workers _before_ the advent of unions.
Amusing site:
http://www.googlism.com/index.htm?ism=harlan+ellison&type=1
To Rob
Nothing you say will change my mind about the Democratic Party. They both have their faults....but there is one thing you gotta remember...yes, big business is usually conservative Republican..and yes...big business Republicans have screwed the working man ...but guess what....so have the unions. And to date I have never heard of a working man paying the wages of another working man....the big businesses pay all of those who work for them...but dear Rob...that is beautiful thing about this country...a person can be a capitalist...it is there right!
so there!
I know this is not Harlan-related and I know I posted this at the forum but this is worth mentioning here.
It's been a rough week for Cuban music, friends. I should have posted sooner but work got in the way. Celia Cruz, Salsa's answer to Ella Fitzgerald, passed away Wednesday afternoon after a long bout with a brain tumor. She was 75. Her body was transported to Miami for a huge wake to be held tomorrow then it will be flown back to New York where it will be buried.
Death has taken her by the hand and if there is an after life, by golly, what a great place to hang out it must be. There Tito Puente, Compay Segundo and the many many great musicians that arrived before her are waiting for the grandest jam this universe has ever seen.
Alejandro
Super Di
Speaking of comic books (were we? who cares?), what are your thoughts on the recently announced and de-announced run of X-Force that was to feature Princess Di returned from the dead as a super heroine? Marvel made the newspapers with their Princess Di story; author Peter Milligan expressing his matter of fact notion that her character fits the book perfectly as she is someone famous for being famous.
Then Marvel chickens out and cancels the run. The House of Ideas gets a good one then decides to cut and run before the Di-worshippers attack.
Egad. This nauseates me.....unless it's simply a clever ploy to raise interest in a special graphic novel collection in a year.
Heaven forbid we have a little bitta fun with the empty shell of celebrity known as Princess Di!
Marvel deserves a big smack in their sleepy faces over this one.
Yeesh. -TODD
TRACY:
Fret not, neither fulminate. Everybody in the Business -- and I mean, without reserve, EVERYBODY -- knew that Freddy Frieberger was the shoo-in universal choice as poster-boy for mediocrity when he was still producing; and subsequently everyone knew he was the worst sort of talentless hack. His name is one of those words that becomes synonymous with what it describes: Quisling, Sadist, Falstaffian, SigAlert, Crapper. His record-- obstinately tasteless tenure at any odd bottom-of-the-ratings job his agent could get him--presaged toilet-twisteroo for whatever series he was helming.
He was an ass-kiss then; he remains so in memory. That he lauded the evisceration Roddenberry countenanced was pro forma
for a guy as pathetically back-of-the-steerage as Freiberger.
Sanguine in my achievements, I remain, yr. pal, Harlan
Well, I'm properly nauseated now. I've just finished reading an interview with "Star Trek," season three Svengali, Freddy Freiberger. The interlocution took place somewhere between the brilliant veneer that he added to the British Science-Fiction series "Space: 1999," and his trip to the boneyard.
But you'd better believe this much, buster: In the day, Fred was the DaVinci of science-fiction, and no Abe Mandel, or Lew Grade told him where the bear shat in the buckwheat, and he told them so.
Towards the end of the column, he waxed sentimental as he recounted his adept, tantamount reshaping, and the intellectual history that he contributed to the Trek/Nytol Mythos. Fred never worried about dissipating the artist's canvass (a.k.a ignoring the writers). If taking chances meant jumping head first into Vesuvius, then so be it. As a by God, case in point--after copious self-flagellation, and admonitions of inferiority--he offered his humble worship for the editorial changes that Gene Roddenberry made to "City On The Edge Of Forever." It proved, Fred said, that you can use other tools (otherwise known as, ignoring the writers), and still achieve something tremendous.
Perhaps I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer. I do try--but the minus-Ellison version of 'City' always impressed me as being just another mediocre episode of "Star Trek," though it would prove thrilling when juxtaposed to the joys held in store for season three.
Wordsworth was right. The world is too much with us. It's time to down some Rolaids.
Cindy...
You took me way too seriously (though, believe me, not about that silly comparison between logging protesters and anti-abortionists - simply because it was factually inaccurate) and wasted a lot of bytes in doing so. I just had to take a shot about Frank's crooning because it always sends me running for bottles of the Pepto.
Mark,
Ben EDLUND (not Englund; I have a suspicion you crossed the name with the actor Robert Englund) was the writer/artist who created THE TICK. I was introduced to this here masterpiece by way of the brilliant animated series, most of which I taped. The live action effort, in a word, sucked. You sound like you'd only caught that lame heap but missed the animated version, which went on for several seasons and moved from Fox to Comedy Central after its run. The animated series followed every story in the comic quite closely since Edlund was involved in the writing and storyboards. I think, therefore, you'd dig the animated version a LOT. I mean it's fucking hilarious, man. It even includes The Tick trying to speak Yid at Dinosaur Neal's Jewish wedding. It'll probably pop up on Comedy Central again but it's also likely to be in the vidiot rental stores.
To an extent the parody infected my once steady ease with the comic book universe - because more often than not, now, when I glance at superheroes on the page, I see these reclusive wretches sitting in an all-night diner on the Boulevard of Broken Dreams.
It's my assumption Harlan has been obviously familiar with Edlund and The Tick.
In a contrasting close to everyone,
I'm not good at elegies but, man, the curfew tolled the knell of a parting day in Santa Monica...right up the street from me and I just had to offer some word about it, however paltry it might be. That was Wednesday, late in the afternoon when I was on the freeway heading back into SM, when I noticed a swarm of newscopters hovering near the beach area. I disgarded it as another one of those car chases local news shows love to exploit. When I returned I got the message on my voicemail from a friend who was there when it happened. He called me shortly after the poor, 86-year-old man glided his Buick through the crowded farmers market. His voice was shaking as he described in his message what he was seeing - almost like a reporter on the scene; a woman with blood pouring out of her head, and two infants smashed. He cut off when he chose to run over and help the woman. I was blown away by the message, of course, and I turned on the news for the details. Later that evening he filled me in - about when he took off his shirt to tuck under the woman's head and struggled with the options left to a medical layman about what to do. The lady, still conscious, was begging for water; he started giving her some when the only paramedic on the scene thus far told him not to. At any rate, he later learned she would be one of the survivors. Understandably, he needed to talk about it a lot; it was along the lines of, "why am I alive and they're dead". We went on talking about chaos, the sometimes tragic roll-of-the-dice. I reminded him, as it was the only helpful reassurance, that the lady he stuck with made it. But I assured him too that the fortitude in my voice was from the security of my apartment and that I could't possibly imagine what it was like for people with victims dying in their arms.
The old man is in a pathetic situation. At first, a group of witnesses wanted to beat the hell out of him; a store owner who'd pulled him out of the car made them back off. It wasn't really his fault. It was the fault of the DMV and the state laws. He'd already had a record of bad driving but they allowed him to keep his license without subsequent driving tests. ANYONE is going to keep driving if he or she is allowed to. This is another one of those sad lessons we're forced to learn the hard way.
At any rate, I can't say enough for those who were lost - the Mexican woman who left a family behind, Dennis Weaver's daughter-in-law, and the rest, who all made up a broad age and ethnic cross-section. They all woke up that morning to another typical sunny day and ended up splattered on the pavement at the hands of a frail old man. It's incredible: we just don't know when it's waiting for us.
As I'm typing this I'm supposed to be working, so I need get going. But I'm going to be watching my back.
>Those who would deliberately harm others-- who are just trying to make a living ARE devoid of humanity.<
Careful. There are a lot of ways to "make a living" that are very deserving of being harmed. Were I a Jew in the Polish ghetto, back in 1941, I'd be doing my very best to harm those paycheck-drawing German soldiers (ok, I just saw "The Piano").
That's the good old Nazi example, of course, the one we can always drag out for any argument, but I hope you see my point. "I'm just making a living" is NOT a good enough excuse to be left alone, if the occupation itself is heinous. And let's not forget that along with defending Joe Logger, who may or may not be noble in his own right (I personally tend to doubt it), you are defending some truly awful extraction companies like Maxxam/Pacific Lumber. A quick check of their ecological record will leave you aghast.
I agree that extremism is always ugly, and the eco-movement has its share of dangerous fruitcakes. But I'll take a tree-spiking Earth-Firster over a bomb-hurling Bible-thumper any day. I suppose it's a matter of degree.
There goes our Cindy, spittin watermelon seeds at the moles popping out of holes in her lawn. Cindy, I would bet you would also think people who sit in trees to stop logging trucks would also be a weirdo protest ritual. I agree with that practice myself, the only reason I do not do it, is because I do not have the kind of guts it takes. See, I admit it. With my luck, some logging truck would turn me into Frankmush.
-------------
There's this literary prize that was given for the worst beginning to an imaginary novel--the prize went to a lady from Alabama for this ditty:
""They had but one last remaining night together, so they embraced each other as tightly as that two-flavor entwined string cheese that is orange and yellowish-white, the orange probably being a bland Cheddar and the white ... Mozzarella, although it could possibly be Provolone or just plain American, as it really doesn't taste distinctly dissimilar from the orange, yet they would have you believe it does by coloring it differently,"
She definetly deserved the 250 duckets.
Strangers
The Newsweek essay was the subject of one of Harlan's TV commentaries. See URL below.
http://harlanellison.com/buzz/bw175h.htm
Harlan,
Any time, pal. I'm glad I was able to help out.
Apropos of nothing whatsoever, Harlan, are you familiar with the comicbook THE TICK published by New England Comics? I know that FOX turned it into a TV show starring Jeffery Wharburton that had limited success but never quite caught the flavor of Ben Englund's offbeat humor. Anyway, THE TICK is a wonderfully absurd book that brings a fresh approach to the superhero genre, a kind of existential ennui centered around the question, what do these guys do when they can't find crimes to fight? Although it's still quite good, the first two years of the run are still the best.
For what it's worth!
Later,
Walshy
No Rob,
While I wouldn't presume to speak for Frank, mine is a genuine affection for him. I play with him because he's sweet and he plays back, pulling his punches (I believe) because he feels the same about me.
Political polar opposites though we be- I consider Frank to be my friend and I like him. I also respect the fact that he doesn't change his message or dilute his antipathy for social correctness. Frank is who he is, no soft soap no tricks and in MY book it only makes him more of a man. No, Rob there is no patronizing from me-- it isn't my manner. If I were given to such oblique methods of conveying disdain I would refrain from it where Frank is concerned my respect for him would not permit it.
I like to argue with Frank because he's sharp and credible. He's dogmatic in his beliefs and he does provide me with a new perspective to contemplate.
Now, Brian--
Are you saying that a belief in the sanctity of plant life neccessitates a reverence for human life as well? I do espouse your opinion that a majority of tree spikers are probably not trying to harm people. However, if one were to ratchet up the intensity of emotion required to become pro-active over a tree-- you'd find a few individuals possessed of a malignant focus lacking in compassion for people who do not subscribe to similar beliefs. It's the same sort of crackedpottedness that presents in some pro-life nutburgers as a belief that nurses and physicians who work in abortion clinics should be killed.
There are crazies in every camp... nobody has a corner on the market.The same bats in the bellfrey cause the demented notion that pro-life terrorist actions are right because dead abortion providers are incapable of killing unborn babies.. as cause some envirionmentalists to rationalize that a dead or maimed logger is incapable of killing trees.
Just pick your passion-- and throw in extremism. Are the feelings of outrage that one criminally insane person has for the unborn any less than those another has for the redwood? It isn't about any particular issue it's about mental stability.
Those who would deliberately harm others-- who are just trying to make a living ARE devoid of humanity.
Was I any more clear this time? I think I missed the mark before.
Cindy
Hello Dorman,
I miss you.
Are you here?
Cindy
Harlan,
Let me know when Jim sends your swag or if I need to send a gentle reminder. :)
Thanks
Jay
problem solved - THANK YOU DORMAN!
OK - Dorman saved the day.
*** Rick *** Please feel free to delete this - I'm copy/pasting it in a Richmond bibliography thread I started in the other "room" - BD.
----- Original Message -----
From: Dorman Shindler
To: dannelke01@enter.net
Sent: Thursday, July 17, 2003 7:40 PM
Subject: re: Strangers in a Strange Land by Harlan Ellison
Barney,
That's the title of the essay that Ellison wrote for "Newsweek." It appeared in their April 7, 1997 issue (page 49) -- I kept a copy. I think Harlan ran the unedited version in his Rabbit Hole newsletter (and I think Newsweek slapped the aforementioned title on it -- I believe Harlan might have had a different title -- check your backissues of Rabbit Hole.
Best,
Dorman
Dorman,
Thank you so much - I'm fwd'ing this to Tim. I'm sure you're correct. That's why I couldn't find it in the older anthologies. You da man. Back to work...
- Barney
Battle Chasers
Harlan, your welcome and Battle Chasers are going into the mail tomorrow.
Cheers, Colleen
Harlan,
You're welcome. I'm truly glad I could be some help.
Take care,
Bill
One Last Bibliographical Question - until the next one.
Okay - I got off the phone with Tim Richmond a couple of hours ago and after confirming and denying a couple of obscure bibliographical references he had one for me that just stumped me - and it's probably obvious and I am simply sun-fried from setting floor joists -
"STRANGERS [note plural] In A Strange Land" by Ellison. This would be a NON-FICTION piece, probably the title of an introduction, but for what exactly I simply cannot remember because every time I stare at the title all I can see is the Heinlein novel and Silverberg anthology and then my eyes roll up in my head. Tim was hoping to throw this in as a post-it note to the manuscript of FINGERPRINTS ON THE SKY ASAP as he is leaving for vacation and I don't have the time to start looking through books before Sunday.
I/WE need the 1st appearance and page #'s of that appearance. Year composed as well if that's cited. Your time and attention in this matter will be rewarded in heaven where your no-prize will be given to you by either Twain or Asimov.
- Barney
BILL ... COLLEEN ... MARK ... STEVE:
Books received. They were probably lying in the rack at the PO Box for a few days, which explains why I haven't thanked you before this ... but the deadlines have been coming thick and fast, so we didn't pick up what was waiting for us till today.
In any case, thankyouthankyouthankyouthankyou, he said, turning widdershins in jubilation. Your signed and personalized first editions went out this afternoon.
I am in your debt, the quartet of you.
Yr. pal, Harlan
HARLAN: Thanks much for the response. The person in question went to the doctor, had the usual battery of tests done, and is informed the most likely cause of being tired at this point in life is simple: He ain't 17 no more.
There are a few more tests to be done, but apparently the best remedy at this point is getting enough sleep.
Until next time. . .
I picked up my copy of Locus this morning. Thanks for the info Alejandro. I am back in the land of the employed after a little over 2 months of looking, thank goodness. I had worked 11 years and 23 years plus at my previous 2 full time jobs and was not expecting such difficulty in finding a new one.I could not have lost my job at a worse time as far as the number of people I was running into everywhere I applied that were doing the same.At any rate I start Monday morning doing customer service on incoming calls for Citi Corp in West Des Moines.
On the fun side I am going to see Joe Cocker here in Des Moines Sunday night and Crosby, Stills and Nash at the Iowa State Fair in two weeks on a Friday night so looking very much to both events. Roger
"you are a peach...sweet petunia"
FRANK AND CINDY...
Y'know...sickly-sweet, eye-twitching, neurotic patronizing of this sort makes me suspect you two would be blowing each other away with 12-Gauges if you ever met, in the worst this side of a Hatfield-McCoy feud.
And being a spectator "devoid of all humanity" I'd honestly want a front row seat.
FYI
Hey Gang,
I came across a website a while back called wired for books and on it, I found a collection a radio interviews conducted by a man named Don Swaim for his radio show that came out out Manhattan. Some of you may be familiar with this show, but for those of you who aren't you may want to check the site out. You can listen to the interviews on RealPlayer. Among the list of authors interviewed are:
Ray Bradbury (twice)
Isaac Asimov
Brian Aldiss
Douglas Adams
Robert B. Parker
Ray Carver
John Gardner
Gore Vidal
Norman Mailer
And dozens and dozens more!
Here's the link:
http://www.wiredforbooks.org/swaim/
Swaim is a very good interviewer. He grew up in the 40s and 50s reading Asimov and Bradbury and gives both men the utmost respect.
______________________________________________________
My issue of LOCUS finally arrived. Hoo-rah, now I get to read Harlan's essay!
______________________________________________________
Frank: where did Vidal say that about Bush & the Sept. 11 bombings? An essay? an interview? Just curious.
Best,
Walshy
I fear I was sleepwalking when I last spiked a tree, glad Cindy reminded me. Cindy, you are a peach, but you hit your head on the lower evolutionary branch with that comment, sweet petunia.
------------
Dooner, Vidal did say that he believed Bush set up 9/11; that was where my wacky comment came.
--------------
Harlan, you may not be as elitist as you seem. I'm sure many elitist types would say comic books represent a lower culture--I don't, but many would. Maybe, "pop culture" elitist is more the moniker you should hang over your door.
Shatoga Says....
Dear Mr Ellison,
Just when you thought it was safe to go back in the water :=)
Anyways, the following was written by my pal Shatoga. He is
wise in the ways and wiles of the world. I found it very enlighteneing, and it seemed sort of relevant to some of what's being nattered on about at this forum, so I thought I'd share it. Yes, it's okay with him if it get's shared. ("That's how the light gets in"*)
"Understanding US and Britain's Neo-nazis
what Liberal 'news' media.
When was the last time you read of "Managment Problems"
The conservatively biased 'news' media skew coverage towards the right...and always have!
"Labor Problems/ Labor Disputes'- never Managment problems/ Managment Disputes.
It's always Management makes "offers" and Labor makes "demands";
Offers: such as lower wages, longer hours, less benefits,
Management stealing Pension Funds (as ENRON proved beyond doubt)
Demands: (historically)
safe working conditions
an end to child labor
the 40 hour work week
overtime pay
health care
retirement/pensions
A Liberal media would have
exposed the greed of management
and championed the plight of overworked underpaid Americans and foreign nationals (imported as cheap labor)
A Conservatively biased media would do exactly as NBC-CBS-ABC-CNBC-CNN have done...
Take the side of the corporations with editorializing within the 'reporting'
by using such skewed terms as "Labor Disputes" (when UPS execs were trying to get their greedy hands on UPS employees Union controlled pensions.
The Federal government watches unions like hawks, but trusts management to
just
do the right thing, without any oversight.
a la ENRON (who invested pension funds to inflate stocks
so management's stock options could make the thieves richer as the workers lost everything.
It's the American way!
Peaceful demonstrations are falsely reported as riots after Police attack peaceful demonstrators,
some of whom fight back against the police state's unjustified violence.
it's gotten to the point that many citizens are so brainwashed that they see only one side of all issues.
Which side do they see?
Why the side the media they loath tells them to look at!
As rightwing media 'reporters' tell him how the 'Liberal' media is lying.
They themselves are that media they bash.
And some people aren't bright enough to see the contradictions:
Star Trek episode:
Kirk:
"Everything I say is a lie."
Norman: "If you're telling the truth, you must be lying..."
Oliver North used this skewed logic successfully during the Iran Contra coverup.
Testified that he'd lied to congress, yet swore he was telling the truth when he testified that he had lied to them before.
'Conservatives' (neo-cons/ not true Conservatives like Goldwater) will believe any lie from their own side!
.
That is what's most bewildering.
They know the media is lying,
yet they believe the lies the media tells them."
~Shatoga~
I've been wondering how it is you keep from jabbing a fork in your eye or something, just to distract yourself from the agonies of boredom you must suffer when you read most of the posts around here. Or maybe you don't keep from doing that. Maybe your face is riddled with tine punctures. I could understand if it was.
Signed,
Diana "You Don't Own Me" Graham
P.S. Shatoga loves me. He thinks I'm a blessing.
(*"Ring the bell that still can ring.
Forget your perfect offering.
There is a crack in everything,
That's how the light gets in"
~Leonard Cohen~ ("Anthem" The Famous Blue Raincoat Album)
Cindy,
"those who would spike trees to injure loggers..."
THANK Brian for straightening out your thong on that because I was ABOUT to snap you in the ol' wazoola with a wet towel for the oversight.
"Both ends of the spectrum remain devoid of humanity"
Harlan. Vidal. Lennon. Just a few obvious names associated with the Left...and CLEARLY devoid of humanity. Damn cold-blooded monsters!
You KNOW generalizations (which I, of course, NEVER make) always get you in trouble!
Uh, Cindy, they don't spike trees to injure loggers. They spike trees to keep'em from being cut down. They put up signs to announce which trees have been spiked, so the loggers don't get hurt. T'ain't the same thing as bombing abortion clinics.
Readercon 2003
Dear Harlan,
I attended Readercon out here in Boston with my good buddy, Mark Walsh. Though we would have loved to see you here in the Hub of the Universe, we did get a chance to talk to Hal Clement and Gene Wolfe.
In one strange panel sessions, two inferior writers gave a critique of Clement's work in the author's presence. Though they tried to be effusive in praise, they couldn't help but insert their own egos into the discussion, and they started to quibble with Clement's works in a panel that was supposed to speak to its value. I found it odd and uncomfortable. They made several less than charitable remarks to the author himself; however, Clement took their remarks graciously.
At a coffee table session with Gene Wolfe, he told us some wonderful stories in which he was a bit too modest about some of his work. One of his best stories, he explained, came about because his editor, I believe it was Campbell, had an illustration of Hitler selling a Volkswagen to Churchill. He went on to say that the editor went alphabetically through a list of writers to write a story to accompany the picture, and was growing desperate by the letter W. Wolfe said "yes" fortunately.
As Mark Walsh mentioned in an earlier post, Wolfe shares your love of Borges and told us a marevlous anecdote about Borges. According to Wolfe, the great author traveled with translators, not to explain the English questions (his English vocabulary was extraordinary), but to translate the bad Spanish that well-meaning spectators insisted on using when asking him questions.
Ellen Kushner, the NPR/PRI ethno-musicologist was there as well to read some of her fantasy writing and to make a plug for her upcoming show on Gamelon orchestras. I'm not sure if you have heard Sound and Spirit out there in California, but it's playlists are really groovy.
All the best,
Steve Dooner
Frank, Frank,
The truth is more complex, lamb choppie. The middle is moderate. The two extremes have those who would murder physicians at abortion clinics and those who would spike trees to injure loggers. Both ends of the spectrum remain devoid of humanity and common sense so I choose to roost in the center... as would you my little sweet tart if you would only use that excellent brain God gifted you with.
You're a delight, Frank-- so quit trying to be such a pain in the tuchis.
:)
yer buddy,
Cindy
This is an even better review: Steve Grant's take on Vic & Blood. You do have to scroll down a little bit until you find it:
http://www.comicbookresources.com/columns/?column=10
Vic and Blood
Check out this link for a nice little review of the new Vic and Blood graphic novel. The comments can get a bit asinine, but what do you expect form a comic book board? Hell, the next thing you know those little joke book fans will be debating politics ad nauseum!
http://newsarama.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4605
-TODD
Martian eclipse, tomorrow at 5:30am. Brightest Mars will ever be for the next six hundred years. Should be visible from the general Caribbean area. If you live in the U.S.A...you'll probably miss out on it. Ah, well. Life's a bitch, then you go to Mars.
Alejandro
Magnificent, many enormous thanks.
Best
Jes
Jes:
The Fourteenth Annual…is the volume you are looking for.
Alejandro
Incognita, Inc
Hey Alejandro
If I may momentarily delurk (I don't feel anywhere near as erudite or brain-nimble as the rest of you guys, so I'm content to read and learn) do you, or any other of the wise 'n wonderful Webderlanders, know in which of Datlow and Windling's 'Year's Best Fantasy and Horror' collections Incognita, Inc appears? I'm eager as all hell to read it...
Thanks in advance
Best
Jes
Heads up, people! The new issue of Locus magazine, with Alan Moore on the cover and an entire section devoted to comics and the graphic novel, just hit the stands. It features a peachy keen essay by Harlan about his love for comics, pretty much an update on the essay he wrote for Playboy back in 1988. It also includes essays by Charles Vess (who edited the special), Neil Gaiman, Carla Speed McNeil (author of Finder) and assorted other.
Miss me, fuckers? :-)
Stan, I could introduce you to the wonderful world of Libertarian Socialism (anarchism); the worlds only hope for the working man or woman. Remember what Jim Hightower said:
"There's nothing in the middle of the road except yellow lines and dead armadillos."
Capice? You too Cindy Sue.
----------------
Everyone email Mahar's show on HBO, and get them to include Harlan in their new season. Believe me, they do listen to emails. Worked for me years ago on his old show.
COLLEEN ... sweetie honey baby lovey ...
Hell, yes, I still need BATTLE CHASERS 7 and 9. Do I want'm?
yew betcha!!!! please send soonest, and let me know what recompense will bring a smile to your pomegranate-sweet lips.
Ever thine, Harlan (with a whoop-dee-doo!)
JIM:
"Tired" could be a lot of things, but if you want my best advice, get this "tired" person to a great -- not good, but great -- cardiologist, and have said specialist run a non-exclusionary, exhaustive battery of every conceivable stress test known to cutting-edge medical science, including an Echo-Stress and the one whose technical name I've forgotten ... though it is often referred to as the "Test to Destruction," in which they lay you out on your back on the table, they put your legs up in the air, and an overhead bicycle-pedalling device is stirruped onto your feet; then you pedal as fast and as long as you can, till you think your head will implode, and they track it on a heart monitor. This is the one that located my arterial blockages six, seven years ago when I had the quad-bypass. The Treadmill Test was showing me as peachykeen; the monitor-audited tracking of the colored fluid showed I was just fine; but when it came to the Upside-Down Bike action, I thought I was going to croak, right there on the table; and a day or two later I was in the ER, and thence to the chest-burster. It spotted everything, and the bells and sireeens went off, and that's what likely saved my ass.
"Tired" could be low blood-sugar, pre-diabetes, Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, overweight, hypertension, any one of a hundred others, some more and some less serious. Get this person to a full-battery cardiologist ASAP.
Yr. pal, Harlan
Dry Smoke and Whispers
Harlan:
Long, long ago, in installment 39 (Aug. 16, 1982) of "An Edge In My Voice," you urged readers to seek out the home-made, old time radio-style drama "Dry Smoke and Whispers," created by 24-year-old Floridians Robert Cannon and Marc Rose. Later, I understand you did a little work with them.
Yesterday I discovered that Cannon and Rose have since drifted up to my neck of the woods (to be more precise, the unextinguished Portland suburb of Beaverton) and are poised to revive the adventures of telepathic Special Detective Emile Song, first in audio form and then perhaps as an animated show. I'm meeting with them Sunday afternoon to talk about the possibility of doing voices for them. Will keep you posted.
Rejoice!
Hear ye, hear ye! Now is the time to rejoice:
http://www.cartoonresearch.com/news.html
Buy it when it comes out and maybe they'll release others. And for those that refuse to follow links, it says that October 28th will be the release date for a multitude (56 to be exact) of Looney Tunes cartoons. Thassright. Looney Tunes. Apparently, Warner Brothers even brought back Chuck Jones from the dead to say a few words.
Mark,
Thanks for the head's up on Lucius Shephard. I'll check him out.
If you've never had the pleasure to read DANGEROUS VISIONS, iBooks and Edgeworks Abbey released the 35th Anniversary Edtion last year with a new intro by Harlan. Also, in the past ten years he released SLIPPAGE, where he talks about his coronary episode in the intro. It also has "The Man Who Rowed Christopher Colombus Ashore," his story that made it into the Best Short Stories of 1994 (wasn't it? Or was it '93?).
Or you can go to Amazon or some other online bookstore and look up the name and see what's out there...
Bill
Not to mention that Harlan contributed a story to McSweeney's Mammoth Treasury of Thrilling Tales and his "Incognita, Inc." was chosen (was it last year?) by Ellen Datlow's and Terry Wiendling (sp?) for their annual anthology of the best fantasy and horror stories and the recent release of the Vic and Blood graphic novel featuring the original tales by ibooks and I know I am leaving something out but I am quite sure some of you out there can fill in the gaps.
I've been lurking for too long a time, but I had to chime in to that last post. He's still writing all right. He's had a couple of books come out within the last couple of years--The 50th anniversary edition of The Essential Ellison and Troublemakers, with more on the way. (By the way, when is the new edition of Deathbird Stories coming out?) He's very very busy, as always.
Re-Reading Ellison
I was looking around the house for something to read.
There was my tired copy of Again Dangerous Visions.
The pages are browning, getting a bit brittle even.
I started reading it ... again.... (for the umpteenth time in as many years)
What a great collection. (I never had the pleasure of reading DV...)
Love the political undertones of the last couple of stories. (I started with the last one and am working my way backwards through the collection.) Still relevant to today's world. Love HE's commentary on each story, each author.
I wanted to find out if Ellison was still around. I haven't followed his work as closely as the rest of you on this board...
Seems like he is, although if I understand correctly, he's experienced (but survived) a heart attack. Holding you in the Light, Mr. Ellison. I hope you get through okay.
Doesn't look like you're still writing, though.
Pity.
Love your work.
Love your edge.
Today's world needs the edge that's reflected in ADV.
Needed it then; still need it.
I'm curious... if you were going to put together a new ADV (ADVA?), who would you put in it? Who are you reading?
What story would YOU write for it?
My best to you...
Sincerely,
Jillaine Smith
Heart to heart
Me? No. I don't have time to be tired because I am--odd of odd--busy writing, among other things, film criticisms and movie reviews of some length: Essay length efforts, to be more precise.
No. There is someone I know who is the same age as Mr. Ellison and last year or thereabouts he began experiencing tired periods. So. . . See where I'm going with this? Since Harlan is, uh, an 'expert' on heart matters I thought he might be of assistance.
Until next time. . .
film critics
Rich: I couldn't agree with you more. I would LOVE LOVE LOVE to see Mr. Ellison return to film criticism, or another forum where he writes essays regularly.
But Rich, have you checked out any of Lucius Shephard's film reviews in the Magazine of Fantasy and Science Fiction? He's quite good and brings the criteria you set out in your post to his reviews.
Thanks for your time,
Mark
Just a thought.
After reading some movie reviews in the NY Times (specifically, A.O. Scott's scratching-at-the-surface column regarding comic books and movies) I'm left to wondering where the truly good movie critics are and it got me to thinking what would Ellison say about certain films. And not just science fiction/fantasy flicks.
Harlan Ellison's Watching is the book I should've stolen from the public library and I miss the essays that talked about film. There are two qualities that make a good film reviewer and Ellison has that in spades: love of film and the ability to critique.
The first is easy. I could throw a keyboard at this site and probably hit a bunch of us that love film. The second, though...As Ellison's thoughts on McSweeney's awhile back demonstrated, the man do know how to critique. There is an art form to it that few movie reviewers today demonstrate and fewer still retain any consistency from one review to the next.
Why doesn't someone pay the man to write reviews? Maybe he doesn't have the time, but for every Entertainment Weekly review or .com crapola review, I long for and remember those Watching columns for their clarity and insight. Especially in these "comic book" days of movies, it'd be interesting to hear from a true professional.
BATTLE CHASERS comics
Harlan, I've located issues #7 & #9 if you still need them. Let me know if they're needed. Mahalo, Colleen
Heart Attack
Jim,
If I might also provide an answer, since I've recently had that joyous experience, I didn't so much feel fatigue, but I did feel 'winded'. I used that term because I didn't want that raw, achy feeling in my chest and the shortness of breath whenever I went for a walk to be a problem with my heart. It wasn't my asthma, it was angina.
However, my case wasn't as severe as Harlan's. I had an angioplasty, which cleared up two of the three clogged arteries that caused the problem. The third was left alone because my heart had grown a bypass of it's own to supply the right side of my heart with the blood flow it needed. That must have taken time. Prior to the last year or so, I didn't know there was ever a problem.
Heart disease is not called the Silent Killer for nothing.
Who, may I ask, is feeling fatigued, etc.?
I hope it's not you. If so, get thee to a physician, pronto.
Chuck
Medical matters
(Elbowing his way in and making his onto the precarious and wobbly orange crate to seek out HARLAN ELLISON):
Mr. Ellison, you may not to want repeat the events that transpired, and that's fine, but a question, all the same, that perhaps you would answer:
Prior to your heart attacking you, resulting in your rib cage being cracked, and a nifty new zipper in your butt cheek, did you feel physically tired for, oh, a year before the big event?
I ask this as a medical matter, not as morbid curiosity.
Thank you for your time.
Until next time. . .
Jim Hess
look what pops up!
alejandro reported:
> Just wanted to call your attention to a recently
> released anthology titled "Cosmos Latinos", published
> by Wesleyan University Press and edited by Andrea Bell
> and Yolanda Molina-Gavilán.
Glad to hear the book has hit the streets, and pleasantly surprised to see it mentioned here. Yolanda's an old friend of mine. . . .
Ben:
We've got three separate versions of the Encyclopedia done by Peter Nicholls and John Clute; 1979, 1993, and 2000. Then there are editions of SF encyclopedia by Robert Holstock, Donald Tuck (His is in three volumes), David Pringle (His is titled "The Ultimate Science Fiction Encyclopedia"), Brian Ash with the Visual Science Fiction Encyclopedia, not to mention the "Mammoth Encyclopedia of Science Fiction", a new one Scotty purchased as few months ago, edited by George Mann. That doesn't include the CD-ROM version of the Encyclopedia, which has some really neat interviews with Mr. Ellison.
Now, Scott will buy the book suggested by Alejandro, and the house will groan again in growing complaint at the load it must bear.
It's a dammed good thing I've got those Ultraman model kits already.
Melissa
Stan
"someday the Democratic Party will see the errors of its ways...and go back to standing with the working man and woman in this country"
I see. Your explanation is...well...so LUCID!
Defect from a party which once stood for the working man and allegedly no longer does to join a party that NEVER stood for the working man and STILL doesn't.
I sense that this GOD of yours must disdain the working man (the one on the lower end of the income scale, anyway) not to mention the universities, community colleges, medical clinics, and health coverage for those struggling economically as much as the Republican party does.
(Incidentally, the Bush administration just officially conceded there IS no God. CFCs blew a hole in blind faith along with the ozone. So, you better look for a better argument).
Re Stan, who wants the Democrats to get back to helping the working man: I guess this means you're definitely _not_ a Republican, then. That's good. At least they haven't reneged on their heritage of _screwing_ the working man.
To Steve, Rob and Cindy
TO STEVE: Nothing to apologize for...but...humbly I accept it.
TO ROB: Reason for my change...at the time...was for moral reasons. Though I have for three years chucked any affiliation to any organized religion...I still have the basic belief in God and what the Clinton Gang did in Washington....well....draw your own conclusions. Maybe it is a pipedream, but I still hold true to the belief that someday the Democratic Party will see the errors of its ways...and go back to standing with the working man and woman in this country.
TO CINDY: I thank you Cindy for your reply.
For ye collectors of Ellison-provenanced stuff, HE is offering up some mint model kits and rare Dick Tracy wallpaper at Heritage Auctions.
http://www.heritagecomics.com/common/auctions/lots.asp?SID=727E7198A6954A51AF9232F057998E7C
Sorry, that previous post was supposed to be addressed to 'ME'. Goddamn sub-tropical humidity, it's warping my brain...
MELISSA,
I actually have a copy of THE ENCYCLOPEDIA OF SCIENCE FICTION right here in front of me. The price tag on the cover reads $39.95. I wouldn't know if that price would be any different in your location. Also, it's a mighty old edition. Scott is correct in saying it needs major revision, but to be fair it DOES have one kick-ass section on great SF authors, from Verne to Bradbury to Herbert to K. Dick to good ol' Isaac. Speaking of which, there's an interesting segment on Harlan too. (Yes, Harlan, you ARE classified as a 'SF author' in this book, but it doesn't truly mean anything. Edgar Allan Poe's in here as well, and unless THE NARRATIVE OF ARTHUR GORDON PYM permanently categorizes Poe as a 'science fiction author', you really don't have much to worry about.)
Here's a couple of quotes from the article, if you want a taste:
"There is something very odd about Ellison as a writer. It helps to explain both his weakness at longer fictional forms and his remarkable strength at the short-story length."
"At his best, Ellison's work is full of a rage for authenticity, an urgency about being human and real in a world of deranging impersonality and evil. His world is an existential testing ground, and the future is a gauntlet that human beings must run."
I disagree with Clute, in that I think Harlan can be perfectly formidable in the novel-length format (I return to ALL THE LIES THAT ARE MY LIFE to confirm that statement to myself), but otherwise the segment reads pretty accurately. Then again, how should I know - I'm not Harlan.
Friends:
Just wanted to call your attention to a recently released anthology titled "Cosmos Latinos", published by Wesleyan University Press and edited by Andrea Bell and Yolanda Molina-Gavilán. "Cosmos Latinos" is the first comprehensive anthology of science-fiction written in Latin America and Spain since the beginning of the 20th Century.
Highly recommended if you want to find out other countries approach the genre.
Alejandro
ME:
The husband suggests "The Encyclopedia of Science Fiction", edited by John Clute and Peter Nicholls. Scotty said it's good, but needs revison.
Melissa
the best encyclopedia of sf
dear anyone,
i picked up a used copy The Visual Encyclopedia of Science Fiction (Brian Ash, Harmony, 1977) awhile back. I like it... lots of nice illustrations and essays on topics. However, I'd really like an Encyclopedia organized like a typical encyclopedia... more current and more author and story-focused, rather than theme-focused.
what are your opinions of the best encyclopedia or encyclopedia-like resource on speculative fiction? feel free to email me directly... and thanks!
ME
And for more fun MLA-hijinks, check out Frederick Crews' hilarious _Postmodern Pooh_.
My favorite bit is when Christopher Robin is revealed as the Mao figure.
Convention fun
Well, I'm jealous as all hell of those of you attending the comics convention out in San Diego. That's a full-on list of attendees!
But I'll carry on and consol myself with Readercon 15 going on right now in Burlington, MA. Spent most of the day listening and chatting with Gene Wolfe, which was quite a treat. He had some wonderfule anecdotes to relate on Borges. And what was the one discussion group we passed on to spend more time with Mr. Wolfe, you ask? "The Closet at Bag-End": a discussion of the unconscious gay impulses in The Lord of the Rings. MLA meets Skiffy!
Later,
Mark
USA
Steve and Stan,
How beautifully y'all have behaved! Would that the pair of you were in Washington representing all of us.
We have all been done in by both sides. The truth lies in the middle.
The middle is where we all belong.
Cindy
Sorry Stan
My pasion got the better of me, Stan. I'm sorry if I used spin in my comments. I think its because I don't see the conservatives in Washington as conservatives, I see them as radicals.
Again my apologies,
Steve Dooner
Susan: a belated Happy Birthday.
To any Palm ebook readers out there: Gerald Kersh's Night and the City was released as a Palm format ebook yesterday; you can find it at www.palmdigitalmedia.com
To Stan: ...and welcome back. Perhaps you see why I usually save the expression of my conservative leanings for the voting booth.
And bests to all.
--tr
Stan, Steve, et al: Just popping in to ask, why do you think American politics is so partisan? Our founding fathers, and George Washington especially, were dead set against the idea of a two party system. Washington believed it was inimical to democracy, and I agree.
Stan, I agree that there's such thing as too liberal and too conservative. But it's not an either/or, black/white deal. It's a spectrum, and there are many valid, important viewpoints that are not covered by the Democratic or Republican Party platforms. I was a Democrat for a decade, until I realized that they had sold out my agenda horribly, and I could no longer support them. I am now a registered Green.
