Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

General discussions of interest to readers and fans of Harlan Ellison.

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FrankChurch
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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby FrankChurch » Sun Jul 27, 2014 2:40 pm


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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby Moderator » Sun Jul 27, 2014 3:12 pm

FrankChurch wrote: I would surmise Barber and Rob do not get their information from actual Russia experts. Hating Russia is easy, nuance is better.


I actually laughed out loud at this.

Frank, I've personally met more Russian experts than you've seen on tv. This is really a genuinely amusing comment. Just where, kind sir, are you getting YOUR Russian information? YouTube?

Kids, we've entered the Twilight Zone.
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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby Moderator » Sun Jul 27, 2014 3:13 pm

FrankChurch wrote:Tell em Steve:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zWvlvSuKHU


Okay, posted the above without reading on. :lol:
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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby robochrist » Sun Jul 27, 2014 3:25 pm

"From Russian experts"

Doug,

And YOU do?

Some of those "experts" as I said happen to LIVE there! Yes, some of my info is first hand. That includes a Russian friend here who works cases in the courts as a translator. She's listened to Russian mafia on the witness stand. That's HEAVY! and has even

In any case, where I might discover my accuracy strays, by-and-large, the picture over there is pretty much as I was saying. Certainly on the issue of poverty, income rifts and media control.

Doug, you know what? You may have a skill looking up data. It doesn't mean you know what you're talking about any more than the next Joe Blow. I mean to be FAIR! My suspicion is that you lean Right, and you fidget a bit to my comments, judging by the conversation we once had on the gun issue.

If you're accusing me of talking out of my ass, I can say likewise.

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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby robochrist » Sun Jul 27, 2014 3:27 pm

um, "likewise", that is about YOU, not "myself". :oops:

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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby robochrist » Sun Jul 27, 2014 3:41 pm

Let me put it another way to you self-proclaimed sages:

Yes, it IS easy to "hate Russia"!

Doug, being as how you're so much wiser and savvy than I, YOU tell me where my summation is faulty! In addition to the poverty rate, the income rifts, pure capitalism, and naked corruption, I forgot to toss in the gay rights issue as well! If you offer corrections - and I doubt you know much about the subject, so I'll double-check your OWN sources! - then I'll look them up and revise where needed.

But if I find out you don't know SHIT, you're gonna KNOW it.

If, on the other hand, you land a doozy, I'll absolutely concede it! Meantime, however, knock it off with the snide shit!

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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby Moderator » Sun Jul 27, 2014 5:19 pm

(Pssst, Rob: I've met Doug Lane. We've shared meals together. Doug is a friend of mine. Doug is no Frank Church.)
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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby Ezra Lb. » Sun Jul 27, 2014 6:44 pm

Couching the "conflict" between Russia and the US as a new Cold War is hilarious dissembling. Putin wishes. He's just a third rate thug presiding over a corrupt society rapidly descending into terminal shitholedom. Nobody is claiming that Putin personally ordered the plane to be shot down. But pouring sophisticated arms to the seperatists makes the Russians ultimately responsible even for what was most probably a fuckup.


Sam Harris on Israel.

http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/why- ... ize-israel


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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby robochrist » Sun Jul 27, 2014 7:22 pm

Russia and the US as a new Cold War... Putin wishes. He's just a third rate thug presiding over a corrupt society rapidly descending into terminal shitholedom.


Exactly right! One can only hope that his CONFEDERATE of thugs goes down the sewer WITH him. Sadly, I don't think it will be that easy. Corruption is grafted onto the system like tonail infection, and the wealthy elite won't be eager to lighten up on their interests. No way in Hell.

======================

Postscript: in case my comparison to Putin's economic policies with the direction our country has taken had an air of hyperbole to it, you don't have to look far - and at the MANY sources out there - to justify it in real terms. We're not THERE. Not yet. It has the POTENTIAL to get there - or damn close to it - if the megamerges deepen their control on the system further!

Why is poverty still growing under Obama? Well, t's NOT because of Obama. It's grown and grown because of continued corporate merging and outsourcing, which is as yet completely unchallenged. Entities like the Koch Brothers and cronies in the Supreme Court and Congress could be RIGHT out of a chapter of Russia under Putin. Now, if somebody comes back and says that's bullshit, as basically Doug did, THEN you demonstrate you have the information down better and that your own sources are as good or better than my own.

