Barack Obama - 44th President of the US of A

General discussions of interest to readers and fans of Harlan Ellison.

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Re: Barack Obama - 44th President of the US of A

Postby Moderator » Wed Oct 07, 2009 10:15 am

Steve Evil wrote:What Grayson said was no worse - considerably better in fact - than what Republicans have been saying about Obama's plan. Anyone who fed the myth of nazi death panels has no business crying foul.


I think that is exactly the point he was making -- and, as noted, Republicans actually backed off their own rhetoric as a result.

That's what bullies do when confronted.
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Re: Barack Obama - 44th President of the US of A

Postby Douglas Harrison » Fri Oct 09, 2009 4:28 am

Obama awarded 2009 Nobel Peace Prize -- CNN

I believe the award is deserved. Kudos to the Norwegian Nobel Committee.

D.

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Re: Barack Obama - 44th President of the US of A

Postby Barney Dannelke » Fri Oct 09, 2009 7:34 am

I agree with Doug. My phone sent me this alert at 7AM this morning...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/10/0 ... 14907.html

and my comment when I re-posted to it to Facebook was;

"...the decision to honor Obama was unanimous."
Because he was only eligible for two months I see this Very Much as a forceful dismissal
of the Bush/Cheney regime policies. And I am JUST FINE with that.

-----------------------

If I had to guess which three moments swayed the committee my guesses would be the Cairo speech followed by the Speech in Germany followed by his trip (early) in his administration to Africa.

Naysayers will say this is all rhetoric and symbolism and I would cheerfully say that our intentions are our best and perhaps our only human credential.

- B
History is a vast early warning system. -Norman Cousins (1915-1990)

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Re: Barack Obama - 44th President of the US of A

Postby markabaddon » Fri Oct 09, 2009 8:23 am

I was a bit surprised that this award was given and, even though I am an Obama supporter, not sure it was deserved. Yes, he has made some strong speeches in regard to resolving tensions in the MIddle East and, yes, it is also true that he has pushed the issue of reducing carbon emissions and controlling greenhouse gases more than any other President. However, he has not gotten any significant results yet, although early indications are promising. I would have rather seen him receive the award when the results are tangible. And yes, I realize this is as much a symbolic award as anything, a direct rebuke to the former administration.

However, I wonder if that could backfire. There is a strong thread of xenophobia within the Republican party, and actions such as this only serve as fuek to the hate filled rhethoric of the Becks and Limbaughs of the world.

I do question whether the Nobel Prize committe may hav made a serious error
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Re: Barack Obama - 44th President of the US of A

Postby Barney Dannelke » Fri Oct 09, 2009 8:39 am

Well, a few years from now they can just give it to him again.

Jack Nicholson to Warren Beatty upon receiving the Thalberg Lifetime Achievment Award about 15 years ago...

"Can I win this twice?"
History is a vast early warning system. -Norman Cousins (1915-1990)

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Re: Barack Obama - 44th President of the US of A

Postby markabaddon » Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:07 am

Not sure if someone is allowed to win the award multiple times, but even assuming he is eligible, it does not negate my earlier statement. The Repugs are going to KILL him over this. You think Limbaugh is not going to lead his show with this story (unless he happens to be on a "vacation" to see young boys in the Dominican Republic again)

At a crucial time in his presidency, when the CBO just came out with a report saying that the Baucus plan would essentially be cost neutral over the next 10 years and a decision looming about what direction to go in Afghanistan, I just think this news could end up hurting Obama more than it helps him, as he needs all the support he can get right now
Governments, if they endure, always tend increasingly toward aristrocratic forms. No gov't in history has been known to evade this pattern. And as the aristocracy develops, gov't tends more and mroe to act exclusively in the interests of the ruling class

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Re: Barack Obama - 44th President of the US of A

Postby Barney Dannelke » Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:23 am

Mark,

I really do appreciate where you are coming from on this. Except for Rush's opinion which I (powerful though he may be) I discount on it's face.

Nevertheless, I just can't imagine being awarded the Nobel Peace Prize as a bad news day. Just not possible. Still grinning.

Sorry.

Still grinning. Whistling a jaunty fucking tune.