Why hasn't a multiparty system thrived in this country? Does anyone else feel like they're trapped by a power duopoly and resent it? They've convinced us that they're the only game in town; a lot of people I knw don't vote b/c they can barely see a difference in candidates, and b/c they don't think their vote matters in the vast sea of either/or votes.
If every disaffected Dem or Repub took a stand and voted third party, things might have a chance of changing around here. We might actually have a representative government, or closer to it than what we currently have.
But I'm not holding my breath.
PAB
Stan,
"My Democratic beliefs then were that the party was basically for the working man"
Your concern was "for the working man"? So, you became a Republican? I'm sure this isn't the first time you've been asked this: what the hell kind of logic is THAT?
As "corporate" as the Democrats are these days (and I do NOT necessarily vote Democrat; I DO necessarily condemn the hell out of the Republican party), they still provide a better chance for those struggling. The Republicans have unwaveringly, and unashamedly, represented the interests of the wealthy - generally at everyone else's expense. History shows this was true during FDR's time and it remains true today.
Harlan & Susan;
The package arrived yesteday. Many thanks; a holiday in July! Alexa particularly enjoyed the video.
Susan; Sorry your birthday package is slow in coming. I had to wait for it to get here from the mid-west somewhere. Talk to you soon. Cheers, Tim
Mispelled last name correction
Sorry Steve...It is late at night and I am tired I apologize for mispelling your last name. At least this conservative will apologize when he does wrong....goodnight all.
To Steve Donner
I am so sorry if I hit a nerve Steve...but you see I was a Democrat before I changed to Republican...for over thirty years.
My Democratic beliefs then were that the party was basically for the working man...that is not true today. There is such a thing as too liberal and too conservative. I am neither one. I am middle of the road, therefore if Republicans fuck up...I will get on their case too. So...Mr. Donner don't spin me. I am not for the Patriot Act as it is written now...I think more thought should have gone into it. No matter what you say...I have a right to quote Voltaire if I want to...because as a writer I do believe in the First Amendment and I will fight for the right for you or I, or anyone else to write and speak with freedom.
Oh...and I've got the new issue. hee hee hee
Confirmation...
Harlan,
Spoke with Jim tonight. He's excited that you enjoy his book. I'll forward the address and will send you a signed #7 with all speed. He's up for an Eisner this year. An awesome book, I agree.
Jay
Harlan,
Sorry to hear that you won't be able to make it. If for some reason you should though, dinner (or other meal of your choosing) is on me (and that means Susan too). I'll be sure to keep an eye out for the BATTLE CHASERS' issues, on the offhand chance they should turn up (seeing as how Jay's takin' care of your other request).
-Andrew
JAY:
I much enjoy AMELIA RULES, and have since issue #1, so if it isn't too big a Convention imposition, I'd get a kick out of having a Jimmy-signed issue #7.
(And tell him he's late with the current issue, and I'm anxious.)
Many thanks, Yr. pal, Harlan
Sorry...clarification.
Harlan,
Jimmy will be at the San Diego Comic-Con and I'm assuming he'll have back issues there. If you're able to make that lunch, I'm sure Jim would be happy to find a copy. If not, I will send one of mine or have Jim send you one.
Jay
Amelia Rules? Harlan, the author's a friend of mine. I'll get it..signed or unsigned?
ANDREW: Probably not going to San Diego Con. Too busy; and too wearying. Julie Schwartz MAY be recuperated enough to be flown in, and I promised him if that came to be, that I'd bust my hump to get down to have lunch with him and Irwin Hasen. But it's all tentative. After the Con, in any case, most of my friends make the few-hour drive up here to LA for a hanging-out. And there's the final Wolfman after-con bash, of course; and the Golden Apple party. so I get to see quite a lot of the gang.
If you REALLY wanna scrounge for me, I need the following;
BATTLE CHASERS (Image) issues 7 and 9
AMELIA RULES issue #7
Beyond that, what I need is so obscure I wouldn't burden you with trying to ferret it out. But thanks, anyway. If'n you find the 3 items above, I'll count it in the miracle category.
Yr. pal, Harlan
Questions for Stan
I must admit I feel too much like Harlequin these days, and I cannot turn from my commie liberal ways.
With creepy statements by Ari Fleischer, telling us to "Watch what we say, and with corporations like Clear Channel, Disney, and Time Warner teling us what is fit speech and what isn't, there may be only a little time left before we're screaming for our lost rights.
Questions for Stan:
Isn't it the convservatives (Republicans and Democrats) who are eager to curtail our speech rights these days through the Patriot Act and the proposed Patriot II?
When you say "defend to the death your right to say it," aren't you quoting a liberal, skeptic named Voltaire?
As a conservative, are you upset by the "fiscal irresponsibility" shown in spending enormous amounts of taxpayer's money and building up enormous deficits to fight wars indiscriminately?
As a conservative, are you nervous with all the new ways the government can invade your privacy?
As a conservative, are you bothered by enormous ethical breeches, such as the deliberate lies that costs the lives of thousands and that leave America soldiers in a perpetual mire in more than one foreign country?
As a conservative, are you outraged at this administration's substantial links to corrupt corporations, such as Bechtel, Halliburton and Enron?
As a conservative, are you upset that America runs around as the "dictatrix of the world" instead of fixing its problems at home? I thought conservatives liked to stay at home?
As a conservative, are you upset that the federal tax role backs are vastly increasing your state taxes?
As a conservative who is mindful of the establishment clause, are you frightened at this administration's quasi-religious statements about "crusades" and its bizarre attempts to send thousands of Born Again Christians to Iraq to convert the benighted populace?
You see, Stan, the real problem might not be with "gays in the military" or "feminazis" or "univeral healthcare" or "lazy teachers" or "corrupt unions" or "tax and spend" liberals anymore. Nevertheless, I will refrain from anymore politcal discourse until Harlan chooses to weigh in or not weigh in on all of this. Tomorrow I return to all things Harlan.
Stan,
"I might not agree with what you say in here...but because of the First Amendment, I will fight to the death your right to say it."
...I'd like to put ya to the TEST. If you don't survive it I'll look after your Word Processor for you. I may need something to pawn soon.
Stan wrote:
"I might not agree with what you say in here...but because of the First Amendment, I will fight to the death your right to say it."
That's nice. I, for one, will defend people's speech rights because it's the right thing to do... and not just because some Amendment exists.
Haddya yank yer chain on that one, dude. Welcome back.
STAN: "I will fight to the death your right to say it."
Yup; you're a conservative, all right.
(Just joshin' ya ... good to have you here.)
I AM BAAACK!
Well Harlan and gang, I am back. It has been a long month whereby I was prevented to get back on here due to ... two deaths of close friends...puter slowing down cause a parasite got in, plus a myriad of illnesses,crisis and utter procrastination has kept me from expounding on here.
I can tell you, Harlan...like you I am about to throw this damna ble thing in the garbage and just go back to my trusty Brother Word Processor...at least I know how to fix the problems with it when they come up. If all else fails I will even go back to my portable Smith and Corona...boxed away and waiting when the power fails. So be warned...libs...I am conservative...I am Republican (middle of the road) and I might not agree with what you say in here...but because of the First Amendment, I will fight to the death your right to say it.
Response on Vidal
Hey guys,
I've read every column, article and book Vidal has written recently, and I think you're misrepresenting him just a bit. To characterize Vidal's current position, he feels that Bush is guilty of perhaps the greatest criminal negligence in our country's history, and he finds it particularly shocking that virtually none of our senators or congressmen are asking any tough questions at all. When no questions are asked, it leaves us all in an indefinite place where we cannot determine the real truth and imaginations wander. Vidal objects to the new secrecy in our society and to the new powers that have been given to our government. Remember, we don't even have a Freedom of Information Act anymore; it was superceded by the Patriot Act.
Vidal also feels that there is a corporate junta in control of our government and that this junta opportunistically exploits the tragedy of September 11th, giving nice, fat contracts to Bechtel, Haliburton, Occidental, Carlysle and Worldcom. I don;'t think this is not a conspiracy theory, unless The Wall Street Journal is now given to conspiracy theories.
Now the above statement may make me a "wacko," but if so I will live honestly in Wacko-ville.
Vidal does note that Bush had substantial warnings about the attacks, but whether he ignored them out of deviousness or incompetence, he leaves to our imaginations. The position, which you ascribe to Vidal, has never been more than a fearful intimation in any of the speeches or interviews I've seen, and his intent seems to be to raise questions that should be raised: "What did you know, and when did you know it?"
I think Vidal would also insist that Bush ought to be fired by the American people as soon as possible, but he is worried, as I am, that the end of the Republic is at hand. I still have hope, of course, but if election time comes again and Florida is another mess, and elderly folk are scared away from the poles by a sudden Red Alert, and African American votes are once again disenfranchised, will Vidal still be a wacko?
In recent memory, this country almost impeached a president over his brainless dalliances with a buxom intern. However, we have done nothing when massive negligence may have been committed? Well, I will simply say, that's odd.
Lastly, I know of nowhere in Vidal's recent writings where he has says defintively that Bush knew about or planned the attacks. He does, however, say that this opportunistic president has used his greatest and most tragic mistake to cement his re-election, curtail civil rights, endanger our republic and fight a war on entirely false grounds. With such facts, we don't need conspiracies.
However, since this is Harlan's board, I further the question on to him and ask Mr. Ellison what he thinks of Vidal, past and the present.
Steve Dooner
Let's put Bush's apology for slavery into its proper context. For one thing, an apology costs nothing-- Clinton probably knew that when he issued _his_ apology for slavery.
And frankly, given that slavery was practiced in Africa before the West came along, aided and abetted the Western slave trade, and that slavery still _exists_ in certain parts of Africa, I have no respect at all for such an apology. (On the other hand, if Bush had said, "Yes, we had slavery, but we _ended_ it, so why can't the rest of the world?" I'd have cheered.)
Chomsky said nice things about Bush's speech? Where'd that happen? (I'm not being scornful. I'd like to know.)
Frank, yes, Vidal seems a little off the deep end lately. Which is too bad, since he's so good at lancing the right wing. Too often the Left pounds the "war for oil" drum, like this is some kind of bottom-line given. I think the war occurred for a lot of reasons, not the least of which is that Bush and company are morons who lack guts and vision. But to presume that this is all some calculated oil grab is that kind of simplistic, conspiratorial thinking that believes that secret boardroom cabals run everything.
I didn't think Bush actually apologized for slavery, which is something a lot of people want him to do, in the name of the USA. Can you post a link if he did? (Not here, you've used your post per day...how about in your briefing room thread at the forum).
Mark, Harlan has mentioned Gore Vidal, who he admires as a fellow curmudgeon; I don't know how they compare politically, but HE does like him. Vidal is a personal hero of mine, and it is too bad that Vidal's political rants lately have been a bit wacko. I mean, there is no way you can prove that Bush knew about 9/11 before hand. He did know about the possibility of a terror attack, but he didn't actually plan it. Bush would have to be a grade-A monster the likes the world has seldom seen. I dislike Bush, but he is not a monster. Now, Rumsfeld on the other hand...sniff.
------------------
I was shocked; even Chomsky is complementing Bush on his Africa trip. Who would have thunk it. I bet the Ann Coulter right had a fit when Bush appologized for slavery. No, I meant his buying of the Presidency from the auction block. Giggle.
--------------
Somebody said "teat", har har.
Mike, I apologize if this issue has been brought up here before. Does the media's coverage of the Iraq invasion remind you of Harlan's "Glass Teat" books? With both Iraq and Vietnam, the media largely portrayed war dissenters as traitors, and equated criticism of the President during wartime with treason.
The Dixie Chicks backlash could have come straight out of the "Glass Teat" columns. This backlash was orchestrated almost entirely by Clear Channel. I wasn't surprised to learn that the huge radio conglomerate's leaders are staunch Bush backers.
our president
I would like to hear as much as possible as often as possible about how Harlan thinks about our president, his policies and his public speaking.
Harlan,
Out of curiosity. Do you plan on attending Comic-Con this year? As Lynn won't be attending this year, if you have a wish-list, I'd be more than happy to take up the cause (if you won't be able to make it) (god, I sound like such a fanboy, sheesh).
-Andrew
Troublemakers
Harlan, the book is on the way. Please let me know if you haven't received it by next week. Mahalo, Colleen
RICH...
I'm not sure if I meant that cannon fire of insults and threats as an apology. It was a mere acknowledgment not an apology. I THOUGHT.
Troublemakers
Harlan,
I have mailed the copy of TROUBLEMAKERS you requested. Please advise if you haven't seen it by this time next week.
Steve J.
Kicked those Troublemakers out on their asses!
Harlan,
The book is on its way. Let me know if it gets to you okay.
Bill
Troublemakers is on the way
Hi Harlan,
I mailed my copy of Troublemakers this morning and if all runs smoothly, you should receive it by the end of the week. I also included the Globe article on Robert Sheckley that I mentioned in an earlier post.
A while back, my buddy Steve Dooner asked for your opinion of Norman Mailer and I’d like to follow that up and ask for your opinion of Mailer’s contemporary/nemesis/sparring-partner/old friend, Gore Vidal. I have read quite a bit of your work and Vidal’s, and have noticed some strong commonalities. For instance, like you, Vidal has had his share of frustration writing for Hollywood; he also has a deep love for L. Frank Baum’s OZ books (his 1977 essay “The Oz Books” praises both Baum and Ray Bradbury.) I could go on and make this post tedious with similarities, but I’ll stop here and say that I’d like hear your thoughts on Vidal when you get the chance.
Thanks for you time.
Best,
Mark
big woids
PAB wondered:
> I know you've encountered this issue; I believe you
> discussed the phenomenon of "dumbing down" and how
> irksome it is at I-Con. I take it you write as you see
> fit and if someone doesn't get it, oh well. However, I
> think the vocabulary of the average American has probably
> shrunken in breadth over time; lots of new, jargony
> words, less focus on older, more obscure words, even if
> they are the most fitting choices. If I want to publish,
> to break into the world of poetry and fiction, should I
> be more careful of the words I choose? Are you? Would you
> be if you were just starting out now?
If you mean "more careful" in the sense of writing simpler, less accurate words in order to land publishers and readers, I would say NO! NO! NO!
The right word for the right job. No more, no less. If you're going to write accurately, as well as from your deepest heart and soul, you have to use the best words to suit, not ones tailored to an imagined audience. Naturally, people who are unfamiliar with the words you use will accuse you of elitism or deliberately puffing up your prose; pay them no mind. (For someone who really uses weird words that will expand your vocabulary, pick up a collection of John Simon's film reviews; he's Yugoslav born and Harvard educated.)
I'm reminded of a story about Beethoven. He was visiting England and a local violinist noticed a piece that was in progress on a music stand, and remarked that it looked far too difficult to play. Beethoven calmly informed the violinist that the piece was not for him -- it was for the future.
Not that any of us is a Beethoven; all I'm saying is that each creator has to find his or her own appropriate audience, rather than trying to create the audience first in the head and then play to it. It's like trying to find a lover by pretending to be someone you're not; you'll end up attracting people you don't like.
When I was a full-time journalist, I got to review concerts, which I loved to do, because even more than film or book reviews, I got the opportunity to use "off-the-beaten-track" language -- odd words and colorful similes and metaphors -- in the newspaper. See my account of the experience which ran in _Editor and Publisher_ magazine some years ago:
http://www.david-loftus.com/Misc/musicreview.html
I speak there about the complaints I had from editors and how I dealt with them.
Paula, I think she meant to say, "the hot regurgetation", but sometimes, regurgetation is a good thing, especially if you swallow poison.
----------
Harlan, the internet is a great resource, it's just the people who use it are the idiots. But, with Clear Channel America, what else can we expect.
Yes, Rich - slighted! So very, very slighted am I! For I discovered it first! Me, Bjarni Herjolfsson, not YOU, Columbus-come-lately! I found it first!!!! Mine mine MINE!
That is to say, yeah - same guy, Rich - Edogawa Rampo (Hirai Taro). And the short story collection - "Japanese Tales of Mystery and Imagination" - is in print and available through Amazon (or the book dealer of your choice, for that matter.)
He also wrote 31 longer works, none of which has apparently ever been translated into English.
PA: I was intrigued by your question to HE, as I've pondered it lately. As a reader, I enjoy learning words I don't know, whether esoteric, medical, foreign, or from some other root. I can pick up a dictionary and learn something new. There is no rush...all done in the comfort of the home. I'm not missing anything as there is no time pressure to know the meaning of the word the moment it's read. Sip some coffee, look up the word, continue reading. No enjoyment missed. One of the reasons I enjoy Harlan's works is not only the way the story is crafted, but the vocabulary he uses. Great stuff. Any writer or speaker needs to communicate effectively, intelligently and understandably. So, any reader can pick up a dictionary and learn. However, I think, communicating orally could be a bit trickier. As a lawyer, I am very careful to speak in plain english to my clients, because speaking legal-ese to them would probably confuse them and I might as well be speaking Portuguese. No time for them to look up words as I'm speaking to them. However, if I do throw out legal terms, I always define it for them or make sure they are understanding what I'm saying. So, as a speaker, it is important to know your audience and to communicate in a way that is understandable to the general audience. Just my thoughts...
Rob,
Your apology is accepted.
Harlan,
Came across an anthology last night that purported to be the "best" horror story as chosen by renowned writers. I purchased the book (I'm sorry, I can't quite remember the name of it, but it was edited by Greenberg and Martin(?) and seemed to be a series of such books, fantasy, science fiction, etc.) based on your input. You mentioned The Human Chair by the Japanese writer Rampo and said that you would love to see someone's face after the last page was read. Indeed, a very creepy story and I will seek out others Rampo has written.
And, in the interests of full disclosure, I will state READ NO FURTHER IF YOU HAVEN'T HEARD OF THIS GUY OR THIS STORY SO PLEASE SKIP OVER THIS UNLESS YOU WANT TO HAVE YOUR OWN EMOTIONS DISCOLORED that after reading the last few paragraphs of the last page I was immediately angry. Then, upon thinking about this story (because as I walked downstairs into the darkened room and found myself looking at my furniture in a way I haven't before and then felt childish for this unease) I realize I had been had just as the protaganist in the story had been had. Bastard!
Anyway, that lengthy post was a thankyou for pointing me to this guy.
***Doug***
I'm not sure and I'd have to go through past posts, but I vaguely recall a Japanese writer you had mentioned. Is this the same one? The writer you mentioned is in one of my notebooks, but I can't find it at the moment and I don't want you to feel slighted because I found it casually glancing through a bookstore and picked it up because of the Ellison connection.
Don Maass
Hi Harlan,
My reference to Don Maass was tangential and of not near enough consequence to call or write you about. You'd asked me -- I'm supposing out of curiosity -- who Bob's agent was: Don Maass.
Sorry about the cryptic nature of the post, it was completely unintentional.
Best,
Bob
Harlan: Hope you got the Troublemakers books you need. Mine's first edition and not in mint condition, so alas I cannot help you.
Question: Do you ever wonder about alienating your audience by using vocabulary that is not part of mainstream speech or writing? I am part of a writer's group, and one of my cohorts asked if I write with the thesaurus in hand because I use a wide array of "big words." I told him I use the best word for the job, and if people don't get it, that's not my problem. On the other hand, I want people to read and enjoy my work, and they might not if they have to sit down with a dictionary to do so.
I know you've encountered this issue; I believe you discussed the phenomenon of "dumbing down" and how irksome it is at I-Con. I take it you write as you see fit and if someone doesn't get it, oh well. However, I think the vocabulary of the average American has probably shrunken in breadth over time; lots of new, jargony words, less focus on older, more obscure words, even if they are the most fitting choices. If I want to publish, to break into the world of poetry and fiction, should I be more careful of the words I choose? Are you? Would you be if you were just starting out now?
PAB
COLLEEN ... BILL ... STEVE!!!!!!
Yes yes yes yes and yes! Send 'em as per the instructions to Mark. If something other than a signed 1st of TROUBLEMAKERS suits you more, let me know; otherwise I'll assume what I'm sending to Mark (when I get your full mailing info) will suffice.
As for anyone else contemplating ... my needs are filled.
But thank you all, beyond MarkBillColleenSteve. And Rick..take it down now, please, if you would.
I am in y'all's debt.
Lovingly, yr. pal, Harlan
Troublemakers
Harlan,
My copy of TROUBLEMAKERS is a second printing, however it does have one small flaw. There is a tiny dog-ear fold at the bottom right of the front cover, perhaps 3/16" in from the corner. It has been pressed flat on the shelf and looks quite presentable -- indeed, it was there when I purchased the book, but didn't keep me from laying down my $12.95 -- but it isn't mint condition. In every other respect the copy is mint; perfect spine, tight binding, clean. You'll understandably want to hold out for perfection, but if it isn't forthcoming please keep in mind that my mint-minus copy is yours for the asking.
Steve J.
Troublemakers
I have a 2nd printing, mint condition. Is it still needed?
Bill
HE, sorry, mine's a first edition. But good luck on the hunt; I"m sure the troops will pull through for you.
Troublemakers
Harlan,
I've located a copy of the third printing of Troublemakers. Will send to you c/o HERC tomorrow. Hope this helps.
Troublemakers
Hi Harlan,
Done and done. The book will be in the mail tomorrow morning. And the signed first edition is more than okay!
Best,
Mark
RICK: I apologize for the second post and WILL NOT do it again.
Question:
"the hot regurge of living in a liberal, put-down culture"
Could someone please explain to me the juxtaposition of the words "liberal" and "put-down" in this phrase? Am I correct in assuming that Tracy is saying that the "put down culture" in America stems from *liberalism*? If so, I find that hilarious, considering all the name-calling that comes from the conservatives in this country. A small sampling: "axis of evil," "evil empire," "the hot regurge of living in a liberal, put-down culture," the blaming of gays for 9/11 by certain parties, "welfare queens," anything ever said by a conservative politico about Bill Clinton... I could go on but I think the point makes itself.
Tsk, tsk, you shouldn't throw stones if you live in a glass house,
PAB
MARK WALSH: Sensational! Many many thanks. Please send it to the HERC address (Harlan Ellison / c/o The Harlan Ellison Recording Collection / PO Box 55548 / Sherman Oaks, California / 91413), as well-packed and as soon as are convenient for you. Please include your full return address so I can send you a signed 1st edition of the book. Is that an okay trade?
BOB URELL: The oblique sentence >Oh, and by the way, it's Don Maass.< appears in your post. It is like the bumper sticker whose referrents are so obscure, the message of the bumper sticker is lost. (KEEP SKIES STRONG! STOP THE S.C.D.F.!) Pure useless confusion and gibberish result. Clarity is, of course, what one wants in a bumper sticker. And in a message of any sort. Consequently, I have NO idea to what you're referring. I know Don Mass; I know he is an agent and a good one; I'm assuming it has something to do with the Sheckley book; I'm even leap-assuming Don is Bob's agent; but it is mightily annoying for me to have to come back and ask you WHAT exactly "is Don Maass"? as in "It's Don Maass."
And by the way, I KEEP TELLING YOU I am not an internet person, that I virtually never pay any attention to this site for days, and that if you want to communicate with me on matters of business, kindly use my phone, the regular post, or my fax.
Respectfully, Harlan Ellison
Troublemakers
HE, I bought the book about six months ago from Borders, so I'll have to check tonight after work. If it's a 2 or 3, it's yours with my compliments.
One copy of Troublemakers, 3rd edition
Hi Harlan,
I have one copy of a third edition of "Troublemakers". I ordered it from Amazon this past May and have only read the intro so far. The book is in pristine shape and is yours if you need it.
Best,
Mark Walsh
HARLAN ASKS FOR HELP!!!
-----------------------
Help!
It has come to my attention, far too belatedly for this to become anything but a pain in the ass, that my publisher iBooks (with whom my Edgeworks Abbey imprint has co-produced several titles) has gone back to press on the trade paperback edition of TROUBLEMAKERS not once, but twice; and never informed me of the second and third printings. The iBooks operation is a good one, and we turn out nice product, but it is far too overburdened with projects for the niceties of author-publisher liaisons to be observed ... such as advising the author that his book has gone back to press again and again. Thus, I've missed reprint editions necessary for my files, and Tim Richmond's upcoming bibliography, and the universities that keep my papers. This is an ultra-serious matter to me. In fact, I'm furious about it! I need copies of SECOND and THIRD PRINTINGS of this book ... both currently available ... either in your hands or in bookstores.
You can tell what printing it is by turning to what is called "the indicia page." That is to say, the page containing the copyright information and the disclaimer, etc. If it's a FIRST PRINTING the number 1 will still be there in the little line of 1-10 numbers near the bottom of the page. If it's a SECOND PRINTING, the 1 will be gone, and the lowest number in that line will be 2. Same m.o. if it's a THIRD PRINTING, in which both the 1 and 2 will be gone, and the lowest number in the sequence will be a 3. (If you find a copy in which 4 is the lowest number, I will kill Byron Preiss and the iBooks staff!)
I need at least two copies each, mint condition, of the SECOND and THIRD printings of TROUBLEMAKERS. Those who unearth these treasures for me will be richly rewarded. Richly.
Desperately, Yr. pal, Harlan
Yep, the other one
Tracy sniffed:
> It wasn't all that long ago, I encountered a pair of
> middle-age imports from that great city to the North of
> us, Poatland.' The geographical location of 'Poatland'
> was never disclosed. It may have been Poatland,' Alaska,
> or Poatland,' Slavania. They demurred. I assumed they
> were from New England. They were agog that Northern Kentucky
> had not only an airport, but a nice airport. I mean, they
> were totally galvanized by this--sort of like finding a
> parakeet that can recite Dunne, and Trollop. It would never
> do if they had to have a cah' (their pronunciation) meet
> them at a crop dusting establishment, owned by some
> haystack named Ray Bob.
The "Poatland" and "cah" (and maybe even the 'tude) should have been dead giveaways, girl. They were New Englanders. We still pronounce our "r"s out here.
And by the way, assuming you were not speaking of Finley Peter or John Gregory, which Dunnes are prose stylists only, the correct spelling is Donne. John Donne. A somewhat useful mnemonic is the very brief poem he sent his wife when he was tossed in jail: "John Donne, Ann Donne, Undone."
I'm reading Greg Bear's _Dinosaur Summer_ right now, having been mildly impressed with _Darwin's Radio_ a year or two ago. More accomplished than the last new storyteller in the genre I heard raves about, David Brin. I assume HE knows Mr. Bear? They share the same agent, for one thing. . . .
Sorry Cindy oh pal, but I would bet your man Bush would defend Strom at a drop of a hood. Lovemunches.
-------------
Well, it seems Ann Coulter wants the whole of Hollywood to be tried for treason. That leaves Aanold and the right wing gal who gets coffee for the producer. That must be her plan; find a legal way to get Hollywood to stop making so many dumb movies. You my hero Ann. Duhhhh.
Eep! Doubled that link
Sorry for the double posting of that link, everyone. I was so excited about Bob getting some much deserved attention that I hadn't read just two posts down.
Mea culpa.
Getting professional
Hi Harlan,
Jim Sallis sent me this link, and I thought you'd like to see it: http://www.boston.com:80/dailyglobe2/187/living/A_reading_life+.shtml
Oh, and by the way, it's Don Maass. I've already talked to him and things are moving along.
Best,
Bob
Grail
I just listened to "Grail" from A Voice on the Edge again, including the foreword.
And contrary to what is said therein, "Grail" is my favourite Ellison story. Many other stories are grimly satisfying, many are fascinating or weird or creepy; but none of them, not even "The Whimper of Whipped Dogs", not even "Paladin of the Lost Hour" have rent my heart asunder like "Grail" has (though "Paladin" comes closely afterwards).
No reason, I just felt like I finally had to say this.
Praise for Robert Sheckley in today's Boston Globe
Hi Mr. Ellison,
FYI: James Sallis wrote an article in today's Globe about the joys of rereading Robert Sheckley. He beleives that Mr. Sheckley is "our Voltaire" and at the same time, "often neglected - as so often are the true originals."
Here's the link to the article online:
http://boston.com/dailyglobe2/187/living/A_reading_life+.shtml
Thanks for your time,
Mark Walsh
Cindy, don't take it to heart. Where I live, it's becoming a veritable Caesar's Salad of lettuce-headed, tomatoe-brained, bacon bit intellects from all regions of the compass. It has less to do with southern despoliations, and short comings, and more to do with the hot regurge of living in a liberal, put-down culture. If the south must face the Colliseum for having low oxygen to the brain, then their executioners will surely perish with them, if you get my drift. It wasn't all that long ago, I encountered a pair of middle-age imports from that great city to the North of us, Poatland.' The geographical location of 'Poatland' was never disclosed. It may have been Poatland,' Alaska, or Poatland,' Slavania. They demurred. I assumed they were from New England. They were agog that Northern Kentucky had not only an airport, but a nice airport. I mean, they were totally galvanized by this--sort of like finding a parakeet that can recite Dunne, and Trollop. It would never do if they had to have a cah' (their pronunciation) meet them at a crop dusting establishment, owned by some haystack named Ray Bob.
I feel the love, baby, from the bottom of my balmy, inbred, socially catastrophic, and illiterate gullet.
I just finished reading Moore, and Campbell's graphic novel "From Hell." Great book. I don't buy into the royal conspiracy though. My own theory is that Jack, The Ripper was a cop.
Thank you Chuck,
: )
Cindy
Frankie,
Chuck is correct-- read the rest of my post. As I was happily slapping it on with a trowel I didn't realize that I was in danger of obscuring my intent. Barney got it-- but as he said it was only because he reads fast and didn't give in to the storm surge of anger I had playfully induced in him.
I actually loated and abominated Strom Thurmond-- not only for his bigotry and rancid thinking-- but for reasons that would be plain to Southerners more than anyone else.
I despised him for being one of the most enduring reasons why no one ever over-estimates the Southern intellect. Strom and Trent-did more to set back the world's perception of people from the South than even the sublime Southern brilliance of Eudora Welty could increase people's estimation of what we might be.
Strom? No way, man... not be a long shot.
The only good racist is a dead racist. Gangrene spreads.
love,
Cindy
Good Source for Kersh
Harlan was talking about Gerald Kersh's books and where to find them a few days ago, and I would like to point out that alibris.com (an internet network of used book stores) currently offers 29 different Kersh titles, in various bindings and at various prices, including some I've never heard of ("Clean, Bright & Slightly Oiled"?), mostly British editions.
I am not affiliated with alibris, just would like to get the word out about where to find his titles, including the recent I-books reprint of 'Night in The City'. Enjoy!
Barry White dead at 58!! Just when I was having a good day. Pleaseeee, I beg the black community, get regular check ups and eat right. I don't wanna see another great black entertainer dead at such an early age. And you wonder why I am so angry at Strom, the inbred for living so long. Sigh.
--------------
By the way, the new Terminator film sucks donkey balls. Maybe I should just get a cool compress for my head and hide.
Peace out.
My genes are so nice I survived the WASH twice
Two questions:
1) Seeing as how I am a MUTHUH will every patch of my DNA or organ bit that survives me be my religion du jour? Says so RIGHT HERE!
2) You think there's any truth to that syndrome where organ donors "take on" the traits of the donor, or is it a result of the chemical soup that patients are shot up with, so the organ will "take"?
to Mr. Ellison: earthquake in Painesville
Mr. Ellison,
According to the Ohio Seismic Network, on 30 June, a 3.5-magnitude earthquake was recorded beneath Lake Erie. It was recorded as a 2.4 temblor in Painesville. No injuries or damage were reported. We have a monitoring station here at Bowling Green State University and it produced a filtered seismogram of the event.
M. Ellison:
Just finished "The Seven Who Fled" last night, pausing at the PC to find the other titles by Frederic Prokosch. Much thanks for the tip; a quite enjoyable read.
Pity I can't reciprocate with a tome I'd suspect you hadn't read.
Scott
Barney;
First off I'm horrified that anyone would ask that question with the intent of accessing a complete list of blurbs. However, I have included as many as I am aware of.
To Any One Who Cares;
To clarify, I have not "cut" anything for the sake of length (Yes Barn, I noticed you also addressed this further). Indeed if I were to have carried on with my original intent the short fiction section would have been overkill in that it would have included all subsequent appearances; this info was already in the anthology section. Therefore, because the reprints are included elsewhere, the short fiction section states only the first appearance. The non-fiction section works the same way. In any case, with the exception of very few lost bits, it's all there. It is my intention to turn the completed manuscript in to David Hinchberger on July 17 (coincidently Andrea's 40th birthday)as he'll be in town for the NECON. I'll keep you posted.
Barn E.; Stay out of the sun big fella, and give me a call. Tim
RE: organs
Interesting price listing on the organs. Now, I'm no transplant expert, but if you get a bone marrow transplant, the resulting cells produced by the bone marrow should have the DNA of the donor. Given that, if you sell your DNA...would you get more or less for 2 different strains of DNA from the same person? If you committed a crime, would you incriminate your host by leaving their DNA at the scene?
Also:
uhm...err...
Actually, it's "ophthalmologist." But I'm sure everyone knew that already...
I love my genes. My genes are so comfortably lovely.
Phoenix:
They are welcome to offer. Suckers. (Now I have this horrific image of Vinnie DiMucchio grabbing his crotch: "Yeah! I'm Pracktickalley GIVIN' Da Stuff away, HEY!)
You should read "The Organ Grinders" by Bill Fitzhugh for a Elmore Leonard type fun-ride on the subject.
More lost treasures...
Has no one a kind word for Buddy Hackett?
Frank,
Go back and read Cindy's post. Read it all the way through. To the end. Especially the end. The whole thing was a long, clever build-up to a big, wet raspberry for the old mummy. Just read it. Notice I'm not yelling. I'm not angry, and I think you're an intelligent guy. That's why I think if you look at her posting again, you'll see it.
Harlan,
You got kicked off NINE TIMES? Maybe you and Susan need a new provider.
Chuck
Fritz LEIBER
That's Leiber, not Lieber.
Would you sell your body?
Hey Mr. Ellison dude and everyone else!
I wanted to share this with everyone and get your
opinion on it. And the only thing I'm going to say is that
they might be able to put a price on the body, but the soul is priceless.
Now, if you already signed a contract in blood, selling your soul, then disregard my last statement.
__________________________________________
NEW YORK (Reuters) -- It may be illegal, immoral and certainly ill-advised, but selling every usable part of your body could fetch upward of $45 million, according to a survey in the August issue of Wired magazine.
Even an overweight, out-of-shape body could bring millions when broken down to its valuable fluids, tissues and germ-fighting antibodies.
There is, of course, a major catch: Many of the valuable human body parts are those a person could not live without.
But it does lay to rest the old concept that the human body, when broken down to its basic elements, is only worth pocket change.
Wired Editor-In-Chief Chris Anderson said the price tag gives an idea of the progress of medicine and biology, and shows how much more sophisticated we have become at understanding the complexity of the human body.
"We tried to find some number through which you can quantify the magnitude of the change in technology that we are all experiencing," Anderson said.
The prices, Wired warned, are based on maximum dollar values for some of the most marketable substances, and makes the unlikely assumption that every trace of those substances could be extracted from living tissue for sale.
To avoid issues such as illegal black market trade in organs, the survey was based on projected prices in the United States and did not take into account potential differences in poverty stricken Third World countries.
Due to advances in science and biotechnology, vital organs are no longer the most valuable body parts, the survey demonstrated. That distinction now belongs to bone marrow at $23 million, based on 1,000 grams at $23,000 per gram.
DNA, found in every cell, could fetch $9.7 million at $1.3 million per gram, while extracting antibodies could bring $7.3 million. The accompanying article did point out that the cost of living in a sterile plastic bubble could eat up a lot of the profit from immune system sales.
By comparison, a lung was priced at $116,400, a kidney at $91,400 and a heart was worth a mere $57,000, based on research of cost estimates from hospitals and insurance companies.
On the reproductive front, the survey found a fertile woman could sell 32 egg cells over eight years for a grand total of $224,000. To approach that amount, a man would have to make 12 sperm donations a month for 20 years.
______________________________________
Would you sell your body parts?
~~Phoenix~~
*** Tim *** No, I wasn't trying to draw you out. Nor was I trying to create any artificial pressure or any other type of passive-aggressive nonsense. I was simply trying out the new Harlan-saver doohicky by doing the most complicated thing I could think of - copy/pasting an old "Ellison-content" response saved in an old version of WORD along with new text and then walking away for 45 minutes.
Like I said, it was just an old alt.fan.HE response from well over a year ago when the bibliography came up over there. You know if I want to fuck with you I'll just get on the horn and do so directly.
*** Harlan *** I don't aspire to owning all of your blurbs and for that matter, since falling down the Twain collecting Rabbit Hole the way you did with OZ stuff in the 1970-80's I've even slacked off on some of the anthology appearances you've had out lately. Makes me feel like a Catholic eating prime rib on a friday night but I manage.
I think noting the Ace SF specials and the Ellroy and Octavia Butler blurbs you did [and 50 others like Simmons, blah blah blah] are worth doing because they were, if not career makers for those folks, at least career enhancers. Plus, they are usually clever as hell. The full page blurb you did for Death Rattle was hilarious. I suppose the natural extension of this thread would be to ask if there were any stand outs in your mind. Most appreciated, most truncated, most subtle praising with faint damns, whatever.
And while I'm caving and asking you direct questions - I was reading the Fritz Lieber I mentioned the other day and thinking about writing in other authors voices, ie. Lovecraft pastiches or homages or simply attempting to slip into another mode such as Dickensian or Tennesee Williams - so here's the question.
When you attempt something like this, do you study the authors natural vocabulary or do you look at his/her whole page style such as amount of dialogue vs. descriptive passages? Or is it a more gestalt approach where if you have to think about it too hard you'll never quite pull it off. What say you? Hmmm?
- Barney
ps. Dellmayyourotinhellnet? You may yet become a computer sophisticate!
Hi Mr. Ellison,
I know that you have given talks to highschool students on many occassions and I was wondering if you had ever written a story for the kids in real time the way you have in bookstores throughout the years. If you have, I'd love to know what that experience was like. It always struck me that writing a story before an audience is a powerful way to communicate the craft of writing. As a teacher at a community college, I'm constantly trying new ways to get my students fired up about writing, and I think if students had the opportunity to see a writer sit down and produce a story, it would give them a new frame of reference.
Thanks for your time,
Mark Walsh
Rick --
the save/restore thing to the clipboard will indeed work on Internet Explorer for Windows; however, there simply is no way of writing to a file with Javascript other than cookies. Trust me on this, I needed that exact functionality and ended up coding a little Perl server that runs on localhost and which the web site contacts to write stuff to the hard drive. If you (or anyone else on here) would like the source code of that, I can hook you up with it.
Katie Hepburn was a great curmudgeon for most of her life, and if you wanted a salty opinion you got it. I was actually surprised the media was as nice to her obit as they were. No mean spirited jabs from Shlox news either. And her views on religion were napalm to the holy ghost. She thought religious people were complete morons. Not all of them, but she was right, for the most part. If there is a God, then the look on Katie's face when she reaches the pearly gates would be classic. I wouldn't be surprised that she told God to stuff it. lol.
-----------
Cindy, you got off way too easy in your defense of Strom the nappy corpse. I love you dearly, but bad men is bad men. God may forgive the man's spirit, but I'm sure he at least got a stern talking too, on the other side.
The whole gamut of America's many terrorist crimes, and I'm sure Brother Strom was holding the silver key. You only have so many mistakes before you no longer can be forgiven--but forgetting his ass is easy. Here's hoping Reagan and Falwell are next on the dung heap.