Put up or shut up!

Lots of people at the top, of course, contributed to the conditions we've seen in the U.S. since 2008. Bill Clinton is among 'em! The trouble now is that, while ideally I wish Obama had the wherewithal to take on the corporate elite, it would, politically, make the President look ineffectual, and, in fact, he WOULD be! In turn, this allows creeps like the Teabaggers and Republicans alike to add it to their list of bullshit faults they place on Obama. The issue is a briar patch.

Russia is like that on STEROIDS. So, when the day comes Putin seems neutralized, a power structure will still be there along with, most likely, a new President who still represents THEIR interest, who otherwise would be ineffectual. That's why Russia is a BIGGER briar patch!

That's what I'm getting at. I'm not simply sitting here "hating Russia"!

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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby Moderator » Sun Jul 27, 2014 7:45 pm

Rob...did you see my note?
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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby Robert Nason » Sun Jul 27, 2014 8:45 pm

Rob, you use the phrase "cronies in the Supreme Court" so often, I'd swear you have a key on your computer that types it out with one tap. Just who are these "cronies," and who are they cronies of? Do you consider Ruth Bader Ginsburg, Sonia Sotomayor, Stephen G. Breyer, or Elena Kagan "cronies"?
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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby FinderDoug » Sun Jul 27, 2014 9:14 pm

Rob,

Anytime you want to direct your ire and insults AT THE RIGHT PERSON, I'll be awaiting your correction.

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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby Moderator » Sun Jul 27, 2014 9:25 pm

- I love to find adventure. All I need is a change of clothes, my Nikon, an open mind and a strong cup of coffee.

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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby Robert Nason » Sun Jul 27, 2014 9:53 pm

I saw Dinesh D'Souza debating Richard Dreyfuss on Huckabee's show last night, and it was rather painful to watch: Dreyfuss was so plainly out of his depth matching wits with D'Souza. Dreyfuss has spent a lot of the time over the past number of years developing a "civics" awareness program for schools across America, but when he was asked his specific views on the Constitution and education, sleavery and American foreign policy, he just floundered. Apparently he's paid a large salary to a "political affairs advisor" to, well, advise him on these matters -- many stars have such advisors along with their agents, managers, accountants, make-up people, PR flaks, etc. -- but his advisor doesn't seem to be earning his pay. Well, to be charitable -- D'Souza would probably not have acted as well as Dreyfuss in CLOSE ENCOUNTERS. (Though I prefer him in THE APPRENTICESHIP OF DUDDY KRAVITZ myself.) Actors want to be serious, not just actors, but they should be serious about their acting.
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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby FinderDoug » Mon Jul 28, 2014 8:57 am

Seeing as I was minding my own fucking business when I got jumped and beaten with a pool cue, I think I've earned a moment.

Rob's cognitive dissonance over who he was beating aside, he still very pointedly directed his pissiness at me: multiple uses of my name, pot shots at my research skills, dredging up some sort of resentment he still harbors over a months-old hunting conversation in the pavvy, a few snide remarks, a loose threat or two.

Had he limited himself to rebukes of content with which he had an issue, I probably wouldn't have even noticed, seeing as Russia is an area on which I agree with him. But Rob consciously chose to add a personal dimension, based on who he BELIEVED had wronged him. THAT wasn't accidental or incidental.

I respect Rob's interest in standing his ground. He's passionate. I get that. But his half-cocked vitriolic responses - all fucking three of them - apparently required only a misplaced attribution in his head for him to start swinging from a place of personal contempt. (The alternative is that Rob has just been so angry at me for whatever his reasons are, he let it full-boil the first time he thought he had a reason.)

Eh. I've known for a very long time there are going to be people who don't find me to be their flavor. Many people aren't my flavor. What Rob chooses to tie himself up in knots with is his business, and if he doesn't like me, so be it. I wish him luck in his future endeavors. Or inner peace. Or whatever will help.

But Rob precisely underscores my point of last week: who willingly wants to join or remain in a community where you can say nothing on a subject, and still be the victim of a personal-attack drive-by from someone SO INTENT on delivering a beat-down, he can't even keep straight who actually set him off?

Eleven years here is more than enough for one lifetime. If you're of a mind, you probably already know how and where else to find me. But don't bother talking to me here. I'm not here anymore.

Be good to one another, those that are capable.


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