- B
History is a vast early warning system. -Norman Cousins (1915-1990)

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Re: Barack Obama - 44th President of the US of A

Postby markabaddon » Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:41 am

I was just discussing the award with the Training Manager here (another liberal) and, while we are in agreement about the potential impact this may have, we also agreed that it is a sad commentary that such a wonderful honor being bestowed on the President of our country could also be viewed with trepidation. You have no reason to be sorry, I wish I was able to enjoy this as much as you are and feel bad that I cannot
Governments, if they endure, always tend increasingly toward aristrocratic forms. No gov't in history has been known to evade this pattern. And as the aristocracy develops, gov't tends more and mroe to act exclusively in the interests of the ruling class

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Re: Barack Obama - 44th President of the US of A

Postby Moderator » Fri Oct 09, 2009 10:04 am

My take is this: The award was given because Obama has done a signficant amount already to lower the temperature of confrontation around the world.

North Korea is coming back to the negotiating table after exploding a nuclear device under Bush's watch.

Iran is actively talking to the world and -- at least tentatively said they will allow IAEA inspectors into their facilities.

The Iraq War is winding down.

The tension between the US and Russia is lessening.

Obama gave a wonderful speech reassuring the Islamic masses that we don't wish them ill.

"Peace" is a relative term, and those who suggest he hasn't done anything concrete to deserve it are missing the point that a world poised on the brink of major conflict -- as we were under the Bush Administration -- versus one in which diplomacy is given more than lip service (and yes, I get the irony of that statement), is a tremendous step forward on the world stage.

Yes, it's for the potential -- but it's also for being a person who is willing to take the steps necessary to ratchet down the rhetoric and try to reach some understanding of the world outside our borders.

It's kind of like that moment when the jackass neighbor down the street who has bullied the entire block for years decides to move. If the new guy moving in comes over with a basket of cookies and says hello you can't help but appreciate the effort.
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Re: Barack Obama - 44th President of the US of A

Postby Lori Koonce » Fri Oct 09, 2009 1:18 pm

Gang

Alfred Nobel, the dude who the prize was named after, and if I'm not mistaken gave it the orignal endowment, made his money by inventing TNT for goddess sake, not quite a peaceful endevour.

And as someone on NPR said earlier this AM, the prize is not only given for past endevours, but as a way to keep a recieptient true to his or her words.

If you listened to the speach that Obama gave, he admitted as much and accepted the award in that spirit.

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Re: Barack Obama - 44th President of the US of A

Postby FrankChurch » Fri Oct 09, 2009 1:30 pm

I should have said "I don't deserve it," give it to Noam..wink.

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Re: Barack Obama - 44th President of the US of A

Postby Lori Koonce » Fri Oct 09, 2009 2:00 pm

I'm glad you put that wink in there Frank cause after being told I was a russian male and needed to go back home, I'm in a serious mood to kick some verbal ass.

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Re: Barack Obama - 44th President of the US of A

Postby FrankChurch » Fri Oct 09, 2009 2:08 pm

The entire left and right agree on something. Obama did the right thing by not embracing the award. lol

Lori, silky and milky, who said that to ya? I defend my woman. lol

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Re: Barack Obama - 44th President of the US of A

Postby Barney Dannelke » Fri Oct 09, 2009 4:24 pm

This morning, Michelle and I awoke to some surprising and humbling news. At 6 a.m., we received word that I'd been awarded the Nobel Peace Prize for 2009.

To be honest, I do not feel that I deserve to be in the company of so many of the transformative figures who've been honored by this prize -- men and women who've inspired me and inspired the entire world through their courageous pursuit of peace.

But I also know that throughout history the Nobel Peace Prize has not just been used to honor specific achievement; it's also been used as a means to give momentum to a set of causes.

That is why I've said that I will accept this award as a call to action, a call for all nations and all peoples to confront the common challenges of the 21st century. These challenges won't all be met during my presidency, or even my lifetime. But I know these challenges can be met so long as it's recognized that they will not be met by one person or one nation alone.

This award -- and the call to action that comes with it -- does not belong simply to me or my administration; it belongs to all people around the world who have fought for justice and for peace. And most of all, it belongs to you, the men and women of America, who have dared to hope and have worked so hard to make our world a little better.

So today we humbly recommit to the important work that we've begun together. I'm grateful that you've stood with me thus far, and I'm honored to continue our vital work in the years to come.

Thank you,

President Barack Obama
History is a vast early warning system. -Norman Cousins (1915-1990)

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Re: Barack Obama - 44th President of the US of A

Postby FrankChurch » Sat Oct 10, 2009 8:11 am

Give me five reasons how he earned the award and we will talk.


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