CATCHING UP WITH QUESTIONS:
To all of you who worried about my lost postings and inevitable emotional meltdowns, the man I worship as a demi-god, Rick Wyatt, He of the Olympian Intelligence, He of the Preternatural Wisdom, He of the Flowing Golden Mane and Herculean Physique ... demigodlike in every particular, yeah, him ... he seems to have solved the conundrum with a litle saver squiggle. This is my first post using this new system, so we shall see, my having been kicked off DellFuckingMayYouRotInHellNet once already.
ARON DEVIN: Yeah, you come late to the party, whereat we've kicked all this around a number of times; but you seem an earnest lad; and advancing the parade for Kersh is a noble endeavor under any impetus; so I'll make this short and sweet, advising you principally to go to my pal Paul Duncan's website for Gerald Kersh, the code for which someone else will post here shortly, I'm sure.
Start with any one of the books of short stories you can lay your hands on. Amazon, eBay, old bookstores ... you'll find them. Rare, but not impossible. Try starting with the ones that were reprinted here in the States, MEN WITHOUT BONES or NIGHTSHADE AND DAMNATIONS. A few others are SAD ROAD TO THE SEA, THE BEST OF GERALD KERSH, I GOT REFERENCES, THE BRIGHTON MONSTER and other stories, NEITHER MAN NOR DOG, THE HORRIBLE DUMMY, CLOCK WITHOUT HANDS, THE BRAZEN BULL, THE UGLY FACE OF LOVE, GUTTERSNIPE, or half a dozen others. Then go for one of the novels: FOWLER'S END, NIGHT AND THE CITY, THE THOUSAND DEATHS OF MR. SMALL or THE GREAT WASH (which was published in a readily available, though out-of-print, Ballantine paperback edition as THE SECRET MASTERS). Ballantine also did one of his collections, ON AN ODD NOTE, and included "Whatever Happened to Corporal Cuckoo?" in one of the Fred Pohl-edited STAR SCIENCE FICTION anthologies; or maybe it was the lone STAR SHORT NOVELS collection. You could look it up. I thought that was what this lumbering imbecile, the IntuhNet was for? So that guys who wander into the conversation years later can bring themselves up to speed. Or even actually try a library, weird as that may be.
STEFAN HALL: Was there >REALLY< honest injun a 3.4 temblor in Painesville yesterday. Huh? Huh? Huh?
STEVE DOONER: Mailer is cool by me. We spoke only once, via telecon, around the time he was actually, physically stabbing his wife, or pushing her down the stairs, or whatever. Memorable phone call, I could hear the action in the background. I'm not sure he even knows I'm alive. But I admire the old lion. He's still got good chops, no matter how long the tooth, so screw his critics.
SHERYL: You're mixing apples and orangutans, kiddo. The recent passionate outpouring of hatred for Strom Thurmond, and the glee at his demise, has nothing to do with Katherine Hepburn, nor everyone's adoration and reverence for her. They were two separate entities, duhh. And just because I praise Harry Truman, does not mean that I dismiss Abraham Lincoln, or more appropriately, Harriet Beecher Stowe. Just because I won't eat lima beans, does not mean that I don't admire the sculpture of Brancusi. Just because I don't want prostate cancer, does not mean that I'm not pleased the Curies discovered radium. Just because... Well, you get it. Apples and opthalmologists. It is not only unfair to chastise Webderlanders for their fixation on Thurmond--particularly in the light of this current and lemminglike, disingenuous panoply of oblations saturating the tube, simply because the tenacious fuck held onto life (probably by way of a pact with some scrofulous demon with no ethic whatever) far longer than a Universe That Cares would've permitted--but it is illogical. People are weird, Sheryl (no shit, Ellison), but nonetheless and finally, at core the thing to remember is this: LIFE IS NOT A COMPARISON OF CHAMBER OF HORRORS. Just because we Jews had a rough row to hoe with the Holocaust, does not mean that we truly understand what life is like for a Native American or a Gentleman of Color. Comparison is invidious. Try to keep your focus; not everything links to everything else; apples and oranges. Thurmond and Hepburn were in different worlds; worlds apart. It would be barmy (as the Brits put it) for someone to say, "Yeah, Strom Thurmond sucked runny eggs, but wasn't that Kate Hepburn a barn burner?!?!" See: makes no sense. Neither, really, and meaning no offense, does your squawk. Defies logic, which is bad for your complexion.
BARNEY: Good luck on finding all my blurbs, encomia, rates, recommendations, and trivial asides. F'rinstance, and just to make you a little crazier, over the transom and into this house last week came a HarperCollins advance reading copy of the collected "Truckers" books by Terry Pratchett, titled THE BROMELIAD TRILOGY, and right there on the front cover is a quote I gave the first book of the three about ten, fifteen years ago. I've pretty much ceased blurbing books, because of bad experiences with the authors of those I refused to praise, and a lot that I actually did, such as for Loren Estleman's THE MASTER EXECUTIONER, which was cavalierly ignored by the Tor/Forge editor, and was neither on the hardcover nor the paperback, after they'd chivvied me for it, to meet an impending deadline. Though it WAS disseminated via pr insert in review copies. So, good luck, old chum.
CHUCK: I cannot poet. Cannot poetize. Can't write poems, posey, or poetry. (Neither can "rap poets," but that's another keg'o'worms for another time.) Tom Disch will back me up on this, my utter lack of talent for iambic pentameter. Never could, never tried very hard, never wrote any. All the poetry I care about writing is in the cadences and rhythms of my prose, a trick I learned from Prokosch in THE SEVEN WHO FLED (are you paying attention, Aron Devin?) and which enhances my joy as I write. But poetizational practices? Nay, I say.
And that brings us up-to-date. Now let's see if this new Wyattscience works as well as we think it will, my having been DellNet-booted-off a total of nine times since I began.
Yr. pal, Harlan
Harlan, when you can get around to it, could you post the name of the novel Donald Westlake published pseudonymously after The Ax? (I thought you'd said The Busy Body, but that can't be right.) Many thanks.
Safe Posting!
Okay, well, I finally bit the bullet and taught myself enough Javascript to do what needed to be done. I think I was able to do in four hours (learning time included) what would have taken a decent web programmer about 10 minutes.
Cookies would have been great but they are limited to 4000 bytes and tests showed Harlan's longer posts exceed that. What I wound up doing was having the page write to the windows clipboard when a message is sent or previewed and added a new Retrieve button to pull it back up. I also added a Save button for people that get nervous during long posts. This should be safe because it does the save before it tries to post the form - so if the internet is down, browser crashes, whatever, the post is saved.
The disadvantage is it's not permanent storage so if you have to reboot the post is lost. If anyone wants to come up with a version that works just like this but saves the post to a permanent storage space (like a hardcoded filename C:\post.txt or maybe a more complicated program that breaks the post up into multiple cookies), I'd love to have that additional safety. It can be hardcoded to Internet Explorer 5.0 or greater since I would load it directly onto the Ellisonian hard drive.
I got Harlan on the horn and he brought up the new posting page and it seems to be working for him. So hopefully this is the last time you or I will hear about a beautiful post ruined.
Barney;
Are you trying to draw me out? Who the Christ asked that question? I'll be back with a longer response to clear that milky water later. Tim
Excellent points about Hepburn, Sheryl. So why are so many of us angry about Thurmond? Speaking for myself, I'm angry because his record is being whitewashed, and the media seems to have forgotten what life in America was like during the Jim Crow era. Thurmond spent most of his political career defending American apartheid. We must never forget that.
Barney, please be sure to keep us up-to-date on that little project. You mentioned it to me a year or so ago and the idea still sounds fantastic. Could/would a grant of some sort defray the costs of the thing?
Can I say one good thing to say about Strom Thurmond? To paraphrase Bette Davis, yes I can: Strom Thurmond is dead. Good.
Now on to more pleasant things.
If you've got a moment, Harlan, I was just wondering....
You've written essays, Novels, short stories, just about every kind and mode of fiction known to human civilzation (except romance novels).
My question: Have you ever tried your hand at poetry? Your prose seems to show a knack for poetic language, but have you ever taken the plunge? Have you ever wanted to?
Chuck
this is a test...
What follows is an answer to a question someone asked me regarding Harlan's blurbs for various and sundry books - would they be included in the upcoming bibliography? This answer originally appeared on alt.fan.harlan-ellison awhile back. I am posting it here again for two reasons. First, based on a recent conversation with Tim Richmond I think he is REALLY on the cusp of turning this thing in. Second - I am trying out the bells and whistles on the new "post saver" feature. This has so far been left open for 45 minutes and required cut/pasting and line editing. I'm betting there are still typos because I am a bit sun-fried today. Now I shall try the preview feature, he said, crossing his typing fingers...
***********************************************************
There may be a page or so of those kinds of citations in the miscellaneous section of the upcoming Harlan Ellison bibliography "Fingerprints On the Sky" compiled by Tim Richmond and coming out this XXXXXX from Overlook Press. It was quite a few hundred pages in it's most recent incarnation and a few things may have been cut for length. I helped assemble that particular data so I lobbied for its inclusion because some of those citations represent a 1/2 page of text and illuminate some of Harlan's tastes and preferences.
This is not to say that without those this bibliography will be in any way incomplete. ALL of the citations any sane person could ever possibly want will be included but there was some doubling up of data.
For instance, in one version of the checklist you would have been able to track each appearance of a story or essay from it's original appearance through each subsequent instance of publication. The problem there is that it duplicates the information in the anthology section and/or the magazine
section while not adding anything to the overall content except an alternate way of breaking down the information. "Repent Harlequin!..." alone could have added 20 pages if we had started with it's original appearance and then listed all of its reprints off of that citation.
I can say the fanzine, magazine and foreign edition sections will have suprises even for the hardcore collectors.
- Barney Dannelke [HERC member #1]
it just amazes me....
Even though I haven't posted in months, I still check in regularly--I have to say that I'm just--well to tell the truth I don't know if I'm astonished or appalled--that everyone (including you, Harlan) has spewn such an amazing amount of vitriol and with such energy in all directions over a man like Strom Thurman--and yet barely a single line acknowledged the passing of a woman who truly changed the world for the better--Miss Katharine Hepburn.
Much of the earliest civil rights movement was intertwined with suffrage and women's rights, and Mrs. Katherine Martha Houghton Hepburn and her husband were in the thick of it all. Young Miss Katharine learned from her earliest days to value human beings, and to stand up for herself, and what was right as she saw it. She never hid what she believed, and lived very clearly according to her beliefs, with little regard for any approval except that of her family and friends. There were times it cost her in the short run, but in the long run...what a life, and what a legacy!
Whether the likes of Betty Friedan or Gloria Steinham or any of the current NOW-cow herd would acknowledge it or not, the "feminist" movement of the 70's was in no small part due to the cultural influence of Miss Hepburn in particular on their mothers and aunts in the 40's and 50's. She set a standard that not a single one of the femininst theorists and rabble rousers who followed her has ever met--to be both a practincing feminist, and a lady of impeccable manners and breeding. When womankind can with regularity achieve the grace and intellectual standard of this amazing woman, who has inspired generations of us in innumerable ways, the world will indeed be a better place.
Strom Thurmond, my left butt cheek. To quote Lerner and Loewe, "Who gives a damn?" Let the dirt return to dirt, as it belongs. After 100 years, he leaves nothing in this world of any value, not even an opinion worth quoting, and isn't worth the time or energy to say anything more than that about him. Spend your time considering rather how to spread the legacy of integrity and fellowship that is left us as human beings by Miss Kate.
Resting Easy
Harlan : Thanks for note. I'm smiling! And by the way...Todd put your books in the very best spot in the house. A bookcase away from all the others. No other books can be near yours! I thought a spot next to Stephen King's bookshelf would be ok. Apparently not! The spot I picked was not good enough, oh no.
Chuck : More smiling from me. Like I said before--you are a sweetheart.
Bye all!!
Todd had a large chunk of his ass eaten for breakfast and even on the farthest reaches of Madagascar you can hear the burp. Toddie, my sweet, hope you have lots of ointment. Oy.
------------
I was going to bring up Ann Coulter's awful new book, but I better be smiles and light for today. This room is in shambles. Love and froggie kisses.
Thanks, Ryan. Yer a real pal.
I'm not Brian Siano. I'm just a friend of his named... er, Ryan. And he asked me to post that he's not snickering about other people getting flamed over posting twice. He asked me to say that he feels bad about it, even though his second post was exceedingly short and definitely of interest to other readers, he did apologize with the perfectly decent understanding that it'd be regarded as a minor transgression, and it shouldn't even be considered a post, really.
Signed,
Ryan Stano
(Friend of Brian Siano, posting from another computer entirely, in fact, from an entirely different state.)
Two items of interest
Harlan,
I thoroughly entertained a crowd of people all last night with only two of the jokes I heard from you on Tom Snyder. It was the absolutely great "crucifixion or 5,000 bee stings" joke that slew them. My thanks, Mr. Ellison.
Also, I just thought I would mention that Norman Mailer wrote a piece for the New York Review of Books that just got posted on their website. It's about Bush Inc. as well as the "flyboy/ jumpsuit escapade" aboard the Abraham Lincoln.
I have never heard your thoughts on Mr. Mailer or his work, but I thought I would pass along the link since it is apropos of the current discussion on the board. Here's the link:
http://www.nybooks.com/articles/16470
Real glad I haven't been stung 5,000 times,
Steve Dooner
A suggestion....
Why not write long posts in Micro$oft Word or some other program (e-mail client, even) where you can save, then copy and paste into the posting window? That's what I do for longer posts. Just a thought.
A possible solution to Harlan's problem . . .
If his printer doubles as a scanner, then there's a relatively easy solution to the lost post quandary: Harlan types his reply on his manual, scans the pages into the computer, pastes the text into the submission box, and posts it as usual. This way, he writes on the machine he's most comfortable with, his words are absolutely-one-hundred-percent guaranteed not to disappear into the ether, and Rick doesn't have to screw around with any pesky java script. True, Harlan will have to negotiate the whole cut-and-paste fandango, but if he knows that his replies will never be lost again, he may be more than willing to do it.
Of course, if he doesn't own a scanner, then this post is irrelevant, and we're all back where we started. (Hey, whaddya want for unpaid labor?)
There are a variety of assistive technologies designed to help people not lose data. It would help if we knew HE's setup. Mac or PC? Explorer or Netscape? Has he ever, or would he ever, touch a word processor, even a basic one like Wordpad or SimpleText?
HE could write in a basic WP with frequent autosave turned on (and saves would go to desktop for easy retrieval), then a macro or batch file could copy text into a Pavilion box. That's the trick...copying and saving is easy to code, but inserting into the web page without using Java is tough...
To "rich",
"One bit of advice: Stick to Kubrick and simple shapes before tackling complex math like adding".
I doubt YOU could recognize a math problem any better than you know how to capitalize your own name!
But - nah - you keep playing with your simple shape. I wouldn't want to take that away from you. It's all you have.
Da fact iz…I found out I was supposed to be slappin’ BRIAN up for the double posting ("Sorry to post twice, but this is of interest: Screenwriter Frank Pierson writes about the decline of films at..."). I accidentally crossed posts, as we ALL do now and then, and YOU had to take the rap - with BRIAN looking on from the sidelines, snickering relentlessly. Shows what a great cop I’d make. But what’d you EXPECT from Barney Fife? Yet, maybe it was the will of Todd's god. Yeah, blame Todd's god - not ME.
Da fact iz…I’d be offering a humble apology had you not taken that shot. Now, things being as they are, the BEST I can offer is dragging your BORING ass into a dark, wet, grimy ally(!!!) and beating your head in with your own simple shape, small as it might be. We mesomorphs are good at that sort of thing.
...and ERIC:
Nope. You still don’t got it. When will you droogs learn I’s always right?
Java
As I mentioned in my request, the html page would be stored on Harlan's computer. So the concerns about the unreliability of the internet, bandwidth, etc. don't really pose a problem. I also don't want to make it part of the main site as one of my standards for webderland is that I don't invade other people's computers in with cookies, local files, traces, etc.
However, the javascript limitation Gunther mentions is a killer. A java applet like Andrew suggests might be the best since the bandwidth is not an issue if it's run locally. Ideally, all the app would need to do is keep a local copy of the comments field, open a socket connection to harlanellison.com, and send the form request through. But if there were an easy solution, I'd have done it. I hand-coded the search and display functions for this board in php and the posting code is a HEAVILY modified perl guestbook script. That's why I need someone with some hands-on experience.
I've given Harlan instructions before in using notepad, as well as hitting CTRL-A CTRL-C before sending the post. The problem with this is that Harlan, like most of us, often doesn't know when he starts to respond if something is going to turn into a full-fledged rant or essay. It's also hard enough to get someone who's used to a manual typewriter to spend any time in front of a computer keyboard to post WITHOUT requiring arcane commands or unusual steps. So what we want is something just as easy as posting.
Looks like that's not going to be as simple as I thought it MIGHT be, but thank you for the advice. If you know any better approaches or someone who could tackle the job, I'm still all ears.
One amendment to my previous post: Ol' Strom was apparently a supporter of interracial relations when it involved himself: http://slate.msn.com/id/2085087/
Rick,
I agree with the previous posts regarding Javascript. It ain't gonna work (not well anyway). There are a couple of other alternatives that may work though;
1. Toss is some code that sends a copy of the post to the poster's email addy. This has the added benefit of being easy to find later. A second email field could be added to the current form so that posters wanting to keep their email private could still do so. Those not wanting a copy sent could just leave the field blank. This doesn't solve problems with major crashes but does have the benefit of being reasonably transparent to the end user.
2. An embedded Java applet. There's lot's of free applets that provide this service. This can be a major bandwidth pig and may not be very user friendly.
3. Netscape 7.x (or Mozilla 1.x). Gives the user the option to save the data input into a form for later use. Would require a minor change on the part of the user and would not put any added burden on the current system. Drawbacks include, a lengthy download of new software and the data is not saved in an easily recalled format.
The only other option that I can see as workable is the copy'n'paste method that has been suggested numerous times. This is one method that I think Harlan might find tedious.
I dunno, maybe someone else has an option that none of us have considered yet.
Jon Stover, thanks so much for posting that Smoking Gun link. I can't bring myself to read the fawning eulogies over Strom Thurmond. The media seems to have forgotten what the hell the civil rights movement was all about.
Thurmond's hateful resume includes the "Southern strategy" he concocted with Nixon in 1968. This was an appeal to racism using code--"welfare queens," "criminal element," "decent, hard-working, law-abiding citizens," and so forth. Although designed to break the Democrats' already weakening hold on the Solid South, it also worked disgustingly well in the North. I understand the "Southern strategy" was designed as a counterattack against George Wallace's success in the '68 primaries.
If there is a Hell, Thurmond is in Satan's movie theater with Wallace, Lester Maddox, Bull Connor, etc. (feel feel to suggest other racists' names here) with their eyelids propped open like Malcolm MacDowell in "A Clockwork Orange." And what is Satan forcing them to watch? Interracial porn flicks for all eternity.
correction...
Not that anyone truly cares, but I should say "Mr. or Ms." since I have no idea and it was sexist of me to assume one or the other.
(you can take the gun away from my temple now, Ms Schlafly.)
Copy/Paste
I'm inclined to agree with Mr. West. I think the best way to do avoid the problems is to use "Wordpad" or a simple text editor and "copy/paste" the data. Of course, it wouldn't be necessary for smaller, less critical essays, but if it's a topic that brings out the Ellisonian Rant it may be the best thing to protect it.
It would also be easier than introducing more code or a new browser window. If the server or ISP crashes, it won't matter if there's a Save button because just as likely the crash will take place while it saves and you'd STILL lose the data. I can't tell you how many letters I've composed in hotmail or yahoo where the server was too busy to send and it erased the post. That's happened saving drafts, too.
Lost Posts
Rick --
unfortunately -- I've been looking into this since I need it for a project as well -- JavaScript won't let you write to any file except a cookie, period; and cookies are too small.
Now, it could be done in VBScript, but that's only if the browser used is Internet Explorer and the security settings are pretty low, which isn't a good idea.
What could be done is a little application that (similar to F. West's suggestion) sits there waiting for input, is able to save and restore it and submit it to the bulletin board; I seem to recall Mr. Ellison has a Macintosh, though, so I'm out of my depth on this one.
Harlan's missing messages...
Rick (and Harlan),
While penning a truly long and important missive, I would NEVER trust an internet interface, even one as smartly designed as this, because they simply have too many inherent bugs and big chunks of change are so easily swallowed whole in the misty ether of cyberspace. Java script is not the answer, no matter how you program it. A far better strategy would be for somebody to show'n'tell Harlan (assuming he doesn't already know his way around his own computer's capabilities...and if he does, I apologize for the unsolicited assuming) how to write up his messages in whatever "notepad" program lurks in his operating system, and then he can copy'n'paste them here when he's done. If the web site eats the message, he'll still have the original copy and he can try again. Why fiddle with the uncertainties of more complex programming (especially Java script...yech!) when a VERY simple computer usage skill can solve the problem quite nicely?!
That's my single meager posting for the year (you folks are far too wise and knowledgeable for me to add anything of usefulness to the many worthy threads initiated in this forum), and now I will go away and watch from the wings like I normally do.
Hope I've helped.
Ta!
F. West
Thanks to the posters who responded to my query for sources & ideas about "Soldier," "Demon with a Glass Hand," and "The City on the Edge of Forever." My presentation was well received but had nothing to do with the 3.4 magnitude earthquake in Painesville yesterday.
Gerald Kersh
Hello Harlan,
It is to that noble, word-knighted saintly quality I appeal; on behalf of furthering my justification for memebership in the literary "Intelligentsia Ellison" club I implore you, although I am assured by your previous pithed posts you have heralded the call before: I am beginning my quest for the elusive, and I use the word elusive as his works are out of print, Gerald Kersh and was wanting, if your time and efforts allow, a neophyte's list for those books worthy of an introduction to this man's work. As my grandfather has left me nothing but a large purse to persue my education I have decided to spend the next year devouring all those precious books I have neglected before due to prior 9 to 5 commitments that I no longer have the need to abide by. Huzzah! I am asking this as I have read most, if not all , of your work (even "Doomsman") that does more than entertains...it informs, spurns, angers, and resolves to move the minds and hearts of those readers fortunate enough to possess even a minutia of the spirit and heart that spawned them. In light of this literary illumination and the truths it has shown me, I beseech your recommendation for the genius dubbed Kersh.
Thank you,
Aron.
P.S.- I could have written, "What are your favorite books written by Gerald Kersh?" but I'm trying to catch your attention by jumping through verbal hoops here.
DEB: Shunt aside your apprehensions. I am in no way "mad" at Todd. Hell, you should've been a fly-on-the-wall here at the house today, as the newscasts carried the eulogizing of Strom Thurmond, merely because he finally got around to taking the dirt nap. THAT was mad; in the correct use of the word, as opposed to its usage of merely being "angry." Susan had to turn the fire hose on me.
Respectfully, Harlan
The Smoking Gun
Ah, the Smoking Gun. It's amazing what they dig up. For one interesting bit related to Strom Thurmond, go to http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/dixiecrat1.html
Cheers (and Happy Canada Day), Jon
Deb,
Todd wouldn't be the first here to have been scolded (scalded?) by Harlan Ellison. If I read our patron author correctly, if Todd were out of Harlan's universe altogether, he'd know it under no uncertain terms. I don't know Ellison, he don't know me. But, I get the impression that he's a pretty honest guy. Really honest. Now Todd can get a smoking "E" shirt from Lynn. The smoldering badge of courage.
Chuck
I'm sitting here listening to an awesome new record as I read some of the messages here. It is "More Conversations In Swing Guitar" by Duke Robillard and Herb Ellis.Still job hunting, went to a job fair today and expect to hear back on some of my previous applications by Friday so maybe you'll get rid of my more often postings soon. It is really wierd how to use up all the extra time when you do not have a job. Bye for now. Roger
Lost Posts
****Oh! If only the post Harlan wrote with Todd in mind over that whole Thurmond thing had been lost! If only Todd had never wrote that in the first place!! I could have spent a few less nights being depressed over Harlan being angry with Todd. And worrying about how Todd REALLY felt about that. As I unpacked tons and tons and (no kidding) tons of books by HE ( various editions with various covers )and placed them on a few newly purchased bookcases in an honored spot in our new home, I felt pretty bad thinking Todd's God had some bad feelings about us. Todd loves to push that envelope. I live with it every day. But truly--Todd is a great human. You just gotta get past the BS. And he loves Harlan to death.
Terminator 3
This article on T3 (http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/tribune-review/s_141980.html) mentions Harlan's lawsuit against James Cameron. (Of course, the paper had to call Harlan a "science fiction writer." Ugh!)
About T3, I read the plot synopsis and the Ebert review, and I didn't find anything that looked like fresh thefts from Harlan's stories. Of course, Cameron doesn't appear to be involved with this installment.
Java, anyone?
I don't know enough javascript to make it happen - but does someone here know someone who could make a little script for Harlan that I could include in a .html page that he could store on his home computer? The page would be just like the Pavilion submission page but would call the script instead of performing a form submission. The script would:
- Write the contents of the 'Your comments' box to a textfile if a new "Save" button is hit.
- Retrieve the textfile into the comments box if a new "Retrieve" button is hit
- Save the comments to the textfile and then perform the submission as normal if "send message" is hit
If we had this, Harlan could hit "save" whenever he gets nervous he has typed too much and might lose it, and even if he didn't hit "save" the system would save his text when he tried to preview or post. We'd have to lose the preview box as I think that would introduce too much complication and I don't think he uses it anyway.
This would be a HUGE boon for the website as I can't tell you how many long Harlan posts we've lost that you never heard about. Anyone up for it?
Also, on the subject of subjects, I didn't have any problem with the "kraut bitch" discussion being in this forum. The only problem was the violation of the one post per day dictum - if some of you guys hadn't screwed that up it would not only have remained here but you'd have gotten to read quite a rousing screed from HE on the subject of political correctness. In the event it is thought that due to the relevance of the topic it should have been given special dispensation, I note that not only was Harlan in agreement with moving it but he thanked me for helping keep his little corner here the way he likes it.
Rob, they ain't "my vile laws." Just my own close critical Cleanth Brooks-esque reading of the preamble:
--Here's the deal. This is Harlan's little breakfast nook at Webderland. When he's not here, we chat about him and his work. When he is, we act like we're guests in his home. That's about all there is to it.--
You obviously have a much broader interpretation of that, more a Northrop Frye take, and that's...ok. I was just suggesting that for those who seem unable to contain themselves to one post per day, maybe a tighter adherhence to the aforementioned blurb would be helpful.
Now, just to get it out of the way, and since I normally never contribute to the death watch that's a perennial fave in this forum....Buddy Hackett, RIP. And to follow the guidelines: didn't HE do some script doctoring on The Love Bug?
Kidding.
RICH & STEVE DOONER:
Twice, this past hour and a half, I sat here and wrote out at long and exhaustive length, answers to you two. Rich's question about "Run, Spot, Run" -- and Dooner's question about Roddenberry's persistent pilferage of other people's ideas.
Fascinating, stimulating, eloquent replies.
Both times, after 45 minutes of essay, this f%$@4!+ing pc and the chaos of Dellnet knocked me off, froze up, went bugfuck, and ate the posts. After the first one, I bit down hard and started over. After the second fuggup, I threw my claws in the air and said NO MAS! Sorry, boys, but you'll never get them queries requited.
Wearily, having sent off the book of Thinking Machine stories to my editor at Random House/The Modern Library yesterday, I remain, blasted and exhausted, Yr. pal, Harlan
Eric, this may be a limited monarchy but your vile laws are TOO far-reaching...
First of all, the "kraut bitch" thread was perfectly at home HERE...simply because Harlan participated in it. The debate evolved as several of us had our own thoughts to add. That's the nature of a forum, whether it's in Springfield or Shelbyville. And Harlan doesn't HAVE to ask himself how it's "relevant" to his work; if he's compelled to respond to a comment that's his gut and passion. We do have latitude here. And I submit to the jury incontrovertible proof of this: 10,000 letters alllll addressed to Santa Claus! Uh...I mean...scroll back roughly a month and you'll find Harlan's OWN summation in response to a newcomer, who was pretty much posing the very question, "what does this have to do with Harlan's work?".
That leads me to your second oversight, "it had nothing to do with Harlan, his work, or his ramblings on this board". We are free to share our passions or experiences here...for the simple reason that Harlan's writing reaches into so many regions of interest; his essays stretching some 40 years dive into film, science, politics, sociology, history, gourmandism, "living", his roots, and god knows what I'm leaving out (Clearly, Harlan was a practical strategist while becoming a writer, choosing to cut into as many markets as possible. Very smart move). As a result you or I might touch on thoughts or experiences Harlan would find interesting - as he often seems to - whether or not he's compelled to respond (as he did with Justin), injecting the element of surprise.
For these reasons I get into topics like science, filmmaking, film history, Holmes, and Dickens and so on. In the end...even though here Harlan and his work ARE the focus of interest, the only true constraint is ONE-A-DAY. Stick to THAT and you're GENERALLY alright. Personal whim is not verboten.
What's really behind this "verbose" response is the issue of the "kraut bitch" thread. I was sharing some important history - violations of human rights in the U.S. among the most insidious I'd ever seen - I'd learned only recently...and was ROYALLY appalled by. They were events I never knew about. One really tore me apart. It's a discussion - a potential offshoot from "kraut bitch" - that belonged HERE...because in ALL frankness, whether or not he chose to respond, only Harlan's input about it would have meant THAT much to me (though I certainly would have been anxious to read other reactions as well). The "relevance": Harlan spent years taking on and writing about the violation of human rights and ringing it by its dirty little neck. So...I didn't dig it at all when that thread (well, MY post anyway!) was removed. I ACCEPTED it; but I hated it. At some point I may re-post part of it, to convey my experience as I took it in; it was quite visceral. As far as I'M concerned...THAT belongs HERE.
The Pentagon's dangerous visions
If any of you are interested in a terrifying fulfillment of the ideas of H. G. wells, Heinlein and Ellison. Check out the Guardian's capsule story on the Pentagon's new super weapons. In the link below, they describe the new weapons that will be launched from space so that we may instantly strike anywhere in the world. It's called FALCON (Force Application from the Continental U.S). Because they don't want all the bother of having to set up forward bases, such as the one we used in Kuwait, they intend now on spending trilions of dollars for new weapons systems that fire from orbit.
I remember how J. Michael Stracynski's Babylon 5 climaxed with the planetary defense systems being turned back upon the planet earth by an evil "American" president. We may not be too far away from that.
Here's the link if you want to see for yourselves:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/usa/story/0,12271,988612,00.html
Also:
After all this Strom Thurmond discussion I reread "From Alabamy With Hate" (anthologized in The Essential Ellison). I recommend it to anyone interested in Harlan's views on Civil Rights.
Steve Dooner
(keeping to one post a day)
hell-raising
Nice work, Michael. Glad to see you're writing on a regular basis again. My wife Carole has been polling everybody she knows to try to figure how Bush can retain such solid support despite all the awful things he's done to and with this country. Here's hoping one of the more interesting Demos can break away from the pack and inspire the country before the next national election.
The Oregonian wouldn't print any more than the first paragraph (yesterday) of an op-ed I submitted about one of last week's Supreme Court decisions, but they did put the entire thing on Oregonlive:
http://www.oregonlive.com/public_commentary/oregonian/index.ssf?/base/editorial/1056974320287460.xml
Now for the obligatory Ellison content. I remember HE mentioning (probably in one of the "Valerie" columns) that he had allowed his home to be used for skin magazine photo shoots a number of times. Was this the famous "tree house" or Ellison Wonderland itself? Could you identify any particular pictorials that featured your home as the setting, sir? I'd love to try to track down copies. . . .
Who's never posted twice in one day on this forum
Bern,
Many thanks, Andy. I thought I was going to have to wait until just after midnight to address the double-posting bit. I actually thought about addressing the grammatical error in my last post, but I agree with Todd for the most part and don't think it's worth breaking the rules on this forum just to show someone that I proofread *after* I already posted.
Rob,
One bit of advice: Stick to Kubrick and simple shapes before tackling complex math like adding.
Your One Post a Day Guy for Things Ellison Related and to Defend My Honor,
Rich
Wow.
Hey Cindy...
That's better than the version you showed me some months back. Your little girl is adorable and quite talented. I've never heard DeNiro done in a band uniform...and it remains menacing. :)
I'll put my two-cents in on Trigger Street once I have some sleep. Believe it or not, it came up as an assignment, so my review will mean something!
Going to bed now.
WARNING: Shameless self-promotion ahead
Regarding the relative merits of the current White House resident, here's a trifle I penned a couple of weeks ago -- my return to weekly column writing after a six-month hiatus.
http://www.columbian.com/06102003/clark_co/45395.html
As you can see, I was a bit pent up. Missed a whole bloody war, after all. But the piece seems to have struck a chord: I've received more than 70 email responses from all around the country, mostly positive. Which means either there's hope, or we're all going down together.
Best wishes to all.
Zuz
Todd,
Yeah you got jumped on. You expected...what? Exactly what happened. After all, most of us are *gasp shudder* Lib-burl In-nuh Leck-shuls. Yes, like the flying monkeys from OZ, people came down on you, including Harlan Ellison. Hey, if you're going to be burned, get burned by the best. But, then I think you knew that. And, I think you know that we all like you. The fact is this board NEEDS a few conservatives just to keep our heart rates up, if nothing else.
Maybe the statements about Harlan "putting you in your place" were a little overstated, (note the ironic understatement) it's only for two reasons: One, you pushed some buttons that were inevitably going to get a heated response, and Two, folks like you, and your posting was worth a response. That puts you one up on most of us, without any overt grand-standing.
So, as you would tell us, relax. T'ain't nothin'. But then you probably already knew that.
Chuck
Multiple postings
It seems to me that if people followed the premise of this board, which is to only post messages to Ellison or discuss things Ellison has written or said (here, in his professional appearances, or in print), one post a day would be no problem.
I've tried to post with that in mind. When I feel verbose, Rick and Lynn have set up a huge forum where we can all rant at will, at length, and ad nauseum.
Rick's moving "the kraut bitch" thread over there was a perfect move, since that's the kind of topic that should be discussed there. Why it was even started here is the question the writer didn't ask himself...it had nothing to do with Harlan, his work, or his ramblings on this board. Nor did it even solicit feedback from HE, although it got some, I suppose luckily. It WAS in the spirit of the old board, where we all chimed in freely with whatever was on our mind. But the game has changed.
I suppose many people are missing the old community feeling the old board had, where there was one room, one group, and you could jumped in with any thought that popped in your head. Well, nostalgia is a sweet drug, so enjoy the memories, and let's now all play by the new rules.
Hey--
I need a favor-- if y'all can...
Right now if you go to http://www.triggerstreet.com you will find my short film, " The Tunic".
You might have to register with Triggerstreet to be able to peruse the moychendise-- but I believe you'll find it worth your while. Triggerstreet is an online filmfestival that belongs to Kevin Spacey-- he set it up to showcase the works of new filmmakers and directors.
Look under "New Arrivals"-- it will be there for a while-- afterward look under "browse" then alphabetical.... "The Tunic".
The music came from a lucky break in my life. My best friend Becky happened to be the daughter of a Texas Swing artist and song writer from back in the 50's. Elvis actually opened a show for him. Becky (my best friend since the sixth grade in Austin) and I married Rippy brothers-- only she got the pick of the litter.
In any case, her father, Arlie Duff was the one who did the music in my film-- it kicks ass like you won't believe ( even if you're not a Texas Swing fan). Becky's mom gave me the rights to use the song in my film... Arlie died a few years ago.
He is best known for the country standard he wrote, "Y'all Come".
And so ladies and gentlemen without further delay I give you my film-- "The Tunic."
It's a little off color...
Let me know what you think.
:)
Cindy
A sensitive question for Harlan
Dear Harlan,
I have been curious about this for a long time, and so I am going to be brave and ask the question.
Harlan, I have just reread your book on an original, award-winning screenplay that you wrote for a famous science fiction series from the sixties. What struck me is that the nefarious producer of the famous science fiction series seems not only to have sent you through nonsensical hoops and torturous revisions, but he also seems--at least there is a strong inference of this in your book--to have cribbed from your script for at least two other later episodes of his show. The entire alternate dimension, "pirate ship" sequence would appear as an episode in the next season and the coincidence seems too strong not to raise questions in a reader's mind. Well the story in the book ends with the original script winning awards, but there is no further discussion of how the producer might have used, borrowed or stolen your intellectual property.
Many of us who read your book find a great irony in this, especially because he would eliminate this sequence from the original script even after he demmanded of you that you write a sequence where the space ship is placed in danger.
I know this is all behind you, but I have never heard or read anything definitive on this--even in your book. Many of us guess this was a case of "light fingers" on the part of the producer. I am also not sure if you can even answer this question because of professional ethics and because of the contractual obligations of a screenwriter, but I though I would ask anyway.
Maybe a general answer might suffice about the nature of the business.
Sincerely,
Steve Dooner
I just got finished reading "Goodbye To All That" in McSweeney's Mammoth Treasury of Thrilling Tales." What an awesome story. I was fortunate enough to hear Harlan read the story at a con in Wisconsin. The discussion afterwards was really interesting when Harlan asked what everyone thought the story actually meant and after a few comments that were not what he had hoped, he said sometimes a story is just a story. Thanks for the terrific story Harlan, that is why I have been reading your work in all forms for 40 years. Roger
One Post Per Day
I am going to defend myself, why? Because I haven't yet posted today and because I just feel like it.
Check my stats.....since Art Deco has gone up I do not believe I have ever posted twice in a day. I also hate when people post corrections to their previous posting when we knew what they meant anyway.
But, alas, I was in the same situation. Should I have left my 'to' go unnoticed and assume everyone knew what I meant. Sure. Only, there was one little teeny tiny reason why I was compelled to double post for the first time: Harlan had previously initiated his long posting to me with a comment about my misuse of 'lay' and 'lie'.
I know my typo was minor, but one of my biggest pet peeves, one of the things that pisses the hell out of me, is reading corporate memos and other 'professional' writing that proves that the writer can't tell the difference between 'to' and 'too', could never tell the difference between 'to' and 'too', and probably just tosses a coin everytime they need to choose between 'to' and 'too' (and don't even talk to me about 'your' and 'you're').
There. I defended myself even though it was really just a waste of your time reading this. I feel better about myself. I like myself, and my friends and family like me, and I'm o.k. and you're o.k. and all is good with the world. Kumbaya.
-TODD
Strange Wine
I've just bought a copy of Strange Wine on eBay from a guy in Scotland. It was in excellent condition, too. I read this book when I was a teenager, lent it to a friend and never saw it again -hey, what are freinds for if you can't let them steal from you. This was in 1979. I've been looking for a copy ever since and when I bought it on eBay I was apprehensive about the magic having faded, about how a book I enjoyed it 1979 would have lost it's impact 23years later. I needn't have worried. I loved it. I loved the stories and I loved the introductions. I wrote a gushing review of it in Amazon and was happy to discover it is going to be reprinted soon. Great news! Let's just hope that they keep the original Leo and Dianne Dillon cover.
Multiple Postings
Rob has it dead on. I am too tired to get riled up. I played 3 hours of Goaltimate (half court variant of ultimate frisbee) savage (no extra people to substitute) yesterday. During that time I blew out a cleat, aggravated a pulled thigh muscle, and collided with someone, landing on my head. I weight six pounds less than I did yesterday morning. Every muscle in my body hurts, my hamstrings are cramping, my neck is stiff as hell from the fall, and my feet hurt like hell from wearing someone else's cleats. So just assume I sent everyone an e-mail like usual screaming at them.
Also, an immediate correction of a noticed typo or other mistake is okay. Otherwise, unless it's responding to a direct question from Harlan I don't care how bloody important you think it is. You'd be surprised how topical something can remain 1-24 hours later.
Fritz Leiber’s THE DEALINGS OF DANIEL KESSERICH is a good read, sort of a Lovecraftian mystery story. (Leiber wrote it while he was corresponding with Lovecraft, shortly before Lovecraft’s death.) Not 24kt, but I don’t think a Fritz Leiber story ever was much less than 14kt.
The 1997 Tor hardcover was the first PAPER publication of the book. In 1996 it was published by Ellen Datlow in an online venue. Omni maybe?
The manuscript was evidently lost for years but I don’t know any of the details. Anybody out there have any information?
...Who now appears to be Andy gently correcting Barney...
about this week's funny B-plot...
Rob,
I went back 150 posts or so (basically since Rick cleaned up the last mess) and checked out which people posted more than once in a calendar day - unless noted, an ongoing subject was either addressed to different people or different subjects were discussed:
Brian Siano
2 Monday, 6/30
2 Friday, 6/27
Rob
2 Friday, 6/27 (Immediate correction of first post)
Kathy M
2 Sunday, 6/29
Todd Cassel
2 Sunday, 6/29 (Immediate correction of first post)
Forrester
2 Sunday, 6/29
There was a whole mess of multiple postings on Sunday, the 22nd - moved over to the threaded Board by Rick (including yours, Rob), who had this to say on the 22nd... [edited by me - not for clarity - but for specific impact]
"...[S]everal of you who don't seem to understand this rule despite repeated notice. Let me make it clear one more time. I have a responsibility to Harlan to make this a place he wants to visit. I have a responsibility to the people he wants to talk with to allow their voices to be heard. I therefore instituted the one-post-per-day rule... [snip]... Regardless of what you may think, and whether or not you may disagree with me, this is not a topic for debate - nor is it a rule to be followed only when you find it expedient. ...[snip]... That so many of you do this...[snip]...cost[s] me time, cause[s] me pain, makes you something more than simply neglectful. That you make a promise to me that you only keep when it's convenient makes you something less than a friend.
If you would like me to think of you otherwise, show that you respect me in this one small way.
Thanks,
Rick
(If you have anything to say to me on this matter, I would expect you to do so in e-mail and not sully this board further.)"
***
I did this simply to clear rich's name - he did not double post in the investigated timeframe.
Bern (sorry about the length)
Listen, Rich, Todd, et al...
Before you doom us all:
Not that I'm trying to unroll the parchment and dictate terms to anyone (besides, you'll probably hear from Rick) - because if I did you wouldn't listen to me anyway - but regardless of what you consider "important justification", slack off with the double posting. Every time I do it I take shit in e-mail Hell; so, I'm exerting in rare form self-discipline to keep Rick and Harlan happy. If I'M able to do that, you are too. I don't want to see posts erased or the site closed down in protest. I really suffered that last time the entire thread was removed - having posted, as always, a brilliant, informative chunk of insight.
NNNNIP IT IN THE BUD!
Dept. of things which have fallen beneath my radar:
"For anyone who loves great literature, Fritz Lieber walked on water" - Harlan Ellison
Yesterday, in keeping with my 'strong back - weak mind' lifestyle I helped a couple of friends move. The payment was beer, pizza and loaner access to his considerable collection of DVD's and books.
So, two and a half truckloads later, after helping myself to DVD's of The Monkeys in HEAD, THE VAMPYRE, some Roger Corman director series stuff I wasn't sure I wanted to pay for and passing on a lot of H. Gordon Lewis trash I started scanning a box of books and right on top was -
THE DEALINGS OF DANIEL KESSERICH [1936] by Fritz Lieber with the aforementioned cover blurb. This copy was a Tor TPB from 1998 and there was apparently a HC edition done in 1997 which I would assume is WAY out of print. The ISBN on the trade edition is
# 0-312-86622-4. I have not read it yet but it's Lieber influenced by Lovecraft and H.G. Wells. Has to at least be interesting.
I suspect Harlan won't mind this belated plug of a text by his old friend.
- Barney
Strom Thurmond joins the Deadite Army
For melodic musing on the fancied death of a politician (Margaret Thatcher, in this case), I'd recommend Elvis Costello's "Tramp the Dirt Down."
Cheers, Jon
Sorry to post twice, but this is of interest: Screenwriter Frank Pierson writes about the decline of films at http://www.delawareonline.com/newsjournal/opinion/perspective/06082003A.html
Pierson wrote _Cat Ballou_, _Dog Day Afternoon_, and _Cool Hand Luke_.
Todd and Harlan,
Well said. (Though, actually, Todd, my orgasm did last about 6 seconds more upon hearing the news of Strom and his untimely death. Of course, wizened old men auditioning for the part of the Emperor from Star Wars does that to me---I blame my childhood experiences at summer camp for this, but that's another story.)
Really what I want to say though is that Harlan Ellison is a cruel, cruel man. WHAT HAPPENED TO VIC, GODDAMMIT??!! Wait. You're not cruel, but you definitely know how to keep the rubes coming back. WHAT HAPPENED TO VIC??!! Ok. This might be along the lines of asking about The Eventual Slightly Chancy Images, but: What happened to Vic?
Are we going to find out? Sooner or later?
A slightly more serious aside: I am kinda curious about Run, Spot, Run. Was this always part of the tale of A Boy and His Dog as conceived in the late '60s? Or, was this an attempt on your part to address some of the critics who didn't like A Boy and His Dog? (And maybe "address" is too strong of a word, but maybe to find out yourself what happens to Vic and to take the 'sting' out of some of those criticisms.)
Glad to be able to care about characters in fiction, I remain,
rich
Just to amplify one part of Harlan's comments re Strom. It was the statement that Clinton broke his heart.
As much as I dislike what happened with Clinton, I have to admit that something like that was true with me, too. I was wary of the guy, and with good reason: his background with the conservative Democratic Leadership Council, his endorsement of the death penalty, his chatter about ending Welfare, were pretty good reasons to ask if this really was the guy to install after twelve years of Reagan and Bush.
Still, there was every reason to expect great things from the guy. He'd pulled himself up from a childhood as deprived as any in this country, and he was clearly intelligent and educated enough to hold a conversation with Kennedy or Roosevelt. He also reflected postwar culture to a degree that no other President has-- especially in the two-career household aspect.
But what happened? The Clintons rode into the White House on the issue of health care, but the plan they eventually revealed was crafted by the five largest insurance companies. So many Clinton "triumphs"-- NAFTA, GATT, welfare "reform"-- were things the Republicans had been trying to push through for years, and failing. They indulged in the same "family values" crap that the Republicans had been shilling-- and the fact that it couldn't protect them from a creep like Ken Starr should have given them reason for doubt. There was Clinton's vacillation on the Balkans, and Rwanda.
Did the guy accomplish anything decent? Yes. He did reduce unemployment, and eliminate the budget deficits that the Republicans had created. (Two things Dubya's managed to reverse within two years-- sort of like how it took years to _build_ the World Trade Center, but a few hours to take them down.)
Most sane people understand that the Whitewater investigation was a ridiculous spectacle, engineered far beyond any reasonable suspicion of guilt by a Republican party demented by the desire to avenge Nixon's downfall. But this doesn't turn Clinton into a saint, a miracle worker laid low by trolls. The fact is that, even if he didn't have to deal with creeps and frauds like Rehnquist and Gingrich and Limbaugh, Clinton's fabled abilities as a politician would probably not have been applied to anything decently progressive. And that's the real pity, because that's one of the reasons Clinton was elected.
Thurmond, Bush, Gore...
Yes, it would be a tragedy if someone assassinated Dubya, because I want to see him and his junta tried before the international war crimes court today rather than tomorrow. Too bad the spineless spawn at the UN extended U.S. immunity by a year.
But, to get to the point: here's a little article a friend of mine wrote on what Gore's term would have been like if he'd won the elections. I especially like the picture.
http://www.adamcadre.ac/calendar/10651.html
Todd: What you utterly failed to realize in your "you libs" post, and continue to fail to realize, is that disgust for Strom Thurmond's brand of vileness does not and SHOULD not restrict itself down partisan lines. The people on this board were not rejoicing about Thurmond's death because we are a bunch of liberals who were glad that an old arch-conservative who thwarted our leftist pansy agenda croaked; we were rejoicing because a force for evil finally left this mortal coil, well past his time. The fact that he was 100 and drooling onto his bib only mitigates the relief at his passing ever so slightly.
A conservative with a conscience could just as easily found reason to be glad the old bastard was no longer around to plague us with the sight of his face. He represented a period of history and a movement in this country that is abhorrent and shameful; perhaps we wish to see his passing as the banishment of one of the last ghosts of segregation. He doesn't exactly represent something that "you conservs" can look back on fondly, does he? Thus, your urge to scold us for our relief at his passing, based purely on political orientation, so greatly ignores the ROOT of our dislike as to seem facile and, well, smug in that oh so partisan way. Your tone begged for a response, and I'm glad it was Harlan who made it, as he did it far better than anyone else here could have.
I think Harlan's point about how much "you conservs" jumped for joy about Clinton's troubles really points out how much the double standard is in play, along with the very nasty demeanor the Republican Party has adopted towards anyone with a different worldview, so much so that they will resort to dirty fighting and low blows. I see that tradition persists. (Oh, and I must point out that there was no "Clintonian grave" to dance on. The GOP utterly failed to kill Bill, and got egg on its face trying. What you had to dance about is beyond me.)
Which brings me to my next topic: I thought your response to Forrester was more than a little insensitive. The man lost his job and he had to tell his wife about it on their wedding anniversary, for chissakes. May I remind you that this JUST HAPPENED to him and I'm sure it's still stinging, not to mention scaring him quite a bit. Your "So what? MY unemployment turned out GREAT; the gods must like conservatives" was really not kind. Forrester is facing a terrifying life transition; some modicum of compassion might be in order.
No one here disputes your right to express your opinion. No one has told you to shut up or rejoiced at the thought of someone telling you to shut up. It was not the opinions or views you expressed that rubbed me the wrong way; your post struck just the right mix of snide, smug, and condescending as to warrant the strength of response that you got. And as for your claim that Harlan didn't put you in your place... well, if he didn't, that's too bad for you.
PAB
JAY: Met Douglas Adams slightly more than casually about half a dozen times, both here in the States and in the UK. Had joyously listened to the radio version, seen the tv versions, read the books long before I ever met him. So I was already a devoted aficionado of his cockeyed thinkingwhen we crossed paths. I thought he was a fine chap; and I was sorry to see him pass in so peremptory and unexpected a fashion. I remain a fan of Douglas Adams ... and his work.
Respectfully, Harlan
Douglas Adams
I just came across the BBC radio program where Douglas Adams deals with the future of technology and media, discussing how the Internet and new digital media will effect how music, publishing and broadcasting sell their products. It's quite an upbeat read.
I was curious, Harlan, if you've read or even met Douglas Adams and what your take is on his work.
WHAT?
Dear Mr Ellison,
Please tell Hathor...
(heaves a deep sigh)
Oh, never mind.
Dear Hathor,
You have breached my rubbery resolve never to address any of youse Webderland Old Regulars again. But probably just for this one post. And only because you said PLEASE (I think good manners should be encouraged)
Anyways....WHAT? 'Eh? If you want data on Paul Williams, the songwriter, my web site will soon be THE place to start. It's an *information* site. Not a fan site (Fan sites are gooey, confusing, and dripping with treaclely sweetness. Information sites are nutritious, and wholesome, and give you fresh breath. Fan sites are run by obsessed love crazed lunatics. Information sites are run as hobbies, and/or out of the goodness of the web master's heart, to be nice, by cool people like me)
Harlan Ellison is pals with Paul Williams. They both worked doing voice overs for Phantom 2040, and Pirates of Dark Waters. Also, Paul Williams was in an episode of Babylon 5, during the second season called, Acts of Sacrifice, and as most folks around here probably already know, Mr Ellison was the "conceptual consultant" for that series. (From, "The Lurkers Guide To Babylon 5" "Harlan Ellison is the conceptual consultant for the series. He has written a "manifesto" for the show that explains to other writers how to write science fiction for television and Babylon 5 in particular. On a day-to-day basis, he has no preassigned duties (though he plans to write a script or two) but is something of a generalist, helping refine many aspects of the production, from writing to sets. JMS (J. Michael Straczynski) (the creator of the show) refers to Ellison's position as "a free-roaming agent of chaos.") http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/making/creators.html
(See also, THE ELLISONIAN NAVIGATION by Shane Shellenbarger at,
http://www.midwinter.com/b5/ellison.txt )
(According to IMDB, Mr Ellison also acted in Babylon 5
"Playing "Zooty" (voice) in episode: "Day of the Dead"
(episode # 5.8) 11 March 1998
Playing "Psi Cop" in episode: "The Face of the Enemy"
(episode # 4.17) 9 June 1997
"Babylon 5" (1994) playing "Sparky the Computer"
(voice) in episode: # 3.11) 8 April 1996"
http://www.imdb.com/Name?Ellison,+Harlan)
For more information on Paul Williams you can visit my site, at http://www.intothenight.net I'll be working on it for the next few weeks so there'll be new cool stuff to see soon, such as spot lights on other fascinating, but not so famous anymore people who Paul Williams has worked with over the years, like Jackie Gleason, and Pat McCormick.
Sincerely,
Diana
P.S. Heh heh, "Sparky The Computer", heh heh...
Hey Roger, your comments are dead-on about Pat Robertson and Jerry Falwell. And while you are it, let's not forget the Catholic priests who manage to fill their hours with little boys.
I'm still with St. Francis -- the best gospel is the one spoken without words.
Problem is those "speaking it" should shut up and let their actions speak. But then what would happen to the Pope? Or to those monstrous Crystal Cathedrals??
I guess democracy still works in this country when a jackass like Thurmond can so well represent a certain segment of the American populace that he continued to get elected. I guess democracy still works in this country when a jackass like Clinton managed to become president and even today can still convince many that he feels their pain. Yeah... sure.
I have no love for most politicians, either conservative or liberal. I can't think of one I genuinely admire. Most of them are out for #1 and if they do a good thing or two for the scatterbrained public... well, aren't we lucky -- it was mutually to their benefit and ours.
Cynical? You bet.
FORRESTER: I feel for you--I've been there myself, save without a family to feed. (If there's anything I can do,drop me a line.)
But the anecdotal argument is not the way to win a political debate. That's the method of the bad guys. They'll use it to their benefit--a la Willie Horton--and then dismiss it when used against them (remember "Hunger is Anecdotal"?).
(Please note: There are "bad guys" of every political stripe.)
Better to hit people with cold, hard numbers, and leave them unable to refute them.
TODD: You may be surprised to find me on your side in this one. Oh, I disagree entirely with the positions you have put forth, and I find no shame in taking glee over the peaceful passing of a bad man--but you have the right to your opinions. I'll be happy to shoot my own opinions against yours, and bring you facts to contradict your feelings, but I wouldn't deny you the right to discourse.
BUT ...
TODD; FORRESTER: There are but two simple rules here: Behave as would a guest, and ONE POST A DAY. You're doing fine with the first, but the second seems to easily escape a lot of people. This forum is too valuable a resource to risk losing, and there's no profit in causing Rick unnecessary tsuris. I don't mean to come off as chiding you from some great pedestalian height--hell; I messed up once or twice and double-posted--but better that the regulars should set the example and keep to it, neh?
Forrester, I understand that you posted out of a pain-fueled anger (one which I would never deny you) and, cooled somewhat, you needed to add a bit more--and that you, Todd, hated to see words improperly used on the forum of one who is firmly against misuse of the language--but really; in both cases, we'll understand.
And one more thing: Katharine Hepburn died today. It was anything but unexpected, true; but sad nonetheless. Another maverick gone.
Hi Forrester. You are absolutely right about the Jerry Fallwells and Pat Robertsons out there who go so overboard in their assessment of the rest of the world that it makes it tough for those of us who genuinely believe and are just trying to make our way out there doing the best we can everyday.
To, Too, Two
And, as I admitted in my little essay, I'm not the perfect writer...but I do know the difference between to, too and two....I used too wrong below because I am a shittier proofreader than a writer.
So no need to leap into that fray.
Ciao. -TODD
My Place
Rob, "TODD: ......He likes you guys and he made sure you understood that, even though he had to put you in your place...SIMPLY by giving you accurate history. A polite Atheist/Progressive...pretty unheard of, huh?"
Rob, my pal, Harlan did not put me in my place. There was no place to put me in, because you guys need to understand something here....I was not writing a defense of Strom Thurmond, I was writing a "don't worry, be happy, he's dead but you could keep on living even if he was still pushing toward 101" note. You don't have to accept my lackadaisacal attitude...that's fine...but I can assure you that no one was putting me in my place.
And yes, I did dance on the 'grave' of Clinton's presidency for those 8 years. I had a blast doing so. I'll admit it. Doesn't bother me.
As for Forrester, "Todd. Yes, you, please pay attention (as well as any others who would use the label "you libs"). Thanks to the glorious "economic policies" and "stragedies" (that's the way he pronouces it, like "new-kuh-ler") of the current administration, I LOST MY FUCKING JOB!"
Not to sound rude, but, yeah? So? Does this mean that there were no layoffs during the Clinton administration? It's a precarious world out there. Guess what? I lost my job to, last spring. Zip. Boom. After 11 years with the same company (Prudential) our healthcare division got sold to Aetna who immediately decided that they would not need any of our systems. So I had 2 years at Aetna to clean up and leave.
I lost my job. Then I grabbed the opportunity that the job loss gave me by repainting and carpeting my condo in NJ while hunting for prospects in Phoenix. I targeted a position, pushed for it, made them understand that I had something of value to bring to their company, and they not only hired me but they gave me a signing/moving bonus and gave me 30 days to make the move that I had been preparing for all last summer.
No matter what administration is in office, people lose their jobs. For some, it's a very painful experience. For others, the gods shine upon them.
Looks like some of those gods like conservs.
Everyone who has been giving the thumb's up to Harlan for putting me in my place or teaching me a lesson or telling me to shut up and go elsewhere if I don't like reading ad nauseum how this person died so let's dance a jig...everyone, please understand something....Harlan was not attacking me. My comments sent him into a lather. The foam flew over his hatred for Strom and for people who wish to speak only niceties of the dead and for Clinton's blown presidency that was further blown by not only Monica but all of us conservs who hated his gloating guts, and the foam flew for years of civil rights fights that Harlan has leapt into headfirst, and the foam flew because for just a moment, though I doubt it, Harlan may have thought I was attacking youse guys and gals for what you write on the board (rather than just sounding off my minority opinions in this cafe).
But Harlan did not put me in my place because of my views or because I don't know the difference between laying and lying, or because I start so many sentences with 'but.' Harlan argued with me over what I wrote. That's all. No one put me in my place, because my place is still right here.
And Harlan is still the man.
-TODD
Rule Breaking Post#2
Oh, and Roger, I'm a Roman Catholic lector / lay director / wedding rehearsal minister. It isn't "cheap shots at Christians" in general. It's a particular brand of Christian that brings out a great deal of hatred and bigotry and violence while hiding behind a bible and calling themselves "men of god." And I know they ain't too happy with my "flavor" of Christianity in the Baskin-Robbins of religions, which are like any other organizations and can be misused and perverted by people mad for power and inclined to corrupt any group to fit their twisted view of the world.
And the previous post title should have read "From a charter member of 'We-Libs'"
Go talk amongst yourselves.
From a charter member of
Excuse me if this is the wrong forum and all that, and that I haven't contributed in a while. I'm not all that concerned what it could potentially cost me, but the time to unload is now.
Not to say that our patron, M. Ellison, did not provide us with his usual excellent insight and remembrance of events and the people who influenced these events. No, not at all. But I feel a need to express.
Todd. Yes, you, please pay attention (as well as any others who would use the label "you libs"). Thanks to the glorious "economic policies" and "stragedies" (that's the way he pronouces it, like "new-kuh-ler") of the current administration, I LOST MY FUCKING JOB! Over five years of labor trying to make a career, under the most trying of circumstances, all that effort gone. Vanished. Kaput, at the stroke of someone's pen who arbitrarily started circling the names of employees who he felt were making just a little bit too much money and decided "Hey, we can staff the department with people who have little or no experience and provide shoddy service to our customers (who we have very few of now) and save a shitload of moolah."
The downtrend that started even during the election because every "captain of industry" started getting panicky that Dubya was going to get in (or other "business leaders" who started cackling and took advantage of the situation as the dollar signs started lighting up their eyes).
And the best part? Better than the fact that I went through exactly the same fucking thing twenty years ago when Ron Old Ray Gun deregulated the oil industry. People being forced out or into early retirement. One dear friend who tried to hang on, who ended up in tears at the end of each day because she was fifty-six and she couldn't find a job elsewhere. I clearly remember her funeral (shortly after when her heart gave out from the stress) and the silence that fell over the group as we tried to comfort her grieving husband when one of the company's managers walked in. The racist motherfucker (who proudly displayed a pciture of Ronnie on his desk) thatI had to put up with for months who thought it was funny to ask me one day, "You wouldn't happend to have a degree in chemical engineering, wouldja? Too bad for you, only job we're gonna have left is at the refinery in Lemont."
The best part is that is that I had to tell my wife (who'd school budget has been decimated the past few years and we have to buy a lot of supplies for these kids out of our own pockets) - I HAD TO TELL MY WIFE ON THE DAY OF OUR WEDDING ANNIVERSARY!
So, to all conservatives, do not sit there smugly and say that the passing of these figures means nothing. Their negative impact on our world, on our society, will be felt for a long time. You're just a hop, skip and a seig heil from saying there was no Holocaust because Hitler's dead, everything is fabulous in Eastern Europe since the "evil empire" Soviet Union is no more and that big bad wall came down, and everything is peachy-keen in Iraq now that Saddam has gone underground. Everyone on the far right can kiss my ass - on the left.
Oh, and one more thing - don't be too surprised if that "confidential intelligence source" that has provided Dubya with all that info on weapons of mass destruction turns out to be his daddy, who probably sold all that shit to Saddam when he was VP and the administration was pissed at Iran.
Harlan. Bill Clinton broke my heart, too. But I still had a job back then.
'AN HOUR WITH ROB' aka 'THE DIATRIBE SHOW'
HARLAN,
I stayed out of the Thurmon string because I felt an abysmal relic from the Jim Crowe era wasn't worth my time.
But, yeah, as you can tell by the responses you have nothing - nothing at ALL - to be embarrassed about. Perhaps you felt your post would read like some diatribe. But your brilliant encapsulation of the facts was a necessary, logical rebuttal to contravene the dead weight and limited thinking that invariably accompanies the ever-lingering devotion to ignorance. It was a catharsis for any of us who care about reality and achieving a better world. It was not a diatribe but an autoclave. There's a nice, fresh, clean smell to the room now. Hell, for that I'm even willing to forgive you for hating my cat.
My only enduring frustration is that there remain LOTS of people who think being a "gentleman" makes up for being a scoundrel (as long as you align with the conservative agenda) - that no matter what facts you present to make the case, no matter what history tells us, no effort at reevaluation will be made. What is the definition of a conservative but to be "disposed to preserve existing conditions, institutions, etc., and to resist change"? In the world of the "conserves" all stays as it is. It is a calcified mind-set that will not question its position however challenged it might be by the facts presented. Whatever the signal reads, for godsake IGNORE it! BLOCK it! If necessary put a SPIN on the facts if it preserves your agenda! Don't learn! Don't analyze! Don't listen! Hell, with a "conserve", you can just keep tuggin' on the genitals and STILL you'll get no reaction. Blocked signals. All remains as it is.
For all his eloquence, people, Harlan rattles off facts in his essays that SHOULD seem obvious. Yet, astonishingly, they remain things that need to be pointed out. And for all the trouble and time in laying it out...there are many people who will read the information and still repudiate it all. It's extremely frustrating.
A closing note to TODD: one time you said Liberals or Atheists (I forgot which, but in this case it makes no difference) seemed invariably rude (laughably suggesting "conservs" are generally otherwise). Well...look at how Harlan addressed you and Roger. In all his passion and frankness, he remains polite and civil. He is a humanist. He likes you guys and he made sure you understood that, even though he had to put you in your place...SIMPLY by giving you accurate history. A polite Atheist/Progressive...pretty unheard of, huh?
...and ROGER: you're not alone in the long drag of unemployment. Since losing my regular job (while trying to concentrate on my degree) after 9/11 I haven't been able to land another regular job myself. Just intermittent temp jobs, so far. And it was roughly 9 months before I could even land those (mainly through the university I attend). I almost lost my apartment; I went so broke I lost a few friends (um, two of which I was dating); at one point I was even out of cash for food (it was then I discovered welfare refuses food stamps to university students). My ensuing rage and frustration began leading to notions of suicide. If I didn't have my art and my passions I genuinely believe I'd have attempted a thrill-ride off the top of a building or putting a 9mm in my mouth. It's scary, man; no question about it. You might want to consider how our "leadership" is proposing to handle things (like "pork barreling" tax cuts for the wealthy - in a wartime period yet! -who already get their cuts through loopholes no one else can get, something people conveniently forget) even as MASSIVE numbers continue being laid off, CEOs (at least some I know about here) give themselves raises, and schools, hospitals, and medical care all get cut, cut, cut (in these areas, I should add, privatized institutions are NOT going to help anyone without funds); my point being, as a conservative you might want to begin asking yourself questions about why you are where you are. Well...not just YOU but the rest of the country.
BEN: St. Louis Typewriter Company. Dan Puls. 904 Castello; Saint Louis, Missouri 63031. (314) 972-1113. www.MrTypewriter.com
Use my name. Tell Dan that Harlan sent you.
Yr. pal, Harlan Ellison
Pulp Art and Other Stuff
A GENERAL RECOMMENDATION TO THE BOARD: I found Robert Lesson's book, Pulp Art, remaindered at A B. Dalton bookseller in Massachusetts. If you folks don't know the book it features gorgeous, full-color reproductions of the work of Walter Baumhhofer, Rafael de Soto, George Rozen, Frank R. Paul, Howard V. Brown, Norman Saunders, and Virgil Finlay. The book is large, but not a full folio size.
If any of you were recently fetuses, I especially recommend this to you. It is the original art that is the source for so much of the imagery in comics and science fiction movies today. When you see this book, you'll have a better understanding of how to separate the hackneyed ripoff from the real thing.
HARLAN: After reading your Thurmond remarks, I just had to pass this along about a living example of a man who has no regard for civil rights. On CBS Sunday Morning, they did a puff piece on John Ashcroft that focused on his human side (if he has one). There was no mention of his rabid fundamentalism and a heckuva a lot of talk about his singing and his affection for pop culture. The whole segment seemed to have been intended to grease the wheels for Patriot II. But the best part was when Ashcroft revealed that he loves The Simpsons. This was one moment in T.V. history that fairly made my brain explode, and I am still wondering how Matt Groening must feel about it.
Utterly confused and afraid,
Steve D
Steve Dooner
Just wanted to say...
...that when I read Todd's post, I was all set to sit down and write response that would show it for what it was but...then I didn't have to. I'd infinitely prefer to sit back and watch a master at work.
Yeah, a deeply satisfying visit to the Pavilion, finally.
This is why I will always be a HE fan, no matter how many times he disses me on dinner or vandalizes my eyewear,
PAB
The one comment on Strom vs. Bill I'll make is this: Anyone else notice how the "hitting on women old enough to be his (great-grand)daughter" bit was viewed as a spicy bit of fun, in Strom's case?
BEN: I dunno who would retail near you, but I know that Bundy Computer (formerly Bundy Typewriter) here in Philly carries LOTS of typewriter ribbons, and even still does on-site repair for typewriters of all kinds. Judging from this, SOMEONE must still be making ribbons ...
If you really can't find any ribbons, drop me an e-mail, and I'll see what can be done ...
(I just scored a great laptop-sized typewriter [with extra ribbon, even!] for three bucks at the flea market some weeks back, I should note.)
Delusions Of Lucidity: Diana , PLEASE!
Talk to me directly. Although in this forum, I am a child's age, in the "Real" world, I AM in my mid-30's. I Can take the hit. The fact is, being of post baby-boomer birth, I have no frame of reference of Paul Williams besides THE MUPPET MOVIE, and that he is the voice of The Penguin in The Batman Cartoon.
(Athough i have bad flashbacks of "Fantasy Island" Episodes and the "Stone Cold Dead" movie, where he WAS a dectective in this white leisure suit with a bright BRIGHT red...blouse...? on underneath....?)
A fine post by HE on Clinton. Fuck Strom, I thought the meat of HE's rant was a very-well honed dissection of just how that man was railroaded out of his place in history by a bunch of righty scum.
I too agonized over the Oval Office blowjobs, wishing with all my liberal heart that the man could have a) gotten a room somewhere without the portraits of the founding folk frowning down on him and b) picked someone a little older for his fun, maybe the wife of some French diplomat, since the Froggies are so understanding about these things and c) when nailed, just said to the country "it's my business, piss off," and not have to come back from the shameless lie later...
But none of that agony even approaches the slings and arrows I'm feeling know over the Bush administration, as they very properly and publically gut our civil rights and trash our ecosystem. I'll take wanton interns on their knees over that Secretary of Interior hag and Reichsfuhrer Ashcroft any day of the week. It's a small price to pay for breathable air and private library records...
HARLAN,
This is the second -and the last- question I will ask that does not pertain to your work. I don't ask it on my behalf, but actually for my brother. He's currently searching for a manual typewriter to work with. He can find a typewriter relatively easily, but what is of more concern is how to locate a steady supply of ink spools, which are NOT really mass produced anymore. Now, since you are one of the few writers out there left who still use a typewriter for professional work, he wishes to know where he could find such a supply of ink spools.
Again, something not urgent, and no response on your part would NOT endanger our very lives, but a vague gesture in the correct direction would be just fine. Thanks.
Oh yes, on cats: I read H.P. Lovecraft's SOMETHING ABOUT CATS at one point. H.P. goes into intricate detail of his love for felines and his distaste for canines. He was eloquent, witty, and forceful in his words.
Too bad the dude lived with his aunt.
HAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!
Lawdy. It seems every time I come in here there is a fire fight going on and I must dive for cover for concern of having my ass either shot or chewed off.
So anyway: A question for HARLAN (remember him? The guy this place is supposed to be about?): I was reading a certain anthology the other day and happened to find therein your wonderful story "Tired Old Man" teamed with the wonderful "The Problem of Cell 13" by the late and undeniably great Jacques Futrelle, and I gotta ask: How did that happen? I mean, it's a perfect tag team effort, from a literary perspective.
But. . . where did you find "The Problem of Cell 13"? Did you but stumble upon it or was it handed to by someone well-meaning who demanded you READ THIS!?!
Don't mind me: Curiousity of a drought-stricken sponge, that's all.
Until next time. . .
Jim Hess
Hi Harlan. Thank you for the honesty of your comments about Strom Thurman, and in small part me. The fact of the matter is I dislike greatly bigots from all corners, and anyone who chooses to use their influence in a mean spirited or stupid manner is not someone I would choose to look up to in any sort of way.I just have difficulty some times with the cheap shots about Christians in general, and the comment I read blaming God for Strom Thurman's actions just struck me the wrong way.I read this section of the board in particular because I appreciate the honesty of the people writing here and will continue to read it. Plus the chance to have you check in from time to time is very enjoyable and I laugh quite often at your responses in particular.I have had the opportunity to meet you on numerous occasions at conventions and special readings all over the country, and have been reading your work for nearly 40 years so I am hardly a newcomer.Just someone that is very tired of trying to find a new job right now. Take care Harlan, and Susan too. Roger Gjovig
The Tyger
Dear Mr Ellison,
*Please* don't cop out, and end up apologizing for your last post. Why would you ever be embarrassed by something like that? Just then, when I was reading what you wrote when you forget for a little while to be "courteous", I was reminded again of what it was that got me to thinking, "God, I love that man" in the first place. It's that heat, that mad eloquent brilliant thing you do sometimes, that is you being passionate, but never talking out of your ass, no matter how pissed off you get, that just does me in. In my opinion, nobody, *NO*body does it better. Or even half as good.
Sincerely,
Diana
(The following bits of nonsense were written prior to me reading your last post. I've now kind of lost interest, temporarily, in pestering you about cats and such, but I'd already written it, so what the heck)
Dear Mr Ellison,
Please tell Hathor I said.....
"About Paul Williams, and as to what there may or may not be for a given individual to appreciate about him? I'd say there's a lot to appreciate about him. But that's me. When I get the information I already have on that site closer to the way I want it, and finally finish adding all the data I have on him, I guess anyone who's curious could go there and learn about him, and determine things for themselves.
Oh, by the way, I think Randy Newman's song, "Let's Drop The Big One" is hilarious".
Sincerely,
Diana
(http://www.intothenight.net)
Dear Mr Ellison,
Just how bad is it, with you and this cat-hating thing? Do they merely get on your last nerve, or do they evoke a maddened blood rage? Are you reduced to cowering, shreaking wordlessly, and pointing at the sight of even the most innocent little garden variety house cat? Do you suck your teeth and turn your face away in maidenly disapproval at the mention of the offending species? Do you shout at them? Shake your fists? Throw rocks? Have seizures, or what? I'm really curious about how this phobia/hate thing manifests itself.
Oh, and is it just domestic cats that you hate, or ALL felines? Do you hate ocelots, and jaguars, and tigers too?
Sincerely,
Diana
P.S. I love tigers...They're SO cool.
"The Tyger".
Tiger! Tiger! burning bright
In the forests of the night:
What immortal hand or eye
Could frame thy fearful symmetry?
In what distant deeps or skies
Burnt the fire of thine eyes?
On what wings dare he aspire?
What the hand dare seize the fire?
And what shoulder, & what art,
Could twist the sinews of thy heart?
And when thy heart began to beat,
What dread hand? & what dread feet?
What the hammer? what the chain?
In what furnace was thy brain?
What the anvil? what dread grasp
Dare its deadly terrors clasp?
When the stars threw down their spears,
And water'd heaven with their tears,
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the Lamb make thee?
Tiger! Tiger! burning bright
In the forests of the night:
What immortal hand or eye
Could frame thy fearful symmetry?
William Blake (1757-1827),
Rick,
Thank you for your response and the e-mail.
I have to grant the likelihood of the Poe/Dickens coincidence.
Murdstone may well have simply been a device to bring out the weaknesses Dickens wanted us to see in the parent - dramatizing her inability to cope with his dominance and control.
Yet, as you suggest there remain some interesting questions. At one point or another the two authors may well have inspired each other - directly or indirectly. The men were contemporaries. At one point, Dickens did a story based on a raven he owned - I forgot the name of it - and Poe, reviewing it, argued Dickens should have made more use of the bird. It is believed this may have been the initial inspiration for Poe’s immortal THE RAVEN. So, it is not inconceivable that Dickens, in turn, could have used some elements of Poe’s childhood for HIS material. Of course we still need to see the evidence.
One aside to add about movie versions of Dickens’ books. I have decided that, as with most cracks at adapting great literature to film, a Readers Digest-like abridgment of the material is the unavoidable outcome. I revisited the ’35 Selznick version of COPPERFIELD. I liked W.C. Fields a lot and I like Rathbone a lot. Yet, I felt the layers and breadth of the novel stripped away. It was really a hollow experience for me. Furthermore, I really hate that kid - Freddie Bartholomew - and his Lord Fauntleroy purity. "Ah, ya deserve it, ya nauseating little shit," I blurted out a few times during the movie. He truly brought the Murdstone out of ME.
On the other hand, TALE OF TWO CITIES came off fine, with Colman’s immortal line, "Tis a far, far better thing that I do ...", and CHRISTMAS CAROL succeeded in the translation several times. So, the effort isn’t ALWAYS botched.
...and HARLAN:
Sooooo, ye be hatin’ me cat, eh?
Be warned, says I...
In me grand crusade I’ve been known to be plantin' buckets o' water over yonder entrance-way belongin' ta cat-haters everywhere (OR hosing 'em down as they be emergin' from their homes). If ye get drenched one day comin' out to greet the mornin’ sun...be blamin' it on Rick fer tippin' me off. AAARRRGGHH!
DEAR TODD:
First of all, it's "lying back in the Valley of the Sun," NOT "laying back..."
And second, and last, is this: no amount of chortling and hoo-ee huzzahing and "dancing on the grave" of any number of wretched pismires like Thurmond, an active force for bigotry, homophobia, racism, hatred between individuals, pork-barreling in aid of the murderous tobacco cartels, separatist divisiveness, calculated ruin of the lives of his opponents or people he just happened to lay a gimlet eye on, lies that short-circuited progressive legislation, fundamentalist elitism, revenge and just plain meanspirited arrogant ignorance, by "you libs" -- if "us libs" started now and only reached the point of beginning diminution by the year 3003 -- would equal by one one-millionth the amount of public and private cackling and Uriah Heep hand-washing indulged-in by Republicans. I offer, as sole and lonely offset to my (and other's) joy at the passing of this scrod, the eight years of steady, unrelenting, meretricious shit that brought down Bill Clinton. Laded onto the scale of rational assessment, our li'l peeping happiness is, to what joy and rapture "you conservs" wallowed in for almost a decade, as a peach pit is to the Great Stone of the Kaballah.
And before you go all bugfuck that I'm defending Clinton, hear this: he broke my heart, as he did every good American who thought he'd turn this country around; and it was solely because of a frat boy character that was more akin to that of a Barbary Coast whoremonger than a leader of nations. But that said, he was capable of great things, yet "you conservs" never gave him an inch of slack. Not a chance. Like Rimbaud, he was doomed from the start. He was, after all, THE FUCKING PRESIDENT OF OUR COUNTRY, Todd! He deserved a shot. A fair shot. A decent shot. But "you conservs" were "dancing on his grave" before he ever revealed the blight of his personal moral turpitude WHICH HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THE PRESIDENCY! It was all "Hollywood Access" bullshit, no more relevant to the affairs of State than whether or not his stools were firm and hard or runny. Yet "you conservs" danced with glee on every inch of a gravesite exposed by yellow journalism, prying into which piece of meat was in proximity to some other piece of meat; your gloating was unrestrained; you drooled over every day's new revelation as if it was even remotely on a par with the daily perfidies revealed by the Nixon debacle; you hounded and chivvied and harassed him, turned loose that lying sack of mendacious monkeynuts, Ken Starr, on him, descended to levels of sperm-on-dresses that our long-awaited happyhappy about Strom's croaking doesn't even remotely approach. And you find our pale, pallid, joy at the long-awaited passing of Strom Thurmond improper, in bad taste, and even cruel?!!?!!
Listen, Todd, sweetie, do not presume to try to teach your Granny how to suck eggs on this one. Some of us were THERE through this latter half of a century when Thurmond's relentlessly vile and destructive life was being lived at the top of his racist lungs; we saw how many lives he destroyed, how many wrong-side-of-the-arguments he won for corporations and J. Edgar Hoover and enemies of the Supreme Court and the ACLU and the Southern Poverty Law Center and John Lennon and the National Endowment for the Arts and on and on and on. An icon of mendacity. a slug unfit for all this disingenuous, hypocritical, putrescent tearjerking ... "he was always a gentleman" is the best one Senator could muster. Yeah, great. The ones with the whips have no need to be other than gentlemanly. It's the invisible cloak pose of the beneficient tyrant, the truly awful.
Thurmond is dead. Too bad it didn't happen fifty years ago. He was so fucking senile and incapacitated these last ten years that he trained and dipped in bile till they were coated, a cadre of string-pullers and minions who carried out all his wretched programs and beliefs even after he couldn't remember how to tie his shoes.
I'm sorry that you and Roger Gjovig (for different reasons) find the recent postings about Lester Maddox (that pig muthuhfuggah) and Strom Thurmond dismaying. You, because you're playing that "oh, what politically incorrect, bad taste, rude never-speak-ill-of-the-dead" card (a Joker with two faces), and Roger because there is "negativity" on this site. Well, despite the absolute truth that I am fond of both of you in your Webderland personae, in sincerity, I'm sorry pals. But there are many other places on this website that will happily accomodate your conversational needs, but THIS li'l corner of the abbatoir is mine, and over here the ill-speakers of the dead are welcome. Chiding them for their honesty, instead of falling into line behind Todd's assertion that Thurmond was, well, not a nice man, with whom we disagreed from time to time like the loving and respectful opposition we are supposed to be, is dissembling of the most mendacious sort.
This message, written at white heat, will certainly embarrass me for its passion when I re-read it tomorrow. But its conviction and its viewpoint will not. So I'll send it now, before good sense arrives to stomp me into courteous civility.
Harlan Ellison.
You're right, the world isn't likely a better place. But when someone like Thurmond is gone, it sure feels like it.
He lived to be 100. He did not die tragically young. No matter how much you hate George Bush, if he were to be assassinated in office, it would surely be a tragedy.
But Strom got his run and then part of someone else's. And, oh, what he chose to do with it.
This is the proud Dixiecrat who said in 1948:
"There's not enough troops in the Army to force the Southern people to break down segregation and admit the Nigra race into our theaters, into our swimming pools, into our homes, and into our churches."
The man who left his Democratic party for the Republican when informed that Civil Rights would be part of the Democrat platform.
The man who staged a record-settin 24 hour filibuster in 1957 in opposition of the Civil Rights Act.
The man who spent his later years trying either avoiding all discussion of his record or spreading the insidiious lie so favored by Confederate revisionists: it wasn't about race, it was about state's rights.
Oh but Thurmond repented, right? This old leaopard changed his spots. Did he really? Here's an interesting article on that subject:
http://slate.msn.com/?id=2075453
Thurmond was a cunning political animal. No way he could have served in the Senate as long as he did without understanding he'd be forced to change along with the country. But even he repented some of his most hard-core segregationist values, what precisely did he do to work FOR civil rights?
We may debate the use of words like good and evil with the understanding that people are cmplex and can rarely be summed up by any one of those words. But some people are evil beyond a shadow of a doubt and no need to name the most obvious. I do not know that Thurmond qualifies as such and there's little of value to be gained in such debate.
Let us judge him by his actions alone. And by that standard, I find little reason to believe the man's record is ameliorated by the mere fact that he "served his country" for so long.
Perhaps it's cruel to actually be happ the man has died. He was out of the Senate and could have lived to 150 likely without making a bit of difference in government again.
But God knows the man had his run. And, oh, what he did with it.
Strom is dead and it's about time.
Strom Thurmond Is Dead
Strom Thurmond is dead. Strom Thurmond is dead. The world is a better place. Yadda da ya and da. Geez, you libs just love making a fuss over dancing on the graves of those who aren't.
No, this is not a defense of Strom Thurmond, so calm down.
As I was saying, you libs love to dance on the graves of any non-lib that hits hard times. I remember when Rush Limbaugh got hit with his ear problem and suddenly everyone on the board was shouting he he deserved every pain that came into his life.
This one's dead, this one's lost his hearing, this one's lost a limb, that one's gone impotent. The world is a better place.
Puleeeeze. Let me assure you; if you are one of the people who sees the world as shit, then guess what.....with Strom dead, it's still shit. If you love your life, then no matter how much you would like to pretend otherwise, his death did not make it that much better....his death did not bring and extra 5 seconds to your next orgasm. Unless you lived in his home or spent your days in his presence during his final years of being nothing but an old guy in Wash'ton, his not so sudden absence ain't changing your world.
Calm down. Take a drink. Skip to the loo. Stop bringing so much drama into the only life you get.
Happily laying back in the Valley of the Sun listening to the Yankee/Met game on internet radio, I remain, your buddy, -TODD
2000X CD
Mr. E and Co.-
Anyone know the status of the 2000X CD? I can't tell if the thing's yet to be released or if there's just crazy low availability.
If anyone has a contact at Fantastic Audio, that would be nifty, too.
Thanks.
RSL
Strom Thurmond is Dead
Long Live The NEXT Well Meaning Individual who makes people question blind faith and think for themselves
(Why do I think it will be a FAR LEFT child of the 60's?)
DIANA:
Being from an Ig'Nant Randy Newman Loving family I can't appreciate the Paul Williams BIG PICTURE here. In all seriousness:????????
P.s> I loooooved Ms. Jessica in "PENNIES FROM HEAVEN" ALMOST as much as Chistopher Walken. Almost.
Dear Mr Ellison,
Instead of the long list of cat facts I was planning to bore you with, I've decided to share this awesome poem.
The Second Coming -- W. B. Yeats
Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all convictions, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.
Surely some revelation is at hand;
Surely the Second Coming is at hand.
The Second Coming! Hardly are those words out
When a vast image out of Spiritus Mundi
Troubles my sight: somewhere in sands of the desert
A shape with lion body and the head of a man,
A gaze blank and pitiless as the sun,
Is moving its slow thighs, while all about it
Reel shadows of the indignant desert birds.
The darkness drops again; but now I know
That twenty centuries of stony sleep
Were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle,
And what rough beast, its hour come round at last,
Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?
It does mentiona shape with body of a lion, but that's as feline as it gets.
Sincerely,
Diana
Cindy,
Very clever. No one can slap Republicans like a Republican, just as it took a Democrat (Will Rogers) to properly skewer the Democrats - when they needed it.
Was that damning with faint praise, or praising with faint damns.
Or just dammitall.
Chuck
Strom Thurmond is dead and isn't it about time.
I pray there is a God for surely any God, no matter how blind or cruel, would condemn such an evil soul to an eternity of torment.
Strom Thurmond is dead and the world is a better place for it.
Cindy, I don't mean to jump on your case too much over Strom Thurmond. I don't doubt that your speak-no-ill-of-the-dead sentiments are genuine.
But when you write that Thurmond "did more for our country in this millenium than any other politician" and mention "all that he contributed to our nation and to all Americans," you seem to be basing this solely on one accomplishment-- the fact that he stood in the Senate longer than any (other) human being. I must ask the obvious question: Just what was it he actually _did_ that was so good?
But from what I can tell, Thurmond's longevity in the Senate is not a good thing. He was a _bad man_, Cindy. He ran for President in 1948 on the _Segregationist Party_ ticket. Throughout his entire political life, he worked tirelessly to keep Blacks down as second-class citizens, to defend the actions of white Citizens' Councils, and to oppose the Civil Rights movement. Yes, maybe his party revealed that Trent Lott was a racist scumbag... but that fact's been a part of Thurmond's life from day one. The fact that he stayed around so long is not a mark in his favor, but a mark against the state of South Carolina for inflicting this gargoyle on our great nation for so long.
I would also like to mention that Thurmond was almost responsible for having John Lennon kicked out of the country. Thurmond wrote a letter to John Mitchell, Nixon's Attorney-General, telling him of Lennon's prominence and anti-war statements, urging Mitchell to bring deportation charges against him. Thankfully, Lennon prevailed (partly because it was revealed that his targeting was politically motivated). But Strom Thurmond tried to keep him out of the country.
Okay, maybe you had all that sweet-stuff to lead up to the Trent Lott one-liner, and maybe you hold a decent, pure hate for the man, I'm missing your point entirely.
My only regret is that Thurmond did not suffer to the degree that a decent, rational Universe would inflict upon him.
Thanks for your comments Cindy. I had read Brian's comment earlier in the day and it has been bothering me a great deal today as I went about my business. Strom Thurman did a great deal in his life, some bad and some good, and whatever he did they were his decisions that were made. HIS DECISIONS! To presume to blame God for any part in his life other than his creation is very wrong. It gets very difficult as a long time reader of Harlan's work and a great fan of his to come to this site and as a Christian see time after time little shots taken at those of us who choose to believe in God. I don't get on here very often to speak, but it is very difficult to come here and enjoy the board when there is so much negative stuff about all kinds of things. I know we all have the right to express our opinion, but some times it just gets a little tough.And then maybe since I've been out of work for a while and am struggling a bit, that just makes it seem worse then it really is. I don't really know for sure, there are just some days I wish there wasn't quite so much negative stuff on the board. At any rate, i guess I'm done for the moment. Bye for now. Roger
Hey Mr. Ellison dude!
I hear you know Paul Williams!
If you see the little dude around sometime, tell him I said HI!
Hey Diana and everyone interested,
I met Mr. Paul H. Williams in Nashville a few years back at the Double Tree Hotel. I spent the weekend watching him give speeches and just being cool. He gave our group a personal concert and then we all met up at the Blue Bird Cafe.
At the time, I was often busy at home so I never got around to making reservations for the BlueBird show. But I was blessed that night, because there was one seat left in the whole house and it was right (and I mean right) behind Paul Williams, the man himself. I could've reached out and touched him...if I were crazy enough. But he did give me a hug because I was the youngest one at that weekend meeting. He also told me about his little autographing trademark, when he was signing my albums.
On the last day of the meeting, I was rushing out to the meeting room because I was running late. The elevators there were so slow and I was pushing that button so many times just knowing that I was going to miss something. When the doors finally opened, there was Paul H. Williams standing there in the elevator. I was already shocked by this but what he did next really amazed me. He said "Good morning,(insert my real name here.) Do you know where I can get some good coffee?"
At this point, I could've died! You see, all that weekend, I didn't wear my nametag as everyone else did. And Paul Williams KNEW my name!!!!! And he wanted my opinion on where to get some good coffee!!!!!
Now the puzzling question is, why didn't he make his own coffee? Every room had a coffee maker. What's the deal with that?
Anyway, Paul is the sweetest.
So, if you're still reading Mr. E., and you get the chance to talk to Paul, ask him if it would be okay for me to send him a travel coffee maker for Christmas or his birthday. I'm sure he'd love it.
Phoenix
A Dickensian asociation.
*** Cindy ***
It's a good thing I read FAST. I was getting so pissed at you that I almost didn't read the end of your post. Good one, indeed.
Hah!!
Today on NPR they did a lot of "praising with faint damns" so to speak with regards to Strom. Kindest words I heard all day were "he sure was there a lot" and "never missed a gavel". That's like getting the perfect attendance award combined with no scholastic achievment.
The only time I've heard NPR go meaner was Nixon's death. The historians and writers Marty Moskowain [sp?] and others had calling in that day to pile the dirt deeper had me pumping my fist in the air all day. I haven't been that happy since Rolling Stone ran the THE QUITTER cover on that Quaker sumbitch.
AND the Supreme Court handed down some good decisions yesterday, so I'm going to enjoy this brief respite in the ramping up of an American Reich.
*** Rick / and others *** A long time ago somebody wrote a fanzine article detailing the many similarities between Harlan and Dickens. I couldn't quite get behind it the way the author did but she[?] put a helluva lot of work into it as I recall.
If Tim and I were together one of us could root it up but I'm just in from 12 hours in the sun and on beer #2. Perhaps Harlan or some other lurker might remember this one.
Uh-oh, my boxer wants to play. Gotta go.
- Barney
Ah, Cindy... good one! I wasn't sure where you were going at first with that one. Thanks for pulling it off so well.
I am deeply troubled at the delight and expressions of pleasure displayed here over the passing of Senator Strom Thurmond. The comments here were thoughtless and undeserved, heaped on a man who is no longer with us and is unable to defend himself against such acrimony. Senator Thurmond's record of service to the American people-- stretches out over SO MANY decades. It should not go unsaid that we all owe him a great deal for what he has done after so many years in our government. His astounding tenure (a staggaring accomplishment)has yet to be duplicated, his contribution cannot be forgotten. While his politics were often an exercise in anachronism the man's life was certainly no waste. He was a human being, complete with the flaws of the condition of being just that. None among us is perfect- but THIS man-- whom y'all would dog on in such a meanspirited and bitter manner did more for our country in this millenium than any other politician. How sad and how ignoble it is that so many now malign him in his absence-- even after all that he contributed to our nation and to all Americans. His gift to the American people remains priceless-- its importance inestimable. There is NO degree of wrongheaded politics that will ever erase the good that was accomplished by this stateman. No-- I'm dispondent that y'all would be so quick to dismiss him at the time of his death as though he never did anything that would leave a positive effect on this world that he moved through-- a living, breathing human being. You should all be ashamed for expressing such sentiments as though his demise were an occassion for celebration and not for somber reflection on the contribution of a prominent citizen now passed. Shame, shame, shame on all of you who have overlooked the mountain of good that this man was responsible for. It is a tragedy of great proportions that you all have lost sight of the great gift that was given to us when God gave us Senator Thurmon. The Bible says we are to respect those who are given length of years and now you all have flown in the face of that directive to besmirch the name of the old Senator. I personally have so much to be grateful to Senator Thurmon for-- I will never forget him.. or his memory. If it were not for Senator Thurmond, I would have never known about Trent Lott. Without Strom Thurmond's big birthday bash-- the nation would not have seen the mask slip- and that racist twerp would still be the swinging stick in the Senate. Yes, indeed Senator Thurmond contributed one important thing in his lifetime, so he really wasn't ALL bad-- just almost.
Cindy
I finally saw "Star Trek: Nemesis." It actually wasn't a half bad movie, and I was actively looking for ways to shoot spit wads at it. It had an abysmal opening at the box office; got sauteed by the likes of "Maid In Manhattan." I think what's happened is that it's finally beginning to dissolve in its own vitriol. It took a while. After a billion, cajillion' repititions of the same tired, old plots, even the village idiot is finding "Star Trek" to be hackneyed, and formulaic.
Susan - Happy (belated) Birthday! Glad to hear the perpetual 29 works for you (1gave up on 29 a while back!).
Frank - I must say, I rarely agree with you. But, Chateau Montelena. Mmmmm (not the kitties, that is).
Am I the only one who finds it interesting that Strom and Lester Maddox died within a day of each other?
(Of course, Maddox reformed--and possibly even repented; I'm not all that up on his post-axe handle life--in the seventies, but still ...)
Boxing up books, boxing up books; I remain,
Alex
Brian, I'd say we could do society a favor; dig Strom back up and kill him again.
I'm leftist, never said I was a loving one.
But, in the real world, anyone who gloats about Thurmon's death, will be labelled with the hate brush. The stark reality in a world where good manners overlays truth.
--------------
Cats are the curmudgeons of the animal world. Harlan, buddy, reconsider. I loves those meowing little varments. And they taste good with a rich Chateau Montelena wine. Burp.
Posting like the Dickens
Rob: I happen to be reading DAVID COPPERFIELD at the moment, and it seems like Murdstone is a lightning rod for the anger and betrayal Dickens feels for his parents. While Mr. Micawber (the good-natured chronic debtor) is widely considered to be based on Dicken's father, I would also say both David's actual father and the Murdstones have their source in Dicken's parents. Dickens obviously considered his father to be a very weak man and it seems by making David Copperfield's actual parents both so weak and sensitive that it killed them. But it's hard to really get engaged with someone who is so weak, so I think Dickens takes out his frustration with his parents in the Murdstones.
It's difficult to say what the inspiration was otherwise - there's certainly nothing unique about a distant, authoritarian, cruel father figure in literature, and Dickens certainly had enough childhood abuse, abandonment, and resentment in his own life to draw upon. I would guess the Poe similarities to be coincidental, but I am by no means an expert and it would be an interesting avenue to wander down. I know our patron author and his friend Maggie Thompson are both huge Dickensphiles, so it's certainly a worthy topic for discussion here.
As far as cat cabalism; other famous cat haters:
Noah Webster, Ambrose Bierce, Harlan Ellison
Correction: sorry, I mean Diana. How dense of me.
Diane's historical highlighting of the cabalistic maligning of cats brings to mind a notion that recently struck me about POE.
...or I should say, more precisely, about DICKENS.
Do you realize there are some striking parallels between the adventure DAVID COPPERFIELD and Poe's life? The accounts of childhood abuse and resentment, the mother's death, the runaway, and, most vividly, the character Murdstone - the sadistic stepfather - sharing much with Poe's stepfather, JOHN ALLAN.
In short, I wonder if Dickens used Poe and John Allan as an inspiration for his novel.
Of course, in speculating this I have to bear in mind the closeness in years between Poe and Dickens. And the controversial depiction of John Allan; some historians view him as abusive, while others view him as merely authoritarian. (And, admittedly, the image of John Allan was largely drawn by a biased, angry Edgar - who, to be fair, had picked up a terrible gambling habit and blew all the money Allan provided him with for school; his argument being he HAD to resort to gambling because his stepfather had not provided him sufficiently to live on. Allan subsequently cut him off. COMPLETELY. You tend to ask yourself, "who WOULDN'T?" He may have been a ruthless asshole, ultimately blind to Poe's incredible gifts, but he may have also had a good argument at the time. I dunno know, more here needs explorin'). Nevertheless, the dark, mythic aspects could have been a moving source for Dickens.
Any lit majors and experts here...do you have any facts or input to validate this theory? Anyone know who Dickens used as a model for Murdstone and the storyline itself...if it wasn't Poe?
(Harlan, you know that I know that you know that I know that you know the answer!)
Brian,
I have it on good authority that Strom arrived in Hell today and is being welcomed by a line of demons beating him with a poplar tree branch. You don't want to know what else they're doing with those branches. After the welcome ceremony, he will be roasted by his peers, then drawn and quartered. (Cigars and elderberry wine to follow.) If you didn't get your invite, I'll see if Maleclysto has an extra one.
It makes me angry that Strom Thurmond died last night. Because he should've died _years_ ago, preferably around the time of the march on Selma. Instead, we got decades of Thurmond in power-- decades of segregationist bullshit polluting the Senate, decades of hate, decades of right-wing maneuverings, decades of subsidies and Congressional support for the tobacco industry, and Lord knows what else as a result of this corrupt, venal, demented little troglodyte's presence on the planet.
I can think of no better proof of God's existence than the 100-year lifespan of Strom Thurmond. It also proves that God is every bit the "malign thug" of Mark Twain's appraisal.
AILUROPHOBIA
"For he keeps The Lord's watch in the night against the adversary.
For he counteracts the powers of darkness by his electrical skin and glaring eyes.
For he counteracts the devil, who is death, by brisking about the life.
For in his morning orisons he loves the sun and the sun loves him.
For he is of the tribe of Tiger"
~Christopher Smart~ (On his cat Jeoffry)
Dear Mr Ellison
During the Dark Ages, cats were killed as demonic beings. It was a phrase in a book written during this period that gave rise to the idea that cats have nine lives. The English writer William Baldwin wrote in his book Beware the Cat that "it is permitted for a witch to take her cat's body nine times." In the 15th Century, Pope Innocent VIII decreed that all cat-worshippers in Europe be burned as witches. During this time, as thousands of "witches" were cruelly burned at the stake, many an unfortunate cat accompanied them to their terrible deaths. This, despite the unsuspected aid that cats provided by reducing the rat population that spread the Bubonic Plague. Even as late as the Salem witchcraft trials, cats were often burned or hung with those accused of witchcraft (remnants of this period can still be seen in the black cats of Halloween).
Some famous cat haters:
Julius Caesar, Charles Manson, Alexander The Great, Napoleon, Adolph Hitler.
Some famous cat lovers:
Abraham Lincoln, Winston Churchill, Charles Baudelaire, Jean Cocteau, T.S. Eliot, Robert Heinlein, Ernest Hemingway, Cleveland Amory, Florence Nightingale, Albert Schweitzer, Sir Isaac Newton, Mark Twain, Henry David Thoreau, Kingsley Amis, Leonardo da Vinci, et al.
Sincerely,
Diana
*** Susan!*** I squandered yesterday's post by hitting the send key before adding
Happy Birthday Susan!!! - belated -
Hope Harlan honors the "29 again" when the spanking ceremony comes around. ;-)
- Barney (also 29 again) Dannelke
Berman, good to know that you are ok, ole chum. And don't let them fool ya; guitars are the children that cry the sweetest.
--------
Shaines was the name of the restaurant Harlan wrote about. I think he mentioned once that it had closed. Too bad, that essay of his always makes me hungry as sin. Bastard. lol.
Here's a link for y'all. It's devoted to Gustav Hasford, a writer whose first novel _The Short-Timers_ was the basis of Kubrick's _Full Metal Jacket_. He wrote two other novels, _The Phantom Blooper_ and _A Gypsy Good Time_, before dying od diabetes in the 1990s.
And all three books are available on the site in HTML, and you can order them as well.
The site's at http://www.short-timers.com/home.htm
The intro mentions he lived with Harlan for a while in the 1970s (also mentioned in Harlan's Hornbook).
The cats...
Mel,
Don't worry. There's a big difference between kids and cats in the heart of a guy. You'd never think in the dark shadows of your heart about how far a child would sail from the tip of your boot. Cats, on the other hand...
Alex:
First I'm happy to hear that no-one (including cats) was hurt. Second, I hope none of the books were too badly damaged.
I told Scotty about it, while he was on break, and his response was "God, the guitars". I reminded him about the cats, and all I got was a "Who cares? The guitars..."
Wondering how Scotty really feels about the kids, Melissa
Alex,
Just what the fuck were you doing with books in your house ANYWAY? I dunno whether to express sympathy over the disaster or call the FBI.
Birthday Greetings
Late but heartfelt, Happy Birthday, Susan.
Bern
Ellison on Food
I seem to remember one or two restaurant reviews in AN EDGE IN MY VOICE. I seem to think there was something about some place's French Onion Soup because it was around that time that I first tried the stuff and fell in love...sigh.
Take care,
Bill
Toenails
Dear Mr Ellison,
I don't care much for sports, but you made that baseball game sound almost interesting. Of course you could probably make a story about clipping your toenails sound interesting. I don't think I'd enjoying watching that going on either.
Sincerely,
Diana
**********************
Hi Phoenix,
Thanks for sharing about yourself. I'd be very interested in hearing how you met Paul Williams, where, why when, etc., along with any personal anecdotes you have relating to that.
And thank you for your kind words about me. :=)
You can ask Mr Ellison questions at this forum. Sometimes he answers them.
Sincerely,
Diana
P.S. Mr Ellison is friends with Paul Williams. You could ask him about that.
Fuck Pens and Swords--The TRUE Weapons of Mass Destruction ...
... are BOOKS.
I came home tonight, planning on a quick 'Net-hop and some much-needed sleep (I work until 2:30 in the ayem, and I've been awake for two days).
I came home to a living room which looked as if it had been hit by a bomb.
An entire wall's-worth of bookcases had fallen, toppling maybe twenty-five hundred of the three-thousand books in the room, all the assorted geegaws and thingies on the shelves, including a rarely-watched twenty-inch television. My pills are somewhere in that pile, as are two of my guitars. I have no idea what damage has been caused to the books, to the things under it--god help me, to the FLOOR (and ceiling of my downstairs neighbors) ...
Neither of my cats are hurt, but one is understandably still scared shitless.
I have to get the important things out of the mess first, but I'm slackjawed; shellshocked. Brian has seen what my living room looks like, but he saw it maybe a thousand books ago. I hope the bookshelves are salvageable. I hope no real damage has been done. I hope Threnody isn't permanently traumatized.
And I have NO idea where I'm going to start ...
I realize this isn't on a par with the Great Webderland Quake of '95, but ... Jeezus Jockstrap ...
Harlan: Seeing Satchel Paige live? OK, that definitely makes me envious. Thanks for the reply.
And as it clocks toward midnight on the West Coast, I guess I get to be the last to wish Susan a Happy Birthday on the calendar day. On the West Coast, anyway.
Cheers, Jon
JON STOVER:
Yes, Smokey, I did indeed see Larry Doby slashing across the Cleveland outfield at the old (now vanished) Lakefront Stadium, 1948-49. But I'll be frank with you: not realizing what an historic breakthrough it was to have a "Negro" playing in the American League -- I was, from having been on the road from age 13, truly color-blind -- I was more concerned with Boudreau and Keltner and Joe Gordon and Jim Hegan and my idol, Bob Feller; and then all my wonder and joy went into Satchel Paige, who was the fastest goddam thing I'd ever seen. He was the 7th Wonder of the Modern World to me, and I suppose I never got behind Doby because of that. He was a splendid player, and I suppose if I'd had a different world-view, I would've paid more attention.
But, oh boy, that Satchel was some sweet candyapple thing to watch work. The Fred Astaire of the mound. Black Nureyev. genie let loose out of the bottle of the Negro Leagues. Threw blue lightning, just a shaft of sizzling blue light, snakestrike fast and evilly accurate, even for a young man; and he was, at that point, by no means a >young< man.
Yr. pal, Harlan
Glad I decided to check this page before dropping like a stone into bed!
HAPPY BIRTHDAY SUSAN!
I hope Harlan makes you a nice cake.
mmmmmmmmm........... caaaaaaake.
best to all,
Michael
To Susan Ellison:
Happy birthday, nice lady. Make sure hubby treats you well. And no store-bought cake.
Chuck
USA
Hi Susan, I hope you are having a Happy Birthday. I stopped at a comic books convention here in Des Moines on Sunday and picked up a couple of Harlan items for my collection. From Detective Comics in October, 1986 I found a very humorous tale called "The Night Of Thanks, But No Thanks" and from Unknown Worlds of Science Fiction in May 1975 I found an illustrated version of "Repent, Harlequin." I would have done better but I forgot my list of comics with Harlan bylines as I was in a hurry to get to church in the morning and left it on my dresser. Oh well. I also found a complete run of Babylon 5 comics and a Twilight Zone with J. Michael Staczynski as one of the authors. not a bad haul. I also got a couple of business cards with email addresses to finish my Harlan collection of comics. Looking forward still to that next issue of Dream Corridor. Bye for now. Roger Gjovig
Everything is funny as long as it's happening to somebody else.
Happy Birthday, Susan
(Don't worry, on the 19th they played the same joke on ME)
Yes, Susan,
A very happy birthday to you. May you and your husband celebrate in magnificent fashion tonight.
Here is to many, MANY more wonderful birthdays.
:)
Cindy
*** David *** I don't know that there's enough for a book, perhaps a chapbook with better production values than, umm, some I have seen.
On a similar front, well over a year ago my wife was paid a very healthy chunk of change to interview Harlan about spicy foods for a celebrity section of Chile Pepper Magazine. Then they changed editors and that became a sidebar piece. Then they were going to run it on their website. Then they changed editors again and it was never run anywhere. It's probably between 700 and 2,000 words. She would know as the transcript is on her PC. But the check cleared and the damned thing is still in the air. Chile Pepper has paid for 1st appearance North American rights But Lenora is trying to get somebody to commit to publishing it or officially letting it go. It's a very nice piece which could probably make for a nice Rabbit Hole page or two if Harlan and Susan would want to run it.
It's frustrating because Chile Pepper didn't pay her a kill fee, they paid the full amount. I'm sure that if Chile Pepper hadn't gone through so many editors this would have been resolved. When you're a freelance writer you don't want to push a new editor on old business - those incoming editors are our next months bread and butter.
This has been quite an education for me as an observer. Lenora has now written for about a dozen magazines including local, regional and national markets. It's the most amazing revolving door I've ever seen. Good, bad or indifferent, it's a freakin' miracle any of these magazines ever get to the printer at all.
The good news is that Lenora is becoming a deadline pinch hitter for 3 of these markets. When the new incoming editor has 3 weeks to do a 6-8 week windows worth of work a proofreader turned staff writer looks like a flaslight beam in a collapsed mineshaft.
And just to head somebody off at the pass, Lenora doesn't check over this blather I type. If she did, 5 lines of 6 would never pass muster.
- Barney
Many, many thanks for your kind birthday wishes. It's good to be 25 again.
All best--Susan
Mongolian birthday song just for The Garden Variety Goddess!
{sung by great burly smelly mongols}
Happy birthday ::UGH::
Happy birthday ::UGH::
May the candles on your cake!
Burn like cities in your wake!
Happy birthday ::UGH::
HE on food
I've certainly noticed references here and there to HE's cooking skills, but I don't recall much writing about cuisine, per se. Has anyone done a bibliography of this particular aspect of HE's oeuvre? (Barney?)
Evidently, no publisher's proposed collecting it all in one place. . . .
U S of A
Hello Diana,
Thanks for noticing and posting such a nice message!
To make it simple,I'm a songwriter who wants to make it big in the music business but doesn't want to go on American Idol.
I have a deep deep love for music. My soul has to have it!
And I see that you have GREAT taste in music!
Paul Williams is one of my favorites. A true genius.
There's a saying "Never meet your heros because you'll end up being disappointed."
Well, I've met Mr. Paul H Williams and he is 100%
tender-hearted, charming, and funny.
I can only pray that our paths will meet again.
And I hope to read more of your posts, Diana.
You seem like a pretty cool person!
Oh, and happy birthday to Susan.
Phoenix
SUSAN,
Happy birthday, and keep Harlan alive and well for another few decades for us all.
Oh - and Frank? I see Helena Bonham Carter as Susan. (Okay, FINE, I have a thing for Helena Bonham Carter.)
Party-time!!!
Bring out the fireworks and other explosive devices, people. It is Susan's birthday!!!! And you know what that means. Party, party, party. Happy Birthday, Susan!!!!! Too bad you ain't in Chicago, tonight. Otherwise I woulld have made arrangements for you and Harlan to see Los Van Van from Cuba at the House of Blues so you two could have danced the night away.
Alejandro
Hell, the Susan, Harlan marriage would make for a great movie. Maybe some great english actress could play the fair Susan, while Harlan could be played by Richard Dreyfuss. That would be a fine and entertaining little ditty. Much more fun than the Al, Tipper love affair.
Peace and eternal happiness Susan. If you get the chance, come here some day and tell us a short story about what you first saw in our Harlan. Not saying he is not the man of all seasons, but we'd all be curious. Be good.
Best wishes for a great birthday, Susan!
-J
SUSAN!
Happy birthday from the Harrisburg brood! To a year free of the Martian Death Flu and full of great joy.
Harlan's Chili?
Dear Mr. Ellison,
Thanks for the reply. I should say I fully expected that you would be a great cook, and I lament not being able to try your prize-winning chili (I am something of a chili fanatic myself). Perhaps the recipe is something you might consider sharing someday? I also regret that I am not acquainted with your food writing. I've read a number of the "Watching" columns as well as the pieces on media from The Glass Teat, but I would love to see how you apply the Ellison style to a good plate of penne.
The ever hungry,
Steve Dooner
Susan: HAPPY BIRTHDAY. Here is the traditional Bermanator Birthday Poem composed just for you:
There once was a woman named Susan,
Who does much more winnin' than losin'.
That beautiful darlin'
Who married ol' Harlan
Hope her birthday is more than amusin'.
(Hey, it's the best I could do on the fly, and it's the thought that counts, right?)
PAB
Susan:
We don't know each other, but please accept mine and my family's best wishes for you birthday.
Love to all, Melissa
Happy birthday, Susan.
Bill
HAPPY BIRTHDAY SUSAN!!!
You'll be getting a package from us soon!!
Lots of Love Tim, Andrea and Miss Alexa.
Swan's Song
Dear Mr Ellison,
I forgot to mention how nice I thought Phoenix's poem was. I'm surprised no one bothered to respond to her about it yet. I bet she posted it with the idea that someone of your literary inclinations might appreciate it. I certainly did.
Sincerely,
Diana
***************************
Dear Phoenix,
Thank you for taking the time and trouble to share that sad pretty poem with us. I hope you decide to post again soon. Maybe next time you can say hello or something and let people know a little about who you are. If you feel like it. :=)
Maybe you'd be interested in knowing that I have a site about the songwriter, Paul Williams, (http://www.intothenight.net) who wrote the music for Brian De Palma's great, overlooked 1970s glitter-rock comedy-musical spectacle, Phantom of the Paradise? The movie featured a female lead by the name of Phoenix! (it also features Paul Williams camping it up as the villian, who's name is Swan)
In case you'd like to find out a bit more about Phantom of the Paradise, the following site offers a decent synopsis of the story.
http://www.briandepalma.net/phantom/phantom.htm
Anyway, I hope you decide to visit Webderland again soon.
Diana
Okay, I have a nice general question for Harlan. We've seen a slew of comic-book movies come out recently, ranging from films based on comics (Daredevil, Spider-Man, the Hulk), movies strongly influenced by comics (Matrix Reloaded), and movies based on comics that are very un-comic-book-like (From Hell, Ghost World).
I'd like to sound you out on the first two categories, i.e., action-superhero fare. Any ideas on what makes or breaks a movie made in this genre? Does it make sense to make a superhero "realistic," given that superheroes are already pretty _un_realistic? Have any of these fulfilled what you've wanted from them, and have any been really egregious disappointments? Does the recent swell of superhero movies give you lots of kidlike joy, or do they seem like too much money for too little content? In general, how do ya feel about the recent blockbuster trends?
Tony;
The anecdote can be had, alongside a great tale of Harlan vs. the Evil Kazan, in the introduction of Edgeworks 4 - "Love Ain't Nothing But Sex Misspelled" & "The Beast Who Shouted Love At The Heart of the World".
A voice...
TODD: Freakin' sweet. I go to school in Tucson (the poor smoldering creature), and am somewhat familiar with Connotations. A friend of Ed Bryant's introduced me to it when I was taking one of Bryant's creative writing classes. Anyhoo, thanks for the heads up!
J
>Regarding The League of Extraordinary Gentleman - I have a very bad feeling about this<
I heard that the production was very troubled, mostly because Sean Connery was being a huge jerk on the set and hated the director. It was a payday for Sean, obviously, since the entire movie is his paycheck and about four geeks creating CGI effects on their Macs.
It may be time for Sean to hang it up. That, or try some light comedy for a change, and get off the action hero train, which he seems to be stuck on since Indiana Jones. I don't think he's done a decent script since Name of the Rose.
Harlan's Comin' To Th' Desert !!
Well, we've now moved into our new house in the desert and we're too friggin' exhausted to move....and I've been too friggin' exhausted to even read this board for awhile.
But now I'm happy: just read that Harlan's comin' to the Valley of the Sun out here in Phoenix, AZ. There's a free SF/Fantasy Convention paper out here called Connotations, and the latest issue had an inspiring little ditty titled "I Have No Mouth And I Must Scream Author Returns To Speak In Valley". Fine, not the smoothest headline for a 4 paragraph article (with photo), and fine again, it ain't until September 10th, but damned if this doesn't make the spouse and I feel better about missing our first I-Con in close to a decade.
Harlan's coming to speak to the Youth of America at Estella Mountain Community College and Glendale Community College! OK, the Youth of America plus two oldsters in their 40's.
Huzzah!
-TODD
Joseph mentioned: "I read the story about you, a lawnmower and your elementary school."
Does anyone know what story that is and where it can be found? Still looking for the story about the midget detective if anyone knows where it can be found. "Killer in the Can"? Priceless!
Thanks
Tony
Regarding The League of Extraordinary Gentleman - I have a very bad feeling about this. I love the comic and "want" to like the movie but Connery is just wrong for the part as the character is conceived in the comic. And including Tom Sawyer is just random Hollywood nonsense. I wonder if Tom will be the unreconstructed Southern racist he was at the end of Huck Finn? That would at least be interesting. Nemo would have him sleeping with the fishes in no time. Just a giggle. - Barney
Harlan: Did you ever see Larry Doby (who passed away this week) play?
Cheers, Jon
HARLAN,
No sweat. But if you ever happen to come across THE HULK in a video store, BY ALL MEANS rent it. You'll be surprised - incredibly so. While hardly a flawless film, it's more eccentric, introverted, and downright WEIRD then you would expect from a standard superhero movie. (No, the Hulk doesn't visit Twin Peaks, and he doesn't inhale from an oxygen tank.)
Thanks anyway. Oh yes - love the IHNMAIMS poster.
Jew-Lover
***Count me in. I was raised catholic and am married to the jew-boy we all know and love--Todd!
***Don't worry Rick-that is all I have to say!
Fried salami on rye eh? Sounds heart clogging. Count this vampire in.
-----------
Thanks to Oprah's book club Steinbeck's masterful East Of Eden is on the best seller list. Props to Oprah for picking a good book. Now if she would only give more of her money away she would be perfect. Give me her money and see the tree of life grow more roots. But good show on the book Oprah. Now if she picks Wilde's Picture Of Dorian Gray I will marry her.
----------
Harlan, you ever hear of Strunz and Farah, the music group? I know you like flamenco guitar. They are amazing and spellbinding. They are called New Age, but I don't hear it. Enjoy when you get the chance.
thunderdrugs are go!
Diane,
The package arrived today, thanks so much. *whew* Let me know what I owe ya...
Harlan & Susan,
I'm very sorry I won't be able to deliver in person. However, you should hear from Mark in the next few days to make arrangements, so at least you'll get the drugs. And you get to meet my better, more thoughtful, pleasant half! (really, don't believe me, ask Lynn).
Cheers,
Peg
BEN: Can't answer your question. Haven't seen THE HULK. Nor have I seen DAREDEVIL, X-MEN II, MATRIX RELOADED, THE CORE or 2FAST2FURIOUS. Plan to see THE LEAGUE oF EXTRAORDINARY GENTLEMEN
and BRUCE ALMIGHTY, if I get my work done.
Sorry, pal.
-he
MR. DOONER, SIR:
Among the many and multifarious jobs I held as a johnny-come-lately bindlestiff, on the road at an early age, was short order cook and fry-cook. Do I cook? Indeed I do. Ask anyone who has sampled my chili, which is world-class, and which I used to take for competition to the world chili cook-off in Terlinga, Texas and which now is so highly desired (though Susan and I make it only five, six times a year) that we have to use a list of our friends, to ascertain (in order) who will be offered the rare opportunity to chow down with us on that selfsame chili. My fried salami on corn rye sandwich is to die for. My duck l'orange is masterful and wickedly crisp. My Khyber Pass Mulligatawny Soup is breathtaking. If you check out Anne McCaffrey's COOKING OUT OF THIS WORLD (Wildside Press) you will find my justly and universally famous recipe for Caffe Ellison Diabolique. Not to mention that I was a gourmet reporter for more than twenty years.
Smartass.
Respectfully, yr. pal, Harlan
Gourmand or Gourmet?
Dear Harlan,
Cindy's post has opened up a serious topic for me. You wrote eloquently, nay rhapsodically, about dimsum. May we expect a forthcoming Ellison cookbook to rival M.F.K. Fisher's masterpieces? More importantly, can Harlan Ellison cook?
Steve Dooner
Hot damn, Lynn!
You might have just come up with the perfect punishment for the bird nazi.
Turn her over to the law.
Cindy
Justin,
Hmmm--
As for someone yelling out " Jew Lover" to you-- if they did that to me I would have flashed my sweetest most charming smile and given them a thumbs up and a cheerful nod.
You're a good sort, Justin.
:)
Cindy
Harlan,
Thank you MOST kindly.
Your post was the delight of my day.
Emeril "BAM" Ellison-- made me fall of my chair ( fortunately it isn't a very tall chair).The culinary Nirvana you describe is enough to lure me from the sticks to Austin very soon. For the heavenly delights that await me, I thank you in advance.
I was also touched and honored by your descriptive invitation.
Hello to your sweet Susan.
:)
Your friend,
Cindy
HELLO KITTY
"We need another and a wiser and perhaps a more mystical concept of animals. Remote from universal nature and living by complicated artifice, man in civilization surveys the creature through the glass of his knowledge and sees thereby a feather magnified and the whole image in distortion. We patronize them for their incompleteness, for their tragic fate for having taken form so far below ourselves. And therein we err, and greatly err. For the animal shall not be measured by man. In a world older and more complete than ours, they move finished and complete, gifted with the extension of the senses we have lost or never attained, living by voices we shall never hear. They are not brethren, they are not underlings: they are other nations, caught with ourselves in the net of life and time, fellow prisoners of the splendour and travail of the earth." --Henry Beston~ "The Outermost House"
Dear Mr Ellison,
Please tell KathyM I appreciate her saying what she did about me, and please tell Rainbow Brite that I said thanks for the nice words. :=) I'd like to think that what she (?) said about you reading my posts was true. But then I'd also like to think that someday I'll manage to re-fold one of those friggin' car maps back to the way it was when I first opened it. In both cases I'm thinking, "Not likely".
What I suspect is more likely is that, if you read my posts at all, you end up wondering stuff like, "How the HELL does this woman keep coming up with the inane shit she rambles on about day after day?"
Believe me, it's not always easy. I probably make it LOOK easy, but that's just because I'm really good at it. One thing I do is try to figure out what I can natter on about that would be interesting to everyone in Webderland. And then I don't write about any of that stuff.
Which reminds me. There's an invention I thought of, but haven't made yet. It would be a perfect and humane way to round up all those tens of thousands of feral cats roaming the Earth, so we could take better care of them. What you should do is, you should make a trap that looks and feels exactly like a brown paper shopping bag. Most cats can't seem to resist crawling into one of them. It's the funniest thing. A cat may be the most dignified, reserved, self respecting cat in the world, it doesn't matter. If you leave a shopping bag on the floor long enough, sooner or later, if the cat sees the "bag" lying around some place it'll HAVE to go inside it (actually, it doesn't have to be a brown paper bag. Fancy shopping bags lure them too, but the brown ones are cheaper) Boxes work similarly.
Speaking of cats and boxes (which I was sort of) how silly am I? I put a box down on the floor sometimes, with a hole in the bottom, and then I poke a stick through the hole and scratch it around, and it drives my cat Wolfgangster crazy. He's apparently not the brightest feline that ever lived. He never figures it out. He never guesses I'm on the outside of the box pushing the stick around. He always falls for it, he hears those scratching noises and thinks, "There's Something In The Box!" and pounces in there. On the other hand, my Siamese cat Ghengi figured things out the very first time I tried that trick with him, and he was only a baby. He did go in the box when he heard a scratching noise inside. But then he came back out of the box after investigating things for a moment. He spotted me back there behind the box, and just LOOKED at me for a moment and then scampered off. I felt pretty silly at that moment.
You're probably not going to catch too many Siamese cats with that shopping bag trap either, come to think of it. They're smart cats.
Ghengi's a hero, by the way. He saved me from being horribly disfigured one time. I have a soft spot in my heart for strays. Especially cats, but other homeless species effect me similarly. Anyway there's a feral cat, a perfectly miserable, and obviously severely abused creature, who scavenges the garbage around where I live. I've taken to leaving food out for him. There's an unused doghouse outside my back bedroom window, and if I hang out of the window by my waist I can just reach the roof of it. That's where I've taken to putting the food. Now this cat HATES people. I don't just mean he's afraid of us, I *mean* he hates us. Madly. God only knows what was done to him to make him the way he is, but he isn't at all a normal cat. He's just plain violent. I don't want to even think about what could have happened to him to have warped him so badly, but that's the way he is. He'll attack a human. He's that messed up. He'll growl and threaten and go for a person. He's scarey and aggressive. Knowing what he's like I'm careful not to go anywhere near him. But anyway, he eats the food I put out. One morning I went to refill the bowl that I keep on the doghouse for his food. I was hanging precariously out of the window, stretching my arm out with this little pot full of cat food to pour it into it, when much to my horror I heard growling. I looked up and there was that cat not two feet from my face, sitting there on a tree branch that reaches out over the doghouse. Jesus-fucking-Christ.
Now my cats are indoor cats. The two of them have divided the house up, Wolfgangster runs the front, and Ghengi rules the back. They're both tomcats, and they don't get along well, but they've worked out a relatively peaceful system of co-existence. They don't cross over into each other's territory very often, and there's a whole ritual of body language and posturing that goes on when one of them does have to encroach on the other one's domain for some reason. They show little interest in going outdoors. They enjoy sitting in windows and looking out, but even if I accidentally leave one open they don't try to exit. If those two toms had worked it out to where Ghengi hung out in the front of the house, instead of the back, I probably wouldn't have a face on me today.
What happened next happened so fast that it wasn't until later that I sorted it out. I mean one moment I'm teetering by my waist out of the window, eyeball-to-eyeball with this menacing creature who WAS going to attack me, and the next moment I heard this hissing sound, something flew over my head, and the mean cat was gone.
As you may or may not have already guessed, what had flown over my head was Ghengi.
Oh man, he beat the shit out of that stray. There was my cat, my fluffy baby, who'd never been outside since the day I brought him home. Never been in a fight in his life, never been aggressive. always calm, sedate, "gentlemanly", out there in the yard, biting and scratching, and gouging for all he was worth. I couldn't believe my eyes. Thanks to him I still *had* eyes in my head to watch the spectacle with, though.
What do suppose it was that had brought him to be standing on that dresser by the window that morning? And what primal genius do you suppose suddenly possessed him? Him who couldn't care less about windows if they were open? Him who rarely dained to bestir his noble shanks even for dinner or a dragged string? Master-of-Napping-With-Never-A-Hair-Out-of_Place. Cool Cat personified. There he was, out there in the leaves and dust, scrapping like a seasoned bar-fighter. How do suppose he knew, in the span of a heartbeat, before my slow human senses had even had time to completely register what was about to happen, that there was danger, and that it was time to fight? Bam. Just like that. No how-do-you-do, no prior warning, no by-your-leave. No nuthin', one second he was the sleek, elegant, ultra sedate house cat I'd always known, the next he was charging like a rage maddened samurai, going from zero-to-sixty, in less time than it took me to draw a breath. Over my head, out the window and into that other cat's face. You should have seen him. He was pretty awesome.
I don't know what got into him, maybe just pure instinct, but I'm glad it did, because that old cat saved me that morning. And *that's* a natural fact.
Sincerely,
Diana
Diana
I enjoy your posts, as well. Hope you don't shy away. You are certainly an original -- and I like that about your posts. If some people posted negative stuff on your website -- what the hell. Ignore 'em. Hope to see more of your insteresting thoughts.
dot dot dash dot fart fart dot dash fart
Harlan?!? Your fadder wuz Basil Rathbone? Holy gene pool Bat-dude!
Seriously, it is nice and somewhat comforting to know such acting talents are remembered appropriately and honorably.
But as to why you allow people other than your lovely wife into the inner sanctum that is your bedroom--well, okay.
Now why did I come in here? Oh! Yes. As a tip of the hat, a deep bow from the waist to the talent that IS (thankfully, still) Harlan Ellison I have decided to launch a writing contest of sorts: No entry fee, no money prizes. Nothing like that. Just the chance for interested parties to flex their writing muscles.
And, oh, yes: No length limit (I gotta wonder what the hell I was thinking on this one). The only conditions are that it be to me by the end of July 2003 and start with a predetermined line.
Which I will not repeat here because I don't want certain people clogging the pool filter around these parts with their stabs and thrusts at said effort.
And why do I mention it? Because a number of years ago, Harlan, you reviewed my writing efforts and did me well to do so. For this I am thankful.
And now comes my turn to do the same for others. I intend to grade these efforts much in the same manner and fashion you graded my half-assed effort time ago. And. . .
If I find one, maybe two, worthy of consideration, I would like to pass them on to you for review. Should you deem them worthy of whatever, then do with them what you will.
At this point, though, I wouldn't get too concerned. The submissions thus far are anything but inspired.
Thank you again for you did for me those years ago. And don't ever stop.
Until next time. . .
I guess I can't comment on the "Kraut bitch" thing then. Poo.
--------------
Harlan, sorry about the Harry Potter rant, I just see those books as a form of crack cocaine for little duffers, who may very well grow up as stupid as they seem. I was at the book store Friday, and the wild youth mob running around screaming at the top of their lungs, as I tried to read, made my gums hurt. I will just end my rant with a peace offering. I hate the books, others appreciate them.
And I do have many things that make me smile, with the beam of the angels glinting from my eyes. Here's a list:
Cute kids, sad movies, Spielberg, Jello Biafra, Chomsky, Harlan Ellison (wink), Michael Moore, sharp political writing, poetry, Van Gogh, Dali, Morricone, Prince, Zappa, black and white films, Unitarianism, ACLU, People For the American Way, Animals, good food, beer, an occasional wench and whipped cream (hehe), Strawberry shortcake, Chocolate pudding, coffee, wine, good conversation, Documentaries, politics, football, basketball, friends, protesting, great books, home decorating, funny t-shirts, C-Span, good television, David Copperfield, David Blane, George Carlin...
Whew... Love to all. Rick, we understand sir. But please lighten up a bit sometimes. Gotta have a sense of humor in this day and age. We will be good. At least they will.
Not the first, certainly not the last time my mouth will cause trouble. In Ellison news: Warren Ellis' latest Bad Signals column paraphrases a pretty delicious quote from our patron author, regarding people who step into speculative fiction without having a clue what they're doing. For the interested, the column has been reproduced here: http://aintitcool.com/display.cgi?id=15492
Ta,
J
Bird murder
Justin~
There's a special place in hell for people like your landlady. The same cell block where they keep the people that throw puppies in sacks into traffic.
I do know that in California, the mud swallows are protected. You can knock the nest down every day up until it's completed, but if there are eggs, it's hand's off.
What your landlady did may be illegal. Check your state's laws.
L.
Diana,
Please don't stop posting! I read this board everyday only for you!! I'm sure Harlan reads everything you post without responding also, just as I do.
Love,
Yr Faithful Fan
Recently, Justin posted a personal experience essay about his experience with a cruel woman which ended with his calling her a "kraut bitch." After some initial hurrahs, a discussion opened up about the fact that this is both a racist and misogynistic phrase.
It is unfortunate that Justin was blinded by his passion in his response to this woman and used the epithets in the first place. However, he was truthful in his telling; it was how it happened, for good and bad. He did not take pride in using the words. He took pride in standing up to a bad woman. He is excused.
It is unfortunate that the folks who patted him on the back (Harlan included) were blinded by their passionate response to his moving tale, and expressed their congratulations by lauding and repeating the phrase. However, they were applauding his backbone, and rewarding his courage. I cannot let the fact that they awarded merit to the action without censuring the language, and in some cases rewarding it, go without some action. But this post should suffice to express my opinion - and since the person for whom this board exists does not share that opinion, I'm not inclined to do anything other than comment - which I have done.
Finally, it is unfortunate that those of you who got into the ridiculously drawn-out discussion that followed all this were blinded by your passionate opinions and forgot that this is not a place without a few simple rules. There is only one post per day allowed here. I only make exceptions if you are Harlan Ellison or you are being asked a direct question, using your name, by Harlan Ellison.
This is done for two reasons. First, to enable Harlan to come here and actually be involved in discussions without having to wade through page after page of the same five people having an extended coffee-house discussion online. This was a problem with the old board that troubled him to no end and I am not inclined to allow it under any circumstances. Second, to enable the less frequent voices, and the less verbose discussions, to be heard. I hope I don't have to explain that one.
In the interest of these two aims, I have moved the entire "kraut bitch" thread to the general area of the forums and removed Sunday's discussion from here. I apologize to those who only posted once, but it is not possible to clean up the mess those who didn't follow the rules made without some collateral damage.
Now, as to that mess:
I have had e-mail discussions with several of you who don't seem to understand this rule despite repeated notice. Let me make it clear one more time. I have a responsibility to Harlan to make this a place he wants to visit. I have a responsibility to the people he wants to talk with to allow their voices to be heard. I therefore instituted the one-post-per-day rule. I also feel a responsibility to keep the spirit of the old board alive. I have therefore devoted no small amount of effort towards providing a threaded message base for other discussions so that you might be able to have a place to talk unencumbered by this place's limitations.
This is the way I have chosen to meet my responsibilities. Regardless of what you may think, and whether or not you may disagree with me, this is not a topic for debate - nor is it a rule to be followed only when you find it expedient. It is a rule and I expect you to do no more and no less than follow it.
When I see people disregarding this simple rule at the expense of other people, especially when they note in their post that they know they are doing it, but think they have some special dispensation to break the rules, it makes me crazy. When I have to spend the better part of an hour moving crap, cleaning up crap, and explaining why I did it, I lose precious hours. In short: when people break the rule, it hurts me. I, who have done nothing more here but try to provide you with a room and a voice.
That so many of you do this to me, cost me time, cause me pain, makes you something more than simply neglectful. That you make a promise to me that you only keep when it's convenient makes you something less than a friend.
If you would like me to think of you otherwise, show that you respect me in this one small way.
Thanks,
Rick
(If you have anything to say to me on this matter, I would expect you to do so in e-mail and not sully this board further.)
HARLAN,
I've made the effort not to ask you any particular question the past few months, since one, I've never enjoyed feeling like a pigeon amongst several dozen pigeons, bickering for more grain from the hands of the old lady on the park bench...and two, if I ever did happen to ask a question, it should be about your work. Or at least SOMEHOW related to...you know...that guy. You know, who writes stuff.
I'm afraid I've failed on both counts, but I am genuinely eager to hear your opinion on the HULK movie. I'm not going to embrace it as the word of God, Buddha, Cthulhu or otherwise. But it's just soooooooooooooooo much FUN to see you tear into celluloid, be it with adoration or condemnation.
I just really, really would like to know what you thought. Today, tomorrow, sometime next year, or not at all, whatever you wish.
With sincere thanks,
Benjamin (known as Lil' Washu in the fourth dimension...)
Dear Mr Ellison,
I'm trying to decide what to do. I'd like very much to patch things up between us so I'd like to know if you actually hate my guts, or if there's any chance that you'll forgive at some point? If you actually hate my living guts or something, it would probably best to just go ahead and say so.
If you're waitng to see if I'm ever going to start getting along better with the folks who post here before you think about chatting with me again, I'm letting you know now that's never going to happen. I don't wish to communicate with any of them about anything ever again. I'm sorry about that, but that's how I feel. Actually there never really was any way I was going to get along with your regulars. It was doomed to fail from the outset. I really tried to get along, for my own reasons, I wanted to like them, it would have been easier if I had, but I never worked out.. Their tone their attitude, their online personas, everything about how they communicate, it all grates on my nerves. And I've pretty much always felt this way. Well not the first day, when for some insane reason I dropped that uncalled for load on them. A mean message not written or intended for them. I never will understand what possessed me to do that. I swear to you. But I did it. And then realized that that was NOT right, none of them had done ANYTHING to me to deserve that, so I tried to straighten it out. And then I kept getting dragged into these "conversations" but I wasn't LIKING these people. See? I wanted to quit posting. You're the only person posting here I might have enjoyed communicating with. But not with THESE people around. UGH. Andway, somehow I just kept getting dragged into one conversation after another woth them, trying to deal with it out of respect for you. Until one day a real reason for wanting to post here presented itself. One which has kept me posting through thick and thin. There's no point in my going into that at this point though.
I'll always have an enormous respect for you Mr E. I admire you. I think you're brilliant, and noble, and I think you have great soul. And I'll be sorry to be going away, leaving someone I think so highly of believing terrible things about me. I'd rather have been able to fix that, but I can't figure out how. If it took being able to get along with the people who post here I was out of luck from day one anyway. And if you think I'm some kind of horrendous person, again, I'm out of luck. I kept hoping you were going to figure out what the situation was, and realize I'm not at all the bad guy here, but that doesn't look to me like it's ever going to happen either.
Everyone else will be really happy if you tell me too beat it, Mr E. And all you have to do is say the word to make it so. If there's no hope of you getting over your problems with me I'm just wasting my time. I'll never be able to accomplish what I want anyway.
Sincerely,
Diana
What I really like about the Harry Potter craze (and if I didn't have too much to read already, and a slight lack of funds at the moment, book 5 would be in my hands right now and all of you would be spared this early-morning insanity I'm about to let loose) is that adults are enjoying the books, too. Why do I like that? Because it's building a bridge between parents and kids. What parent would really want to discuss Pokemon or Power Rangers with their kids? Even the number of parents who'd discuss superheroes THEY GREW UP ON are lower than the Potter-people. But here you have two generations reading the books and wondering what will happen next. What's the significance of this or that? And, in the wait for the next one, maybe they'll find other stories for themselves or to share with each other that will bring even more magic into their lives.
I remember when I worked at the Big & Nasty (between 1993 and 1999) and R.L. Stine's GOOSEBUMPS pamphlets--I meant books--were the rage. I can promise you, parents didn't discuss those books with their kids. Nah, Harry Potter is a good thing. I can't wait to sink my mind into it, myself.
End of rant. Go about your business.
Bill
HARLAN,
...I always thought you wuz a right purdy feller...now ah know why.
As for your 'pa', there...among his most memorable moments for ME are his roles in THE DAWN PATROL, IF I WERE KING (as the pathological King Louis), MARK OF ZORRO (as the pathological Capt. Esteban), obviously ROBIN HOOD (as the pathological Sir Guy), TOWER OF LONDON (as the pathological Richard III), and his BEST Holmes, as delivered in HOUND and TERROR BY NIGHT (the tightest and most disciplined, if you will, of the Universal series). If you would care to share some of the pride n' joy your 'pa' brought to you in them days - the roles YOU dug him in - hey, please, don't lemme stop you.
I will add with regards to Ms. Wray, she had but ONE true rival of the day...Maureen O'Sullivan (complete and unclothed in TARZAN AND HIS MATE); they were, in my view, tantamount to the pre-Hays Playboy-Of-The-Month. The two made ME pathological.
BTW...I was going to rent a film because your buddy Steve McQueen was in it (I have by now seen most of his films): NEVER LOVE A STRANGER. My hand reached for it but drew back as though it had taken a near fatal electric shock. Harold Robbins (UGGGHHH!) scripted the thing. Unlike NEVADA SMITH, which was BASED on Robbins' THE CARPETBAGGERS but scripted by John Michael Hayes (quite successfully), this was turned out ENTIRELY by Robbins. IS it a piece of shit? Or was it a rare moment Robbins pulled off something worthwhile? I don't wanna blow cash on drek that's going to annoy the hell out of me. I GENERALLY view films for practical reasons as much as for enjoyment; this one I may have no reason to bother with.
Thanks.
...and later on, down the Yellow Brick Road, I have a question about one of your essays. An interesting one, I think.
Until Next Time...
Sweet Dreams, Little Nemo
ROB: You are absolutely correct on the proper title. I was typing quickly, the book was in another room, I mistaked minownself. Thanks for the correction.
There are two portrait photos in elegant art deco frames in my and Susan's bedroom. I tell all who ask, that they are photos of my mother and father when they were young. "My, what a handsome couple," everyone says. My mother and father were actually decent-looking human beings, but nowhere as godlike as the two in those photos. And since almost no one else knows what my mother and father looked like, they smile and say, "My, what a handsome couple they were." This bit of jackanapery on my part, this innocent balderdash with which I amuse myself for Murgatroyd-knows-what-silly-reason, is herewith related to you, specifically you, Rob.
The people in those frames are Fay Wray and Basil Rathbone.
Have a nice weekend. Yr. pal, Sillyass Ellison
Justin,
I think your reaction to the mindless destruction of the nest was entirely appropriate. The old kraut's behavior is so typical of the old mind-set that saw animals as mere objects to be used and discarded like kleenex. I just hope you'll be okay, and that the swallows can start again. I don't know how long they live or how often they mate, but the species has had to deal with predators long before we came along. My hope is that they build a new nest outside your window, and that Frau Sweinhund will stay away.
I was following the conversation on dim sum and shar-she-boe, and it left me wondering about chinese food and the heart. Having had my heart roto-rootered recently, I would like to keep the arteries unclogged, but I don't want to lose the variety in my diet. I'd like to think chinese isn't too bad, since I never heard of a high rate of heart disease over there. I can kiss french fries and donuts goodbye forever, but I'd like to keep some fun food for the occasional treat.
Chuck
Endangered Species
You might, if you have not already, also want to check out Douglas Adams' book on endangered animals. It's called "Last Chance to See" and perhaps his finest book.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ISBN%3D0345371984
There was a radio series, too, but I've never heard it. I'd love to, though.
HARLAN, that book you were referring to...was that 'A Gap in Nature: Discovering the Worlds Extinct Animals'?
If it's the same one I'm thinking of I remember the book's impact being enhanced by complex illustrations showing what these animals might have looked like were we to see them in their natural habitats; the illustrations having been meticulously worked from skins, bony parts of the animal, and old drawings. I've seen this book several times. And I remember it fueling my anger, that MOST of these creatures were eradicated by the human species with the destruction of habitats, over-hunting and waste, introduction of disease, and bringing in new predators. This scope of loss reminded me of the situation I was subjected to in Indonesia, where its rainforests are even now being demolished by illegal logging and gold-mining. Were it not for the scientists, researchers, and environmentalists I worked for the siege would have been complete years ago...
The only thing we seem determined to PRESERVE is our heritage, however base it might be.
Geez, Frank, how can an admitted Spielberg-phile be critical of... well, anything else? :)
Undoubtedly, the absurd success of the Harry Potter books is out of proportion with the merits of the books themselves - no book is that good! But they have fired up the imaginations of an entire generation of youngsters. Would you bitch about the Hardy Boys books or Tom Swift or Danny Dunn? There are surely other equally worthy or even superior kids' books that go ignored because Rowling's series munches such a huge piece of the pie but that's no reason to denigrate the books or the author. She's written some darn good kids' books that have kids doing something other than trying to figure out the latest cheat codes on Gang(sta)Raper 4 or whatever they're playing.
JUSTIN:
Great post and you should be proud.
I have often felt cruelty to animals to be the most horrifying and inexplicable of human actions. Not that I'm saying human-on-human violence isn't horrific - it's just that, well, in SOME cases, you can at least understand it. Another person can be an asshole. Another person can really piss you off. Let's face it, some people deserve to get their asses beaten and hard. That doesn't mean you're justified in doing so. But you can at least understand a crime of passion or an act of vengeance. The emotional wiring is there to explain such acts.
How can one do such a thing to animals though? I am chilled to the bone when I hear people talk so casually of killing animals. Harlan's baby chick story sends icy spikes up and down my spine.
I have a vivid memory as a child. I was about 5 or 6 and I was in the backyard of my friend Rick's house with his younger sister Heather who I think was a year younger than me. We were watching a bee that had fallen in the sandbox. It was obviously wounded. It crawled around in a circle, flapping a wing pathetically. Heather and i watched it for a while and we both started to cry. Rick came along, asked what we were doing and then stepped on the bee, laughing. I ran home crying. Last I knew of, Rick was in jail.
I wouldn't have such a potent reaction to a bee today, I admit. I don't feel the same connection to the insect kingdom as I do the mammal kingdom. We choose our sides, after all. But when I hear about people setting dogs on fire or crushing baby birds, I can't help but think those are the true sociopaths. The people that I should be VERY VERY afraid of.
Because they obviously don't work the same way I do. They have totally different wiring. And that's scary.
Justin:
My husband was stationed in Germany, during his stint in the Canadian Armed Forces. When he told me this, I envisioned tons of photos and stories of beer gardens. Instead, I got tales of a dark, sooty, ugly grey city, and even greyer people; no pictures and the comment that, if the German people were not the direct inspiration for T.S. Eliot's "Hollow Men" from "The Wastelands", Eliot then conspired with the ruling deity to create them to serve the purpose. Your sad tale is simply more evidence supporting his premise, I would guess.
But, he did get a leave, and went to Paris. Tons of photos of the City of Light, the Louvre; some containing a young woman Scotty won't name...
I know, it's before I came into his life, but I'm still jealous.
Dimsum? There's a good place in Timmins; Scott and I go there occasionally.
Lonegungirl: Nicely done! Our best to your success!
Love to All, Melissa
RE: dimsum
Oooohh--I love dimsum. I haven't been able to have it for the last few months as I've been attempting to lose some of the weight I've put on in the last few years, but it is one of my favorite meals. Something about having to grab dishes off carts as they randomly sweep by your table just adds to the experience immensely. I would agree with the early start time, although when in SF, I have seen huge rooms filled with dim sum eaters as early as 0900. Shark's fin dumpling, chow fun, sesame balls...I mentally drool just thinking of it.
I'm not a huge bow fan, but a link with some info on it (including various spellings) is http://www.greatworldchefs.com/chashu.html
Another thing to remember is that a mark of a really good dim sum place is the sheer volume of noise inside. In Monterey Park, the conversational noise is so great, there are signs outside the restaurant requesting people not talk, so as not to disturb the neighbors.
RE: Nothing in particular
Not that this should be totally meaningful for anyone, but I PASSED MY BOARDS today, and am so relieved that I could actually vomit.
Have a happy day--I intend to.
JUSTIN:
Oh, shit. I spend the morning reading a wonderful, terribly heartbreaking book on extinct species, A GAP IN HISTORY, which damn near brings me to tears; and then I read your post. Your reaction to the kraut bitch was precise and correct. there are moments when humanity MUST overwhelm propriety. Tell your mother that. You demonstrate with your fervor the truth of the universal dictum that for every action there is an equal and opposite REaction. The kraut bitch was the yin; you are the yang. My condolences go out to you.
FRANK: Your Harry Potter post is a sorrowful, mean opinion. Do you find no joy anywhere, old friend? I lament for you because, in this one instance, you are so very very sadly wronghearted.
Otherwise, wishing you all well, I remain,
Yr. pal, Harlan
CINDY:
Shar shi boe is common. It is a dimsum standard. You shouldn't be having to stalk such a plentiful item this gravely. In Los Angeles, New York, San Francisco, Toronto ... dimsum joints are pandemic. I have no idea what the situation may be in Texas, but I betcha Dallas, Houston, especially Austin, Tucson, San Antonio, maybe even Fort Worth, have their share of Chinese dimsum restaurants. Check the Yellow Pages or the inevitable, glossy "city" magazine that lists the Best Dining Spots Do not go to just any Chinese restaurant, though, because clearly you are dealing in your area with "chinese" restaurants being run by Korean, or Taiwanese, Vietnamese, Japanese principals who would know shar shi boe in a Dallas Moment otherwise. No, you must go to one that serves dimsum brunch, either on Saturday or Sunday. Dimsum is now so popular as a repast, however, that a lot of parvenus have added the word to their Yellow Pages ads, or even to their in-window menus, so be cagey. You needn't be Byzantine about it, but go between 11:30 AM and 2:00 PM. PREFERABLY EARLIER RATHER THAN LATER IN THE DAY. (Because, as I will explicate in a moment, the marvelous, magical method of serving dimsum works to your advantage earlier in the day ... also, if you request to be seated near the doors to the kitchen ... )
Ask for it as I've indicated the pronunciation. Or, as is the case with standard dimsum joints, it'll be brought to your table -- along with dozens of other tidbits (for "dimsum" has a number of translations in English, but the most common is "small bites") -- on a rolling hot-cart, right to your table. There will be three, four, five, six different carts, serially wheeled out of the kitchen steaming hot, each cart bearing three, four, five different varieties of viand You select what you want, and they charge you by the plates stacked up on your table. You'll recognize shar shi boe because it looks like a large dollop of cloud-mass; a white flour semi-hemispherical rosette, stuffed with a sweet meat paste of deep purple hue. Each portion sits on (and must be peeled off) a square of rice paper. Usually comes two or three to an order. Dip in hoisin sauce. Mmmmmmmmmm.
Try the turnip cake. Usually three to an order. About $1.50. Try the shrimp dumplings: har gow. Dip in soy sauce. Try the sticky rice in lotus leaf. Try the sesame rice dumplings (my fave). Try siu mai (pronounced shoo-my), the scrumtious pork dumplings. It occurs to me that your restauranteurs may not know the name shar shi boe, but they might recognize the phrase "pork bun." Try the lotus seed buns, the hom sui gok, the steamed ribs in black bean sauce, the steamed fun gor.
Or just come to LA and Susan and I will take you to the Golden Dragon in Chinatown, and we'll stuff you so full of goodies that they'll dribble you out of the joint like a basketball.
Shar shi boe, char she bo, pudd'n tame, ask me again and I'll tell you the same, by whatever name, Cindy, it is easier to get than you think. Follow my directions, have shar shi boe tomorrow morning, that soon!
Yr. pal, Emeril BAM! Ellison, the Iron Gourmet
Where is Hitchcock when you need him?
Forgive the length of this post. It is, unashamedly, a vent post, and I'm sorry to just pop in with a "vent post" without contributing anything to discussions for a while, but it's been... well, you know how it is. And anyway I know most of you to be bright and sensitive people who would never do something like THIS, and who will surely understand why I am so upset:
In late April a pair of effortlessly handsome swallows, male and female, began building a nest just outside the window where I do most of my writing. For almost eight weeks I watched them build their nest from mud and grass, meticulously bringing bits in, taking bits away. It was an incredibly difficult, intricate process, and it was my pleasure to witness it. Two weeks ago they moved in for good, and the overhang beneath which they'd built their home protected them from the fierce dust and rain storms that have been plaguing the area these past few weeks. Then, six days ago, I sat down to write, and saw three babies snuggled up in the next, sandwiched between the parents who would occasionally swoop off and collect food for their kids.
This morning I awoke to the sound of scraping outside my bedroom window, and as I lay contemplating the idea of dragging myself out of bed to investigate, my dad came into my room and told me the landlady had come from Arizona to inspect her property, to do some cleaning and repairs. She had been wiping down the screen outside my bedroom window, that's what the noise was.
She had also knocked down the nest. My father was terribly upset with her, but I burst instantly into a fit of apoplexy. I ran out back to confront the woman, who turned out to be an elderly German. Understand that when I was in Europe I came to dearly loathe every German I came across, and when I heard her thick accent, like an epileptic giraffe trying to recite Coleridge in mid-seizure, I thought simply, "Figures."
As I write this, the mom and dad swallow are swooping frantically outside my window looking for their children, crazed with worry.
"Why," I asked, maintaining precisely the sort of composure I am known for in these situations (imagine a javelina on amphetamines), "the fuck did you knock down that nest?"
"VELL YOU ZEE, VE CANNOT HAVE ZEM HERE BECAUSE ZEY CAUZE PROBLEMZ."
"What problems?"
"VE CANNOT HAVE ZEM."
"What did you do with the nest?"
"IT IZ IN A BAG."
"Youre going to keep it?"
"JA."
"And what," I continued, trying desperately to fight off the urge to slap her face, "did you do with the babies?"
"I BURIED ZEM."
I scarcely knew what to say. "They weren't bothering anybody," I protested, feebly. Then a thought struck me, and I proceeded my inquiry, horrorstruck. "Were the babies ALIVE, when you buried them?"
"I DON'T NEED ZIS LIP FROM YOU. VAT DID YOU VANT ME TO DO, KILL ZEM AGAIN?"
How is it possible, I put it to you? How can one living thing do that to another? It was a question I put very pointedly to the disgusting specimen, to which she replied with the dumbest, blankest shrug I have ever had thrust at me. And perhaps that speaks volumes more than any detailed, articulate explanation ever could. The kind of blind, unthinking cruelty that could allow a person to destroy lives (or bury them still breathing) so effortlessly leaves me devastated and sickened with my species, because this whole episode is an apt metaphor for the patterns of careless and destructive behavior for which homo sapiens have become justifiably infamous. I know that far worse and more hateful things happen on a minute-by-minute basis, and it is strange how I can hear about an African massacre on the BBC and not be thrown into a fury that equals the rage I feel now, but I suppose that's by design and necessity. A person would go crazy. A long time ago, on this very board, someone paraphrased Philip K. Dick, and if I recall correctly it was a question that went something like this: "Are all people really people, or are some people just reaction machines without empathy?"
So I exploded in her face, possibly overreacting and being hideously inappropriate, but I don't think so, nor would I give a fuck if I did think so. I was railling against the attack of the zombiewomen, what the fuck do you want me to do, hold my tongue? "WHAT THE FUCK IS THE MATTER WITH YOU? HOW COULD YOU DO THAT TO ANOTHER LIVING CREATURE? (the shrug) SO IT'S A SORT OF SWALLOW HOLOCAUST, IS IT? VAT EEZ ZEES, ZE FINAL SWALLOW ZOLUTION, YOU HEARTLESS KRAUT BITCH?!"
There are times in my little retellings of events that I exaggerate and make myself out to be braver or smarter or quicker than I normally am, but that's a direct quote and I couldn't be prouder. After that exchange I essentially chased her off her own property with a string of threats and abuse my mother would disown me for. Little satisfaction it gives me (but some).
This morning I have witnessed the utter destruction of a home and family I watched form with admiration and joy, and went on to yell obscenities at an elderly immigrant woman whilst still in my PJs. And those birds are still flapping madly outside of my window, and I feel like it's going to drive me insane, because I see them flapping and chirping, commiserating with and shouting at one another, and I know that all they're doing is fighting against the realization that their lives have been for naught. All their hard work, care and industriousness undone in one careless knock of a broom handle.
And how was your day?
I agree with Eric, that anything that gets kids to read is a good thing. Frank, don't know where all your anti-Rowling venom comes from. Would you rather they watched TV or played some Grand Theft Auto? Sure there are "better" books in the world than Harry Potter, but it's a great starting point. My best friend's niece loves those books, so my friend got her the Chronicles of Narnia and the Wrinkle in Time books. Her niece loved them too, and now she's interested in a genre that has, in the past, been shunned by girls. This is a very good thing.
Cookie: I'm sorry that guy hurt you so much. For people like that, the best punishment you can wish on them is already in place-- every morning they have to wake up and look in the mirror at their own faces. Believe me, I understand the desire to be as Horus unto Set but, as Harlan himself pointed out in "The Man Who Was Heavily Into Revenge," the thing about revenge is that it rarely works out the way you want it ... except if you're Montresor, but then again, he's crazy and also obviously miserable. I hope the memory of this will lose its sting for you soon b/c you deserve to be happy.
Cindy: Should I know what SharSheBoe is? Or is it an inside joke?
Eric: I just read your message about embarrassment on message boards. You're right, it's really not that important in the grand scheme of things. But I am so rarely embarrassed or ashamed that any instance of public humiliation stands out. If you think about it, the Internet is the most public of all places; anyone in the world, if they click on the right links, can see what you wrote. To me, that's an ideal site for embarrassment of a very modern kind, but it fades quickly.
But you're right; in the end, usually it's just sticks and stones.
PAB
Eric, have you seen the kids that read that shit? They all act like cult members before a kool aid binge. So fuck J.K. Rowling and her awful books. Evil, they are.
Here's a great opening line by one of my favorite horror writers, James Herbert, who's book Others this opening paragraph comes from. It is a stunner:
"My redemption began in Hell.
It was a day like any other--except there are no days in
that singular (in both senses of the words) Place. No minutes, no hours, weeks, or years. No seconds either. There is no time in Hell, you see. There just is. That's the Hell of it."
Makes you want to read the book, eh? :-)
-----------------
Cindy, better just to check the menu next time and see if it is there, before ordering. Or just call every damn restaurant in Texas. But remember, avoid the places that serve cat. Meow.
Whatever one thinks of Harry Potter or J.K. Rowlings as a writer, it's damned reassuring to see the kids of this country go nuts over a work of fiction.
My wife has ordered me to pick up the book today (she loves them). I read the first one, and thought it imaginative and clever, although the prose was a little to basic for me. But how nice that people, especially kids, are lining up to READ, instead of watching some under-projected (the projector lamps are mighty weak these days) flick about jerking off or blowing up, chowing down fat-laden popcorn...
"Next to debt - the hardest thing to get out of
is a warm bed on a cold winter morning."
-Walt Wallet of Gasoline Alley
I'm on a list that posts and trades and collects old pulp covers over on Yahoo and that was someones signature line. I saw it an immediately thought of BASE from MIND FIELDS.
The folks on that list are debating if pulp/comic/coin/stamp collectors are more prone to obsessive compulsive disorder then "normal" folks. I don't know. I think it's more like order than dis-order but then I'm not on meds. Also I refuse to believe that having multiple editions of Ellison titles or a complete run of various comics in multiple formats makes me a candidate for Pax-l or whatever they hand out for this condition.
And what's wrong with having 6 editions of GENTLEMAN JUNKIE and 5 editions of ROUGHING IT. Stop looking at me like that.
- Barney
It's ALL in the phrasing, Diana.
Scholars and theologists can't even agree if that Commandment was "Thou shalt not kill" or "Thou shalt not commit murder."
And these are LEARNED people.
"Mediocre Will Hunting" types such as myself are just screwed.
(Or, at the very least, FUN at parties and seminars for all the wrong reasons)
Like my dark side, I give into it, accept it, and hopefully develop enough depth of character to find a NEW original, sophisticated way to be self-conscious about my existence and the thoughts I conjure up.
Schoolgirl Gone Bad Version 4.9 and Counting :)
That's, Doo-MAHS, not Dumb-ass, ya dumbass.
Dear Mr Ellison,
I came across a messageboard today where a woman was trying to lay claim to nobility for some of her baser human emotions, like hate, rage and a desire for revenge, by attaching a quotation and reference from Shakespeare to her comments. I think that was sadly bogus of her, because in truth, hasn't the revenge driven character classically been drawn as a tragic figure for the most part? In tale after timeless tale, the individual bent on "pay-back", or maddened by hate, has been depicted as monsterous. That's always been the lesson. I mean, take The Count of Monte Cristo for example, for a large segment of that story Edmond Dantes was driven by his desire for revenge. When he discovered that Fernand, a friend he'd loved and trusted from boyhood, had deliberately betrayed him to a terrible fate, he became so single minded in his hate and intent on retribution that it steeled him to survive, and ultimately escape from, prison. But anyone who thinks that that was what the tale was about has entirely missed the point. There's no arguing that his rage was what held him strong through many desperate years, but The Story was a tale about true love and trust, and honor. Love lost, and trust betrayed, and honor disgraced. And then made right again. He was a man who, even after he escaped from captivity, was still imprisoned by his hate, until true love finally set his soul free again.
Here's a short list of a few more of the countless tales there are, about the timeless struggle between the powers of darkness (hate and/or wanting revenge and/or evil) and the powers of light (love, white magick, and forgivenness) and about the ultimate, inevitable triumph of good-over-evil. I'm sure you could think of even better ones yourself.
Beauty & The Beast
A Christmas Carol
The Merchant of Venice
The Wizard of Speed & Time
The Bible
The Hobbit & The Tolkien Trilogy
Star Wars
The Complete Sherlock Holmes
Cinderella
The Lion, The Witch & The Wardrobe, et al.
C.S. Lewis' "Space" Trilogy
Zenna Henderson's stories of "The People"
Stranger In A Strange Land
The Foundation Trilogy
The Shawshank Redemption
Rocky
You mentioned that you gave in to your dark side years ago. Or sold your soul to it, or something dramatic like that. Sorry to learn that about you, if it's true, but frankly I think that's actually a load of hyperbolic horse pooh. From what you continually focus upon about your lifemate's virtues, I gather she's someone who embodies, for you, all that's good and lovely in the world. It appears that in marrying this amazing epitome of saintly womanhood, you were at least hoping to be saved from the worst in yourself. (it appears like that since you keep saying it's like that) That's not the act of someone embracing the dark side of themselves, but more the act of someone running from it. Hurray for you if you're doing that. And God speed you on your way.
Sincerely,
Diana Graham
And She Was Gone
She chose to walk alone.
Though others wondered why.
Refused to look before her,
Kept eyes cast upwards,
Towards the sky.
She didn't have companions.
No need for earthly things.
Only wanted freedom,
From what she felt were puppet strings.
She longed to be a bird.
That she might fly away.
She pitied every blade of grass
For planted they would stay.
She longed to be a flame.
That brightly danced alone.
Felt jealous of the steam
That made the air its only home.
Some say she wished too hard.
Some say she wished too long.
But we awoke one autumn day
To find that she was gone.
The trees, they say, stood witness.
The sky refused to tell.
But someone who had seen it
Said the story played out well.
She spread her arms out wide.
Breathed in the break of dawn.
She just let go of all she held...
And then she was gone.
I'll take a shot:
a)If You Could Kill Just One Person You Know Personally, Who Would It Be?
There is only one person I know for whom I feel enough contempt that I have actually considered doing him physical harm. He screwed me over bad. If I knew that I wouldn't hang for it, I'd kill him and a lot of people would be cheering me on (the guy is widely despised. When he dies, people are going to go to the funeral just to make SURE the bastard's dead.) Since I know I *would* hang for it (being most probably inept at the act of intentional homicide), I choose simply to ignore him and avoid him or any of his friends as much as possible. I won't name him for fear of bad mojo (and I *have* thought to cast a spell on him: the mirror box doll to reflect all his evil back onto himself. Luckymojo.com describes the ritual drill in detail. "Goin' down to the Crossroads.....!")
b)What Was The Most Embarrassing Personal Moment In Your Entire Life, The One That Made You Pray The Earth Would Open and Swallow You?
When aforementioned evil mo'fo took some info I gave him and used it to embarrass some other people who I consider friends. It's a twisted story and my name wasn't directly mentioned, but all involved knew from whence the info originated. I thought we were speaking in confidence. It was dirty low blow to send widespread emails to my colleagues containing "jokes" at the expense of my friends and I. I am not at liberty to be any more specific. Anyway, I could have shot myself when it happened.
c)What Is The One Thing, If The Cops Broke Into Your Residence With A Search Warrant, That You Would Rather Go To Prison For A Hundred Years Than Have Them Find?
For a hundred years? That's hard time. Even if they found my mislaid stash, I wouldn't do hard time like that. Not even under the heinous Rockefeller laws. And if, in their legal warranted search, they manage to find the black and white photo of me as a young woman in a long wig standing naked by a waterfall in the gorges of Ithaca, I'd be shocked and thrilled. I'd thank them profusely. I have no idea where that photo is. It disappeared. I didn't look fabulous, but I looked better than now! I was wearing a long wig. But that's neither here nor there...I was just thinkin'.
I certainly don't want them to find the sleazy amateur porn mag my old man and I bought on a whim back before we had kids. I think (hope, pray, better go make sure) we threw that out with the old HIGH TIMES.
Thanks for letting me play! :)
Harlan wrote;
"P.S. Cindy, darlin', it's pronounced SHAR SHE BOE."
GOD-- JESUS, JOSEPH AND MARY-- I am SO embarrassed.
THAT explains the expressions on the faces of countless Chinese waiters over the last 20 some odd years. God only knows what I was askin' for. They all looked at me as though I had just attempted to order a fried rat on a stiff tail, and said very curtly, " We don't have that."
I DID think it was rather odd that in 20 years I hadn't found a SINGLE Chinese waiter that had ever HEARD of it. Okay, so I haven't had any ( now I'm afraid to try to spell it too) since '83 (I think) but I've never forgotten it. It is heavenly.
Soooo- I guess that would mean you can find it in places other than Chinatown in LA?
Jeesus, what was I askin' for? NEVERMIND DON'T TELL ME.
I'm better off not knowin'.
Thank you for the correction...
Harlan-san,
:)
Cindy
Dorman,
Where you been, buddy?
Cindy
Re the midget detective story:
If I recall correctly, Harlan titled the story "Can Opener," and it was published under the title "Killer in the Can," title change courtesy of editor W. W. Scott, who changed titles a lot.
HE reminisced about this one on a taped interview about the last days of the pulp era -- might still be available through HERC?
--tr
HE story
I was wondering if someone could tell me what is the title of the story HE wrote about a midget detective and which book it's in (if any). Also, has his story "Only Death Could Stop It" ever been collected in one of his books.
Much thanks,
Tony Adams
>Oh, and Eric, there are 2two2 "r"s in embarrassment.<
Yes, yes, I know...and I botched the subject-verb agreement in my third to last sentence. Look, I'm at WORK. I've no time to EDIT. I'll TRY to do better next time....
I now have a whole slew of Buddy Rich big band albums, and they are wonderful. That boy could slay a drum kit. Check it out if you got the coin.
Hope everyone saw the Ken Burns documentary on Jazz. Some of these pop artists should hide their heads in shame. Those guys had some dedication to their craft, that's for damn sure.
Puts a flower on Duke Ellington's grave.
Earl Wells: Thanks for the Asimov title.
For some reason, Harlan's comment about actions that would stun a police dog caused me to imagine a television series co-starring Harlan and the Littlest Hobo trekking through small-town Canada. No, I don't exactly know why either -- there must be some Cordwainer Bird/Ralph Von Wau Wau engrams still floating around in my noggin.
Cheers, Jon
Harlan, you'll notice that no one who posted their answers actually made any specific revelations. Most of it was, "I'm boring. I would have no real answers to your questions."
Now, probably most of us (not me, of course), would, under the pressure of revelations by other dinner guests and your cajoling, dig down and find some nuggets of evil to offer. Moments of true homicidal rage, excruciating embarrassment, or the threat of great shame tend not to fade from the memory, but divulging them would take more than a post in a forum as a prompt for revelation.
As for the "who would you kill" question, I thought immediately of this line: " The thousand injuries of Fortunato I had borne the best I could, but when he ventured upon insult I vowed revenge." And even after he avenged himself in the most monstrous way possible, Montresor was still thinking about it all 50 years later with the same passionate intensity. Some people are just heavily into revenge, I guess. Not a healthy urge AT ALL, but entirely, frighteningly human.
PAB
Adding Basil to your regimen...
HARLAN,
Basil Rathbone, in roles ranging from the dark, sadistic stepfather (with the look of an austere undertaker) in DAVID COPPERFIELD to the enduring embodiment of HOLMES, must have been ubiquitous in your childhood. Do you hold any nostalgic affection for the actor? Was there a role you preferred him in or remembered him for most?
Harlan, I knew I'd be beat the first time I read the story about you, a lawnmower and your elementary school.
Struck Dumb By Wonder
Dear Mr Ellison,
Pithy Reveals
1) There's no one I know personally that I'd like to murder. There's no one I know OF that I want to murder. You didn't ask "Was there ever a moment when you wished someone was dead?" You didn't ask "Was there ever a moment, a time when you knew you could have/would have killed someone if you'd had to?" You didn't ask "Was there ever a moment when you wished you had the power to instantly, painlessly, "vanish" someone, at least temporarily?" I could have given a "yes" to those questions. But what you were talking about would be premeditated murder, so my answer is there's no one.
2) At first I was thinking I had no answer at all for this question. I've never been *that* embarassed. My son's embarasses me sometimes He's been known to start arguing and shouting at me in public where I'm inclined to be reserved and dignified in such an environment. So when he takes to acting common in the street, that embarasses me to some degree. In the moment. But never to the point of wishing I were dead or anything. After all, it wasn't *me* acting common. Who the hell hangs onto that kind of emotion, anyway? Or thinks about it much after it's over? Who mulls? Who broods? Who cares? Not me. That's why I couldn't even remember anything to offer as an answer, even to myself, upon initially reading either of those first two questions.
Hey! I think a pattern is beginning to emerge here. I'm so excited. "A moment". Right. For a moment. In the moment. Then. Not now. Bad shit happens. It sucks, maybe it even sucks intensely (well with me it's everything's felt intensely, but that's me). You deal with it, in the moment. And then it's OVER. Done. Finished. Not happeneing anymore. You move on. You process it, maybe learn what you can from it, and then you let it go. Maybe bad shit will happen again. PROBABLY bad shit will happen again. But if ain't happening right now, why the hell should I sweat it now? Who the hell wants to sustain intense painful emotions? A crazy person? Someone generally dead inside? Someone thrilled that they've felt ANYthing, ever? Someone who lives in a psychic void outside of their rage? Someone who only feels alive when they're SUFFERING? Someone with a severely limited emotional repertoire?
Speaking of limited emotional repertoires, those were two pretty limited and banal questions. When you think about it. Which I did. For a moment. Why not ask people about other intense, common-to-all-humans emotions they've experienced? Besides rage and shame? Pleasant and painful? Why not ask them when they've ever felt utterly ecstatic? Or stunned by grief? Or moved to tears by joy? Or scared shitless?. Or breathless with anticipation? Or completely disgusted? Or struck dumb by wonder? Or gravely disappointed? Or delightfully surprised? It's true you might learn something by asking someone about when they've felt "embarassed". But I think you'd learn a whole lot more by noting what emotions a given individual decided to dwell on, when offered an opportunity to choose from an array.
3) If there was such an item, who'd be dumb enough to make a public announcement of it?
Sincerely,
Diana
DEAR FOLK: I was not, by describing "dinner games," suggesting anyone impart specifics of revelations here. No no no no no. It is STRICTLY a closed-environment, what's-said-here-stays-here, non-public and definitely non-internet pasttime. Some of you seem on the verge of imparting. Kindly do not. Heavens to Murgatroyd, please no.
Oh, and Eric, there are 2two2 "r"s in embarrassment.
Besides, gang, and you can trust me on this ... MY revelations of murderous intent, most embarrassing moment(s), and meanest thing ever done, well, as I say, trust me on this ... kiddies, I would leave the lot of you choking on my dust. Kaff kaff.
The foregoing is entered for your consideration devoid of even a speck, a cinder, a scintilla of hubris, arrogance, Recourse to Authority, or even braggadocio. It's just that despite being saved from the Abyss by Susan's loving nature, I gave myself over to the Dark Side aeons ago, and what I have done in my time, oh lord, new horrrors! new horrrors!, well, it would stun a police dog.
Warmly, Yr. pal, Harlan
yakkin' and listenin;
David -
Emailed my address. I have the weekend off to work on the outline and Lynn has given me some great feedback. Keeping in mind it's for KIDS (I had to pass on some of her quite vivid, yet mature pirate language) I think we've got a great series.
I grew up on classic radio tapes, especially the anthology mystery/adventure programs. Arch Oboler and Carlton Morse we favorites and have fond memories of my dad and I sitting out in the Dodge Dart waiting for my older brother to get off work about 10 at night listening to CBS Radio Mysteries in the early 80s. I know its still a viable medium.
The kids are ticked because I am fed up walking into the room and seeing the lot of them glued to the glass teat, zombified and ignorant of anything outside that 24" square. I shut it off for a few days and gave them activity books, crayons and my collection of "The Shadow" and other MP3s of OTR shows (a mixed bag). With it raining all week, they've had no other choice but to use their brains and god-given creativity. They seem to enjoy my "Star Wars" radio series and "Escape"
So the goal is to pry kids off the vidbox using creative marketing and a good, high concept show. I'll have more this coming Monday.
Jay
readin' and yakkin'
Jay Smith wrote:
> David: A long while ago, we talked about your tapes.
> I'd still love to hear them if you still want to
> send them.
So you were the one! Email your snail mail address to me privately, so I'll know where it is and can send you a sample of everything from Bradbury and Holmes to T.S. Eliot and Milne. My dubbing equipment is execrably primitive, but I think one can still make out my enunciation and expression.
I spoke about my book at a spacious and luxurious Barnes & Noble in Eugene, Oregon last night. I usually go an hour or less to spare the audience, but people kept talkin' and askin' and nobody was leaving, so we went for more than an hour and a half -- after which I went out to dinner with a couple of folks from the audience, one a net friend from rec.arts.books and one a stranger. What a wonderful night!
>I will not divulge what I did<
That's not playing, Rich. I can think of mean and stupid things that I've done, but none where I would have died of embarassment. Regrets later, yes. I think HE's verbiage was too extreme...a hundred years in the slammer to hide my dirty underwear? My life is to staid and usual for me to have dead baby parts hidden in my attic.
P.A., you referenced your webderland embarassments. I can't think of a place where I'm LESS embarassed. We are all just words on a page here, projecting images of ourselves that are often writerly, sometimes interesting, but I'm betting far from the actual mark. There's nothing I can say here (or see said about me) that's going to cause me anything more than bemusement. Let's never forget...tear away our trappings and we're just another Internet chat room. A room of shadows, spouting, ranting, wheedling, proclaiming...one of the curses of the gift of language is that we, as a species, are incapable of shutting up. And one of the curses of Internet forums is that like auto driving, it brings out the agressive super-ego in everyone.
Which is why I'm sure some of you were surprised when you actually met each other at I-Con. People ARE a lot gentler, more patient and better tempered in person. Even, I'm guessing, the patron writer.
I wanna play, I wanna play. Okokokokokok...ummm
a) Shoulda asked this around 10-15 years ago. Time does make anger and hate dissipate somewhat, though I'm sure if I encountered these one or two individuals today, I'd have some strong words. And anyone else I can think of that I'd like to kill is already dead.
b) There is one thing that still haunts me today. I will not divulge what I did, but it was so mean and petty and cruel and stupid that as soon as I did it, I knew immediately that I wished I could travel back in time 30 seconds to relieve me from the embarrassment of not only myself, but the person I perpetrated this act on. I did, and sometimes still do in moments of reflection and melancholy, hope that the earth would swallow me up.
c) This is easy, but I think I'm safe because I believe I destroyed all copies. My Army Basic Training graduation photo. >shuddershudder< Really. Words cannot do that picture justice, but I think I got rid of 'em all.
(And for those that say there is nothing...you're not thinking hard enough. I guarantee you, that if a stranger were to poke around in your personal belongings, that there is something, maybe you can't think of it right now, but there is something hidden in the closet, underneath that pile of clothes, in that shoebox that you haven't opened up in twenty years, buried beneath old stationary...there is something.)
As far as the dinner games - I could play the who would you like to kill that you know personally. My heart wouldn't be in it the way it would have been 10 years ago but some feelings are hard to completely suppress.
As far as the personal embarassment thing, well that would be SO much easier.
Nothing personally incriminating in my house except for 3 or 4 boxes of skin magazines. But those all contain Ellison stories and are PURELY FOR RESEARCH!!!
Interestingly, I've seen Harlan run and/or play game #1 or 2 but not #3.
- Barney
Dr. Who??
Harlan and Susan,
Diane is posting the wonder-muco-killer to me today. Provided it arrives before lift-oiff, you should have it in your hot little hands within the next 2 weeks.
To my deepest disappointment, there's a high probability my travel will be canceled due to committments in Kuwait (along the lines of their crisis becoming my urgency... They will be made to pay...grrrrrrrr!!!).
If that's the case, Mark (my better half) will do the house call, since he'll still be going to the coast and should be in LA for most of his trip (June 25th - July 7th). I've gotten your number from Rick and will be sure Mark has it. He'll give you a ring to arrange a drop-off after the jet lag wears off.
Susan, is there anything you desperately miss from the UK that'll fit in a suitcase? As long as we're transporting goods....
Cheers
Peg
Webderlanders On The Air!
Michael, David & Peter -
I left information in the forums about the show. I'd be honored if you want to participate in any way. I will post particulars on zebrapix.com soon...probably this weekend. David: A long while ago, we talked about your tapes. I'd still love to hear them if you still want to send them.
Harlan -
Thanks for replying. I know you're a busy man and I couldn't ask you to take a chance sight unseen on something like this (and certainly not without proper compensation!). My HOPE is that I can make this a project that kids will enjoy, get something out of and possess a level of quality that would be worthy of your interest. In any case, thanks.
Jay's hearing voices
Jay... don't know if you still need anybody, but I'm quite handy with voices.
Comes from growing up wanting to be a cartoon, I guess.
So you can count me in, if you like.
---Peter
La langue, il n'est pas reste ici
Mark reported:
> Side note: I'm dating a woman from Columbia, and last night
> she was telling me how colorless and impoverished the English
> language is compared to her Spanish.
Au contraire. Just because most Americans employ it colorlessly
and with a retrograde paucity of imagination, hardly makes the
language itself colorless.
One of the beauties of English is that it has taken parts of
so many other languages, including Spanish.
By the way, we spell it "Colombia" up here.
The dinner game:
Question #1: I would have a terrifically hard time narrowing it down to only one person.
Question #2: I have been embarrassed, but never to the point of wishing for death; I take pains to avoid such situations. I think my most embarrassing moments in recent history took place right here on this message board, in fact. Ain't that grand?
Question #3: I don't have anything in my house that I'm embarrassed to possess. That's the truth.
I would be very boring at this game, except on the subject of fantasy assassinations. It's a good thing I have a well-developed moral code.
PAB
Dinner Game
Harlan!
I'm convinced: I'm going to a dinner party tomorrow and I'll spring the game on my friends! Here's hoping none of them want to kill me.
Side note: I'm dating a woman from Columbia, and last night she was telling me how colorless and impoverished the English language is compared to her Spanish. (she can tell me she loves me in Spanish in something like 28 different ways!), but the more I read your postings the more I disagree with her. I'll have to introduce her to Webderland and show her what you're capable of doing with a little colorless English!
Mark
Cindy, sorry I didn't respond to your little environmentalist jaunt of late. Sorry to break this to you dear, but did you know that Texas has the worst environment of any other American state? The oil companies and electric barons seem to have that big ass state by the short hairs. And your love bug, W. is largely responsible for much of it. Being in the pocket of them and all. You did good sweetie, but the wall grows ever larger. But good to see that my lefty concious is rubbing off on you.
---------------
What the hell happened to Ben Affleck?
He starts out a decent actor, and amazing writer, who does largely small films of note, then it starts: Film after film of junk food cinema. He goes for the easy bucks and of all things falls in love with JLo for God's sake! He has mansions and cars and a private plane, and the woman every starving man with a dick and an imagination wants. Jennifer Lopez must be Satan--that's it--he is under some kind of Santeria spell. This one time admirer of Howard Zinn and Chomsky has gone to the dark side of easy fame. Come back to us Benjamin, come back!! What's next, Janeane Garofalo dating Sean Hannity?
Answers
I know, I'm on sabbatical, but Mel sent M. Ellison's post, and I've got to answer.
A) My father: And nearly did, except for the four policemen who pulled me off the bastard.
B) The moment when Pierre Decoberte, my best friend and brother discovered the truth about my stealing from him, and about my life, after I'd consistantly lied to him about where and with whom I'd lived. Perhaps it doens't seem like much to others, but to an kid who have so few friends as I did, losing even one was near apocalypse. He forgave, and remains the best friend I'll ever have.
C) Nothing. Let the motherfuckers come, and they'd better have a servicable warrant.
Now, back to work.
Scott
HARLAN: Oy! Another senior moment. Got my Charlies mixed up. Thanks for straightening me out.
CHARLIE (in St. Pete): I'll send you an email -- and thanks in advance.
--Dorman (self-banished for two days because of double-posting).
recorded voices
Jay:
I don't know how I would contribute from up here in the Pac NW, but I'd love to join your project. I've done more reading aloud than anyone here but Harlan -- maybe even more than him, since I've read half a dozen books to my grandmother, more than a dozen to my wife, a few odd others to girlfriends in the past, and more than a dozen for recordings for the blind -- and have a terrific batch of voices I can offer (you should hear my Holmes and Watson, or Dobby from Harry Potter), as well as good, clean, articulate narration if you need it.
The round table
I truly lead a boring life. I thought about those three questions HE just posed, and I can't answer ANY of them....
1) There's really no-one I know that I want to kill. Really. Or would have killed, for the common good.
2) While I have had some moments of personal embarassment in my life, there were none so damaging that I wished for chthonian engulfment.
3) There's absolutely nothing in my house worth going to prison for, not even for one year. Hell, not even for a week.
How humbling!
JAY: Thanks for the invite, toots; but I fear I'm much too busy to get involved. My genuine sorry.
DTS: You DO know that the Charlie in St. Pete is not Charlie Petit, who's in Chicago area, don't you?
Long gone Jones, aka -he
DEAR MR. O'CONNELL:
Yes, from time to time I still initiate the "playing" of that dinner game. Almost invariably when I'm stuck mid-thigh in a post-prandial situation with people I neither know nor actually invited to dine with me. It happens: a friend will have a friend visiting; a friend will have a relative s/he "had to bring along because s/he was just dyyyyyying to meet me;" a fan or three will have gratuitously invited themselves along sans solicitation; ad nauseum.
But even with people one has known forever, this little rigadoon banishes the boredom and superficiality of a great many dull dinners -- cast your mind back -- how many evenings have you frittered away silently enduring the Chinese water torture of less-than-edifying tabletalk by friends and acquaintances who wind up rating the latest movies they've seen, or recounting half the idiot plot of one of Wednesday's sitcoms, just to relate a gag line that wasn't particularly lively in the original, much less crippled by the amateur retelling?
Variations on this m.o. that work like a baby doll are a)If You Could Kill Just One Person You Know Personally, Who Would It Be? b)What Was The Most Embarrassing Personal Moment In Your Entire Life, The One That Made You Pray The Earth Would Open and Swallow You? c)What Is The One Thing, If The Cops Broke Into Your Residence With A Search Warrant, That You Would Rather Go To Prison For A Hundred Years Than Have Them Find?
You'll perceive that as you begin going around the circle (do NOT start with yourself, if you can avoid it, because it looks too pro forma, too "rigged," and if you have thought about what YOUR contribution will be, it'll likely be stronger than what the casual participant will come up with on a first pass), the first one or two reveals will be mitigative, pallid, self-serving, and usually the sort of thing that can be excused by "oh, well, you're only human...we all do stuff like that from time to time" -- in other words, bullshit intended to shine you on. But if you actually poo-poo such balderdash with something like "oh, c'mon, what kind of disingenuous pantywaist crap is that? throw us a bone, fer crissakes!" you will start getting escalated truth around the time of the third or fourth contributor. Then you can offer the dissemblers a chance to recoup, by going back to them, in the light of new horrors revealed by those who spoke after them, and suggest they dig a little deeper. That's when they begin trying to outgross everyone with the REAL stuff. And you can learn an infinitude about even total strangers, with this exercise. It's endlessly fascinating, if you keep pushing for the pithy reveal. The best part of it all is that it turns a bland waste of an evening into a memorable encounter session.
This all falls under the heading of The Art of Conversation.
An art-form growing as rare as the creation of Epic Poetry.
Respectfully, Harlan Ellison
oh yeah, here's the email: cmalsam@aol.com
DTS, as well as you should know by now (!) I live in St. Pete. What do you need? I'll see if I can get sunday's paper.
Hi ALL: Just in case Charlie Petit is out of town, anybody else here live in or near St. Petersburg, FL? I wanted to get a tearsheet from their Sunday June 22nd issue. I can provide finanical recompense or a bottle of Kansas City BBQ sauce in return.
Thanks.
--DTS
kicking off my shoes...
First off, thanks everyone for your words of welcome! This is a friendly, fascinating place.
Harlan, I have to ask: Have you played that dinnertime game since the baby chicks horror? It's one of those "be careful what you ask for" moments. On the one hand, you want to get the people at the table to open up and shock the hell out of you--I can imagine you growing bored with the tepid "revelations" you were getting and prodding people to get nastier; who wouldn't?--but on the other hand, you're always running the risk that someone will offer up something you really wish you had never heard... I'll have to try this with my friends!
I also have to mention that entering this site has brought back another early memory for me: discovering, while I was in high school, this scandalous independent movie about a telepathic dog and his human... driving with friends into Milwaukee to the revival theater, the Oriental, to see "A Boy and His Dog"... and being introduced the the world of... uh... "mature" science fiction :) It was fantastic!
Mark
recorded voices?
Michael -
Great! With Lynn, Cindy, Alex and others, it would be a webderland jam-borr-ee! :) I'll send you a character list and an address.
Thanks!
SERIAL KILLERS
Dear Mr Ellison,
As you may be aware some of the folks who frequent Webderland have been known to leave anonymous hate messages in the guestbooks at my two web sites from time-to-time. Lately it's been escalating. I believe that the best way to discourage that kind of thing is to bring such activities out into the light. Thus this post.
So far I don't know all that much about these people, because I haven't looked into it hard yet. ALl I know to date is that the two anonymous Webderlander who've been writing hate messages to me for the last couple of days, are apparently located in New York (maybe the Rochester area?) and Illinois (Chicago? Springfield?), and that the person who left that series of gross monkey-sex messages in my Paul Williams' guestbook a few months ago is in Central Texas (San Antonio? Fredricksburg? Around there). I guess none of them know that along with their IP#'s and other useful information, my site stats show the time and date of all visits to my sites. I guess they also don't know that whenever someone leaves a message in one of my guestbooks, I immediately get an e-mail notification. Also, I can tell right away which IP#'s are related to which messages. And something else, something they couldn't know, unless I mentioned it, is that I have a program that can trace visiters to my site back to their points of origin. In other words, I can, if I need to, find out *exactly* where those "anonymous" hate-messagers are located.
(Oh, I forgot to say, that it looks like the individual from Chicago might be affiliated with Northern Illinois University. I'm not absolutely sure about that yet, though)
You know, I can't think of any healthy reason why someone who says they hate me as much as this person in Chicago claims to, would spend their time looking at pictures of my face. But the guy in Illinois has done just that, he's spent literally hours over the last few months gazing at my photographs. This doesn't seem healthy to me. This same person, has visited my site about ten times today, maybe looking for a response to his recent messages? I'm sure he'll read this post, so I'm saying to you, where he's sure to see it, that he's not going to get any answers from me.
I think that individual in Chicago just may be a genuine crazy person. Like a serial killer or something. He's spends hours staring at my pictures, and lately, as I've said, he's taken to leaving hate messages in my guestbooks. He's been bringing up stuff I said weeks and weeks ago, apparently *still* furious. I figure only a crazy person holds onto things like that. What normal person remembeers stuff someone said in a fight they were in two months ago? Some shouting match long gone and forgotten by anyone sensible? What seems the most odd to me is that what he's mad over is something that wasn't even said to or about him.
Anyway, I'm thinking next time I get any messages like those last few, I'm going to post them, the IP#'s of who ever made the posts, and the name of the poster's ISP, on a page on my web site. Along with their addresses and phone numbers. Once it's all set up I'll invite everyone I know on the internet to take a look at the information.
Look, I'm not mad or anything. Someone wants to try and pick a fight with me over something I said about someone else weeks ago that's his problem. He's wasting his time. I'm not biting. The only reason I'm even going on about all this is that I think it might be a bad idea to encourage any more of this menacing-from-the-shadows foolishness. I'm concerned that that guy from Chicago, for example, might actually be a psychopath. The best thing I can think to do about him at present is make sure he can't find any dark corners to hide in in my neighborhood, virtual, or otherwise. I've sent the IP#'s of those hate message folks and their ISP information to several different people I know. My son's got the info, my mom does, my brother does, etcetera. I'm going to e-mail the information to some of my on-line friends next. And if I find any more hate messages in my guestbook from these people, like I said, soon everyone else will know about them too.
Sincerely,
Diana
JAY: Voices you want? I can do plenty, and I'll send it on CD or electronically. Let me know at the above email.
Hugs to all,
Michael
Harlan, thanks for the backstory. I sensed that it came from real life and wasn't something you concocted from whole cloth just to mess with us. It had the ring of truth to it, which was probably why it bothered me so damn much. How did you proceed with the rest of the evening after hearing that? I definitely would have had to call it an early night-- but you did ask for it when you introduced that game. Remind me never to play it.
Now I'm wondering if I was supposed to dislike the Missy character. Like you, upon hearing that anecdote, my blood froze. That one line in the story summed her up-- nothing else I could have learned about the character could alter my opinion of her from then on. My current theory is that my loathing for Missy was supposed to bleed over onto Kerch, a character who I ended up disliking immensely by the end of the story.
Now that I've recovered somewhat from the visceral horror of the image, I'm trying to understand its function in the narrative... because at first it seemed so gratutious to me. Maybe overanalyzing that line and squeezing it for greater meaning is a way of distancing myself from it. In any case, it was one hell of an effective image because I'll never forget that story as long as I live.
(and for a corny moment, Berman realizes how lucky she is to be able to talk about such things with Harlan Ellison... ahem, moving right along...)
And yeah, thanks, now I'm wondering what evil deed the future Mrs. Sterling divulged. I don't imagine you're telling, though, are you? I would try to persuade you with a box of rare comic books or unopened vintage action figures, but alas... I must probably resign myself to never knowing.
Sorry to be thinking about this right before bed,
PAB
Radio Serial Voices
Harlan,
I wonder if you would consider voicing a minor role for a children's radio adventure serial, what you would require and how I would get that process started. I'm working on a series of 15 minute cliffhanger swashbuckler adventures with the local public broadcast station that are meant for kids 7-14. I thought (in the best possible context) that you would be a great "King of All Who Are Evil" who is talked about but only heard in the last chapter.
I ask because I am also asking other webderlanders...and "Rat Hater" scared the hell out of me.
Thanks for reading and considering.
Jay
P.A.:
Well, I can answer at least one of your two questions about the awful "lawnmower/baby chicks" remark. WHY I used it in that story...hell, kiddo, I have no idea. My mind and memory are a welter of oddments, fragments, bits'o'stuff; and when I have need of something that will encapsulate a character (such as "he had the eyes of a Dachau gravedigger" or "she walked with the swagger of a seagoing man") I rummage through the attic and find one that seems apropos. How or why I settled on that specific item, at that specific fictional juncture, well, chalk it up to Incognitus Processiae.
Where it CAME from, however, is another matter. Because I remember exactly who said it, when it was said, and my reaction to it. It was said by a woman who was, at the time, my assistant; now the long-time wife of a well-known writer. A party of fifteen or twenty of us were sitting in a Brazilian restaurant on Melrose Avenue in Hollywood, roughly twenty-five/six/seven/eight years ago. It was the wedding day of my fourth marriage, and the bunch of us, including a young Bruce Sterling out of Texas, his future wife, a smattering of other writers including Arthur Byron Cover, were all sitting around a huge booth-table, sucking down empanadas and slurping chicha moradas, and I ventured one of my deadly "dinner games." This particular one was called What's The Most Awful Thing You Ever Did? And at first, everyone was reticent, or offered some pale-ass "dasterdly deed" like pissing in a college roommate's orange juice because he was always drinking that juice belonging to the guy who did the pissing. This was pretty pale stuff, and I thought the game was going to tap out a dud, until the woman who was, at the time, my assistant responded to another woman's "most awful" admission (which was pallid, at best) with the casually tossed-off remark, "Aw, hell, when I was a little girl back in Texas, we used to bury baby chicks up to their necks in the dirt, and then run the lawnmower over 'em."
My blood froze.
It was as casual a statement of random, unfeeling evil as I've ever heard. And it summed her up for all time in my mind.
That's where it came from. Oh, and it wasn't Bruce Sterling's youthful soon-to-be-wife who said it, though she, too, was out of Texas. No, her remark was even more casually bloodchilling than the lawnmower-chick remark. Dwell on THAT one.
Yr. pal, Harlan
P.S. Cindy, darlin', it's pronounced SHAR SHE BOE.
Top of the evenin' to ya Mark! I think you'll find this an interesting and friendly place - in fact, I see you already have. Pull up a chair.
Chuck
Ah, the afterglow of the bookstore...
The new edition of "Vic and Blood" (lovingly coughed up by the Borders in Fairfax during an after-work book buying orgy this afternoon) is a nice piece of work. Corben's cover would make a beautiful lithograph for the wall. Very slick production, love the new art, greatly enjoyed Blood's wit and wisdom, and I'm cheered to have the three published pieces (thus far) in one place. Saves wear and tear on my Savoy Book.
Granted, at least one proofreader should be flogged. It makes me wonder why I'm doing marketing work for a Canadian modem company.
It's sweet, Harlan. A terribly glorious whetting of the appetite (I've clung to the name Spike like a grail since the January 1981 Amazing/Fantastic fell into my greedy little hands - because that's what we obnoxious fanboys do, cling to minutiae so fine, it would sift through silk if we let it go), but I like it - it's a very nice edition. Muchas gracias!
Welcome, Mark!
A Belated Thank You and a Welcome!
Harlan,
Thank you for the extraordinarily nice compliment you paid to a bit of frippery I wrote something on the order of a week ago, riffing off a P.A. Berman question - suggesting that it was worth preserving as hard copy in your abode.
I should have responded to you in a more timely fashion - but I was in the midst of some personal angst of significant consequence to both me and my family, the specific details of which need not be aired in this forum. I riffed off PAB's comment as an exercise and a distraction - that it amused you was an unexpected and welcome bonus. Thank you again.
Bern
P.S. The name is Sun, by the way, with one "n". The references were delightful, even if obscure...
P.P.S. Mark, welcome! Kick off your shoes and stay awhile...
Hello, Mark:
I'm not some form of greeter here, but as one who's come to truly enjoy the people who populate this little patch of the internet, welcome. You'll find quite a number of truly engaging souls.
Love to all, Melissa
Cindy, why not try submitting a script at the Project Greenlight site that HBO maintains? You know, the thing that Ben Affleck and Matt Damon are part of. Being on a reality show with JLo's honey buns might be fun for ya.
--------------
Saw an excellent documentary on HBO: Oliver Stone went to Israel to do a film about the Palestinian/Israeli conflict and it is stunning. Very fair on both sides, and Stone does hold back from his usual bravada camera work. Even though Stone is a radical lefty, like me, he doesn't preach on this, and we see the conflict through a harrowed lens. Must see.
Rob,
Where did you find those Outer Limits quotes about HE? Those were great.
Thanks
Tony
Outer Limits producer Ben Brady on Harlan Ellison: "I had to LOCK him in his office to make him finish the script"
Outer Limits director Byron Haskin on Harlan Ellison: "He was crazy! I had to chase him out of my office once!"
Just peeking in to see what goes on....
Hi Harlan and everybody!
I'm the writer/teacher Cindy mentioned in her last post. I'm not a professor, as Cindy so kindly called me, but just a writer who was lucky enough to teach a few screenwriting courses for UCLA Extention online. If you know anything about the program, you know they'll hire anybody...
But I was lucky enough to have Cindy in my class TWICE, and both times her talent, charm, humor, generosity, and penchant for killer Texas-style aphorisms made her everybody's favorite. Besides, she was one of the few who actually understood that after you START a writing project, it's kind of important to FINISH it, and that made her a Superstar to me. I betcha she learned that from Harlan's writing class, so thank you Harlan.
I'm a little bit of a stranger in a strange land here, because I have read so little of Harlan's print work. I'm more familiar with his early TV work, and yes, I consider "Demon With a Glass Hand" to be a masterpiece. The first season of the old Outer Limits is out on DVD, and I'm waiting for season 2, so I can get "Demon" and Harlan's other episode, "Soldier." I have them both on Beta -- yes, BETA -- but the tapes and the old Sony deck aren't what they used to be.
Thank you, Cindy, for introducing me to this board! I'll have to visit again...
Mark O'Connell
Jon,
I think the Asimov essay you are looking for – about a book being the perfect medium for reading printed matter – is “The Ancient and the Ultimate.” It’s included in the collection THE TRAGEDY OF THE MOON.
Barney,
Everett F. Bleiler is a distinguished and prolific editor and scholar in the fields of science fiction, fantasy, and detective stories. Some of the highlights: in the late 1940s and early 1950s he coedited a year’s best SF series with T. E. Dikty. For Dover books he edited collections by Bierce, Blackwood, Doyle, Hoffmann, and Lefanu as well as anthologies of Gothic and Victorian fiction. And in the last decade or so he wrote two monumental surveys, SCIENCE FICTION: THE EARLY YEARS and SCIENCE FICTION: THE GERNSBACK YEARS (the latter with Richard J. Bleiler). Absorbing even a substantial fraction of Bleiler’s work is akin to completing a master’s program in the origin and development of those fields.
HARLAN: I've a question.
If a reputable newspaper or magazine (one devoted to news coverage rather than a genre or industry mag or paper) asked you to do a regular column on whatever, would you do it?
(and I realize that the case and other things steal from your time to DO something like that ...)
Dear Mr Ellison,
I'm really not looking to stir up any trouble, Sir, but one of your Webderlanders left an inappropriate and anonymous message in the guestbook at my Paul Williams fan site yesterday.There's no point in your going to try and get a look at it, I've deleted. How I know it was one of them is because they mentioned you in the message.
I wouldn't want to speculate about who wrote it, or what motive this individual had in doing so, beyond wanting to upset me that is, but unlike Mr Wyatt, who rarely deletes a post in his forum, I'm never going to leave any message in that fan site guestbook that's mean spirited and unpleasant.
By the way, that's hardly the first time one of them's posted something like that in there. This is just the first time I'm mentioning it to you.
I don't know how you feel about Webderlanders leaving disgusting messages to your friend. But I'm pretty sure he wouldn't understand what was going on if he ever happened to read some of the foul stuff I've had to delete that's been put in there by them.
He's *such* a nice man. He does not deserve to get trashed by these people just because they hate me.
If any of them want to write gross messages they can always post them in the guestbook on my personal web site. Or send me an e-mail. Or post in here. But they really should leave Paul Williams out of the unpleasantness. You know I'm right.
Sincerely,
Diana
Not Harlan, but...
P.A.,
I know you asked Harlan directly, but I figured I throw this out there until he answers. On the recording ON THE ROAD WITH ELLISON, Volume 1, he tells the story of "The Dead Gopher." In it, he says that he loves animals, never hurt animals as a kid, and knows of a write who was very nice but, when she was kid, would take baby chicks, bury them so their heads stuck out, and run them over with a lawnmower. I would assume it's one of those tales one is told that creeps into the fiction because, as they say, "Truth is stranger than fiction." Hope that'll suffice until/unless Harlan answers.
Bill
My former professor through the UCLA extension program is Mark Gehred O'Connell.He became a buddy of mine over the course of several years. He was the instructor for the courses I took to write my INGENA screenplay. I mentioned to him that I had written the short story originally as a handstand to impress Harlan who had been subjected to my embarrassing romance novel attempt. I told him that Harlan never read my short story-- but his friend Ed Bryant did-- as did Gil Lamont back when.
Today ( yesterday) Mark wrote me this about Harlan; " I'm telling you, his pre-Star Trek Outer Limits episode "Demon with a Glass Hand" is the best hour of science fiction ever done on American TV! "
I asked him if I could quote him on this board and he replied that I could-- if I gave him the link to this site.
He THEN wrote-- about Harlan;" He's one of the reasons I went into writing, and you can trace a direct line from me watching his Outer Limits and Star Trek episodes as a kid to my writing for Star Trek. "
I'm sending the link as soon as I post this.
So here you are Mark-- this is Harlan's haunt.
yer pal,
Cindy
sympathy for the no-necks
Harlan: This is something I've been thinking about for about a week, since I reread "All The Lies That Are My Life." I was reticent to mention it, but it's really late, so what the hell.
In this story, Larry is talking to Leslie about the most awful thing he's ever heard. He says, "The most awful, I guess, was something Missy told me. She said that when she was a kid down South, they used to take baby ducks and chicks, and they'd bury them up to their no-necks in the dirt, and then they'd run the lawnmower over them."
For some reason, this image has haunted me ever since. It *IS* the most awful thing I've ever heard, for its sheer gratuitous, wanton destruction of something so emblematic of innocence and vulnerability. I can barely wrap my mind around what kind of human being, child or not, would do such a thing, or why, or how, and the recurring thought of it has rendered me nauseated and dumbstruck by turns.
Also, as a side-effect, it caused me to loathe the character of Missy all out of proportion to her importance in the story. I became convinced that she had to be an utterly vile, hateful person if she'd ever done what you described. I was not happy for her when she got the Kerch Corporation; my reaction was closer to Sylvia's, I'm sad to say.
I wonder if I even want answers to these questions, but, if you feel you can tell me, from whence did this image spring (and please don't say Schenectady, I'm begging you)? What inspired you to place it in this particular story? It seems sort of like a throwaway line; are you surprised to hear that it knocked me for a major loop in a way that very few things do? That it warped my reading of the story?
In fact, I wrote a three page reaction to just that line in order to get it out of my head. It didn't completely work, though, so here I am bugging you with it. I'll stop before I plummet into even greater incoherence. Thanks in advance for any light you can shine on this for me.
I remain your overly sensitive fan,
PAB
For those who love comic books, just thought I'd mention the History Channel is showing a program titled, "Superheros Unmasked" on Monday, June 23. Looks interesting. Also, for those of us who...well, I don't know if you can say *enjoyed* "Gopher in the Gilly", but who appreceated and admired it, History Channel is also going to air a program on side show freaks. I don't recall the air date.
FYI.
And Cindy,
I DID take the Small World ride several years ago. Half way through, I nearly had to jam my fist in my mouth to keep from screaming, "Make it stop! They all HAVE THE SAME HEAD!"
I'll never take in a ride on Patrick Stewart's recommendation again.
Chuck
Yeah, it's actually an Isaac Asimov question. Anyone know the title of the essay in which Asimov goes through a chain of reasoning about perfect entertainment media to arrive at the conclusion that a book is just medium? If you know the collection as well, that'd be swell, but with a title I should be able to find the right collection.
Cheers, Jon
Okay - Science Fiction: The Gernsback Years [Kent State Un. Press] Everett F. Bleiler. Got it. I didn't know scholarly works will eligible. Cool.
- B.
Dept of: It's not log rolling if I ask you...
*** Harlan ***
I'm looking at my World Fantasy Awards Nomination Ballot and I had a couple of questions -
I'm assuming GOODBYE TO ALL THAT is under 10,000 words?
Right now the plan is to nominate the McSweeney's. Does it qualify as an anthology or will they call it a periodical and throw my nomination out? I don't want these suckers to pull a Jeb Bush on me when I paid for this privelage.
Would DANGEROUS VISIONS be eligible as a re-release under multiple-author anthology? Also, can you win the Lifetime Achievement Award twice? I think you should.
If you win the lifetime achievement award twice I think they should take one away from somebody else. I'm thinking of a person who's last initial is A.
And who the heck is/was Everett F. Bleiler. Seriously. The sarcasm was an exclusive to the last paragraph.
Any preferences with regard to artist / Novella / or Special Award Professional and/or Non-professional? My novel nomination is made but I am open to "influence" with regard to these other categories. Even denizens of ivory towers and other lofty and biased perches should be allowed the occasional "suggestion". If Barry Malzberg can't keep up with all this stuff how the hell can I?
- Barney
ps. Tim said the "package" arrived. Not sure of contents yet but no drug sniffing dogs were aroused so it's all good. - B.
APROPOS OF ABSOLUTELY NOTHING
Dear Mr Ellison,
Okay, so there's this really annoying woman who calls herself a High Priestess of Something or Other and calls herself Lady Crystal Unicorn Raven (or something like that), and calls herself a Light Bringer, and a Pipe Carrier, and a Channeler of Light Beings, and claims *she's* a Light Being, and says ufo's are constantly circling over her home in Alaska for some reason, and has somehow given birth to invisible red-headed twins even though she wasn't ever pregnant, and who keeps posting at various sites of a mystical, spiritual, cosmic- consciousness type nature all over the internet, who I like to confuse with rationality and reason on occasion, by asking sensible questions, and by presenting other, possible points of view, on different subjects she's given to expounding on from time-to-time. Always adding that whatever I shared is not necessarily, or even likely to be, what *I* think ("I'm just saying"). She eventually got aggravated by the way I kept saying that the stuff I was sharing was not necessarily what *I* believed, and the way I kept saying, "I'm just saying" and she finally forgot herself for a moment long enough to ask me, "What the hell *do* you believe then?"
To which I initially replied, "Shut up", and then, "None of your damned business". And then I told her to shut up again. But later I wrote a list as an answer to her. I knew she was going to want to argue with me after she read it so I prefaced it with something to the effect that I had no interest in, or intention of, discussing The Subject (but that I find other people's beliefs fascinating, as an abstract, and would enjoy reading any sharings anyone felt moved to do on the matter) I never did make the post. I felt happy enough with having gotten her the point where it had even occured to her for once to ask someone else, *any*one else, what *they* thought about something. I considered that progress, and decided I'd leave well enough alone.
But now there I was with this not deep, but very cool, list about stuff I believe, and I had nowhere to put it. You already know where I'm going with this don't you Mr E? Yep, you do. (And just about now I bet you're thinking something like "I'd like very very much to tell that woman where to put it") But ha ha, you won't tell me anything like that. Anyways I've already figured out where to put it all on my own! Thus the following:
MY SPIRITUAL BELIEFS
Sort of make sense. To me anyway.
Include, *but are not limited to*, the following...
MY SPIRITUAL BELIEFS
Are:
Subject to modifications without notice, as new information becomes available.
Kind of an eclectic new-agey, quasi mystical, vaguely Pagan, somewhat Taoistic hodge-podge, taken from what my parents offered as Truth, filtered through my own experiences, perceptions, studies and reasoning processes
Not to be taken by me or anyone else as gospel
Subjective
Arbitrary
Founded on a solid base of skepticism
Rarely open to discussion
Not something anyone can use to get a handle on me
OTHER STUFF
I'm:
An ordained minister
Not a Xtian
Not a Buddhist
Not a Muslim
Not a Hindu
Not affiliated in mind, fact or Spirit with any organized religion
A consulter of oracles
I BELIEVE:
In Synchronicity
In True Love
In Kindred Spirits
In Soul Mates
In Karma
That God(dess) is Love
That The Word is God(dess)
That there's Something Going On
That information is available
That we're all connected somehow
That we're all in this together
That nobody's perfect
That music has charms to sooth the savage...
That to everything there is a season, and a time to every purpose under heaven
That no one has all the answers, or The Ultimate Authoritative Truth
That anyone who thinks somebody has (or that they have) all the answers, or that believes that there even *is* an Ultimate Authoritative Truth is weak minded and missing the point
That we're here
I BELIEVE THAT WE'RE HERE
To work
To learn
To learn how to love
To grow
To question
To wonder
To speak
To rhyme
To reason together
To sing
To dance
To laugh
For A Purpose
To try and figure out why we're here
And so forth, and so on, and etcetera...
OTHER STUFF I BELEIVE (MAYBE NOT SPIRITUAL (BUT COULD BE)
I believe it's okay to "fight dirty". Yep. Screw that Marquise of Queensbury's rules crap. Trust me, The Marquise of Q was never a skinny little white girl with eyes too big for her face, and a smart mouth too big for her own good, growing up in the predominantly black and Puerto Rican neighborhood of Williamsburg, Brooklyn. No doubt HE grew up living in a castle some place with servants who would kick people's asses for him, if he asked them to. It was easy to make up all those noble rules for other folks to follow. After all, he wasn't going to be the one getting the crap beat out him if there was fight.
Trust me, if it looks to me like somebody wants to fight me, and I don't think I can take them on on my own strength, I'll try to distract them somehow, and then I'll hit them in the back of the head with whatever comes to hand, (a brick, a garbage can, a dead rat, whatever) when they're looking the other way. I'll only feel bad about doing something like that if I fail to knock them out. Because I never feel good about having to run away from a fight, or about getting my ass kicked by anyone. Maybe some people would think this was wrong, but I believe it's okay.
I believe whoever drinks the last of something (milk, juice, soda, etc) should throw the depleted container out, not put it back into the fridge empty.
I believe whoever uses the last ice cubes in the ice cube tray should *refill* the ice cube tray with water and put it in the freezer, & quit putting empty ice cube trays in the freezer.
Same type of courtesy should apply to the toilet paper.
I believe something should be DONE about telemarketers.
I believe everyone reading this list should quit reading this list a go have a snack or something.
I believe you've got to put down the ducky if you wanna play the saxophone.
Okay, there's lots more stuff that I believe, but I'm tired of writing now.
Sincerely,
Diana
Doug,
Don't forget, if you make it out in July, Comic-Con is gonna be going on (Neil Gaiman's gonna be there). Plus, you know you wanna run screaming from It's A Small World, admit it...
-A
Doug!
Do it-- you won't be sorry. But don't forget to have dim sum while you're out there.. that way I can live vicariously. Char Siu Bau is the best food in the world BAR NONE... ah but I may have misspelled it. Just learn to pronounce it Chah shoe bow (as in "of a boat"). I'm not kiddin' it's devine. Don't freak out if you see somebody wheeling by with a load of fried chicken's feet. I haven't ever tried them-- I live on a farm and I KNOW where they've been...but maybe you can and get back to me on them.
CHA SHOE BOW --
Yeah, yeah right-- I know
Gesundheit!
:)
Cindy
ps Don't go on the Small World ride at Disneyland... it'll haunt you for friggin' LIFE!!!!!
The local Borders (Sterling, VA) has proven less than useful - their happy little inventory system says "Vic & Blood" is "On the way!", as of noontime, when I stopped in for the impulse buy.
Harumph. And people wonder why I normally stick to Amazon.
Harlan - any signings or readings in the cards in support of the book? Ever since US Air gave me that free round-tripper for sending me to the Big Easy by van from Mobile, I've been mulling over a first-ever West Coast trip. (Of course, there was that one time I went to Spokane - but that's hardly coastal... and that was more like travelling back in time, anyway.)
If I'm going to head west on the corporate dole, I'm going to make sure I get their money's worth.
Hello Harlan,
Thanks for responding to my Theodore Anneman inquiry and the encomia was sincere. Ted "The Enigma" Anneman was a, for lack of better terms, "mentalist/magician" who offed himself in the early 40's at the height of his career. He was an entertainer and did not feign real psychic powers, although that point was severely disputed among those who saw his marijuana and alcohol induced performances.
There are many fascinating and interesting stories regarding this man about whom I'm collecting information for research purposes and a possible book proposal. I figured your legendary presence in the ephemeral fields of entertainment might lend some insight into this tortured genius or any of his associates.
Your chagrin is greatly appreciated concerning your lack of knowledge about this, as you so aptly phrased it, "remarkable and memorable" man.
Concerning the 5 other things in the Universe about which you know nothing, I have my own theories which I will post here later for your raconteurish perusal.
Until then a fond adieu,
Aron
Alex Jay: I'm sure you're right. I don't know jack about the Laci Peterson case, really, so maybe it's foolishly naive of me to think her publicity will help anyone. Maybe it's me trying to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.
Rick: Your rant is right on. Of course you're right; internet anonymity does pose hazards for the naive and trusting, just as real life does in general. In my experience, if you read someone long enough, the truth will out. I think the risks come into play primarily when money or personal meetings are involved. In the case of random people on BBS or chat room sites, sure, you could get some sticks and stones, but mostly you can survive it mostly unscathed.
OTOH, I have met several people via this board alone who I can call actual, real friends now. Because of this board, I got to meet Harlan Ellison, for god's sake, and had him vandalize my spectacles and dis me on dinner (pfffthh!). Overall, the good of the Internet far outweighs the bad, though it's caveat lector all the way, as you said-- but isn't that true with anything you read?
PAB
Hey Chuck,
Maybe it's time for Matt Groening to create a new animated series. He could combine elements from "The Simpsons," together with the most fungent parts of "Futurama;" out of this mileau, we would have a new spin-off: "Homer's Brain Trust." Each episode would be a thinly veiled pastiche--A Day In The Life Of A MENSA Gold Card, Placard Carrying Doofus.' Imagine the thrills, the chills as every genius in Springfield bans together to discuss ways of annihilating the blacks, the whites who are brunette, and under six feet tall; the Jehova's Witnesses; the Gypsies; the Rainbow Coalition, heh, while in the same sentence, winking, and griping about how thier butt still hurts from molten, nocturnal activities the night before. Consider the sumptuous wit, and irony. Oh, the not-to-be missed joys of watching them shame, and humiliate middle-aged women, now widows, who have just lost their husbands, and who they deem unattractive. Why? Because they're MENSA, and because they can.
I have nothing, but the highest admiration, and respect for your father's decision.
Alex,
No personal experience here, but I've heard that Williams is a pretty enjoyable jazz guitarist - not that great, but he certainly acquits himself nicely. Even if he is a damn Yankee. (And personally, I enjoy the hell out of Black Jack McDowell (a former White Sox, thank you) and his rock bands.)
Regards,
Joseph
An interesting aside, since we have so many fans of jazz, and so many fans of baseball here:
The Verve Music label is about to release the first album by a talented guitarist who plays Latin jazz.
His name? Bernie Williams. As in the longtime and oft-injured outfielder for the hated New York Yankees.
The album looks good, though: Guesting on it are musicians liek David Benoit and Kenny Aronoff, and stars like Ruben Blades and Bela Fleck. And it LOOKS good, too: The label tapped LeRoy Neiman to paint the cover art.
(Of course, I have to nitpick: Verve's promo art shows Williams with a Stratacoustic electric-acoustic guitar, and the album cover pictures him with a Telecoustic. These are thinline guitars, made by Fender to resemble the popular Stratocaster and Telecaster. They LOOK great. And they'd be cool for someone like myself with more enthusiasm than talent or skill. But several jazz guitarists I know have opined that the guitars are not the best when it comes to sound and tone.)
And Williams--who I've often heard had planned on a musical career before he got into baseball--isn't the only Yank to prefer a maple neck in his hand than a maple bat: Former Yankee pitcher Jack McDowell is now concentrating on his indy-rock band Stickfigure.
Both athletes are quick to point out that their music is not being marketed as that of baseball players, but as serious musicians. Still, I have to wonder: Half of the Williams press release is devoted to his diamond curriculum vitae.
CINDY: I realize that Laci Peterson was eight months pregnant, and have no problem with the concept of that soon-to-be baby considered as a separate victimn, as an eight-month-gone fetus can survive outside the womb. But I had MUCH rather that such decisions be made by precedent, on a case-by-case basis. The proposed Unborn Victims bill is an unnecessary sham backed by the antiabortion contingent with an eye toward getting it to apply to cases where the fetus would NOT be viable outside of the mother.
The idea of legal profiteering off a tragedy to further one's own creed turns my stomach.
PAB: I'm sorry, but I haven't seen a damned thing in the media which would suggest that Laci Peterson is being made as a poster case to point up the problem of spousal abuse or muder-by-intimates. It's just being shown as a "pretty girl dead" thing, and that annoys me for the reasons I have stated before.
HOOPS MCCANN: Loved your movie.
STEVE JARRETT: "The Islets of Langherhans"?
Just a small tidbit from Amazon.com that I found interesting:
"Customers who bought titles by Harlan Ellison also bought titles by these authors:
H. G. Wells
Mark Twain
Robert Louis Stevenson
Daniel Defoe
J. D. Wyss"
The only thread I see here is writings about remote islands (Wells - Moreau's island, Twain - the Sandwich Islands, etc.). Not sure where the link to the Ellison canon would be, but one could certainly be in worse company.
Steve J.
"the Internet hides our faces from each other, so that our ugliness is solely based on our words and conduct towards others? Rather liberating, in its way."
It's also rather scary, in its way, too. I wrote something about this concept over seven years ago, and I think it's still applicable:
http://harlanellison.com/rants/rt960313.htm
Deep Thoughts
"Perhaps, if I am very lucky, the feeble efforts of my lifetime will someday be noticed, and maybe, in some small way, they will be acknowledged as the greatest works of genius ever created by Man"
~Jack Handy~
Dear Mr Ellison,
"Whenever I hear the sparrow chirping, watch the woodpecker chirp, catch a chirping trout, or listen to the sad howl of the chirp rat, I think: Oh boy! I'm going insane again.
To me, clowns aren't funny. In fact, they're kind of scary. I've wondered where this started and I think it goes back to the time I went to the circus, and a clown killed my dad
If you define cowardice as running away at the first sign of danger, screaming and tripping and begging for mercy, then yes, Mr. Brave man, I guess I'm a coward"
I hope if dogs ever take over the world, and they chose a king, they don't just go by size, because I bet there are some Chihuahuas with some good ideas.
I don't think I'm alone when I say I'd like to see more and more planets fall under the ruthless domination of our solar system.
If you ever fall off the Sears Tower, just go real limp, because maybe you'll look like a dummy and people will try to catch you because, hey, free dummy
I can picture in my mind a world without war, a world without hate. And I can picture us attacking that world, because they'd never expect it.
Is there anything more beautiful than a beautiful, beautiful flamingo, flying across in front of a beautiful sunset? And he's carrying a beautiful rose in his beak, and also he's carrying a very beautiful painting with his feet. And also, you're drunk.
Contrary to what most people say, the most dangerous animal in the world is not the lion or the tiger or even the elephant. It's a shark riding on an elephant's back, just trampling and eating everything they see
I think the mistake a lot of us make is thinking the state-appointed shrink is our friend
A funny thing to do is, if you're out hiking and your friend gets bitten by a poisonous snake, tell him you're going to go for help, then go about ten feet and pretend that *you* got bit by a snake. Then start an argument with him about who's going to go get help. A lot of guys will start crying. That's why it makes you feel good when you tell them it was just a joke.
I guess I kinda lost control, because in the middle of the play I ran up and lit the evil puppet villain on fire. No, I didn't. Just kidding. I just said that to help illustrate one of the human emotions, which is freaking out. Another emotion is greed, as when you kill someone for money, or something like that. Another emotion is generosity, as when you pay someone double what he paid for his stupid puppet.
I remember that one fateful day when Coach took me aside. I knew what was coming. "You don't have to tell me," I said. "I'm off the team, aren't I?" "Well," said Coach, "you never were really ON the team. You made that uniform you're wearing out of rags and towels, and your helmet is a toy space helmet. You show up at practice and then either steal the ball and make us chase you to get it back, or you try to tackle people at inappropriate times." It was all true what he was saying. And yet, I thought something is brewing inside the head of this Coach. He sees something in me, some kind of raw talent that he can mold. But that's when I felt the handcuffs go on"
These Deep Thoughts were brought to you by me, courtesy of Jack Handy. (Thanks Jack)
Regarding the following "deep" thought":
"the Internet hides our faces from each other, so that our ugliness is solely based on our words and conduct towards others..."
Wow, that was like, *so* deep.
(Ahem... http://simplycosmic.homestead.com/Me1.html )
Sincerely,
Diana
Diana
Dear Mr Ellison,
Your old pal Paul Williams now has his own music publishing company, called Hillabeans Music. There never is much new information about him or his doings on the internet, but I came across a list of dozens of titles put out by Hillabeans the other day. He cowrote every one of them. His new body of work is beginning to rival his past efforts.
http://www.intothenight.net/Hillabeans.html
I haven't found the lyrics for most of them on line, what with them being new, and/or unknown. Having nothing else to offer his information starved fans I went and added all the links I could find about the cowriters. That should keep them happy for a while anyway.
Who knows, maybe you'd enjoy seeing him perform again. If so you can get information about an appearance he has planned with Melissa Manchester coming up in October at the following url.
http://tinyurl.com/ee4l
Sincerely,
Diana Graham
Cindy: I know exactly what you mean, about Laci Peterson and the effect of beauty on the beholder. I have been thinking about just such things recently: how people want to believe that the beautiful are good, how beauty alone can so inform a person's opinion that it causes the imputation of qualities that may or may not be present. All other things being equal, people DO care more about attractive people than ugly (you don't see Danny DeVito on the cover of The National Enquirer much).
This is not to say that Laci Peterson's notoriety flows solely from her beauty; it is merely the hook that draws in the viewer or reader. If all the publicity about her murder helps even one woman recognize a pattern and get out, then Laci's beauty posthumously has done the world a service, which is poignant as hell, IMO.
You are right in saying that this impulse in humanity is shallow and rather facile, but I agree with you and thank you for pointing it out. Makes ya think about human nature, don't it? And (not to go off on a tangent), isn't it nice that the Internet hides our faces from each other, so that our ugliness is solely based on our words and conduct towards others? Rather liberating, in its way.
PAB
Yes Lynn,
Thank you for that link.
Good one.
Cindy
Alex Jay
Here is some interesting information on the matter we have been expounding on.
http://www.eaglelake.org/staff/erics/idea/beauty.pdf
It isn't really even our fault-- as human beings, that we react in such a predictable and apparently shallow manner to cases such as this. It is a pitiful thing-- but one that is clearly part of our biochemistry. Members of the media are not exempt.
I do think the media capitolizes more on the tragedy factor than the pontential rights for the unborn angle.
Since you mentioned it though-- as you (no doubt) well know I believe there should be rights for a baby under a blanket-- or in a womb if he/she would be viable outside the mother's body. What difference does the placement of a child beneath an inch or two of flesh or a layer or two of fabric make? If he could breath on his own if he were outside the mother's body he should have the right to do so.
Meantime, the mother still has her choice in the matter. She has the right to not have it in her body-- but she has no right to see the infant dead no matter that his life would pose an inconvenience or complication.
I agree with you that we need to focus on the victimization of
women and not just of "a" woman. But I feel that any story such as Laci's does draw attention to the matter and so is beneficial. Perhaps a woman someplace will see situational similarities and will see that at times these things play themselves out in horrific ways. In such a case the story could have life saving potential.
I hope you are well, Alex Jay-- it's good to read you.
:)
Cindy
Hey Dorman,
I miss ya.
Cindy
Hey, cookie-- I seem to member Mr. E., while decrying the current state of music stores, commenting something like "You can't even find a section for Steely Dan anymore". ( I think this was before the Dan's resurgence with "Two Against Nature". ) Reading that made me think he was at least a bit of a fan. It's always a nice thing when you find you share a common like with someone you respect.
Just a quick comment to all of those who have stood before the loaded diaper; who have tolerated the ungodly mess of chocolate sauce, flour, dishwashing liquid and eggs the blessed little one has finger-painted all over the kitchen; the sudden displays of nudity, as you chase them down the street; the incessant arguments of defiance, that blessed child's entire vocabulary seems to consist of only the word NO!; the onmipresent noise of their toys which seems only to cease when the child has found something to do which will bring trouble to your home...
For one day, ceasefire.
Happy Father's Day, one and all, and remember: Video cameras are fantastic items. You never know when a covertly created piece of video will come in handy to pay back the damage a child's innocent attempt at wreckage will wreak on you, both emotionally and financially.
Can't wait for one of my kids to make a run for public office.
Scott
HARLAN: Likely, you've known about this one for a good long time, but I figured it was worth putting in front of people: In Donald Rumbelow's acclaimed THE COMPLETE JACK THE RIPPER, there's a chapter devoted to fictional representations of ol' Jack, in print, film, opera, what have you.
The last such covered is "perhaps the best of the Ripper short stories and certainly one which grows on the reader." This he says of "The Prowler in the City on the Edge of the World--and this AFTER having discussed "Robert Bloch's "Yours Truly, Jack the Ripper!" Whoo.
LACI PETERSON: The war was winding down, it was a relatively slow news day, the victim was reasonably photogenic, and the family of the victim had made a big stink. Plus, the woman was pregnant, so you have the opportunity for added pathos and a pro-life legislative push, to treat the murder of pregnant woman as a double murder, with the fetus being given the rights--in death--of a fully realized person.
(The importance of this last should not be overlooked.)
Never mind that roughly 15,500 people are murdered in the U.S. each year. Never mind that over the last twenty-five years, more than eleven percent of all murders--or over 58,000 out of over 512,000--were committed by spouses or boyfriends/girlfriends. Never mind that over one-third of ALL female murder victims in recent years were killed by an intimate (and the proportion of female murder victims killed by an intimate to the tital number of female murder victims, stable until 1995, has been steadily increasing).
All of which pissesme off mightily.
If Laci Peterson's case were being used as a platform to publicize with an aim toward curtailing the huge amount of domestic violence in the country and the rate of intimate murder of females, fine and good. But that's not at all what's being done.
If anything, the celebritization of victims like Laci Peterson gives the OPPOSITE impression; that such murders are so unique as to deserve widespread nationwide coverage.
And to me, that makes the media complicit in a dangerous lie.
Because very little will be done because of this.
... but that's just my take.
(Stats courtesy of the DOJ, working on 2001 data)
Dumb pop music question
Dear Harlan,
I hope you aren't offended by a question about music, but I'm just enamored of Steely Dan's latest effort EVERYTHING MUST GO. I wonder if you like Steely Dan and if you plan to buy their disc. Do you? I know it's a stupid question but I think they're such a *smart* band. Smart-alecky at times, too. The writing is superb and the execution, flawless. But then again, it always was.
I hope you and Susan are as well. I really miss RABBIT HOLE. If the gigs are kind this summer....well, maybe.
Thinking kindly of you,
cookie
LYNN: Thanks for the link. I've read that story before (as, no doubt, many others have, too). It's one of the handful that get pulled out when people try to justify the hue and cry and awful media blitz that surrounded Princess Di's death after the car accident (the sort of accident which happens all the time -- and which can be avoided if drivers weren't reckless -- or passengers insisted they stop driving so). The Princess did her share of good deeds (as she should have, given her station, and the fact that she didn't have a 9-5 job). But so do others. After all, if looks didn't have something to do with the excessive moaning and mourning on the part of Lady Di, why didn't Mother Teresea rate the same sort of reaction when she died? (And I'm not talking about the silly, conspiracty theory media stories -- I'm talking about the wailing, hand wringing, shitloads of flowers, media eulogies, magazine and newspaper articles, etc., etc).
--DTS
Princess Di
DTS~ See a pretty face in action: http://tinyurl.com/ecbu
:P
L.
DEAR NDUGU (nope, nope that wasn't right...)
DEAR GOD (shoot, that wasn't it either -- sorry Alice)
Oh yeah!
DEAR RICK: In other parts of the world, people go about their lives believing that (since the advent of 24/7 TV broadcasts) the way a man looks doesn't have anything to do with his being elected President. Or that large parts of many techonologically advanced nations cannot be held rapt by the news of a death of a woman who, for the most part, did nothing more than be beautiful (Princess Diana). In those parts of the world, people even believe that physical attraction has absolutely nothing to do with the way humans pair off and form long (sometimes lifelong) relationships. I wonder what it is that makes those folks so gullible? Lack of commonsense? Too much caffeine? Frequent Quantum teleportation while wearing buckycarbon equipment? Perhaps only God, Marilyn Vos Savant or Mr. Ellison (bet ya thought I'd never make the connection) will ever truly know.
Yrs. in ongoing sincerity and concern,
--DTS
P.S. Hiya, CINDY.
(Well, _I_ thought it was funny!)
Harlan,
Thanks for the update. I thought I had been checking the board pretty regularly to catch your earlier posting, but 'cha know, these eyes just ain't what they used to be. My bad.
The calendars should be getting there any time now (they include a letter that spells out the other details as well).
What's In A Face?
Dear Mr Ellison,
Please tell Dave Irvine I was just kidding about hating him? Thank you. :=)
Also, even though I really do think that whole "Well as ASIMOV says..." thing was kind of weak, the truth is if he'd done it in support of some dearly held opinion of mine I never would have said anything. Really, going on about it was just something to write about.
(It isn't EASY you know, coming up with stuff to say every day in all these posts I pretend to make to you)
*********************************************************************
KathyM
You're welcome for the information. The song Kris Kristofferson wrote that's on Ol' Blue Eyes Is Back, is, "Nobody Wins". He originally recorded it on his "Jesus Was A Capricorn" album.
You know, it wouldn't surprise me to find out that Harlan Ellison knew Kris Kristofferson. That guy *knows* people. He knows Paul Williams. Maybe from back when he was close friends with Robert Blake. I'm not sure about that, but I do know that Paul Williams had a recurring role on Robert Blake's TV show Baretta. And I also know that Harlan Ellison was a friend of Mr Blake's. So I just figure that's likely when they met. Paul Williams knew Kris Kristofferson from working with him on the movie A Star Is Born (Paul Williams cowrote the music for that movie) So I think it's at least a possibility that at some point Harlan Ellison and Kris Kristofferson have met. ??????
Diana
********************************************************************
Dear Mr Ellison,
I was wondering if you could help me to decipher something I read a little earlier? I'm thinking I might have misunderstood. Or maybe I'm just being guilty of "nit-picking" again. Let me know what you think.
The writer is commenting on a story that has apparently been in the news recently, about a young woman who had gone missing and was later found dead, horribly murdered, along with her child.
And I quote:
"Frankie love...I suppose if she had been a nondescript girl, devoid of physical beauty, the report of her disappearance would have engendered only a momentary mental comment; " How awful ". We would have paid scant notice. But beauty is a sword and her sweet and smiling face skewered us all and invested us in the outcome of the mystery... That is why-- I think- we care about what happened to her"
So okay Mr Ellison, tell me, am I wrong? I'd really like to know. Because what I read is that according to the writer it's only the fact that this murdered woman was beautiful that made her terrible death such a tragedy. She's saying (the writer's a female) that if the murdered person had been "devoid of beauty" she wouldn't have cared, wouldn't have empathized with the fear and pain and grief of the victim's family and friends. She's saying that if the person in the news story had been ugly, then she would have found the matter worthy only of a "momentary mental comment". It also seems that she's actually trying to attribute her perspective, to all the rest of the people in the world who were following the story as it unfolded in the press. I mean she says..."her sweet smiling face skewered *us* all", "invested *us*", "That is why...*we* care"
I want to make sure I got it right. That is what she said. The murder victim was beautiful, and "That is why...we care about what happened to her"? Not because someone, anyone, whatever they may have *looked* like had been terribly murdered, and not because that innocent, defensless unborn child, shared his mother's awful fate. No she says the only reason any of it was worthy of more than a "momentary mental comment", was because one of the victims of this tragedy was...pretty.
The most godawful thing of all in those statements is that this woman actually thinks that she's gone and said something lovely. You can tell. She's genuinely convinced that she's just tendered a profound gift, a glimpse into the beauty(sic) of her own soul.
Like a whited sepulchre.
But, maybe I misunderstood.
Sincerely,
Diana
Ontario, Canada
Frank: Well, yeah -- exactly. And as I think you're saying 'It's not that I don't care about Laci Peterson -- I just can't figure out why she matters when so many people don't', I'd add 'well, geez. Remember Jessica Lynch? She mattered so much, she won't even give interviews to dispute and/or confirm what's been reported about her rescue since her rescue.'
Am I reading the ticker right -- more American servicepeople killed in Iraq after the end of the Iraq war than during it, or is CNN screwing up again?
Cheers, Jon
Let's make one thing clear about IQ tests-- they are, to be perfectly blunt, a gauge of clerical skills. They do not measure any innate "trait" that a person has, either genetically fixed or environmentally variable, and should never be regarded as the "measure" of a human being.
Here's a nice thought experiment to illustrate the point. We've all taken variations of IQ tests, the SAT being the most famous. Now, imagine trying to apply such a test to a society of humans of about 8,000 years ago. Even the _concept_ of a test was millennia in the future. Could such a test really measure some innate "trait?" in such a population?
I think there's a ghastly irony in the fact that the tests are designed to measure abilities in areas that are desired in our civilization (ability to understand texts at a rudimentary level, compute math problems, certain abstractions) and many of the people who do best on such tests are those with disorders like Asperger's. Makes one a little leery of the standard all of us will be held to in an "information economy."
Frank, I have to love you.
I can understand growing sick of the Laci Peterson coverage. Getting ratings by what may be morally may be the exploitation of a tragedy is pretty disquieting.
But, like Cindy (mad props to you, Cindy), I think we DO care. Partly because of her beauty, yes, and the contrast between it and the later state of her body. That isn't all of it, though. Her death is more "important" than that of, say, someone having a heart attack in his basement because we have been given a narrative. We have a story as well as a face to associate with Laci Peterson, and if our interest in her death is partly driven by base desires and sick yearnings, it's also driven by sympathy.
I'm with you 100% on Geraldo, though.
MENSA: What's it for?
Tracy,
My father was a member of MENSA in the early 80's. That was here in Colorado, and they were much the same as the group you described. He got discusted with it pretty quickly. I guess many MENSA members can do "Rain Man" without actually trying. It reminds me of the Simpsons episode where all the smart people got to run things in Springfield. They ended up creating an even worse mess than the "dumb" people. Stephen Hawking gave them a good scolding at the end of the episode.
Chuck
Sorry for the glazed eyes, and the bile concerning MENSA. I may have experienced them as being degenerate, and twisted, and loopier than a DNA Double Helix. Then again, the community I'm in may be the one place on Earth where they're not a boon; the rotten apple at the bottom of the barrell. I scored 177 on the WISC verbal scale, but I waxed mediocre on the non-verbal scale. I think it's a useful tool for guidance counselors in certain classroom situations, but otherwise it's about as distinguished as having a wart on your schlong.'
I just pulled out my copy of the illustrated "Vic & Blood." That was such a perfect marriage between words, and images--it still eats my lunch to read it. It's the only story I've read where nuclear holocaust is nonpariel to the rest of the horrors in the book. It was brutally honest about the human survival instinct, a real puker.' I thoroughly enjoyed it.
Frankie love,
Laci Peterson was ( in pictures ) so lovely and real-- so easy to embrace, that when we looked at her face, filled with joy and verve and LIFE we could do nothing but empathize. The palpable void her disappearance left in those who knew her...or loved her became tangible to those who did not. How effortless to look at that sweet faced happy child and imagine the delighted anticipation she felt for the child that grew within her. She named the baby Connor and that made him real as well.
I suppose if she had been a nondescript girl, devoid of physical beauty, the report of her disappearance would have engendered only a momentary mental comment; " How awful ". We would have paid scant notice. But beauty is a sword and her sweet and smiling face skewered us all and invested us in the outcome of the mystery.
Now that she has been found-- in such horrific condition-- her longed for and well loved son washed ashore like someone's discarded refuse-- we look for retribution. We lay for the one who has wrought this monstrous act that robbed us all- as human beings-- of one so bright and filled with promise.
How could we NOT pay attention to the unfolding tragedy?
That is why-- I think- we care about what happened to her.
Cindy
Thanks to
Diana and Iana for the info on Sinatra. I do have the OL BLUE EYES IS BACK cd -- but have to admit it isn't one of my favorites, but I will check it out again for the Kristoferson songs. (I love Sondheim's "Send in the Clowns" by Sinatra; very nice). And I thought, perhaps, the Kristoferson song might be "For the Good Times" from the Trilogy cd -- but, again, not one of my favorites. I'll also check out the site mentioned by Diana. Thanks again to both of you.
While I'm at it, a few weeks ago my computer died, and I was unable to thank those of you who provided me with your recommendations for books in the sf genre. I printed off all recommendations, and intend to check those books out. I appreciated the input from those who responded. So far, I've finished reading the Space Oddysey series by Clarke, "I, Robot" and "Robot Dreams" by Asimov, and have just started "The Essential Ellison." My sister, knowing of my fondness for time travel stories, gifted me with a colleciton of short stories by Jack Finney. It's so nice to have so many stories to look forward to. Makes up for the dreary weather we are having when one can sit on the back porch with a cup of coffee, a great book, and listen to the rain gently hitting the awning.
another pecksniffian contribution
By the way, Rick:
In the opening paragraphs, near the top of this page, the adjectival form you want for excessive talkativeness is "logorrheic." I kind of like "logorrhetic," actually, but in any case, even the root word has two r's in it (think "diarrhea of the mouth").
The word has been on my mind this week because it is -- appropriately enough -- the winning word in the 1999 Scripps Howard National Spelling Bee depicted in "Spellbound," and I've been laboring over a detailed review of the film for DocumentaryFilms.net.
Remember that Pat Sajak is also a member of Mensa. That puts a nail in the coffin, I'd surmise.
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What the holy fuck is so fucking important about this goddamned Laci Peterson case? I'm sorry the the poor woman had to die, but why is her death more important than any one elses? And why the fuck is Geraldo fucking Rivera so fascinated by this shit? He goes on Fox Snooze and acts like this story is up there with Cointelpro. The media can virtually kiss my ass and Geraldo can go back to Iraq and stick some grade--A munitions up his ass. There, I feel at peace once again. Zen healing has it's limits.
Z-z-z-z-z-z. And Stuff
Dear Mr Ellison,
Please tell Dave Irvine to pass me the stringbeans? And that I hate him?... :=) Thanks.
Dear Mt Ellison,
It's beginning to look to me like *some* people aren't sure what to think about ANYthing until they read what some Famous Guy had to say about it first.
Z-z-z-z-z to what "ASIMOV said" about stuff. Don't get me wrong, ASIMOV had the power to turn my frown upside down. He was interesting and kind and funny. And I enjoyed learning what he thought about various subjects (even though he was an atheist and is now burning in Hell like he deserves) (Probably) (I'm not sure) (quasi-mystical agnostic here) because he didn't go in for talking out of his ass much, as far as I could tell. He was generally careful to back up his stated opinions with all kinds of fascinating FACTS and interesting well researched INFORMATION. I loved the Foundation Trilogy. (I've got to say that some of those seemingly endless short story collections, on various themes that came out under His Name pretty much bit the big one, though) (but I kept buying them anyway. Because I was such an ASIMOV whore, er I mean fan) But just because someone tacks on "Well as ASIMOV said, heh heh heh..." to everything *they* think about stuff doen't add even one sub atomic particle's worth of weight to what *they* think. I think it's SO lame when quotey guys do that. They seem to feel like they have to immediately quote some "Famous Guy" as soon as they state one of their own bogus completely-unsupported-by-facts opinions. Like they don't think their own opinion was good enough to stand on it's own. Which it probably isn't. Which is why they keep having to say stuff like, "Well as ASIMOV said..." all the time. ("Well I think, blah, blah, blah about this stuff. And as ASIMOV said about similar stuff...blah, blah, blah. So that means I was right, to be thinking what I was thinking about that stuff. Right? Doesn't it? Well doesn't it? I mean ASIMOV said...) Z-z-z-z-z-z
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Dear Mr Ellison,
If you find the time one of these days, maybe you can see to it that MENSA gets the following message from me?
Dear MENSA & Co,
As a fellow representative of the human race, I would like to apologize profusely for those members of our species who insist on continuing to say nasty bitter things about your organization. Who knows what their problem is? Inflamed bowels or something probably. Just ignore them. Don't let them ruin your day. That's my unsolicited advise.
My Uncle Paul is a member of MENSA. He's likes to compose limericks about obscure things. He did one once about The Fitzgerald Contraction which was so funny that I nearly snorted soda out of my nose the first time I heard it. I'd share it with you, but it's not only funny, it's also more than a little risque. All I can tell you about it is that it's definately NOT the famous (?) PG13 rated one that's on the internet.
Sincerely,
Diana
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To KathyM,
I can't believe I forgot to mention that Mr Ellison's friend, singer/songwriter Paul Williams (who I